# Schwinn Fore Brake on Monark Springer



## Henryford2 (Dec 8, 2018)

Just want to make sure my logic is correct. The orientation in the picture is essentially the only way I can get the Schwinn fore brake to fit in the Monark springer. The question is does the brake stay go on the movable leg or stationary leg. If you mount the brake stay on the stationary leg it would stop the rocker arms from pivoting? If I mount the on the moving leg it moves with the wheel? Thanks


----------



## bike (Dec 8, 2018)

Both move relative to the axle I believe- so...


----------



## Henryford2 (Dec 8, 2018)

Just to confirm, you're saying mount the brake stay to the moving leg? Thanks


----------



## bike (Dec 9, 2018)

no
Either location will cause the brake arm to pivot- the schwinn fork is made so that the arm stays fixed relative to the axle- you cannot mount the schwinn brake on the monark without binding the fork action- will probably bend the fork.


----------



## Autocycleplane (Dec 9, 2018)

If you can make it work I think the worst that will happen is the fork won’t move much while the brake is activated.


----------



## Freqman1 (Dec 9, 2018)

I just gotta ask "why"?


----------



## Autocycleplane (Dec 9, 2018)

Freqman1 said:


> I just gotta ask "why"?




Safety. I don’t like riding without one. You know I’m putting one on whatever poor fleetwood I eventually end up with.


----------



## Henryford2 (Dec 9, 2018)

I'm trying not to reinvent the wheel. Drum brakes on a springer front end is not a  "new" concept. So I'm hoping someone can share some past success (or even failures) in making this conversion.  I can't mount the brake stay to the fork without taking into consideration the swing (arc) motion of the springer. The brake arm moves towards the bike approx. 11/16" when the springs on  the forks are completely collapsed.


----------



## WES PINCHOT (Dec 9, 2018)

I AGREE!  
THERE DOES NOT SEEM TO BE A SOLUTION TO MAKE THIS INSTALLATION WORK!
SOMETHING HAS TO GIVE OR SOMETHING IS GOING TO GET DAMAGED.
BE THE BRAKE ARM OR FORK/SPRINGER  LEGS.  
BETTER TO PUT THE BRAKE ON A SCHWINN.


----------



## Henryford2 (Dec 9, 2018)

Wes, I enjoy and embrace the quote "Those who say it can't be done are usually interrupted by others doing it". HD has been combining drum brakes and springer front ends for a long time. I was hoping to find some who was willing to share their success in making this change. If not, I'll eventually figure it out. Thanks.


----------



## SKPC (Dec 9, 2018)

I have seen it done over on RRB.  @TheRenaisanceMan  fabricated a short rocker arm that rotated on the back portion of the fork pivot(Beehive Springer) that attached to the brake arm.  He had the brake mech. on the right side of the bike as I remember. I'll look for a pic.  It was on an unfinished project.


----------



## WES PINCHOT (Dec 9, 2018)

MY HUMBLE APOLOGY!  FROM A SCHWINN COLLECTOR!
INGENUITY IS THE MOTHER OF INVENTION!
I HOPE ONE OF THESE CABERS CAN HELP YOU.
LOTS OF EXPERTISE WITH THE CABE.


----------



## cyclingday (Dec 9, 2018)

The two point pivot attachment is what needs to be done.
The Huffman Twin Flex uses a small strap  that just allows for the slight amount of movement needed to accommodate the action of the swing arm.


----------



## Henryford2 (Dec 9, 2018)

Wes, no apologies needed. I am a "newbie" to the bicycle hobby and respect your breadth of knowledge and experience in the hobby. Perhaps the error is mine in posting this question on the CABE rather than a more "appropriate".


----------



## WES PINCHOT (Dec 9, 2018)

THE 'CABE' IS THE HEART OF THE HOBBY!
THE MOST APPROPRIATE AND BEST PLACE TO ASK QUESTIONS.


----------



## GTs58 (Dec 9, 2018)

..


cyclingday said:


> The two point pivot attachment is what needs to be done.
> The Huffman Twin Flex uses a small strap  that just allows for the slight amount of movement needed to accommodate the action of the swing arm.



