# Need help with 1934 Motorbike ID? Value?



## Nick-theCut (Mar 18, 2013)

the crank is marked AS 34, so obviously if it is original to the bike it is Schwinn built.  I thought it was a Premier bicycle because of the chainring.  I've seen a Mead Crusader in a '26 catalog with the same chainring as well.  The headbadge is missing, drilled holes are vertical.  heres the pics


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## Nick-theCut (Mar 18, 2013)

*a few more pics*


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## bricycle (Mar 18, 2013)

1915 Mead sprocket?


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## Oldnut (Mar 18, 2013)

The frt fork is identical to the one on my 1919 excelsior hmm


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## Nick-theCut (Mar 18, 2013)

The chainring to me is similar to teens Mead bikes. (Why I bought it) the details  of the seat stays, fork, and the serial number should be what tell us what it is.  
Please chime in any opinions.


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## chitown (Mar 18, 2013)

I'm thinking Schwinn built but that is definitely a Mead/Premier chainring. The lower cross bar is a little higher than others I've seen (where the tube meets the down tube and head tube). The volcano/flares look more crude than known Schwinn's as well. The fork looks Schwinn for sure though. Is that original yellow/orange paint under house paint???

In conclusion... don't know.


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## Nick-theCut (Mar 18, 2013)

Found these 2 images: premier bicycle image




Premier Headbadge with vertical holes

however the website the picture came from said that that badge is from WW2.
Who knows.
Did Schwinn bikes use vertical badge holes?


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## chitown (Mar 18, 2013)

Nick-theCut said:


> Did Schwinn bikes use vertical badge holes?




Most early thirties Schwinn badges are vertical, spaced 2 3/16" apart.


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## fat tire trader (Mar 18, 2013)

I think its pieced together. The frame's seat stays do not look like Schwinn seat stays. The fork is a Schwinn fork.


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## Nick-theCut (Mar 18, 2013)

*Need help with Motorbike ID? Value?*



chitown said:


> Most early thirties Schwinn badges are vertical, spaced 2 3/16" apart.




These holes seem to be 2 3/4" apart


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## bricycle (Mar 18, 2013)

Indiana excelsior?


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## Oldnut (Mar 19, 2013)

Indiana excelsior makes sense with the frame and the vertical badge holes.hmm


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## Balloontyre (Mar 19, 2013)

the lower and upper rear fender bridges do not look Excelsior to me, they lack the wide mouth trumpet connection and arching design.


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## Nick-theCut (Mar 19, 2013)

So we all agree the crank is incorrect, sprocket looks Mead/Premier, and the seat stay arches are uniquely straight.
The eBay seller wasn't a collector, but was tipped off by a collector that it was a Premier bicycle.  That makes some sense for obvious chainring reasons, but also that no one really knows what it is.  My only Premier bicycle CD catalog is 1913 and doesn't show a motorbike.


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## Balloontyre (Mar 19, 2013)

1926 Crusader Catalog


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## Nick-theCut (Mar 19, 2013)

Balloontyre said:


> 1926 Crusader Catalog




I like this, except the vertical Headbadge holes wouldn't work on the Crusader badge.


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## bricycle (Mar 19, 2013)

...plus the seat stays are curved..... rats.


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## Nick-theCut (Mar 19, 2013)

crude joints


2" gap between top bars... No tank is fitting in there.
Keep the guesses coming


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## bricycle (Mar 20, 2013)

I think the skinny elgin tank will fit...


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## Balloontyre (Mar 20, 2013)

Nick-theCut said:


> I like this, except the vertical Headbadge holes wouldn't work on the Crusader badge.




I posted the '26 catalog just to show the chain ring, the catalog bike frame looks like Schwinn.


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## Nick-theCut (Mar 20, 2013)

Howie Cohen made a suggestion that the frame could possibly be Colson.
Vertical drilled badge holes and straight seat stay supports.
Can someone tell me if the serial number resembles other Colson numbers?


