Schwinn Base Coat


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GTs58

I'm the Wiz, and nobody beats me!
Sep 2, 2012
10,652
9,467
Central Arizona
#1
Does anyone know if 1955 was the last year of the gold base coat on the Opal colors? And was it just used with the Red colors? I've only seen this situation on the Opal Red bikes that were 54 and 55 models.

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Likes: Sven

Jeff54

Cruisin' on my Bluebird
Sep 11, 2013
2,189
966
Ft Myers, Florida
#2
That is NOT "gold base coat" The color shift from red to an orange-ish-gold tone is due to sitting in the sun for several years, (Ultra violet rays exposure).the silver/aluminum coat does not fade as much under the clear red top finish coat. Clearly protected somewhat from Ultra violet rays by the decal, as seen in the chain guard. "Gold base coat" Nonsense: Fore Peat's sake how many timeds ave fact vs fiction over this faded color have you been told ? Take off the head badge on a faded Opel red Schwinn and crap "gold tone" faded red is revealed Proof positive it's just crap clear red top coat 'Candy apple red' with no ultra violet protection in Schwinn's paint producer. >>>>>
>>>
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schwinnlax

Finally riding a big boys bike
Jun 14, 2016
117
151
52
La Crosse, WI
#3
I've often wondered if that is the color opal red fades to in too much sun rather than it being a base coat showing through.
 

Jeff54

Cruisin' on my Bluebird
Sep 11, 2013
2,189
966
Ft Myers, Florida
#5
I've often wondered if that is the color opal red fades to in too much sun rather than it being a base coat showing through.
Indeed. Here's a macro shot of the front post on 1955 ' sun faded frame and chain guard to a orange-ish-gold tone, Corvette, I posted. polished it smooth and glossy, down to reveal the multiple coatings un-molested by ultra violet rays, under the head badge. Silvery flakes and crackle that creates the Opel-like effect base. The Crackle appears red but it's not as it seems rather. it's either within the silver mixture or a separate clear red coating on the flakes. Finally, Top coated with clear red, known in the 1950's and there after as 'Candy Apple red' . B/C it's what cinnamon clear red candy apples were made like. I did not grind or sand this, which appears to be 100 grit, it's what Schwinn did to the bare metal before painting coat the red lead primer on. I guess this helped the paint stick to metal.
1955-corvette-opal-red-laye-jpg.jpg
 
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spoker

Riding a '38 Autocycle Deluxe
Mar 3, 2011
5,185
2,318
Minneapolis, United States
#6
candy paint was invented by one of the old customizer guys in the mid 50s,candy paint is nor just thin paint,its made from toners that are used to tint paint,this was b4 paint companies invented or used uv in there paints,uv is like sun block,it blocks the suns ultra violet rays there for preventing color fade,i think it was gene winfield who first discoverd candy apple painting,was multiple coats or laquer[up to 20]coats,usually had a host of longevity problems just like schwinn bikes

]
 

GTs58

I'm the Wiz, and nobody beats me!
Sep 2, 2012
10,652
9,467
Central Arizona
#7
Boy, some really good info here and the terminology is just flat out exquisite! Never heard of clear red before but I'm always open to learn. I'm no paint expert like Jeff, but I've had quite a bit of experience in paint and painting and something is going on with these early Opal Red bikes from say 1954 and 1955. I've also come across a vast amount of translucent Red Schwinn bikes where the red paint has faded and no other years have this gold hue when the red is gone or faded, NEVER. I've seen a Radiant Red Varsity where all the red was gone with just a few hidden areas were there was still traces of red. That bike was all bright silver and no sign of any gold anywhere from either paint or UV damaged red paint. Over the years I've seen many 54 and 55 Opal Red bikes were there is a gold tone after all the translucent red paint has vanished. I believe there was what the experts call "a piss coat" of gold shot over the silver base coat on these 54 and 55's and that's pretty evident in the pictures.

Here's a faded worn 1959 and no signs of gold. Then the 54 Jag where the red was long gone years ago. Note the cantilever bar where it's scratched. Gold then silver then primer. And a few other shots of that Corvette.

