Oldbikeguy1960
Wore out three sets of tires already!
I know I am treading on sacred ground here and am not trying to make any new enemies here. But this has been on my mind for a long time and I need to get it off my chest. Thanks in advance for your understanding and courtesy in your answers.
I have built and repaired many of these bicycles in my life, as I remember most were for people who had a couple bikes and always wanted that particular one they never got as a child.
Unfortunately, that is not the case today. Now we have guys that own basements, garages and even pole barns full of bikes. I am putting that group into the above titled classes and explaining my view on these groups. Please be uderstanding and not too offended.
Bike Collectors.
This group I am sure is the largest here on The CABE, but not the largest of the three groups listed.
The Collector sets out to get one of each bike they ever wanted as a kid but could not afford. I understand this and have done this in the past myself. I still think it puts a bite on the hobby, because many people who want a particular bike cannot find one because they are all sitting in dealer style rows somewhere. Their owners had an abundance of cash and could buy ever increasingly expensive bikes most of us could never afford on the spot. Still, like I said I have been there although without the abundance of cash.
Worse to me is the collector of hard to find parts that they hang on the wall and dust occasionally when there are bike builders out there looking for that part. If they are lucky enough to find one it is usually ridiculously priced because there are hundreds of them hanging on walls doing nothing.
I have always wanted a Violet Stingray, preferably a 3 speed bike but flexible there. I see threads where one wasn't perfect enough for their collection so they hang it up as wall art.
Sell the thing man! When you can scour the country for near perfect original bikes and pay exorbitant amounts of money for them what is that frame or seat or fork to you? Another trophy nobody else can ever enjoy.
Then we have the Investor. Out of the three groups this is the one I like the least. I have seen this group destroy more dreams than the other groups combined. It happened in the musclecar market, the old motorcycle market and any other market one could desire something from.
They are there only to make money. They don't care about the product, only how many dollars it will bring. Parted or whole doesn't matter as long as they maximize their investment.
It's because of people like these that it is so ridiculously expensive to buy a nice bike or a part to finish a bike. I wanted to build a copy of my December 1971 Disc Brake Orange Krate. I did about 12 years ago, but had to sell it to help my brother with his dad's funeral. The local investor guy came to buy it for an already lower than market price but insisted on whittling me down by pointing out all the (tiny) flaws the bike had. He knew I was in a bad position and instead of compassion he showed only greed. I ended up selling because funeral homes won't even move the body until they are paid in full with cash or a high interest loan. I did not even get enough for the bike 10 years ago to buy a rear wheel now. I know he parted the bike for a substantial profit or sold it for 4-5 times what he paid me.
Yes, it was my decision to sell but under very extenuating circumstances.
Now a disc brake wheel can cost as much as $2000+ for a nice one like I built from parts for about $300 12 years ago. A decent disc brake bike can bring double that or more. It has nothing to do with the hobby, (or lifestyle as I see it) only another stock in their portfolio.
These people have decimated every hobby or lifestyle or whatever you call it that exists. Hemi musclecars, old British, Japanese or American motorcycles, vintage toys, etc.
The last but maybe not the least is the hoarder. The person who has to have every nut, bolt bracket seat etc of every bike he can find and puts them in a big pile to rot away. Then he hears that a disc brake Krate wheel can bring $2000 so he digs into a pile and pulls out a rusty, bent rim wit some of the pieces missing and Bam! It's on eBay for $2000. When you explain it isn't worth that much in that condition they get defensive or downright rude and violent. No poop, this really happened to me.
I saw a bike on eBay that, while nice enough for a rider was listed as something it wasn't. I contacted the seller to try to explain what I meant nicely and by the 3rd message from him he was accusing me of molesting his child and said it was on camera and he was contacting the authorities. I had no idea who he was or where he lived but regardless I would never do that or allow it to be done while I still drew breath. I reported him to my local authorities and the County Sheriff and court subpoenaed eBay for the sellers name and address. I am sure when they found him they threatened him with prosecution if he filed his false report. I also contacted eBay but they of course did nothing. I probably still have the screenshots of the conversation.
All because he hoarded this stuff up from barns, garages, basements and back yards then saw a dollar sign on a turd.
The moral of my story?
This is a hobby or lifestyle. Nothing wrong with making some money but do it fairly. Consider the person you are dealing with. I am on disability, and probably shouldn't spend any money on old bikes but I cannot afford old cars and I need something to keep me busy. I enjoy building old bikes and always have.
I still want a Violet Stingray, preferably a 3 speed frame. I have a sandblasted (not by me) 1965 coaster frame but I want one with a reasonable amount of paint. I can be happy if I need to put non correct parts on it. I want to ride it while I still can.
If anyone knows of a frame at a reasonable cost you can PM me.
