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Paint prices no wonder people use spray bombs

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rideahiggins

Cruisin' on my Bluebird
I went to the local PPG paint store today to see if I could get some paint matched. They said they needed a 3" x 3" sample to get the paint code from. Well theres not much on a bicycle with a 3" x 3" area. So I found some chips in the books that matched pretty close, Schwinn Coud white. I asked, how much? He said $371 a gallon, plus the hardener, plus the reducer. There was a blank stare from me and the counter guy until it sank in. Now I know it's been a while since I painted anything (6 or 7 years) but has paint really gone up that much or did the counter guy just not want to mess with my bicycle colors. Is this the average price for automotive paint now? The one color I was trying to match is the Schwinn Rose. There is a 1958 Lincoln color that is really close but he didn't have the paint codes for that anymore. He said it was too old. So where to go from here? Yes, I've seen the spray cans available but I'm not lookig for spray cans. I've searched the web and nobody is willing to reveal the secret paint code formulas.
 
Some thoughts, where to start?
The paint codes for classic bikes. Codes for MANY brands and models have been retrieved, saved, or decoded over the years. WHY folks aren't more forthcoming about them I don't know. AND, guys have been restoring bikes with extremely accurate paint recreations but when it comes to inquiring about the paints used it's like some big freaking mystery. Why???

My experience with auto paints is extremely limited, but it's what I'm doing RIGHT NOW so I'm kinda tuned in. Apparently yes, paint prices have gone stratospheric, much of the old good paints are getting eliminated by the EPA, apparently PPG is the only brand doing lacquer now, Dupont is leaving that ball game behind due to regulations. Also, because of forced lead reductions the recommended 1:1 paint:reducer doesn't apply to dark hues anymore, you've got to use 2:1 paint:reducer.

On the bright side, painting bikes uses VERY little paint. You can buy the smallest container they offer and as long as you're not buying the show-car line of paints it'll run $70 for the more expensive hues. Reducer is cheap but when I bought the tiny can of catalyst the other day it was $30!!!

I'm WAY behind the learning curve so I'd like to hear from guys with mucho experience here.

This just struck me as a funny comparison... I could easily get bent outa shape about auto paint prices, but let's compare; Today, one of the "good" brands of house paint (the big 3, Benjamin Moore, Porter, and Sherwin Willimams), Benjamin Moore's Aura series of paint is $70 a gallon! That's acrylic latex house paint.
 
I'm kinda out of my league on this one, but maybe you want to email CABE member Aaron at VintageSchwinn.com. He has an array of Schwinn colors in aerosol cans.
 
I'm kinda out of my league on this one, but maybe you want to email CABE member Aaron at VintageSchwinn.com. He has an array of Schwinn colors in aerosol cans.

Don't be afraid of the spray cans, most guys having custom paint put in cans are using quality paint with the hardener already in it. I was told by the paint guy down the street that it has about a 10 year or less shelf life. I think they are using a single stage acrylic enamel which goes for about 125 to 200 a quart depending on color. The closer you get to red the more expensive. I think you can get 3 to 4 spray cans per quart but I'm not exactly sure. One thing you might consider is to have a quart put into spray cans and try to resale the full cans you don't use.
 
I used to paint Harleys and did some car hoods and mural stuff too. I mostly did airbrush work (some stuff posted in my gallery) and my buddy did all the body work and clear coating. Because we would buy a couple gallons at a time of the main colors we needed for any particular project, we got to know the PPG guys pretty well. But when it came to airbrushing I only needed tiny amounts of paint. I never wanted to get any colors off the color swatches they had because those were all mixed from their base colors. So I would just walk in to the PPG shop and just so happen to have a case of pint glass jars with me. I said I needed samples of the base tones to work on a custom mural job (or whatever). Because I was a regular, they thought nothing of it and filled me up with almost every base color they had which ended up lasting me a couple of years of worth of bikes, tanks, helmets, hoods... They also hooked me up with samples of pearl powders that were a ton of fun to work with (did some killer ghost flame tanks with just pearl in the clear) and again lasted a long time because of the little amount I actually used. It's harder to ask for small samples of specific formulas because they are doing the mixing. So I told them just to give me the base colors and I would tinker with the colors myself. They thought I was nuts but I didn't care, I knew once I got those samples I was set!

