I could use help with a second Schwinn Superior I found

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Orange Fiets

'Lil Knee Scuffer
This morning I took a look at the following Schwinn Superior.
B656FA2D-C865-4DF3-A5ED-E79918D1657C.jpeg


The SA hub states “49”. The seller wants crazy money for it because it’s old (but has no idea how old).

It has lots of patina but the frame seems solid.

The bb serial number is B719.

What do you think? Is it pre WWII or not?
Any additional information is very much appreciated.
Best,
Bernard

Additional pictures can be found here.
Pictures of my other Superior (Pre WWII can be found here).
 

rennfaron

Wore out three sets of tires already!
It's prewar because of the rear fork and pretty sure pre 40'. I would have to look up all the specs but first glance...
  • Missing rear fender
  • Front fender is wrong and younger than the frame.
  • Brake levers are from the 60s
  • Light kit looks interesting, can't tell what kind.
  • I don't think superiors of that time got T10 pedals shown and would be a touring pedal of that era...
  • Stem looks mid 40s to 50s. (can't tell). A profile shot and front shot would help, but looks to me that it is a razor stem.
  • Wrong saddle - that is a schit saddle from the 70s/80s/90s or modern...
  • Rear rack would never be on a bike like this and is 70s
  • Bars look correct-ish but may be a later version considering how much has been changed (could have been swapped with the stem).
  • head badge is correct
  • Grips are wrong and from the 60s/70s
  • Chainring is wrong (I think) and few years younger than the bike
  • Brake lines are all later and those calipers I don't think would be on the bike of this age. Calipers look later 40s to me.
  • Shifter is post 63' and is not original to the bike, as it looks like it was updated with a later rear hub. Pre 63' and the graphics on the face are inset/engraved and infilled with paint.
  • To the point above, I would guess the wheels (rims) are not correct either. Those look like the stainless steel rims you would find on lightweights during the mid to late 40s or could be S-6s. I didn't look up the year of the frame serial but it could have had wood rims.
  • Obviously tires are not original and are mismatched
Everything else...looks correct-ish... :grimacing: haha
Basically, that's a frame with a couple extra correct parts. The incorrect parts have value and you could recoup some to help correct the bike but the original parts carry far more value than those parts (a lot of money out of pocket to correct it).

Here would be what you are looking at for a more correct example that is the same age...
s-l1600 (1).jpg
 
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rennfaron

Wore out three sets of tires already!
I was going so fast I missed the extra pics. Just saw them and am correcting some of my notes above now that I can see more.

The link to your second superior does not link to anything...

Also, as much as I beat up on the incorrect parts, these are still VERY uncommon bikes (frames). However, it sounds like the seller needs to be pulled back to reality on the price considering what is not correct.
 
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Orange Fiets

'Lil Knee Scuffer
I was going so fast I missed the extra pics. Just saw them and am correcting some of my notes above now that I can see more.

The link to your second superior does not link to anything...

Also, as much as I beat up on the incorrect parts, these are still VERY uncommon bikes (frames). However, it sounds like the seller needs to be pulled back to reality on the price considering what is not correct.
I know this is a subjective question but what would you find reasonable?
And here is the correct link to the one I own (yes it’s repainted unfortunately).
Feel free to PM me if you prefer.
 

rennfaron

Wore out three sets of tires already!
That's a hard question because everyone values their time/efforts differently. Also timing affects everything too, as prices have climbed over the last couple/few years. It also depends on your goal with the bike. Do you want to have it to have it and keep it like it is or do you want to try and get back to more correct condition. If the latter then you need to start adding up the grocery list of parts and that will help you determine where you need to be on the frame to make it worth the money/time/effort. You also need to consider that some of the parts will be very hard to find and/or costly to acquire.

Here is one up on ebay that has been sitting awhile. It is a pretty darn nice example. https://www.ebay.com/itm/154316664912?campid=5335809022

Here are two others that sold within the last few years.
Screen Shot 2021-05-22 at 3.17.34 PM.png
Screen Shot 2019-11-25 at 10.31.06 AM.png
 

Orange Fiets

'Lil Knee Scuffer
I very much appreciate each of your help. I sent the seller my much lower counter offer. I do like it. I'm in the Chicago area so I love the fact that this is a piece of local history pre WW2. I am not planning on building it all up back to original. But you never know.
 

GTs58

I'm the Wiz, and nobody beats me!
I didn't think much of it at first since that was built back up with non original parts. Now I'm thinking it may have been a Racer model where the parts were harvested or just taken off and replaced for some reason. The fork has no fender mounting tab indicating this was not a tourist model. Or maybe the fork was replaced? I wonder if there is any trace of the hat in ring seat tube decal left or if it never had one.

1621718553996.png
 
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