# Simoncini "what is it worth "



## Jrodarod

Got this on a trade. I have no idea what it's worth or yr. I plan to sell it or trade for Schwinn balloon stuff. Dirty but should clean up nicely.


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## bulldog1935

It has a wide mix of parts from the 80s/90s.  SunTour RD - the steel pedals really stick out as not belonging.
Looks similar to a SunTour Sprint group
http://velobase.com/ViewGroup.aspx?GroupID=d2de31d8-4269-4dad-945b-50da5aa017ab


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## rustjunkie

Headtube looks kinda steep? 
Damage to the lugs from collision?


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## WVBicycles

Looks like Suntour Superbe derailleurs which would make sense since the crank is Superbe. The stress cracks in the paint on the head tube is a bit concerning.


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## Jrodarod

It doesn't look like a crack on my side. I'll clean it up. Paint is flaking in s few areas.


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## Jrodarod

Both upper and lower tubes show same wear. Top and bottom seat post area are also the same? Rough life or crappy paint?


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## Jrodarod

Forks look straight. I put air on the tires and bike rode straight


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## bulldog1935

I think rustjunkie is just not used to looking at aggressive Italian frame geometry






WVBicycles said:


> Looks like Suntour Superbe derailleurs which would make sense since the crank is Superbe. The stress cracks in the paint on the head tube is a bit concerning.



the reason I called out SunTour Sprint was the position of the adjustment screws in the RD

Will also have to add that is a fairly young frame to have weathered to that state.  My Viner Pro Team CX is the same age, and all its weathering amounts to just sun fading of the paint.


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## WVBicycles

Suntour Superbe and Suntour sprint the adjusting bolts are in the same position I guess it could be either one of them just with the decal worn off


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## Jrodarod

They have print, "superbe pro"


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## harpon

I think the bike might get $400-$500 not counting shipping on ebay- maybe a little less if you tried to sell it locally.  How much patience do you have and how desperate for the cash?  I'd touch those lugs with some white paint at least.....


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## WVBicycles

I would say its worth between $300 to $500 depending how picky the buyer is on the rust spots on the frame. The Suntour Superbe Pro stuff is like gold tho its the best component group ever and was superior to Campy Super Record. Is their a steel maker label on the frameset possibly Columbus or Tange? It most certainly an Ebay item for sure .


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## Jrodarod

No markings... but here is a better pic of the markings on the cranks.


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## harpon

Never tried Superb derailleurs, but as to the rest of it, the crank especially, nothing was superior to Campy Super Record.  This is one of those bikes from the mid 80's or after when more and more people simply couldn't afford the full Campy routine as it got up towards $1500 for the bikes.  The Japanese stuff was getting very good and people switched over because it was also slightly cheaper.  I'm sure it works as well, but servicing a campy bike with Campy tools was a Zen all it's own, and I don't think any other bikes could be overhauled as quickly after a sloppy race or stage.   And I started to feel after working in my share of bike shops through the 70's and early 80's that I was glad I was finally out, because things were getting diverse and more exotic, and more and more special tools seemed required.


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## bulldog1935

The Campy Chorus rear derailleur of today is the SunTour Superbe Pro of yesterday.  OK, maybe it's a better SunTour than SunTour.  
SunTour's 1964 patent for the slant parallelogram rear derailleur could not be copied before 1984.  Immediately, Shimano copied it.  
Campy tried tinkering other ways to get the same geometric effect, but finally gave in and copied Suntour in 1988 with the first gen. Chorus.


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## WVBicycles

I was never really a fan of Campagnolo to be honest  and several bike shop owners I know who use to race swore by Superbe Pro. I had bikes with Campy and yeah they worked fine but it was nothing to worship .


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## Jrodarod

I will place it on ebay tomorrow at .99 and let it rip.


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## WVBicycles

looks like it cleaned up really good best of luck


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## harpon

WVBicycles said:


> I was never really a fan of Campagnolo to be honest  and several bike shop owners I know who use to race swore by Superbe Pro. I had bikes with Campy and yeah they worked fine but it was nothing to worship .



  Maybe you had to be there in the early 70's, before there was any Japanese knock-offs much or other designs.  When I got my first full-campy bike in 1971- a Gitane Super Corsa- after my 68 Varsity had gotten stolen- it was the first one the riders in Indianapolis had seen with Nuovo Record side-pull brakes.  The other riders all still had Universal brakes- a couple of Chrome Cinellis among them .  You couldn't buy any real racing bikes or much in the way of components anywhere in town if you didn't order a Paramount from Schwinn.  Throughout most of the 70's, a full Campy bike was almost standard issue for road riders- they were then $400 to $500 and unless it was something like a PX 10 or Gitane Tour De France- There was almost nothing else.  So it was almost a way of life!

I picked up this SR Nuovo Record knock-off on ebay recently, for that Schwinn traveler Frame I'm building.


 



This is the only kind of thing that came out of Japan that got respect then- a virtual Campy Nuovo Record copy- an SR or Sugino-  The Nuovo Record crankset sold for $50 then and you could get one of these - with both rings for $25-30- which is about what I got it for-  I've painted the indentations with Shimmer green to match the frame and have some Red alloy bolts in it now-  along with a fluted seatpost also detailed in green flutes it really adds some bling-  I'll put some photos and or a write-up up soon.




Anyway-
 I worked at a bike shop in 73 and 74 and we were one of the first importers in Indy- and the Jap stuff wasn't held in much high regard and actually could still be a little shoddy if it wasn't a top line Fuji or Nishiki.  I was later amazed at just how fast the quality did in fact catch up - and lucky for us!

These days the Asians pretty much save cycling as a whole from corrupt western Oil driven Capitalism I'm afraid at least IMHO.


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## WVBicycles

At the age of 33 I didn't start road biking till I was in my mid 20's my first road bike was a Specialized Allez carbon tubed alloy lugged racer with Shimano 105 so I guess I can say I was spoiled when I started riding and collecting. My Holdsworth had all Campy NR and its the one bike I regret selling. I have a late 90's with Campy Athena I believe and that bike rides like butter. I know all the Japanese components but when it comes to Campagnolo I am a total noob.


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## harpon

The pinnacle was Record and Super Record- then they ruined it.  When they wen;t to 7 cogs and beyond, they had to make the chainwheels thinner and then out of steel or very steelish alloy.  By that time Campy had lost their edge- I had a newer crankset like that a few years back- I forget the model, and the chain just grated on the chainwheels itself- it looked good, but I almost felt it was sabotaged.  I really cant say, I don't have enough experience with it- but I remember I could tear my Full Super Record Masi down, overhaul and put it back ready to go again in less than a hour.- that was the early 80's by then.


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## bulldog1935

I'm currently running a 7-sp SunTour Winner freewheel on 126mm rear axle, and 8-sp Record cassette on 130mm rear axle.  (And my super oddball, 5-sp freewheel on 115mm rear axle.)  5-sp rear through 8-sp rear can use the same chain.  No offense, but I don't believe there's a difference in cog thickness up to 8-sp.  Between 7- and 8-, the width of the freehub body is different.
Even have a 9sp cassette on 130mm with a compact double.
My thought on newer drives beyond this - 10- and 11-sp - is chain life is affected, which also can affect cog and ring life if chain stretch is not monitored, and chains replaced frequently.


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