1850's bike

[Dan the bike man]

Ok I got this bike, well I call bike dispite it pre-dates pedals. One source called it a "running machine". I'm looking for any and all information I can get please. Someone told me Leon Dixon is good at these. I don't know him but will be put in touch with him. Does anyone here know anything about these?
The bike is over 7 feet long, over 4 feet tall and I'd guess it is over 100 pounds! Looks hand hammered iron, seat and everything looks that old -to me anyway. Thank you!

 

[Andrew Gorman]

That one moved fast... More discussion about it at:
http://thecabe.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?49721-Trade
Some more shots of the tops of the forks, bars, dropouts,etc. would definitely help.

 

[Dan the bike man]

 

[fordsnake]

Ok I got this bike, well I call bike dispite it pre-dates pedals. One source called it a "running machine". I'm looking for any and all information I can get please. Thank you!

It's called a Draisine...predates the Boneshaker

 

[Dan the bike man]

Thank you, I didn't know the name of them. Have you seen others? Do you know if everything is correct on mine and about how much the value is? Thank you again I love learning about these!

 

[fordsnake]

Thank you, I didn't know the name of them. Have you seen others? Do you know if everything is correct on mine and about how much the value is? Thank you again I love learning about these!

Here you go...https://www.google.com/search?q=dra...oHAAg&sqi=2&ved=0CAcQ_AUoAQ&biw=1839&bih=1024

 

[Andrew Gorman]

Unfortunately it looks like it's been arc welded at all of the joints, a technology that wasn't around until the 20th Century, and if those welds are repairs, it is a method that does not work very well on 19th century wrought iron, which has many layers of slag hammered into it. In the 19th century an iron bike frame and fork would have been hammered out in one piece by a blacksmith, maybe aided by a power hammer. Here are some pictures of a ca. 1869 machine taken apart for a comparison:
http://s53.photobucket.com/user/gormanao/library/ca 1869 Boneshaker?sort=3&page=1
How does it ride? There are a bunch of bike geeks in England who race around on Laufmaschinen-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vFCrHsrZGT4
Looks like fun! I love the sound of steel tires on pavement....

 

[Dan the bike man]

I don't know the first thing about arc welding. But the fact that it's 20th century technology makes sense. To me (again I know nothing about welding of any kind) it looked as if the maker melted iron and let it drip on to the frame. Not sure if that makes sense.
There are things about this bike that make it seem correct like the handle grip looks used-worn not made to look worn. As do the wheels. I've been around antiques all my life and know things can be made to look old.
All my online searching (even the links above) fail to show something EXACTLY like this. All of the ones online are different style. I've looked at originals and repops and nothing is like this.
On Mikes original post in the Antique bikes thread he stated he was told it's original so I'm taking that to be fact but I need to be put in touch with an expert in these. I hope Leon Dixon whom I'm going to be put in touch with - or someone else can give me a 100% sure answer of when this was made, and where. Repairs don't bother me, as long as the over-all bike is early 1800's.
Lastly while looking at the handle grip I noted it says "patented" and "size 3" no date is given for the patent however. I'm only guessing but I would think a 1850's era patent would not have a date, but a later one would? Just a guess.
I welcome any and all feedback if you know about these. Everything is another piece of the puzzle.

 

[Andrew Gorman]

You can check at the Wheelmen board- I actually posted about this bike there a few days ago. There is not that much traffic through it, so don't expect a lot of replies right away. It is odd machine- Draisiennes faded from view in the 1830's, and it wasn't until Lallement/Michaux came up with pedals that two wheelers came back, and they were large wheeled to get reasonable gearing and with a short wheelbase. Yours is definitely large wheeled and long wheelbase and no sign of pedals. The seat is awfully low and far back to be effective if there ever were pedals. Is there any sign of a missing spring between the head and the rear axle? Or is the seat at a reasonable height for someone to scoot it along like a dandy horse? Here's a good contemporary book on the subject:
http://books.google.com/books?id=aT...d=0CC8Q6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=velocipedes&f=false
That can give you an idea of what people were thinking a bike should be at the time. One of the Wheelmen thought it could be a pedal-less trainer from a rental rink, but the geometry is completely different than most other velocipedes. For what it's worth, the grips in my velocipede now are from an old auger handle, but the metal bit with the patent info didn't make it on to the bike. Yours is an interesting puzzle. Because of the welds I'm leaning towards it being a newer home made piece using an older pair of buggy wheels . and something else re-purposed as the grips.

 

[Dan the bike man]

So is there a chance it's 1850's era?

I had just joined the wheelmen group when I came back here to see if there were any new posts. I guess I should have done more homework before buying it but it sounds like there is still some hope that it was a bike related item from the 1800's with later repairs? And am I understanding correctly that your grips had the patent metal ring, and that mine is from a fishing pole? There is no sign of springs ever being under the seat. I am hoping I can find someone who lives or comes to MI who is an expert and can look at it in person photos only do so much good. Thanks again! It's very interesting to learn about.