Shelby Hiawatha - my first Ballooner

[Axman88]

Thanks for the pictures with the tape measure, now I know what my extra set of truss rods are for.....I knew they were Shelby but didn't know the year.

I always find it useful to have a dimensional frame of reference in these kinds of shots. I took pics of pretty much everything while it was apart. Here's a few more that some future visitor might find useful.
frame:

Downtube: I think I was burning an inch at the top of the downtube, which makes the center of crank to top of seatpost look like 20" in this picture. I had a smaller number in my head, for some reason. Parallax?!

Head tube:

The prewar "snowflake" chainwheel was put on the bike by the previous owner.

I don't know how long images attached in this way will last? Some years ago, I diligently setup a cloud storage, and dutifully attached images as links, but that site lost the domain, and all my links were broken. I do size them down a bit before pasting them here, so hopefully I'm not wasting too much data space?

After riding the bike for a few days, I have to say that I'm not unhappy with the 52/20 (26/10 skiptooth) drive ratio.

This sprocket ratio with the 26x2.125, 559 tires gives 67.4 gear inches, or a 5.0 with Sheldon Browns "Gain Ratio" which takes the length of the crank arms into account. https://www.sheldonbrown.com/gear-calc.html

My English 3 speed, with it's 26x1-3/8 tires on 590 wheels and AW hub running 48/18 gives me
Gear Inches Gain Ratio
Low 51.8" 4.0
Mid 69.2" 5.4
Hi 92.1" 7.2

I think either of these systems beats discussing ratios only in terms of sprocket teeth counts, because the sprocket ratio number doesn't account for the considerable effect of wheel diameter and crank length on distance traveled and effort required. Here's more info on the methods. https://www.sheldonbrown.com/gloss_g.html#gearinch
https://www.sheldonbrown.com/gain.html

I can push the Hiawatha up to it's cruising speed without too much trouble. On my 5.6 mile commute, I've made an average travel time of about 32 minutes, including stoplights and a mild morning quartering headwind. That's 10.5 mph average, and better than I can manage in the car, which is sorely limited by traffic and traffic control devices.

 

[NBHAA]

Regarding so-called "Shelby Hiawathas"... There is no such thing as a "Shelby Hiawatha." It is either a Shelby... or a Hiawatha. Can't be both. This is a bicycle collector's myth. Just like there is no such thing as an "Edsel Mercury" automobile.

Hiawatha was its own brand and was not part of the Shelby line. Nor was it part of the Shelby Cycle Company. Nor did Shelby make all Hiawathas. Some, yes for certain years and certain models. All? No way.

Biggest mistake made by people attempting to do DIY history on Hiawathas is to look for Shelby stuff (like old ads) and then expect/assume one to be exactly like the other. Using "if this, therefore that" logic. It just does not work that way.

Also it is a mistake to think that Hiawatha bicycles were sold only by "Gambles Department Stores"... they weren't. They were sold by lots and lots of stores, coast to coast.

Finally Hiawatha bicycles were made by numerous bicycle companies. "Hiawatha" was not Shelby Cycle Company, nor was it any particular bicycle company. Nor was it a model name. "Hiawatha" was a brand name... in itself. SOME– not all– were sold in Gambles stores. Many were not.

Adult analysis of these bicycles and attempts to rationalize their performance and gearing into what makes sense to an adult in 2023 will always prove to be frustrating. These bicycles were not made for touring or adult style riding. They were primarily made for kids. And most kids in the era when these bicycles were made tended to live in cities. And tended NOT to ride in streets or nicely paved roads. A bicycle might have been used for a paper route (as mine was) or to ride to school or the local park (as mine was). Otherwise, these bicycles cruised the sidewalks on the block where one lived. Things were very different back then.

National Bicycle History Archive of America has extensive files on Hiawatha bicycles. My friend, the late Brooks Stevens, designed many of the Hiawathas. And yours truly began collecting Hiawatha bicycle literature in the 1950s. So we know these bicycles.

Leon Dixon
National Bicycle History Archive of America
(NBHAA.com)

 

[stezell]

So Mr. Dixon I guess it would be correct to say some were Shelby built Hiawatha badged bicycles?

V/r
Sean

 

[NBHAA]

As I already stated. Shelby-built. But not Shelby. And not merely an existing Shelby with a "Hiawatha" badge slapped on it.

