# Please help Identify This Bike



## fat tire trader (Feb 12, 2013)

Hello,
Can anyone identify this bike

http://www.fattiretrading.com/teensmystery.html

Thanks,
Chris


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## bricycle (Feb 12, 2013)

Hey Chris..Columbia badge imprint was my first instinct too. Other than that, the vintage would be about 1897-1902 or there-'bout's. It needs a loving good home. hint..


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## fat tire trader (Feb 12, 2013)

I don't know if this one shall stay, or shall it  go. I think the next step will be to trace the badge marks, so that others can compare badges. This bike needs a stinking badge.


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## MrColumbia (Feb 12, 2013)

I think it is a Pope made bike. It may have  been badged with one of the other names from the ABC.


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## fat tire trader (Feb 12, 2013)

Thanks Mr. Columbia,
Assuming that it is a Pope, is there a way to narrow down what year it might be. For example, in 1909, they came out with a new crack shaft mechanism, was this used on all models, and when did they stop using it?






Thanks,
Chris


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## chitown (Feb 12, 2013)

Drop-outs/chain adjusters don't look like Pope Mfg. I thought Pope had a solid piece that was threaded? Though with all the companies Pope was buying and liquidating at this time, it could be any number of factory origins under the Pope umbrella.


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## eazywind (Feb 12, 2013)

*Victor badge, same design*

I have a Victor badge with that cutout style. Don't know if Victor badged bikes were made by pope or not, though. Marc


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## bike (Feb 12, 2013)

*Ususually*



chitown said:


> Drop-outs/chain adjusters don't look like Pope Mfg. I thought Pope had a solid piece that was threaded? Though with all the companies Pope was buying and liquidating at this time, it could be any number of factory origins under the Pope umbrella.




I have found columbia and higher line bikes use the sold threaded piece, lesser the stamped type - one example that is later is the elglin bh or falcon vs col airrider...


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## josehuerta (Feb 12, 2013)

Would this Ranger badge match up?


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## highwheel431 (Feb 12, 2013)

*Not a Columbia*

If the fork is original to this bike it is not a Columbia.  Columbia used the same fork crown from 1900 through the late 20's and perhaps even into the thirties.


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## fat tire trader (Feb 13, 2013)

If the fork is original, I don't have any reason to think that it isn't, then the fork crown might be the clue to identify the bike. Its fork crown is very similar to a Columbia fork crown but is not flat on top, the head set is also different. Here is a photo of the front of one of my chainless bikes for comparison.






Does anyone have a bike with a similar fork crown?

Thanks,
Chris


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## pelletman (Feb 13, 2013)

I don't think Columbia either.  Victor was NOT ever made by Columbia.  Overman and Pope were mortal enemies.   Overman was put under by Spalding and was out of business by 99/00


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## chitown (Feb 14, 2013)

Though not the same as your bike, I'm posting this to show Pope had other types of forks besides the flat crown type.

This is a 1908 Rambler:

View attachment 84126


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## pelletman (Feb 14, 2013)

I think the reference was to Columbia, not all Pope companies after the ABC debacle.. All those bikes would have had their own distinctive features I think.  I think us early guys think Columbia when we thing Pope


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## fat tire trader (Feb 14, 2013)

chitown said:


> Though not the same as your bike, I'm posting this to show Pope had other types of forks besides the flat crown type.
> 
> This is a 1908 Rambler:
> 
> View attachment 84126



That is an attractive fork.
Thanks,
Chris


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## highwheel431 (Feb 15, 2013)

*Pope?*

David you are correct.

I never said that Pope didn't make other styles of fork crowns.  However Columbia's used the flat crown from 1900 into the 30's.  

Just for the record Pope Manufacturing Company didn't exist from 1900 through 1903.  Pope sold out to the American Bicycle Company in 1899.  ABC became American Cycle Manufacturing Company in 1903.  ACM went bankrupt and Pope bought up what was left and it once again became Pope Manufacturing Company in 1904. Pope went bankrupt and it became Westfield Manufacturing Company in 1916. The Columbia brand name continued throughout all the changes then and still today.  When ABC was formed there were 43 companies that came together.  Some of the big names besides Columbia were: Crescent, Rambler, Cleveland, Crawford, Fay, Featherstone, Imperial, Monarch, Spalding, Stearns, Sterling, and Tribune.  Many of the other companies were parts suppliers.

Ross


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## fat tire trader (Mar 26, 2013)

*Could it be a Mead?*




Here is a 1919 Mead Crusader. The fork looks very similar to mine. I would think that my bike is earlier if the handlebar is original. My seat stays are not as curved as the Mead in this picture.



Thanks,
Chris


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## ejlwheels (Mar 26, 2013)

What is the measurement for the mounting badge holes?


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## fat tire trader (Apr 8, 2013)

I sold the bike to Fordsnake yesterday, hopefully he will figure out what it is.


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