Just a note. I have talked to the owner of that Jag about the paint after it was purchased from hzqw2l

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faded opal red 2.jpg


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Likes: mrg

schwinnlax

Finally riding a big boys bike
Jun 14, 2016
117
151
52
La Crosse, WI
#8
Presumably the original paint is still there under the decals (chain guard, seat tube). That being the case, the original red paint is still there under the decals, and not somehow scraped or worn off. Unless the red paint faded to clear revealing a gold coat underneath, it has to be the red paint that faded to gold. Just using logic here...
 

schwinnlax

Finally riding a big boys bike
Jun 14, 2016
117
151
52
La Crosse, WI
#10

Jeff54

Cruisin' on my Bluebird
Sep 11, 2013
2,189
966
Ft Myers, Florida
#11
Boy, some really good info here and the terminology is just flat out exquisite! Never heard of clear red before but I'm always open to learn. I'm no paint expert like Jeff, but I've had quite a bit of experience in paint and painting and something is going on with these early Opal Red bikes from say 1954 and 1955. I've also come across a vast amount of translucent Red Schwinn bikes where the red paint has faded and no other years have this gold hue when the red is gone or faded, NEVER. I've seen a Radiant Red Varsity where all the red was gone with just a few hidden areas were there was still traces of red. That bike was all bright silver and no sign of any gold anywhere from either paint or UV damaged red paint. Over the years I've seen many 54 and 55 Opal Red bikes were there is a gold tone after all the translucent red paint has vanished. I believe there was what the experts call "a piss coat" of gold shot over the silver base coat on these 54 and 55's and that's pretty evident in the pictures.

Here's a faded worn 1959 and no signs of gold. Then the 54 Jag where the red was long gone years ago. Note the cantilever bar where it's scratched. Gold then silver then primer. And a few other shots of that Corvette.


.
As you're clearly attempting to undermine me for my usage of the term of 'clear red' vs transparent . Not to forget stalking me for years too. Yet little do you know or understand ]quote GTs58, ";I've also come across a vast amount of translucent Red Schwinn bikes where the red paint has faded a vast amount of translucent Red Schwinn bikes"

Translucent you say? is semitransparent and Schwinn's top coats, at least into the 1980's ,metallic type of colors, are all transparent. . 1 ,more time: their top coat is transparent, (clear that's tinted with a color but many think of transparent as translucent too.

So, B/C I've discussed transparent, semi and translucent colors for more than 20 years in sites like this, for whatever reason people seem to visualize it's completely transparent when 'clear' (an incorrect word or term) is added when describing the color. . Yet clear is not a color, but 'clear red' is, Go figure? In the mean time stop this nonsense of stocking me, calling me a pot head in topics . Not to leave out ignorance in this nonsense of a gold base under opal red. jeez. Unlike U I own a 55 faded to gold corvette, and the evidence; you're miles off reality, are the photos I've provided,[wink]l' Hint: guaranteed; dopes are the self proclaimed experts or wizards.
 
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Freqman1

Riding a '37 Dayton Super Streamline
Jul 14, 2009
17,570
20,703
Evans, GA
#12
Probably walking into the middle of a poo storm here but Schwinn didn’t use a gold base coat on these. I’ve seen a ‘57 Phantom where one side was gold and the other red. The red oxidizes and turns to a gold color
 
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GTs58

I'm the Wiz, and nobody beats me!
Sep 2, 2012
10,652
9,467
Central Arizona
#13
Quote:
What color is apple red?
Candy apple red (occasionally known as apple-candy red) is the name code used by manufacturing companies to define a shade of red similar to the red sugar coating on candied apples. The typical method for producing a candy apple finish is to apply a metallic base-coat, followed by a translucent color coat.


I've seen faded out red paint over the years and being in Arizona where the sun kills all paint, I have never seen a red paint fade out to gold. And if one thinks it does, why does this situation seem to be happening only to Schwinn's early Opal? And why doesn't this happen on every candy Red bike that Schwinn produced? Maybe a paint chemist can answer the questions.
 

