# What a find! Pre War Hawthorne?



## partsguy (Nov 14, 2009)

Well, I decided to go to the Springfield car parts swap meet today and I found this there. It is complete, minus what I believe was a headlight. An old man was selling it and said his mom bought it brand new in 1940 or 1941 when they lived in Virginia (or was it West Virginia?). I asked about the tank and he said there were batteries in it but the only kind of rust or corrosion was towards the bottom. It still had the rear reflector on the rackand in good shape! I believe the rear tire is original. It has been repainted, but it's original color was blue as well and the original color can be seen inside the tank. I could tell it ran and I decided I would finish looking and comeback. I cameback and it was still there. The deal was done and she was hauled out. Dad and I had some difficulty getting it to fit in the car and I had to remove the basket, manuvure it around, and my dad had to puch down the handle bars and do the same. Only after all this and we got in the car did I realize my right had blood on it because I cut it and didn't notice.

Is this bike really a 1940 or 1941? What year is it? How would I decode the numbers? What is the horn supposed to sound like on these? Mine makes a "popping" noise. It works, but it makes a popping noise and I don't think it's normal. Is there anyhing that is not original to the bike or is missing that I don't know about? Let me know, these are new waters for me.










The rear tire that I believe might be original or just really old:







Seat needs some repair on the seems:


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## OldRider (Nov 14, 2009)

I could very well be wrong but I don't think that seat is original to that bike.My early 70's  3 speeds have those seats.


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## SimpleMan (Nov 14, 2009)

Nice find.......one of my favorite CWC ladies bikes. Heres a picture of my wifes Hawthorne. I've changed the grips and pedals since this photo was taken, but this is pretty much what an original one looks like. Looks like a seat and chain guard are about all you need as far as original parts.


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## Strings-n-Spokes (Nov 14, 2009)

The popping noise is probably a dirty contact, I think cleaning off all the contact point, battery terminals and switch contacts with fine sandpaper will help.

It is a CWC made bike, that rack is really nice, is their a light in it?

It probably had truss rods, prior to the basket being installed.

Gonna be a nice looking bike when it gets cleaned up.


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## RMS37 (Nov 14, 2009)

The bike is a Cleveland Welding built Hawthorne. It is postwar, probably a 1947.  That tank was not produced before the war and the similar prewar version of the frame would have tangs for a drop stand. 

SimpleMan?s bike is an excellent example of what the bike should look like complete. The basket is an addition and usurped the space where the truss rods and the headlight originally resided. The IRC Special tire is actually an imported replacement probably from the 1980?s. The original tires would have been Riverside Mates branded for MW.

The serial number is stamped into the bottom of the crank hanger and will have a letter followed by five numbers. You may also have a Cw suffix but I think your bike may be earlier than that. If you post or PM the number I?ll give you my interpretation of it.


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## partsguy (Nov 14, 2009)

RMS37 said:


> The bike is a Cleveland Welding built Hawthorne. It is postwar, probably a 1947.  That tank was not produced before the war and the similar prewar version of the frame would have tangs for a drop stand.
> 
> SimpleMan’s bike is an excellent example of what the bike should look like complete. The basket is an addition and usurped the space where the truss rods and the headlight originally resided. The IRC Special tire is actually an imported replacement probably from the 1980’s. The original tires would have been Riverside Mates branded for MW.
> 
> The serial number is stamped into the bottom of the crank hanger and will have a letter followed by five numbers. You may also have a Cw suffix but I think your bike may be earlier than that. If you post or PM the number I’ll give you my interpretation of it.







The number is (drumroll

B11742        C (with a small "w" inside the "C")


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## partsguy (Nov 14, 2009)

Strings-n-Spokes said:


> The popping noise is probably a dirty contact, I think cleaning off all the contact point, battery terminals and switch contacts with fine sandpaper will help.
> 
> It is a CWC made bike, that rack is really nice, is their a light in it?
> 
> ...




Thanks. What you see is a reflector, very nice design too. I removed it though because I don't want it to get broken, it was already chipped when I bought it!


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## partsguy (Nov 15, 2009)

Wonderful news! The horn works! My neighbors dog was right next to me and I honked it. That samp could jump! While I was trying to fix it, my brother thought it was someone's car alarm going off or some kid playing with a car horn. He then realized it was me.


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## RMS37 (Nov 16, 2009)

I checked your serial number against my model and added your bike to the database this morning.

The model places B11742 Cw in the middle of 1947. This is based on spreading the known CWC postwar production volume based on serial numbers over the production span for these bikes and interpolating the date of manufacture. 

