# TOC? Teens? Elgin King



## Nickinator (Apr 6, 2014)

Picked this up locally today, had been hanging in garage rafters for 40+ years. Not sure how many parts are correct or even what year it is, guy said his father was working on restoring it before he died (note the chromed pedals, stem and chainring).

Solid wood rims don't match exactly, and rear hub is a coaster brake, frame was stripped of orig paint but fork is still orig and both holes are closed...stem?? not sure on that part being period correct at all, and it doesn't fit in the headtube well, possibly due to the rechroming? Bars? Seat? Chainring? Has a nice block chain.

Anyone know what year this would be, and what is the history behind Elgin King? Would like to know if parts are correct, but may end up as a parts bike if it's pieced together. And may be at MLC/AA. Thx!

Darcie


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## Nickinator (Apr 6, 2014)




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## chitown (Apr 6, 2014)

Here is a 1912 Sears catalog pic for reference.


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## Nickinator (Apr 6, 2014)

chitown said:


> Here is a 1912 Sears catalog pic for reference....




That's it alright! ...and looks like most of the parts are correct. The PO gave us his dad's notebook where he'd drawn out the red "head" and gold pinstriping before stripping the frame, just like in your pic.

Question- OK I see this was made for Sears, but by whom, and when was the first Elgin made?

Thx Chitown!

Darcie


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## jpromo (Apr 6, 2014)

Good looking bike there! I picked up a similar bike recently, a 1908 Peerless, also sold by Sears. Mine had mismatched wheels too and I've seen several others since with the same ailment. I figure the rear wheel has been swapped because many 1900s bikes would have come with a fixed hub out back. A coaster was an option on mine for 3$ more; but 3$ on a 17$ bicycle is quite the expense. So the 20s roll around and the owner throws a newer wheel on the old bike out back to get a thoroughly modern coaster brake.


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## ejlwheels (Apr 6, 2014)

I have 4 Davis made frames like that.
Check the serial number on the bottom bracket.
Is there a serial number running parallel to the chain wheel?
I think Davis was supplying a lot of frames for Sears at that time.


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## Nickinator (Apr 7, 2014)

Jason we also figured the rear wheel was swapped, due to the coaster brake, but didn't know it was an option even then, good to know. When were coaster brakes pretty standard?

Eric the S/N is 66055. Davis?

Also, when were the first Elgins made? 

Thx!

Darcie


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## Gordon (Apr 7, 2014)

*Elgin*

Looks very similar to mine, but I think mine might be a year or two older. Mine still has original paint. Same grips and fork I think. Saddle is different. Mine has armless Eclipse hub with 1908 patent date.


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## fat tire trader (Apr 7, 2014)

Gordon,
Do you mind showing a picture of the armless Eclipse hub? I did not know that one existed.
Thanks,
Chris


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## Nickinator (Apr 7, 2014)

Gordon said:


> Looks very similar to mine, but I think mine might be a year or two older. Mine still has original paint. Same grips and fork I think. Saddle is different. Mine has armless Eclipse hub with 1908 patent date.




Wow that's a nice looking bike.

Darcie


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## bricycle (Apr 7, 2014)

Darcie/Nick, There was a co. by the Name of Elgin Cycle co. of Elgin Illinois that built bikes from 1895-1908. This may be one of those.
Jenkins Cycle works also built some of the bikes for Sears & Roebuck. This badge is a bit different from one I have. 
There were: Elgin Kings, Elgin Queens, Acme Kings, Red Heads, Napoleons, Masters and a few others.


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## Gordon (Apr 7, 2014)

*hub*

My apologies. Obviously my memory is not what it used to be. The hub on my King is not an Eclipse but is an Improved Peerless. From the patent information, it was invented by Peter O'hono and the original assignee was AJ Musselman.


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## bricycle (Apr 7, 2014)

Saddle is about 10-15 years newer, srem, pedals appear replated? Dibbs on those juicy grips....


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## Nickinator (Apr 7, 2014)

The bike was taken apart in the 70s and the guys intention was to restore it but, he only got around to plating the pedals, chainring and neck then he just left it.

Nick.



bricycle said:


> Saddle is about 10-15 years newer, srem, pedals appear replated? Dibbs on those juicy grips....


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## tbone (Apr 7, 2014)

i have been seeing a lot of elgins around this time period lately... well maybe not a lot, but more than i normally see.

this one just sold yest
http://www.ebay.com/itm/221405756000?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2648


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## fat tire trader (Apr 7, 2014)

tbone said:


> i have been seeing a lot of elgins around this time period lately... well maybe not a lot, but more than i normally see.
> 
> this one just sold yest
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/221405756000?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2648




Except that bike, I was watching the auction too, is not an Elgin. It is a DP Harriss/Snyder Cadet.


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## fat tire trader (Apr 7, 2014)

Gordon said:


> My apologies. Obviously my memory is not what it used to be. The hub on my King is not an Eclipse but is an Improved Peerless. From the patent information, it was invented by Peter O'hono and the original assignee was AJ Musselman.



Thanks!
It is a Peerless branded Musselman.


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## Nickinator (Apr 7, 2014)

bricycle said:


> Darcie/Nick, There was a co. by the Name of Elgin Cycle co. of Elgin Illinois that built bikes from 1895-1908. This may be one of those.
> Jenkins Cycle works also built some of the bikes for Sears & Roebuck. This badge is a bit different from one I have.
> There were: Elgin Kings, Elgin Queens, Acme Kings, Red Heads, Napoleons, Masters and a few others.




In the ad Chitown posted, it calls this bike the Red Head Elgin King, and ad was from 1912? Wondering about those dates from the Elgin Cycle Co. then....I am pretty sure it's the same bike as in that ad, but I can't see the badge. Hard to differentiate between 1908 and 1912 isn't it?


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## fat tire trader (Apr 7, 2014)

bricycle said:


> Saddle is about 10-15 years newer, srem, pedals appear replated? Dibbs on those juicy grips....



Why do you think that that saddle is 10-15 years newer? My research leads me to believe that that style saddle was available at least as early as 1915.


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## bricycle (Apr 7, 2014)

I can check my 1906 catalogue....


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## tbone (Apr 7, 2014)

fat tire trader said:


> Except that bike, I was watching the auction too, is not an Elgin. It is a DP Harriss/Snyder Cadet.




HA! tht shows you how much i know.


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## Nickinator (Apr 7, 2014)

fat tire trader said:


> Why do you think that that saddle is 10-15 years newer? My research leads me to believe that that style saddle was available at least as early as 1915.




It looks like the same saddle as the one in that ad to me...Bri ya gotch yer glasses on?


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## bricycle (Apr 7, 2014)

the one in the ad isn't "sprung".
Yes, there were sprung that early, but not super common.


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## Nickinator (Apr 7, 2014)

bricycle said:


> the one in the ad isn't "sprung".
> Yes, there were sprung that early, but not super common.




Yes sorry, the seat I saw was in that Sears ad link posted by Chitown but a few pages in, that seat was listed as an option.


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