razinhellcustomz

Wore out three sets of tires already!
May 28, 2018
970
471
59
kiel wisconsin
#14
That is NOT "gold base coat" The color shift from red to an orange-ish-gold tone is due to sitting in the sun for several years, (Ultra violet rays exposure).the silver/aluminum coat does not fade as much under the clear red top finish coat. Clearly protected somewhat from Ultra violet rays by the decal, as seen in the chain guard. "Gold base coat" Nonsense: Fore Peat's sake how many timeds ave fact vs fiction over this faded color have you been told ? Take off the head badge on a faded Opel red Schwinn and crap "gold tone" faded red is revealed Proof positive it's just crap clear red top coat 'Candy apple red' with no ultra violet protection in Schwinn's paint producer. >>>>>
>>> View attachment 1031953
As you're clearly attempting to undermine me for my usage of the term of 'clear red' vs transparent . Not to forget stalking me for years too. Yet little do you know or understand ]quote GTs58, ";I've also come across a vast amount of translucent Red Schwinn bikes where the red paint has faded a vast amount of translucent Red Schwinn bikes"

Translucent you say? is semitransparent and Schwinn's top coats, at least into the 1980's ,metallic type of colors, are all transparent. . 1 ,more time: their top coat is transparent, (clear that's tinted with a color but many think of transparent as translucent too.

So, B/C I've discussed transparent, semi and translucent colors for more than 20 years in sites like this, for whatever reason people seem to visualize it's completely transparent when 'clear' (an incorrect word or term) is added when describing the color. . Yet clear is not a color, but 'clear red' is, Go figure? In the mean time stop this nonsense of stocking me, calling me a pot head in topics . Not to leave out ignorance in this nonsense of a gold base under opal red. jeez. Unlike U I own a 55 faded to gold corvette, and the evidence; you're miles off reality, are the photos I've provided,[wink]l' Hint: guaranteed; dopes are the self proclaimed experts or wizards.
I would like to know what base coat was used for the coppertone color? Thanks from a FLAPPER ACCORDING TO GTS58. Thanks. Razin.
 

razinhellcustomz

Wore out three sets of tires already!
May 28, 2018
970
471
59
kiel wisconsin
#15
Probably walking into the middle of a poo storm here but Schwinn didn’t use a gold base coat on these. I’ve seen a ‘57 Phantom where one side was hold and the other red. The red oxidizes and turns to a gold color
I would agree , Shawn. I have several red schwinns that have done the same thing due to years of exposure to the UV rays ETC. Thanks. Razin.
 

razinhellcustomz

Wore out three sets of tires already!
May 28, 2018
970
471
59
kiel wisconsin
#16
Probably walking into the middle of a poo storm here but Schwinn didn’t use a gold base coat on these. I’ve seen a ‘57 Phantom where one side was hold and the other red. The red oxidizes and turns to a gold color
I would agree , Shawn. I have several red schwinns that have done the same thing due to years of exposure to the UV rays ETC. Thanks. Razin.
 

Mark Johnston

Finally riding a big boys bike
Apr 16, 2017
249
589
54
Phoenix
#17
Don’t know if this helps, but I managed to recreate a decent Coppertone using Duplicolor “Chrome” engine paint for a base, with a light coat of Duplicolor “Copper” over it.
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515CBB17-8D3D-47DA-BD7E-F1B35B56B621.jpeg
 

GTs58

I'm the Wiz, and nobody beats me!
Sep 2, 2012
10,652
9,467
Central Arizona
#18
Probably walking into the middle of a poo storm here but Schwinn didn’t use a gold base coat on these. I’ve seen a ‘57 Phantom where one side was hold and the other red. The red oxidizes and turns to a gold color
Are you 100% sure of that? Can you prove this is the case with these examples?
A true red does not use any other pigmentation to where the red would fade out leaving a gold color and red does not oxidize turning to gold. Candy Apple Red as they call it was normally shot over a silver or gold base, usually a metallic or metalflake, depending on what the final desired color was. A gold base gave the red candy a warmer and darker shade of red, and I don't understand how anyone would say Schwinn never used gold under some of their Opal colors.
Maybe @mrg can take a close look at his example and tell us what he thinks. It sure looks like a piss coat of gold over a silver base when the red pigmentation completely faded away.


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No gold what so ever on @vincev Red Klunker.

Quote: Thanks for the info.It was from out west and the paint is really faded away but a resto would ruin it for me.



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I hate to bother him, but @Metacortex has a collection of Schwinn Reporters and this topic might be mentioned in one of the issues.
 
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Likes: Mymando

razinhellcustomz

Wore out three sets of tires already!
May 28, 2018
970
471
59
kiel wisconsin
#19

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