~ ~ ~ 1943 Huffman/Dayton Military Bike Found! ~ ~ ~

[Krakatoa]

Thanks to all for the responses so far.

Here are some more pictures of the frame & fender with the wheels off. The undersides of the fenders definitely are olive drab, and where the housepaint has flaked off the frame more of the same color. I certainly feel the housepaint should come off, but don't really know how durable the original olive drab paint was. What is your opinion on this Adrian? In my next post I will address the originality of the various parts on the bike.

 

[Krakatoa]

Trying to get the parts that are here figured out to determine what is right and what is not. Wondering on parts like the stem and kickstand that were normally chromed or plated, would these parts in this situation have been just painted unchromed/plated or painted over? Thanks to all for you input.

Nate

Updated:

Frame~ OK
Fork~ OK
Truss Rods~ OK
Crank, chainring~ Correct, but crank is bent, chainring is ok.
Pedals~ Correct Torrington 8, but these are rough, not wood blocks.
Fenders~ OK
Fender braces front~ One is still riveted and appears to have remanants of olive drab paint. Other is chromed, newer with universal slots. Need one front.
Fender braces rear~ One is correct three hole type but reattached with screws, other is universal type replacement, both overpainted heavily. Need one rear.
Guard~ Missing need.
Seat post~ Need straight solid, length?
Seat~ Have this one waiting on further opinions.
Stem~ Found! Torrington 'R' plain finish
Bars~ OK Olive drab Torrington script
Wheels~ Need heavy duty drop center type beveled.
Hubs~ Need front Eclipse barrel type 36 -10, have rear blackout Morrow 1st 1/4 1945 but not hd spokes.
Kickstand~ Probably incorrect. What is correct type?
Fender light~ Missing. Plain Delta winner type.

 

[Mercian]

Tryder is right. Originally, they were painted a flat green colour. That said, the paint doesn't seem to have stuck very well to the hubs, I think because they were Parkerized, a dull grey finish, which survives quite well.

Here are pictures of mine before repainting, showing the Pakerization, and also the M2 (Quarter2, 1943) build date for te hub, and the '36 10' indicating the spoke number (36) and spoke size (10).

When built, the hubs generally predated the main part of the bike by a couple of months, which is why I guess yours would be M3, or M4. That said, wheels were often swapped in service for repair (the Army had loads of bikes, and weren't worried about originality), so it is not unusual to see L(42), M(43) or N(44) dated hubs. The important part really is the '10' spoke size. these are heavy duty spokes specified for the bike. It is easier to find Eclipse hubs smaller smaller size spokes '11' or '12'. If the other Eclipse hub you have is marked '10', there's a very good chance it's the hub it left service with.

The front hubs are easier, in a way. They are marked Eclipse, 36 10, again for spoke number and size. Front hubs are not dated, so easier (!) to find an appropriate one for the bike. Note, they should be parkerized and painted, not chromed like the one below. I chose this picture because the markings show up best.

(Credit: Izee2)

Hope this helps,

Best Regards,

Adrian

 

[Mercian]

Hi Nate,

The paint is pretty durable. I understand that Huffman used a yellow (Zinc Chromate?) primer on at least the frames, whereas Westfield didn't..

In fact,Westfield installed the headbadge before painting, so that it often rusts under there, and you get a paintless Ghost Image when you remove the badge).

The bike by this point would have no chrome on it at all, so any chromed parts are unlikely to be correct.

I'm going to look through the pics now, to see what else I can add.

A+

Adrian

 

[Mercian]

Hi Nate.

Pretty well all the info you need is on this page: Click on the blue links for illustrations.

http://www.bergerwerke.com/historyG519.html

Post. yes, incorrect, but should be a straight solid post, same OD as the clamp ID.

Stem, yes, incorrect. Should be a 'Torrington R'.

Wheels, yes, incorrect. Should be heavy duty 26” x 2 1/8” rims, "drop-center" beveled. Again, unchromed, just painted green. There were NOS ones for sale over the last few years, but these have almost gone, and are now quite expensive.

Saddle, yes, incorrect. Correct frame illustrated here: http://www.bergerwerke.com/prod651seatframe.html

Hubs, date as discussed in my post above.

Can't really tell about the stand at this point.

Pedals should be Torrington 8's, normally with a wood grip. They look close...

Also missing; Grips, Bell, Tool pouch, rear reflector (?), Delta Winner light (with makers name on bottom, on top is post war).

Still, the only Huffman specific part missing is the chain guard, so you have a pretty good start.

Hope this helps.

Best Regards,

Adrian

 

[Krakatoa]

Thanks Adrian!

The chromed Morrow is dated P3 36 13, 3rd quarter 1946, but not hd spokes. The blackout finished Morrow is dated O1 36 13, 1st quarter 1945, but also not hd spokes. It is laced into this drop center.

This is the stem that was holding the Torrington olive drab bars in the other bicycle. It appears to have a raw or perhaps cadnium finish.

 

[rustjunkie]

Saddle, yes, incorrect. Correct frame illustrated here: http://www.bergerwerke.com/prod651seatframe.html

Best Regards,

Adrian

I have a question, please: a Mesinger is shown on a Huffman bike in a picture taken from an Army technical manual, why is that saddle/information not correct?

http://www.theliberator.be/militarybicycles.htm

 

[partsguy]

@37fleetwood @hoofhearted

 

[tryder]

Thanks Adrian!

The chromed Morrow is dated P3 36 13, 3rd quarter 1946, but not hd spokes. The blackout finished Morrow is dated O1 36 13, 1st quarter 1945, but also not hd spokes. It is laced into this drop center.

This is the stem that was holding the Torrington olive drab bars in the other bicycle. It appears to have a raw or perhaps cadnium finish.

View attachment 447792

View attachment 447793

View attachment 447794

View attachment 447795

View attachment 447796

That is a Torrington stem. Looks correct.

 

[Mercian]

That is a Torrington stem. Looks correct.

I agree, just compared it with mine, it is the correct one.