# Hercules "royal Prince" Made In Birmingham.



## Eatontkd

Looking to restore this Hercules. The chrome looks good from a distance and the paint is worn through to the primer in many spots. I'd like to find it's year of production but the only stamp I can find is "B 1405" on the fork below the headset. The 3-speed hub is made by Hercules not S/A. Any ideas on how to find the date on this one would be appreciated!


----------



## Gasbag

"B type 6" hub is generally thought to be 1956, where the 6 is the year. B hub production began in 1952 and a first year hub would be "B type 2".

Nice bike by the way!


----------



## Eatontkd

Thanks so much for the info "Gasbag"!


----------



## bulldog1935

it's all Raleigh (at least TI) - the tubing fork crown is proof of that.  Nice bike, and it looks cozy.


----------



## Eatontkd

Ok, but I was under the understanding that Raleigh didn't purchase Hercules till 1960... Were they "sharing" parts as a lot of other Brit industries did?


----------



## Gasbag

Tubing Investments (TI) was the parent corporation that acquired and consolidated many of the British bicycle brands. The major brand consolidation began in the very late 1950s and continued into the 1960s. It is generally thought that rather than move the inventories of the factories to Raleigh in Nottingham, that the individual brands continued building until inventory had been mostly depleted and the remaining inventory was then moved to the Raleigh plant. There are all kinds of odd combinations in the early sixties bikes as a result. Here is a link to a small wiki about TI https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TI_Group


----------



## bulldog1935

Eatontkd said:


> Ok, but I was under the understanding that Raleigh didn't purchase Hercules till 1960... Were they "sharing" parts as a lot of other Brit industries did?



As I followed the wiki, TI owned Hercules before they merged them with Raleigh in 1960.  So while your bike was made in the Midlands, probably after 1960, the manufacturing moved to Nottingham.

Great head badge.


----------



## Eatontkd

Yeah that sounds like what I got out of the article too.  I was interested in the bike because of the chain guard and the head badge.  The seller also threw in a barn fresh Rudge from 1953. It's  rough and I'mnot sure where I am going with it. I can post pics if you're interested.


----------



## bulldog1935

love to see the Rudge photos


----------



## Eatontkd

My $30.00 1953 Rudge: 


 


 


 


 


 
Seems like so much to do on this one. However, people seem to be more excited about this one then the Hercules.


----------



## bulldog1935

thanks - looks like a great project


----------



## SirMike1983

I think the Hercules is the more interesting because of its uniqueness. Both are quality bikes.

The alloy hub is uncommon but not rare on the Rudge.

This is an English bike collector rorschach test of sorts. Some love upgraded, conventional bikes like the Rudge, and some like oddball or more unique bikes like this combo part Hercules. I like the oddball stuff. I have a Hercules Model C coaster  brake variation from 1946 that I love.


----------



## bulldog1935

topper for GP


----------



## Gasbag

I'm with SirMike on this. My Rudge and Raleighs are nice and desirable bikes but as I have matured in the English 3-speed hobby my interest has become piqued by the oddball and lesser known brands and models. I have two bikes built by the Cooperative Wholesale Society (CWS) in Tyseley England. CWS weren't built for export so they came to our shores as somebodies personal property. I jokingly say that I have the largest CWS collection in North America but that may actually be factual. Not much more than a year ago I wouldn't have thought about parting ways with my Raleigh DL-1 or Rudge Sport but I now see that as a possiblity to be replaced by bikes that are virtually unknown to most other 3-speed enthusiasts.  I guess I have gone down the rabbit hole in this hobby.


----------



## Eatontkd

bulldog1935 said:


> topper for GP




Umm, forgive my "newby-ness", but "GP"?


----------



## Eatontkd

Sounds like I most've done well here for a first timer! He was asking $70 for both. I could've offered him less, but I felt him to be in need of the cash so I parted with my money and came home with both...my wife was thrilled!! The seller has A LOT more old bikes, I mean, A LOT! If any of you are interested in seeing YOUR wife thrilled, let me know and I pass on his info!


