Colnago Super (Piu)

[Jesper]

Here is my weekend rider. I have a century in a month and want it to be perfect so stripped it down for overhaul, new BB, chain, bar wrap, paint touch-up.
Never really researched it, but it is about '89-'91 with the clubs engraving in the stay caps instead of "COLNAGO". I think it has the 4th gen. BB clubs cut-out with "COLNAGO" engraved above the cut-out, 130mm rear spacing, internal brake cable routing. Tubing unknown; Colnago used Tange (per catalog) on some Supers in the 90s; no decal on it when I first got it.
I doubt that it is '89, more likely a '90-'91 given the paint and rear spacing.

 

[cyclingday]

Very nice!
I always liked the look of those fully sloping fork crowns.

 

[Jesper]

I will show a final build on this since it is my rider. I don't like to show stuff I've built up for sale and not personal use; I let the next owner show it off.
I just got in two trades ('86 Colnago Nuovo Mexico, '98? Fondriest X Status), one that I owned previously!

 

[Jesper]

Getting close to finishing this ride.
Upgraded brakes to NOS Veloce dual pivots, and changed stem from an old well weathered panto'd black Colnago 3t stem to a black 3t Mutant stem (120mm). Swapped out my wheels to Veloce hubs with SGR Apollo rims (tires: Vittoria 700c x 230), but my Veloce 8 speed cassette cogs which will fit on the freehub (Veloce also) does not allow for the lockring nut to thread. Apparently there are 2 different sizes, and mine is too big for the freehub even though they are of the same Veloce model (though probably different years). New Veloce cartridge BB.
No changes to crankset (Galli 170mm, 53t/42t), rear derailleur (Campy Chorus), front derailleur (Campy Nuovo Record), pedals (early Look, "D" cleats), ITM bar, Campy shift levers, Galli/3t seat post, San Marco Concor Super Corsa saddle.

 

[Jesper]

Sorry, photos somehow deleted on previous post.

 

[Jesper]

Quick note: I had a note from my initial purchase of this bike by the original owner that said he got the bike in 1991 (mid to late), but he was not sure if it was a previous year's frame leftover, a frame built in the year of the purchase; or possibly a frame built in '91, but actually made for the '92 model year. So the age is probably about what I suspected given the frame features and what was shown in Colnago catalogs in the years prior (late 80s). He did mention that it initially had a Columbus decal, but could not recall the graphics ("SL" tubing designated, or no tubing designation), and I have no other notes to provide anymore info regarding identification. I would assume an "SL" frame; definitely not an "SLX" frame since no helical reinforcements were discernable at the BB shell conjunctions. Fork steerer is not a Columbus reinforced design; I assume it is a proprietary Colnago fork complete (blades, crown, and steerer).

 

[Jesper]

The steerer on this bike has a dimple hammered into it; I do not know the significance of the mark. The drive side d-o also has a similar dimple in it (see photo).
Does anyone know what the meaning (if there is any) of these marks indicates? I don't think I have this on any other Colnagos, but this frame is a later frame than my other steel frame Colnagos (very late 70s-mid 80s) so I may not have the same marks on the earlier frames; nothing comes to mind when I think about it. It seems to be a very ambiguous mark if it designated a fork/frame pairing; possibly a builder's mark.

 

[Jesper]

I am trying to use a wheelset that has a Campagnolo Veloce freehub with an alloy body. I do not know what year the hub is. When I installed a Veloce 8 speed cassette (fits perfectly) I could not get the lockring to thread onto the hub. I thought I had too many cogs on the hub for some reason, but no; 8 spd hub and 8 cogs.
What I found was that the lockring was larger in diameter than the freehub body threading. I had not run into this problem before, probably due to not swapping out parts or running many freehubs on my wheels, but I had purchased the wheelset assuming my cassette would fit (which it does) without any issues. I do not know what year the cassette is either, but I suspect the cassette is older than the hub.
While doing some research I discovered that Campy used 5 different sized lockrings; 3 with different thread O.D.'s and 2 different flange diameters.

Here are my notes; I'll try to dig up a link for the info I found.

29.0mm
Supposedly, the 29.0mm outside diameter ring is for cassettes starting with a 12T cog or larger, and used only on 8 spd steel body freehubs. The ring will not fit Campy Record 8 spd freehubs having an alloy body and that came with titanium cogs; that freehub uses the 26mm O.D. ring that also fits early (1997) 9 spd units.

26.0mm
The 26.0mm O.D. ring has 2 flange sizes which are used dependent on what starting small cog is fitted. If 12T or larger than the 38.5mm flanged ring must be used, and it is not interchangeable with the 11T cog set-up which uses a ring with a 35.2mm flange diameter. both rings are designed to fit 9 speed freehubs ('97 & '98 Record, Chorus, Athena, Veloce, and Mirage 9 spd hubs), and all factory built wheels w/9 spd hubs of the same time frame. Fits '99 Athena, Veloce, and Mirage 9 spd hubs. All Campy 9 spd hubs will also fit a 10 spd cassette.

27.0mm
A 27.0mm O.D. ring is used on Campy's "oversize" 9 & 10 spd hubs that appeared circa 1999. The ring's flange size (38.5mm or 35.2mm) is comparable to the 26.0mm ring dependent on if a 12T or 11T cog is used.

So I have an alloy freehub (presumably Veloce; the hub dust cap says "Veloce") and a Veloce cassette that that fits the hub, but I don't know what ring size I need. I have not measured my ring, but I would assume it to be 27.0 or 29.0mm at this point. My small cog is 12T so I assume I might need the 38.5mm flanged ring to fit. I think I have another cassette that is loose so I will check the ring (if it's still with the cogs) compatibility with my hub set-up and provide whatever info I can as a future reference for others.

This will teach me not to be lazy and to rebuild the wheelset that I already had on it, albeit a 6 spd FW in friction, but I wanted to have a rear hub that fit the 130mm rear fork; I had to squeeze the stays a little to install my rear wheel. Still sticking with the friction at this point even with the 8 spd. I do not know if an early 90s Chorus indexing group I have will work on the hub; not even sure how many speeds my Chorus drivetrain is since it is still on an old Basso that I do not ride.

If anyone has experience with this and can shed some more light on the subject it would be greatly appreciated.

Should I post this as a "general" forum topic? I think it should be made known to the general community who might not view this particular thread.

 

[Jesper]

I have measured the lockring's thread O.D. and flange diameter:
Thread= 29mm
Flange= 38.5mm

The hub's size is 27mm. I don't know if this indicates that the hub is of the "over-sized" style and circa '99 and later or not.
My small cog is 12T and the ring sets in it perfectly so it seems original to the cassette.

This would seem to indicate that a 27mm was also used on an 8 spd hub with an alloy body at some period in time.

As a note; these hubs (front and rear) are super smooth and without any discernable play. I want to use them with the Veloce cassette on hand orherwise a waste of money just because of a lockring. I may have to try ebay if I don't have one, and now after realizing how many options were available it doesn't look too good that I'll just habe one lying about.

 

[Jesper]

Thanks @Schwinny for making this ride come together (albeit a lot later than expected; my fault). I will get a final photo posted complete with wheelset.