Just like Sears bicycles... some were Murray-built... but they were definitely not "Murray" bicycles. An Edsel automobile was built by Ford Motor Company... but it was certainly not a Ford.

 

[49autocycledeluxe]

so in your world is my 1942 BFG Schwinn not a Schwinn with a BFG badge?

 

[NBHAA]

No. In YOUR world your BFG whatever is still a BFG whatever.

I didn't make it so, B.F. Goodrich and Arnold, Schwinn & Company made it so. THEY wrote the rules and made the differences.... that you apparently are not aware of.

There is a reason why Arnold, Schwinn & Company invented/coined the term "Schwinn-Built"... but for whatever reason people in hobbies today who see themselves as experts think they are smarter than Schwinn... and even smarter than B.F. Goodrich. And these people want to tell us there was really no difference between ASC and BFG... and that Hiawathas are really Shelbys... and that Murrays are really just J.C. Higgins with different names. No difference. Just one big dumbed-down, generic boulliabaisse. No need to differentiate because then you've have to LEARN something.

AND if the dead people who you want to argue with were alive, they'd tell you to look, listen and read the factory literature from BFG. The stuff that BFG sent out to their dealers. Some of it even listed differences. But then... you've already done that... haven't you?

 

[49autocycledeluxe]

... it is exactly like the other one I used to have with the Schwinn Liberty badge.

I used to have a BFG Schwinn DX as well. same bike other than paint.

 

[Axman88]

Regarding so-called "Shelby Hiawathas"... There is no such thing as a "Shelby Hiawatha." It is either a Shelby... or a Hiawatha. Can't be both. This is a bicycle collector's myth. Just like there is no such thing as an "Edsel Mercury" automobile.

Hiawatha was its own brand and was not part of the Shelby line. Nor was it part of the Shelby Cycle Company. Nor did Shelby make all Hiawathas. Some, yes for certain years and certain models. All? No way.



National Bicycle History Archive of America has extensive files on Hiawatha bicycles. My friend, the late Brooks Stevens, designed many of the Hiawathas. And yours truly began collecting Hiawatha bicycle literature in the 1950s. So we know these bicycles.

Thanks for your response. I understood that Hiawatha was a brand, not a model or manufacturer going in. I called it a Shelby Hiawatha because the seller had, and personally interpreted the term to mean "Hiawatha made by Shelby". I probably should have called it a "Hiawatha by Shelby", or "Shelby built Hiawatha".

I was inclined to think it was made by Shelby, not only because the seller had so indicated, but because the construction appeared consistent with their badged products in various ways, the frame design, the tube spacing, the bronze colored undercoating in the brazed areas, and parts like the truss components and brackets.

With your detailed knowledge, what manufacturer would you think made my particular bike. Who do you think sold it? What would be the correct specific model designation of Hiawatha? I see my bike's serial # is now appearing on the Shelby "mystery / War bikes?" list labeled as "DCO". What does "DCO" mean.

 

[SKPC]

"DCO" is made up by me to mean Double Curved Offset, a style of frame. Your "H" 5-digit serial number with the odd font "9" is manufactured 42-46ish...ish and not sure I would bet on when it was built. Leon may as he may have literature or data relating to this difficult time. "War Bikes?" is just a question, not a statement. The Shelby Badged Serial number thread is simply narrowing down and uncovering the serial number "mystery" that is still unfolding as bikes are vetted. Hopefully it provides more clarity for what is and what isn't.

 

[Axman88]

"DCO" is made up by me to mean Double Curved Offset, a style of frame. Your "H" 5-digit serial number with the odd font "9" is manufactured 42-46ish...ish and not sure I would bet on when it was built. Leon may as he may have literature or data relating to this difficult time. "War Bikes?" is just a question, not a statement. The Shelby Badged Serial number thread is simply narrowing down and uncovering the serial number "mystery" that is still unfolding as bikes are vetted. Hopefully it provides more clarity for what is and what isn't.

Thanks for your response.

I wanted to mention that when I took a look back at my picture of the serial on the hanger bracket, it appears like there might be a final digit, close spaced behind the 9, perhaps a "2", or "3", which would make the number six digits, like perhaps H338192, if that makes any more sense? I didn't notice it till much later. Haven't gone back and look at the steel again either.

Is there a thread on the technique people use to expose serial #s? I didn't do anything to reveal the number on mine, the bike came to me as pictured, must have been a P.O. who scraped the paint off.