 Something like a leaf spring shackle right?


----------



## SKPC (Dec 10, 2018)

Here you go. Jims'(@The Rennaisance Man) pics and solution..







This is a Beehive linkage springer but has the same action as on your Monarch springer.  The axle, dropout link and brake arm move together as one by attaching the brake arm to the pivot, not the leg.


----------



## Henryford2 (Dec 10, 2018)

Thanks, nice idea. I actually found this as well on the RRB forum. I might be over thinking this due to my inexperience with bikes, but this setup does answer the problem with the pivoting of the brake arm due to the springer action, but does it help with the motion of the brake arm due to the torque on it generated when braking? It would appear that the arm would simply pivot if there is any arm movement due to the braking torque? Does the mounting need to accommodate the pivoting of the springer arms and also keep the arm from moving  due to the brake arm torque when braking? Thanks


----------



## SKPC (Dec 11, 2018)

Just remember that the hubs' axle, face, and arm are all fixed to the dropout plate by the axle bolts being tightened.   It all moves together (rotating up and slightly backwards) as the fork compresses as you mention.  The brake arm can't be fixed to either leg without binding the springer action. You have to somehow fabricate a metal plate or rod that fixes the end of the brake arm to ONE of the pivots. With the hubs' brake arm on the left side as you show, the rear pivot as an attachment point would give you the proper angular strength compared to the front pivot.    Keep us posted on what you come up with..


----------



## Henryford2 (Dec 11, 2018)

Following  SKPC's suggestions here are two alternatives, each have different advantages/ disadvantages. The first is using the rear pivot as the attachment point. You can see that with the springs on the springer compressed, the arm follows the pivot. There is a very slight bind on the screw at the Schwinn brake arm, but this can be taken care of easily. It does give a better angular strength. The only downside was that it used up the space on the longer rear shoulder bolt that is normally used for the fender stays to mount the arm (popsicle stick). 

The second alternative was to add the arm on the front pivot. Did this by replacing the short shoulder bolt normally found on the front and replacing it with a longer one. It allowed the brake arm to pivot with the springer motion as well. This option would still allow me to use the longer shoulder bolt on the rear leg for the fender stays. Perhaps the steep angle could cause some issues but it's not immediately evident.

Soliciting opinions as to what appears to be the better solution. Thanks again for all the help/advice. Joe


----------



## SKPC (Dec 11, 2018)

Try also flipping the wheel so the brake face & arm is on the right side & connected to the front pivot?


----------



## Henryford2 (Dec 11, 2018)

Nope, it does pivot but very little room to work with. I also noted that it seemed to make compressing the springer springs more difficult, in fact my popsicle stick broke!
Any reason you wanted to see the brake reversed, other than "what if"? The brake arm would also occupy the same space as the fender stays.






View attachment 917620


----------



## SKPC (Dec 12, 2018)

Problematic one way or another when trying to rig this to work.  Looks like at this point it is back to the left side mount idea.  To be perfectly honest, this highly desire-able Schwinn fore brake would be better suited on a single pivot fork or rigid fork or Schwinnster Bicycle Restoration.
     You may want to look into the Monarch reproduction rockers/fork that have been designed with Disk Brake mounts on them,  but it would require building a new wheel with a disc hub, and then picking up a proven Avid BB5-7 mechanical disc brake setup....  Good luck HF2!


----------



## Henryford2 (Dec 13, 2018)

No problem, I'm moving the torque arm back to the left and using the rear pivot. The only difference is I'm moving it to the outside of the fork rather than trying to stick it between the fork and the wheel. This way I can fasten the fender stays normally and all I have to do is make up a "new" shoulder bolt to mount  the pivot. Easy Peasy. The fork is a Monark reproduction, the original was too bad to use, going to a disc brake doesn't hold true to the spirit of the intended build. Thanks for the help, I'll be sure to post some pictures when it's done.


----------



## SKPC (Dec 13, 2018)

Yep. Seems to be the best option in your case with your build-up.  Really like the extra stop with drums, so I also run a few of them.   When you are done with the rigging, show us a pic!  skpc


----------

