# Removing rust from paint, exhausting my resources



## partsguy (Apr 30, 2017)

I am trying to bring back the paint on the frame and fork of this blue '55 Radiobike. I really, really want to save any of the original paint that I can. I KNOW the paint is underneath and mixed in with this rust. I tried WD-40 and a green kitchen scrubbing pad. I tried WD-40 with 0000 steel wool. Even tried letting the WD-40 soak for a period of time. I tried rubbing compound. All produced miniscule results, if any.

I tried all of the above on a red '55 Radiobike, and they all worked quite well. So I guess the rust I am dealing with is deeper than I thought. I have heard and read various opinions about Evapo-Rust, Oxalic Acid "wood bleach", and other chemicals. Not sure which path is best for this particular bike.

I am open to any suggestions you all have. Repainting is the VERY LAST resort. I just can't leave a rusty frame and fork with brightly-colored, albeit scratched up, parts on it. I want this bike looking it's best.

Thanks in advance!


----------



## SirMike1983 (Apr 30, 2017)

It looks to me like that rust is on the surface of the frame itself rather than on paint. The paint itself may be gone from those areas, though there's a chance you get lucky.

The deal with using chemical means to dissolve rust is that you will go down to bare metal if indeed that rust is on the surface of the steel itself. The result will be grey steel and blue paint, not any kind of "brown" or "patina" or what-have-you. 

https://bikeshedva.blogspot.com/2015/08/removing-rust-from-fenders-oxalic-acid.html





Here is what I mean, above. The fender on the left was cleaned with oxalic acid; the fender on the right with WD-40 and 0000 steel wool. The Oxalic Acid will remove that rust right down to grey steel, even in small pits. The Oxalic fender is much cleaner, though perhaps it has a less "consistent" condition.  Evaporust will do the same thing, but  you don't have to mix up crystals like with the Oxalic Acid.

This all amount to a gamble - is there paint under that rust? If not, you'll have mostly a grey steel frame with patches of blue paint. It will be cleaned of the rust but it will look a bit odd. Only you can really assess if there's any paint under that rust because you have the frame on-hand.

And I'd lean toward Evaporust rather than Oxalic Acid for a frame. I wouldn't want Oxalic Acid crystals left inside the tubing, though you probably could get it pretty clean and then shoot Frame Saver or something in there afterward.


----------



## partsguy (Apr 30, 2017)

SirMike1983 said:


> It looks to me like that rust is on the surface of the frame itself rather than on paint. The paint itself may be gone from those areas, though there's a chance you get lucky.
> 
> The deal with using chemical means to dissolve rust is that you will go down to bare metal if indeed that rust is on the surface of the steel itself. The result will be grey steel and blue paint, not any kind of "brown" or "patina" or what-have-you.
> 
> ...




Very good info! Judging by the wear on the rest of the parts (they were in an attic, bike itself ridden for decades after they were removed), I would say there are a lot of areas that will be barren of any paint, especially on the rear tubes of the frame, where the chain, kickstand, road debris, and other things wore the paint off. That allowed the rust to start. The top tubes, seat tube, down tube, and headtube seem to have paint, but it is very thin, almost looks like it faded badly in the sun in some areas.

An evapo-rust bath may be the last step to take before a repaint. But, I'll cross that bridge when I get to it  See what I mean though? The frame and fork are oxidized badly while all other parts, while scratched, are in very good condition. A repaint, as hard as it is for me to swallow on this rare bike, may be the BEST solution in my eyes. I mean, the tank almost looks like it didn't come with that frame because the colors are so drastically different.


----------



## GTs58 (Apr 30, 2017)

The paint on the frame is gone with the wind. What was the original paint type on these, a candy? Looks kinda like the Schwinn opal blue.


----------



## partsguy (Apr 30, 2017)

GTs58 said:


> The paint on the frame is gone with the wind. What was the original paint type on these, a candy? Looks kinda like the Schwinn opal blue.




The more I scrubbed it, the more I realized it. I'll still try evapo-rust, what else do I have to lose?


----------



## GTs58 (Apr 30, 2017)

I think you will be wasting your time, but it's your time to waste.   Check out one of my Radiant Blue forks here. There is no exposed rust, it's all under the paint. The inside of the fork legs are solid rust under the candy blue and it looks 10 shades darker than the frame. Nothing can be done with this other than a repaint.  And then look at my stripped frame that was black. After a chemical paint strip, I had nothing but rust to deal with. That is not primer, it was all rust from missing paint and underneath the paint.


----------



## partsguy (Apr 30, 2017)

Ick. That is too bad. That is definitely a pitfall to the candy paint of the 1950s and 60's. Radiant Blue is very close. The tank and chainguard on my bike is nice enough to get a laser match done though.


----------



## GTs58 (Apr 30, 2017)

With the candy paint you can see the rust underneath. Solids will not show the rust underneath the paint, but believe me it's there. Worn out paint is really porous and the moisture will infiltrate the paint if not waxed or protected with something.

Metalcast Blue may be a close match to your bike if you want to try that first.


----------



## partsguy (Apr 30, 2017)

If I so choose, isn't it possible to age the new paint? Even just a little?


----------



## GTs58 (Apr 30, 2017)

I've had good luck ruining new paint by wiping it down with xylene. Goof Off will ruin/age it even better.