I have a degree in Illustration from a fine Art Academy which I had to spend a whole semester on color theory and making color wheels with all different kinds of paint so I'm pretty confident I can match any paint out there as long as I have a sample... just don't ask me how I made that color because I do it by eye and not some formula to be recreated. I don't have the patience to measure. I like more the mad alchemist approach, hovering over his shop, tinkering it until it is perfect. I just know if it's off, what I need to add to make it match... a little of this and a little of that.

Color matching can be a pain but for me it is a challenge to try an recreate something original. The hardest stuff to do is the transparent stuff, and in my opinion those paint jobs look the best! You can get the richest, purest colors when using transparent paint. Opaque has some degree of white added which dulls the colors.

I have no reservations about using a bomb can (did it on my Silver King). You can get a good finish and there are a ton of colors out there. But if you're going for a show quality repro and they don't make your color in a bomb can... you gotta pay up to get the good stuff. No way around it.
 
I'll throw my two cents in here since I am painting the Elgin right now-

My local body shop supply store (Welle) mixes up any color I want in PPG Deltron, which is great paint (we used it in the body shop my husband and I had for many years), it's a very particulate heavy paint, so the color is dense, and you don't need to use a whole lot (compared to say Duplicolor laquer, which can be like water!). They mix it in tall spray cans for me, for about $25.

Then I use a special 2 part premixed clearcoat (has the catalyst in it) in a can called Spray Max 2k, high gloss, and honestly, you cannot tell that the paint job wasn't shot out of a gun. The clearcoat is also about $25 a can. And so much less hassle and mess (and cost). However, once clearcoat is activated, potlife life is 48 hours, but I've used them for over a week or more with no issues.

I chose my Elgin's colors out of paint chip books at Welle, they had some pretty old books so I could find vintage colors without poly/metallic.

Darcie
 
This is good info Darcie, and a good descriptor of how to strike balance between "rattle can" and a much better paint quality that happens to be in an aerosol can. My local auto paints place is giving about $25 a can as well and I'll definitely take this option when I can.

I've used LOTS of rattle can over the last couple of years, and I've become proud of the results even with masking and multiple colors and clear coats, granted, Rustoleum has gotten MUCH better over the years. My major complaint with good old-fashioned rattle cans is, and it's a big one, resiliency. I do bare metal prep with a bead blaster and etching primer. When it's all said and done, look at the paint cross-eyed and it chips, STILL!

No more. This catalyzed primer, base coat/clear coat is BULLETPROOF and thick, I love it!
 
This catalyzed primer, base coat/clear coat is BULLETPROOF and thick, I love it!

I know! and I also get great results using just the clearcoat with catalyst, over almost any paint
(providing you have good prep- we also bead blast to bare metal and use wax and grease remover just prior to primer/painting). :)
 
One thing about some paints..........waiting too long to add a second coat can be disastrous. I found out the hard way.....some paints (Rustoleum in particular) which I'll NEVER use again BTW, has to be second coated within a few minutes after OR it will blister up.....and eff up a paint job big time. Make sure whatever you use is a sand-able first, or second or any coats...can sit overnight between coats if needed AND take on additional coats without a nasty reaction. I like to apply thin coats....let them dry overnight......sand....reapply......and you get a nice smooth, deep shine....all with a spray can. I've been told though.....that too think a paint job......chips easier.....and that might be avoided by Nickinator's method. The Firestone was done with canned spray paint and I thought it came out quite nice. The color difference on the orange is the camera, not the paint results. The second pic is the "before" bike.
 

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