The model also falls into step with the series of changes made to the frames over this time period. Those that are relevant to your bike include that it has the second style of postwar rear dropouts and does not have the seat clamp with the annular ring (which was introduced in 1948.) 

While SimpleMan?s bike is a great reference for your bike, you may also be interested in checking out this bike, B21291; a Hawthorne currently listed on eBay with a serial number that is probably less than a month newer than yours.

Item number: 350277686050


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## partsguy (Nov 16, 2009)

RMS37, where do you get this info. at? I did a search on thecabe and nothing turned up. Also, is there something like a color chart I could look at? After some "forensic" work, I found out that my bike had cream or white colored accents. I knew it's main color was blue, and I have the inside of the tank to use for a match. The inner tank and tank braces are untouched and pretty clean.


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## Strings-n-Spokes (Nov 16, 2009)

It looks like the Ebay bike has a mens seat.


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## partsguy (Nov 17, 2009)

Strings-n-Spokes said:


> It looks like the Ebay bike has a mens seat.




It does? What is the difference?


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## partsguy (Nov 17, 2009)

Update, since the basket isn't original, I ditched it and I must say, it looks much better. I have asked the seller on eBay if he would part the bike out. I'd hate to pay that to ship a bike which most of it, I won't even need.


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## Strings-n-Spokes (Nov 17, 2009)

Mens seats are longer front to back, whereas a ladies seat is usually about as long as it is wide.


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## partsguy (Nov 18, 2009)

I asked the guy if would part out the red Hawthorne, as I didn't want to pay $150.00 shipping for something that I'll only need a few parts from. He said he'll sell me the truss rods, chaingaurd, and seat for $70.00! Is that really a fair price? The whole bike was $60.00! :eek:


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## RMS37 (Nov 19, 2009)

Hi, I?ve been trying to get back to this thread but all of a sudden CWC bikes are floating to the surface everywhere. Here is another bike, similar to yours on eBay (offered up by CABEr Eazywind)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=360209334790&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT

I just posted some background information in another thread about my CWC serial number project. Basically my serial number/production date model has been constructed over time by constantly adding serial numbers to a data base and combining that information with what I have been able to gather from factory catalogs and real world observations. 

I don?t have any factory or catalog information on paints from the time period your bike was produced. As far as color charts go in general, you are better off if you find an unmolested area of the bike to sample (which it sounds like you did.) 

Hawthorne advertised the use of some specific automotive paint colors just before WW2 but I don?t know if the practice was continued after the war or if the colors were truly formulated to match the named automobiles or only to approximate them. Printed sample colors or descriptions by themselves are good for an idea of what was available at the time but are not very useful for samples to scan and match to.


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## partsguy (Nov 19, 2009)

You are right about the unolested area of paint. The inside of the tank is where I found it. It was truely a beautiful shade of blue in it's heyday before it was repainted. 

What do you think of the price for those parts? should I deline? $70.00 sounds a bit steep. It is only the truss rods, chaingaurd, and seat. (red eBay bike)


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## RMS37 (Nov 19, 2009)

Whether or not the package is generally a good deal monetarily, in your case I would hold out for a better deal... The chain guard on the red bike is an after market replacement and is not correct (one of the photos shows the remainder of the clamp from the original guard.) The seat is a boy's seat so it is also not correct for your bike. That leaves the truss rods which, by themselves, are probably not worth what is being asked. I also noticed that the whole bike is now being listed as a buy-it-now for $60.00.


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## npence (Nov 24, 2009)

I might have some truss rods for you. I live in sidney ohio just north of you on I-75. Also might have the chainguard you need if you can get a picture of one and maybe a seat.


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## partsguy (Nov 24, 2009)

npence said:


> I might have some truss rods for you. I live in sidney ohio just north of you on I-75. Also might have the chainguard you need if you can get a picture of one and maybe a seat.




I live so close, I can look at them in person if I can find a day to do it or next time I have a scrap haul.


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## npence (Nov 24, 2009)

your invited up whenever you have time just have to let me know in advance.


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## Cyclops Bikes (Dec 13, 2013)

SimpleMan said:


> Nice find.......one of my favorite CWC ladies bikes. Heres a picture of my wifes Hawthorne. I've changed the grips and pedals since this photo was taken, but this is pretty much what an original one looks like. Looks like a seat and chain guard are about all you need as far as original parts.




What year is your wife's Hawthorne?  Original paint?  I've got a complete men's real similar without the truss rods and I think a light.  I would love to restore it to original paint scheme but am having trouble locating pictures.

Thanks, 

Mark


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