----------



## bulldog1935

general principle - there's a Schwinn conspiracy - they have their own Schwinn Lightweight forum page, but they still post Schwinns here and top them any time they can
So I keep looking for nice Condorinos to post.


----------



## SirMike1983

Eatontkd said:


> Sounds like I most've done well here for a first timer! He was asking $70 for both. I could've offered him less, but I felt him to be in need of the cash so I parted with my money and came home with both...my wife was thrilled!! The seller has A LOT more old bikes, I mean, A LOT! If any of you are interested in seeing YOUR wife thrilled, let me know and I pass on his info!




You cannot ask for a better deal than $70 for both. Each is worth more than that individually- the Hercules because of decent completeness and good condition, and the Rudge because of the brand cachet and alloy rear hub.


----------



## Eatontkd

Okay, "note to self: watch out for those  Schwinn people "!


----------



## bulldog1935

maybe just top threads of interest, or on-topic  

And again, congratulations on such a great buy for very cool bikes.


----------



## Eatontkd

Hmm, just realized my 700cc road bike wheels fit the Rudge frame... might be a game changer!


----------



## bulldog1935

will certainly give you great tire choices


----------



## Miketothek

Eatontkd said:


> My $30.00 1953 Rudge:
> View attachment 325343
> View attachment 325344
> View attachment 325345
> View attachment 325346
> View attachment 325347
> Seems like so much to do on this one. However, people seem to be more excited about this one then the Hercules.



I want that sprocket so bad! Awesome bike man.


----------



## dweenk

Did TI buy Armstrong cycles? If so, was that before or after the Raleigh deal?


----------



## bulldog1935

dweenk said:


> Did TI buy Armstrong cycles? If so, was that before or after the Raleigh deal?



British Cycle Corporation was formed in 1956 by Tube Investments to take over the Birmingham makers, Hercules, Armstrong and Brampton.  
1958, TI took over Sun
1960 is when TI took over Raleigh
https://www.gracesguide.co.uk/British_Cycle_Corporation

Raleigh began buying up other cycle makers in the 30s and 40s
https://www.gracesguide.co.uk/British_Cycle_Corporation


----------



## dweenk

Thanks for your reply. It appears that TI had a plan well before the Raleigh purchase.


----------



## neighbor

Eatontkd said:


> Looking to restore this Hercules. The chrome looks good from a distance and the paint is worn through to the primer in many spots. I'd like to find it's year of production but the only stamp I can find is "B 1405" on the fork below the headset. The 3-speed hub is made by Hercules not S/A. Any ideas on how to find the date on this one would be appreciated!
> View attachment 324565
> View attachment 324566
> View attachment 324567



Here’s a bit more info





						Hercules Royal Prince
					






					www.frankb.us


----------



## neighbor

Getting this today. Only thing missing is the seat bag and original grips.


----------



## Oilit

neighbor said:


> Getting this today. Only thing missing is the seat bag and original grips.
> 
> View attachment 1519897
> 
> View attachment 1519898



Nice project, that should clean up and be a looker! Have you checked the rear hub for a date? From the bikes I've seen, @Gasbag is correct on dating Hercules hubs so you can at least get close on the year.


----------



## neighbor

Here it is, looks like a 1954 time capsule. I’m “chuffed” as they’d say in OL’ Blighty


----------



## neighbor

Few more photos for documentation purposes.


----------



## Oilit

neighbor said:


> Few more photos for documentation purposes.
> 
> View attachment 1520096
> 
> View attachment 1520097



That's really nice. I've got a 1954 that's similar to yours, but it's got more rust and is rougher all around. Thanks for the pictures!


----------



## Threespeedmafia

I have Shelby Traveler badged Hercules with a Type B 5 hub. It has been repainted and has no decals unfortunately.


----------

