# Wolff American identification



## Jesse McCauley (Mar 2, 2022)

Hello Cabe folk! 
I have read a few threads about Wolff American bicycles and the eventual selling of the company, I'm curious if there are any concrete ways of dating these machines? 

Eccentric dropouts, appears it would have had a quilled seatpost- The crankset and fork will probably be key components in dating but I'm not sure? 

Photos come from the seller so I have not seen the bike in person yet.


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## corbettclassics (Mar 2, 2022)

This Wolff doesn't really line up with the early ones from what I can see Jesse. I could be wrong but I don't think it's late 1890s for instance ( 1896/97 ).  I'll look more and see what I come up with.  I think it might be 1898 though or even 1899?

I have an ad showing the new model for 1902 and it basically has this crown so maybe 1902 or later.  It's different than my Wolff-American which I believe is 1900 or maybe '01.

- And with this poster of the woman on a Wolff ( with the same cranks and fork crown ) then maybe dating the poster can help as well with dating that bike.

I have an 1898 catalogue in archives and it does show the cranks and crown basically the same so I think 1898.  Mike Cates is selling a ladies bike on eBay same as that bike and he lists it at 1899.


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## corbettclassics (Mar 2, 2022)

This is my Wolff-American with different fork crown than the one you're inquiring about.  And my badge has rivets where the one you're showing I believe has screws holding it on.  I think screws would have come later but ...


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## Blue Streak (Mar 2, 2022)

Without having the 1898 and 1899 Wolff American catalogs for reference and looking at just the seat binder area and fork crown, I am thinking your frame above is 1898 based on the references below. They describe a new seat post binder design introduced in 1898. 1897 and earlier had pinch type seat post binder. The December 1898 reference states 1899 models will have a new hollow arched fork crown. 

November 25, 1897 - The Cycle Age and Trade Review 







December 16, 1897 - The Cycle Age and Trade Review




January 13, 1898 - The Cycle Age and Trade Review







January 27, 1898 - The Cycle Age and Trade Review







February 3, 1898 - The Cycle Age and Trade Review








December 15, 1898 - The Cycle Age and Trade Review


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## Barnegatbicycles (Mar 2, 2022)




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## corbettclassics (Mar 3, 2022)

I sent Jesse the 1898 catalogue to let him go through it.  I haven't had time to browse but I'm sure it's 1898.  Curious to see what Jesse comes up with.


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## Velo-dream (Mar 5, 2022)

WOLFF-AMERICAN High Art Cycles 1896 catalogue for sale | Sell - Trade: Bicycle Parts, Accessories, Ephemera
					

up for sale = an incredible nice catalogue for sale,  date  1896 : WOLLF -AMERICAN High Art cycles  nice survivor !- very good condition  32 pages with different models of  cycles, parts etc..  400$ shipped, signed for .....or best offer  pay pal for friends only




					thecabe.com


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## Jesse McCauley (Mar 5, 2022)

Happy to report back that this Wolff frame is making it's way through the bikeflights / UPS world to me! 

I will post some better photos once it arrives and we can hopefully get some answers. 
Thanks everyone for your help!


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## New Mexico Brant (Mar 7, 2022)

There are a couple Wolff catalogs available for view at Northwestern's digital collections:






						Digital Collections - Libraries - Northwestern University
					






					digitalcollections.library.northwestern.edu


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## Jesse McCauley (Mar 18, 2022)

I’m still a bit stumped about the exact date and model of this Wolff but here is how it currently sits, hopefully some details that stand out to someone more knowledgeable than myself on these bikes.

I happened to have a set of Wolff pedals in my stash already which I installed. 
I also added the quilled oversized (1” diameter) seatpost, saddle, period / patina collared style semi drop bars, 1/8” Diamond block “racing” chain, and New Departure (BRX / SM) narrow barrel hubs w/ 1/8” cog. The chainline is still a bit tight but I found a couple extra Diamond links even! 

The absence of split bottom and specialized 98’ seatpost attachment is confusing based on others I’ve studied. 
The use of 1/8” wide drivetrain is also worth noting though I’m not sure if it is distinct to particular models.

The chainwheel driveline is interesting as well in that the crank arm brings the chainwheel “inside” the bearing line and runs basically overtop the drive side bottom bracket race.

No serial number visible immediately but it does have a rather thick overpaint I doubt I will mess with.


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## corbettclassics (Mar 18, 2022)

Jesse - ( 2 photos attached )

This is what the correct seat post looks like.  It has a bolt on top so the cluster is clean with no type off attachment etc.


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## Barnegatbicycles (Apr 15, 2022)




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## corbettclassics (Apr 15, 2022)

Barnegatbicycles said:


> View attachment 1607116



The bike Jesse is trying to identify doesn't have that Hex head they are describing here.  I believe that was a one year only thing for Wolff.  

I thought of posting that too but Jesse's bike is definitely not the Hexagon head.


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## Barnegatbicycles (Apr 15, 2022)

corbettclassics said:


> The bike Jesse is trying to identify doesn't have that Hex head they are describing here.  I believe that was a one year only thing for Wolff.
> 
> I thought of posting that too but Jesse's bike is definitely not the Hexagon head.



 Two years that I have found so far 02 and 03. I know it's not his bike.  I was more so posting for the future people who look at this post. It already has a lot of great info on it so why not make someone else's life a bit easier and consolidate information.


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## corbettclassics (Apr 16, 2022)

Barnegatbicycles said:


> Two years that I have found so far 02 and 03. I know it's not his bike.  I was more so posting for the future people who look at this post. It already has a lot of great info on it so why not make someone else's life a bit easier and consolidate information.



I think it would be absolutley fantastic if you could start a separate thread on - "Identifying your Wolff-American bicycle" - for those who own one.  I just figured that we were trying to help identify the particular bike Jesse had and that the "Hexagon Model" didn't really have any relevance to the identity of his bike. If it did then I would have posted that Hex model as well.  I've only got about 60 (or more) pics etc in my "Wolff-American" archive section (and need more!) but figured it's senseless to start posting everything if it doesn't help with his bike.

Do you own a Wolff??? .... I think it would be great if you could start a separate thread to help get the identifying procedure going for all of us.  I could sure use some more information.


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