# Stuck stem, need suggestions



## Tim s (Mar 20, 2022)

I have been trying to get an aluminum stem out of a steel steerer tube. The bike is a 84 Raleigh Competition. I have been spraying it with PB Blaster trying to get it to move side to side and hitting on it with hammer with a block of wood as a buffer. I have been working on it for a couple of weeks on n off. Any suggestions?Thanks Tim


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## catfish (Mar 20, 2022)

If PB blaster isn't working, you might need this....


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## Junkman Bob (Mar 20, 2022)

Dent puller might work


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## WillWork4Parts (Mar 20, 2022)

Is the wedge still stuck at the bottom? If you haven't already, put the bolt back in sticking up a few threads from the top and tap it down with same wood block and hammer. Wedge has to be dislodged before you can think about twisting. 

Note: I've also had wedges with stripped threads. May have to try tightening just to make sure threads are intact enough to help tap the wedge down.


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## bulldog1935 (Mar 20, 2022)

@WillWork4Parts has done this before - all correct. 
You have to get the wedge apart and driven down before the stem will come loose - raising the stem bolt on its threads and tapping it back down is how you do it.


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## Tim s (Mar 20, 2022)

The wedge is free and loose. If I used a torch on the stem not close to the threads will that do it ? Will a heat gun also work?


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## J-wagon (Mar 20, 2022)

Well.... May be galvanized. RJ the bike guy removed Alu stem from steel steerer but sacrificed stem in process.


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## Tim s (Mar 20, 2022)

Thanks . Tim


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## bloo (Mar 20, 2022)

If there's a hole in the bottom of the fork crown, maybe you could turn the bike upside down and feed it penetrating oil from the bottom.


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## GTs58 (Mar 20, 2022)

I'd heat that up as hot as possible. Soaking it for weeks on end with a weak acidic chemical obvious doesn't work and a penetrating fluid IMO is worthless.


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## WillWork4Parts (Mar 20, 2022)

Being a lightweight bike makes things a lot more delicate....😐 Not sure about a Raleigh, but hopefully a chromoly fork? That would help in the twisting department, just be careful not to bend the fork if it makes it to a vise. Worse comes to worst, the aluminum stem may shear, but that will allow you to remove it from the bike and cut or drill broken pieces out. If you are 100% sure the wedge moves up and down freely, you can try tapping the stem down with the wheel off and the fork backed up on something solid. ANY movement is something to work with, especially if it's corrosion we are dealing with. If you see it move, start twisting back and forth and don't give up, every little bit counts! I fear heat might soften the aluminum, point the torch down the stem bolt hole if it suits you though.


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## Tim s (Mar 20, 2022)

I have been doing the upside down thing along with right side up too. I have been straddling the wheel and hitting the stem with hammer and wood block. I will try hitting it with the wheel off and have the fork ends up on a block of wood. Thought about turning the bike upside down and putting the stem in a vise then with the wheel off thread a long 2 by 4 through the fork and use leverage to get it to twist. The 2 by 4 would be used at the crown end when twisting not the end of the fork. Not sure this would do it, any thoughts?Tim


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## J-wagon (Mar 20, 2022)

Tim s said:


> Thought about turning the bike upside down and putting the stem in a vise then with the wheel off thread a long 2 by 4 through the fork and use leverage to get it to twist. The 2 by 4 would used at the crown end when twisting not the end of the fork.



That's worked for me on steel to steel rusted. Alu to steel may be different. Good luck!


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## bloo (Mar 20, 2022)

If you get any movement at all, immediately add more oil and let it soak.


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## Andrew Gorman (Mar 20, 2022)

I'd heat the stem up as hot as you dare whenever you think about it for a week or so.  Patience is the key.  Try to get the stem to rotate before trying to hammer it out from the bottom.  Is the expander a wedge or a plug? Whacking on a plug type stem can just expand it.  Find a drift punch taht will fit inside the stem and pound on that.


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## The Spokemaster (Mar 20, 2022)

bloo ....see his reponse above ....mixture of 50/50 acetone and ATF ...be sure to plug hole in top of stem ....give it a lot of time to work ....patience​


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## J-wagon (Mar 20, 2022)

Alu-steel corrosion diiicult. Here's another example :
Post in thread 'What does your current project look like now?' https://thecabe.com/forum/threads/what-does-your-current-project-look-like-now.43157/post-1405546


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## bleedingfingers (Mar 21, 2022)

I read somewhere that the aluminum and steel have a chemical reaction and that ammonia will break the the bond .
I have blocked all the holes and filled the steer tube with it and seemed to work but also used heat as well .
Could be bullcrap but worked for  me a couple of times .
I would try everything and be patient I soaked the hell out of the ones I removed with wd-40 and anything else I could lay my hands on
before I tried the Ammonia.
Would be a shame to cut that stem .