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## Nick-theCut (Mar 21, 2013)

Howie e-mailed this pic this morning.  He didn't mention the year, but want me to compare the frame.  He stated that the wheels are not correct.
What do you guys think ? My frame doesn't have drop stand ears built into it.



Fork looks a lil different too, right?


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## bricycle (Mar 21, 2013)

That has a totally different tank opening.


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## ozzmonaut (Mar 21, 2013)

I'm going to guess Hawthorne. Most prewar hawthornes seem to have a different tank style, but some have your style opening . I have a frame that is supposedly Hawthorne. It has 2 3/4" vertical  badge spacing and the tank opening is 2 1/4" and shaped like yours. They also had cruder welds earlier on.


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## ozzmonaut (Mar 21, 2013)

There's one a few posts down on this thread that looks like the one I have.
http://thecabe.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?6457-New-guy-with-a-Hawthorne-Flyer


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## Nick-theCut (Mar 21, 2013)

It definately resembles this frame and fork


Adamtinkerer posted that one and called it a crusty Flyer.  
All the others from your thread seem to have horizontal badge holes.
We might be getting somewhere.


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## bricycle (Mar 21, 2013)

...Hathorne sprocket...


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## Nick-theCut (Mar 21, 2013)

Did Hawthorne use the sprocket on my bike?  Hawthorne serial numbers start with a letter, from what Im finding, and also have horizontal badge holes.
The frame/fork/ seat stay supports are the same.
So if the frame is the same, obviously they can be stamped with different numbers and drill different holes for another bike maker, or distributor.
Howie Cohen said that Premier bikes are Mead bikes with different paint schemes.  It is a Premier/Mead sprocket   Isn't it?
So, couldn't Mead have used Hawthorne's frames as a template or something of that nature??
Wow I'm rambling


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## bricycle (Mar 21, 2013)

..."You talk'n to ME?"...... sorry Nick I gots no idea.


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## Nick-theCut (Mar 21, 2013)

bricycle said:


> ..."You talk'n to ME?"...... sorry Nick I gots no idea.




You and the rest of the forum, if they're listening (reading)


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## Nick-theCut (Mar 22, 2013)

1 4 8 6

Does anyone recognize the serial number?


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## ozzmonaut (Mar 23, 2013)

My hawthorne has no letter and more primitive stamping like that. Also look up images of hawthorne badges and you will find some with vertical holes.


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## ozzmonaut (Mar 23, 2013)

Also many brands used similar if not exact frames, minor differences being in welds, stamping, etc. I had a tank from an old Mead and was testing it in different frames that people owned for some time. It was a perfect fit for Meads, a hawthorne, a colson, Schwinn b10-e. There was no patent on the laws of geometry so I guess they could build a frame however they wanted.


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## ozzmonaut (Mar 23, 2013)

http://www.ratrodbikes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=32497&p=318484
3rd post down


   and this one


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## widpanic02 (Mar 23, 2013)

*!*

I have talked to the guy you got this bike from quite a bit! If I was on the west coast I would probably go to Arizona and see the collection he bought. He has never collected bikes but spent probably close to 50,000 bucks on a bunch of Toc 20's 30's stuff. He offered that moto to me on the side but at the time I was more interested in all his early hub parts . The lot of toc hub stuff I got from him is awesome. He has about  20 toc men's bikes left as well as a garage full of parts . Might be worth making the trip . Kind of regret not picking that moto up because it seemed to me that he did not even clean it up . Looked like it was really dusty and dirty which is a good thing because I thought there might be some paint under there. Another good thing about that moto that I don't think many people saw was it had ( early?) torrington 10's on it. Enjoy nick want to see pics when it's finished


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## widpanic02 (Mar 23, 2013)

*!*

Oh yeah,and to the subject at hand I'm pretty sure the guy had no idea what he was doing with all the parts he bought and I think your bike is a mix of excelsior and mead parts. Still a cool hybrid or one to fix right!


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