----------



## partsguy (Apr 30, 2017)

Hardy har har 

I meant like an antiquing type of process. When I first got the bike, I was opposed to repainting the frame because I think the newly painted frame and fork will stick out against the 62 year old parts too much. Would be better than having the frame rusty though.


----------



## WES PINCHOT (May 1, 2017)

ERROR!


----------



## WES PINCHOT (May 1, 2017)

partsguy said:


> If I so choose, isn't it possible to age the new paint? Even just a little?



TRY TALKING TO ONE OF THE MASTER PAINTERS LIKE BOB U. ON THE CABE AS BOBCYCLES!


----------



## partsguy (May 1, 2017)

@bobcycles

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


----------



## Rollo (May 1, 2017)

... Forum member 72runner swears by soaking painted parts in wood bleach ... He says it makes the rust disappear without hurting the paint ...


----------



## Rollo (May 1, 2017)

... Here are some before and after pics of his Grey Ghost that was soaked in wood bleach ... The whole bike was taken apart and soaked in it ...


----------



## SirMike1983 (May 1, 2017)

partsguy said:


> Very good info! Judging by the wear on the rest of the parts (they were in an attic, bike itself ridden for decades after they were removed), I would say there are a lot of areas that will be barren of any paint, especially on the rear tubes of the frame, where the chain, kickstand, road debris, and other things wore the paint off. That allowed the rust to start. The top tubes, seat tube, down tube, and headtube seem to have paint, but it is very thin, almost looks like it faded badly in the sun in some areas.
> 
> An evapo-rust bath may be the last step to take before a repaint. But, I'll cross that bridge when I get to it  See what I mean though? The frame and fork are oxidized badly while all other parts, while scratched, are in very good condition. A repaint, as hard as it is for me to swallow on this rare bike, may be the BEST solution in my eyes. I mean, the tank almost looks like it didn't come with that frame because the colors are so drastically different.
> 
> View attachment 459392




Probably so. There's a very good chance that soaking in Oxalic Acid or Evaporust puts you on the road to re-paint, just because the paint is so distressed. That being said, my inclination might be to leave it alone and go as-is. It's original and part of the biography of that particular bike. So someone put the accessories in the attic and rode it bare bones for awhile; that's the life of this bike and the condition is reflective of it. It's a sort of authenticity, I think. 

If it were a common 3-speed or something of that sort, re-paint, sure. But I think you have an uncommon, original and fairly authentic representation of what that bike is as an artifact.


----------



## partsguy (May 1, 2017)

SirMike1983 said:


> Probably so. There's a very good chance that soaking in Oxalic Acid or Evaporust puts you on the road to re-paint, just because the paint is so distressed. That being said, my inclination might be to leave it alone and go as-is. It's original and part of the biography of that particular bike. So someone put the accessories in the attic and rode it bare bones for awhile; that's the life of this bike and the condition is reflective of it. It's a sort of authenticity, I think.
> 
> If it were a common 3-speed or something of that sort, re-paint, sure. But I think you have an uncommon, original and fairly authentic representation of what that bike is as an artifact.



That is the only thing holding me back on repainting. I do not plan to sell the bike, and would rather see the blue paint instead of the deep rust over the frame.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk


----------



## partsguy (May 2, 2017)

SirMike1983 said:


> Probably so. There's a very good chance that soaking in Oxalic Acid or Evaporust puts you on the road to re-paint, just because the paint is so distressed. That being said, my inclination might be to leave it alone and go as-is. It's original and part of the biography of that particular bike. So someone put the accessories in the attic and rode it bare bones for awhile; that's the life of this bike and the condition is reflective of it. It's a sort of authenticity, I think.
> 
> If it were a common 3-speed or something of that sort, re-paint, sure. But I think you have an uncommon, original and fairly authentic representation of what that bike is as an artifact.




Some more thoughts, along this train...rust vs paint....

I do like history, obviously, and the story behind this bike is documented, and unique.  Most bikes get stashed away and the whole thing is pristine, or the sheet metal parts get removed and scrapped. Lost to time. Somehow, 95% of this bike was saved either by a hoarder or someone who just had the foresight to know that he better save the parts, since Huffy advertised these bikes being built in limited numbers even then. If I leave this as it is and proceed with the mechanical and electrical work, it is a living artifact. A Dayton-built survivor displayed anytime I ride it and the story I will tell matches the look of the bike.

I really am stuck in a quandary. I have confidence that even with the frame and fork getting repainted, this being a true blue Radiobike won't be drawn into question because of the documentation here on CABE and RRB. Plus, all of the parts for it will be left original. The story behind this particular bike, serial 5H075871, is also now known here for all of time. The sheet metal parts still have an incredible luster to them, so much so that a slightly aged fresh paint job on the frame and fork can really do it justice. The vintage whitewall tires are going to be cleaned and the chrome re-done anyway, why not spruce up the frame and fork too? Seeing Scott's pristine blue bike strongly makes me consider a repaint, because blue is one of my favorite colors.

I like to preserve history, but I also envision how much more gorgeous the bike can be with a new shot of candy blue.


----------



## deepsouth (May 3, 2017)

66 Auto color in Joplin, Missouri sells House of Kolor candy base coat. It's much easier than candy paint to use. Comes in a lot of great colors. You get the candy look without all the hassle of candy paint. Used it on my 1958 Red Phantom with great results. Give it a look.


----------



## oldwhizzer (May 4, 2017)

Paint just the frame to match and look for a original paint frame down the road.


----------