All replies welcome, but please be at least as decent as I was and we can talk about our views like adults. Or very old teenagers.
Done whining now.
I have built and repaired many of these bicycles in my life, as I remember most were for people who had a couple bikes and always wanted that particular one they never got as a child.
Unfortunately, that is not the case today. Now we have guys that own basements, garages and even pole barns full of bikes. I am putting that group into the above titled classes and explaining my view on these groups. Please be uderstanding and not too offended.
Bike Collectors.
This group I am sure is the largest here on The CABE, but not the largest of the three groups listed.
The Collector sets out to get one of each bike they ever wanted as a kid but could not afford. I understand this and have done this in the past myself. I still think it puts a bite on the hobby, because many people who want a particular bike cannot find one because they are all sitting in dealer style rows somewhere. Their owners had an abundance of cash and could buy ever increasingly expensive bikes most of us could never afford on the spot. Still, like I said I have been there although without the abundance of cash.
Worse to me is the collector of hard to find parts that they hang on the wall and dust occasionally when there are bike builders out there looking for that part. If they are lucky enough to find one it is usually ridiculously priced because there are hundreds of them hanging on walls doing nothing.
I have always wanted a Violet Stingray, preferably a 3 speed bike but flexible there. I see threads where one wasn't perfect enough for their collection so they hang it up as wall art.
Sell the thing man! When you can scour the country for near perfect original bikes and pay exorbitant amounts of money for them what is that frame or seat or fork to you? Another trophy nobody else can ever enjoy.
Then we have the Investor. Out of the three groups this is the one I like the least. I have seen this group destroy more dreams than the other groups combined. It happened in the musclecar market, the old motorcycle market and any other market one could desire something from.
They are there only to make money. They don't care about the product, only how many dollars it will bring. Parted or whole doesn't matter as long as they maximize their investment.
It's because of people like these that it is so ridiculously expensive to buy a nice bike or a part to finish a bike. I wanted to build a copy of my December 1971 Disc Brake Orange Krate. I did about 12 years ago, but had to sell it to help my brother with his dad's funeral. The local investor guy came to buy it for an already lower than market price but insisted on whittling me down by pointing out all the (tiny) flaws the bike had. He knew I was in a bad position and instead of compassion he showed only greed. I ended up selling because funeral homes won't even move the body until they are paid in full with cash or a high interest loan. I did not even get enough for the bike 10 years ago to buy a rear wheel now. I know he parted the bike for a substantial profit or sold it for 4-5 times what he paid me.
Yes, it was my decision to sell but under very extenuating circumstances.
Now a disc brake wheel can cost as much as $2000+ for a nice one like I built from parts for about $300 12 years ago. A decent disc brake bike can bring double that or more. It has nothing to do with the hobby, (or lifestyle as I see it) only another stock in their portfolio.
These people have decimated every hobby or lifestyle or whatever you call it that exists. Hemi musclecars, old British, Japanese or American motorcycles, vintage toys, etc.
The last but maybe not the least is the hoarder. The person who has to have every nut, bolt bracket seat etc of every bike he can find and puts them in a big pile to rot away. Then he hears that a disc brake Krate wheel can bring $2000 so he digs into a pile and pulls out a rusty, bent rim wit some of the pieces missing and Bam! It's on eBay for $2000. When you explain it isn't worth that much in that condition they get defensive or downright rude and violent. No poop, this really happened to me.
I saw a bike on eBay that, while nice enough for a rider was listed as something it wasn't. I contacted the seller to try to explain what I meant nicely and by the 3rd message from him he was accusing me of molesting his child and said it was on camera and he was contacting the authorities. I had no idea who he was or where he lived but regardless I would never do that or allow it to be done while I still drew breath. I reported him to my local authorities and the County Sheriff and court subpoenaed eBay for the sellers name and address. I am sure when they found him they threatened him with prosecution if he filed his false report. I also contacted eBay but they of course did nothing. I probably still have the screenshots of the conversation.
All because he hoarded this stuff up from barns, garages, basements and back yards then saw a dollar sign on a turd.
The moral of my story?
This is a hobby or lifestyle. Nothing wrong with making some money but do it fairly. Consider the person you are dealing with. I am on disability, and probably shouldn't spend any money on old bikes but I cannot afford old cars and I need something to keep me busy. I enjoy building old bikes and always have.
I still want a Violet Stingray, preferably a 3 speed frame. I have a sandblasted (not by me) 1965 coaster frame but I want one with a reasonable amount of paint. I can be happy if I need to put non correct parts on it. I want to ride it while I still can.
If anyone knows of a frame at a reasonable cost you can PM me.
All replies welcome, but please be at least as decent as I was and we can talk about our views like adults. Or very old teenagers.
Done whining now.