Mystery Roadster

I bought this roadster diamond frame awhile back in the market forum. I find it hard to pass up unique lightweight/roadster bikes. Usually I have some idea of what they are but this one is a mystery.

Bike looks to have a welded frame with weld seams clearly visible. The rear drops appear to be inserts welded into place rather than stamped out of a single piece of tubing. The bad silhouette looks western flyer to me, but that's just a guess. The frame came without a badge. Bottom bracket does not have a serial number on it, but the non-drive rear drop has "M&S Co." stamped on the side. The seat tube has a partially remaining decal with a shop in Brooklyn NY on it. Paint is obviously red with white spears and has blue accents around the spears.

Wheels are a mis matched set- Centrix rear hub with a generic, black out front hub. Rims are mis matched as well. The tires are 597 MM/schwinn sized, but I suspect one of the rims is an old-type 599 ISO size.

Any ideas as to what this is?

Manton & Smith?

I think that's a good call. I checked through here and Rat Rod and found a similar lightweight with a slightly different paint scheme and the M&S stamp. It looks to be the same bike, though it had a rectangular "Nonpareil" badge.

same parts as my 41 monarch lightweight

rustjunkie said:

Manton & Smith?

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Welded frame too

I agree--Manton & Smith. The paint scheme probably didn't match your example because this looks like a repaint. A skilled repaint, but it does look it mostly due to the cups being painted. Everybody was cranking out minimalist diamond frames right after and even a few during the war. Many of these examples do have visible welds in lieu of brass braising from material shortages. I imagine the original crank was blacked out since this has the look of a late wartime or very early postwar bike.

I like the geometry of this frame. The rake of the seatpost looks like it'll fit a taller guy nicely.

jpromo said:

I agree--Manton & Smith. The paint scheme probably didn't match your example because this looks like a repaint. A skilled repaint, but it does look it mostly due to the cups being painted. Everybody was cranking out minimalist diamond frames right after and even a few during the war. Many of these examples do have visible welds in lieu of brass braising from material shortages. I imagine the original crank was blacked out since this has the look of a late wartime or very early postwar bike.

I like the geometry of this frame. The rake of the seatpost looks like it'll fit a taller guy nicely.

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It's possible it was a professional repaint done by the shop whose sticker appears on the seat tube. The sticker went over top of the red paint and based on the lighter area where the sticker used to be, it had been there for some time. The quality of the paint is excellent. There's no real crazing or irregular areas like you see on a home repaint. The blue accents are spot on as well. I suspect a professional job at a shop, probably the Brooklyn shop referenced in the partial sticker, if it's a repaint.

Hjhhhh

Badge holes are vertical and around 2.25 inches apart. Does anyone have a Manton & Smith or Western Flyer (shadow looked that shape) head badge that would fit that?