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## SirMike1983 (Mar 21, 2022)

The theory behind the liquid ammonia is that it will react with the aluminum oxide and dissolve the oxide. Penetrating oil will not dissolve the aluminum oxide, though it is tempting to try it because heat and penetrating oil is generally used for iron-on-iron and steel-on-steel contacts. But it will not work well on galvanic corrosion between aluminum and steel. I'd be tempted to try the ammonia the next time I run across the aluminum-steel issue. I've been told that automotive antifreeze can do this as well, but never tried it. Thankfully it has been awhile...


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## Schwinny (Mar 23, 2022)

So its the cone stuck in the steerer, not the bolt stuck in the cone?
Ive experienced the same and had good luck bringing the bolt up 1" or better then smacking it back down with a 2lb sledge. If that doesn't knock the cone out.... call an exorcist.

May damage the bolt head with a direct blow, metal to metal, but a thick piece of wood between deadens the blow by quite a bit. No need to wind up, just smack. I then got the cone out with the fork on the bench.


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## bloo (Mar 23, 2022)

We need some clarification then. I thought the wedge or cone was already loose, and it was simply the aluminum stem stuck in the steer tube. Which is it?


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## Schwinny (Mar 23, 2022)

Maybe I didn't get the idea right?
If its the stem surface area against the steering head surface area.... yuck
I must have started in the middle some how.
Went back to #1....

I did that a couple times but it wasn't extremely hard. I had the wheel off, fork wedged high up on the legs not to move or bend. Handlebars installed, turned the stem. If the handlebars wont do it, a long pipe or rod. Longer the better.
At some point either the stem breaks or comes out. No choice. Lever action works one way or the other.

I had a steel to steel seat post corroded to weld so hard it ripped the seat tube when I twisted it with a lever...
...but it came out. Different of course but it had been soaked for a week.

You may have to sacrifice the stem  but I doubt the steerer will be damaged much past the corrosion

One thing I might ask is HOW you know the wedge/ cone is loose and lowered?
Sorry if its stupid but sometimes...
the bolt is out but how do you know it is loose from the stem?

....I also disassembled a bike once that had a 22mm stem slightly ground down and hammered into a 21mm steerer.
That one I had to turn the bike upside down and hammer the stem out with a sledge.


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## WillWork4Parts (Mar 23, 2022)

Schwinny said:


> One thing I might ask is HOW you know the wedge/ cone is loose and lowered?
> Sorry if its stupid but sometimes...
> the bolt is out but how do you know it is loose from the stem?




You have to know the health of your threads on the stem bolt and wedge. If it torques up normal and doesn't give you that rubbery feeling, they're all OK. Also if you go beating too hard on say...a 50s stem bolt...that isn't hardened, you'll want to take it all the way out and make sure you haven't bent it. I'm pretty sure I've turned a few stem bolts "S" shaped even with a 1lb hammer. If that's all ok and you've raised the bolt head and tapped it down a few times, it's safe to say your wedge is moving down with it.


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## Schwinny (Mar 23, 2022)

WillWork4Parts said:


> You have to know the health of your threads on the stem bolt and wedge. If it torques up normal and doesn't give you that rubbery feeling, they're all OK. Also if you go beating too hard on say...a 50s stem bolt...that isn't hardened, you'll want to take it all the way out and make sure you haven't bent it. I'm pretty sure I've turned a few stem bolts "S" shaped even with a 1lb hammer. If that's all ok and you've raised the bolt head and tapped it down a few times, it's safe to say your wedge is moving down with it.



Yes. 😀
Sorry, a question for the OP @Tim s
I see tape over the top to smack-on. Im assuming the bolt is removed


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## volksboy57 (Mar 24, 2022)

If you don't care about the stem, and nothing else on the bike is aluminum or titanium, maybe put some gallium on the stem after sanding it. It should soak into the metal making it very brittle


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## PCHiggin (Mar 24, 2022)

bloo said:


> If there's a hole in the bottom of the fork crown, maybe you could turn the bike upside down and feed it penetrating oil from the bottom.



That works too, I use KANO KROIL penetrating oil. The only stuff, other than the GM product sold @ dealers that eats rust. The other stuff is useless


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## Jay81 (Mar 24, 2022)

I second KANO KROIL, although I have never tried it on a stuck aluminum stem, it does work great on steel stuck in steel. Might be worth a try.
Let the Kroil soak in for a few days, and apply it a few more times. I would also recommend trying this: reinstall the handlebar, and stand over the front wheel, using your legs to prevent it from turning side to side, while using the handlebar as a lever to try working the stem back and forth.


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## Tim s (Mar 24, 2022)

Hi everybody, I have tried the straddling the front wheel and twisting the stem with a handlebar many times. As I turn the bike from upright to upside down I can feel and hear the wedge sliding . I will have some time to mess with it more in the next few days. Thanks for the suggestions I will let you know how it goes. Tim


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## bnewberry (Mar 26, 2022)

I haven’t done this yet, but I have read that as a last resort lye will dissolve aluminum. Look it up and proceed at your own risk (or at least the bike’s risk).


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## Gnarlymarley (Mar 26, 2022)

I’ve had good luck with dry ice in water. Remove the stem bolt and plug the stem hole with a rubber plug. Flip the bike over. Pour the water/crushed dry ice solution in from the fork side. Then fill a large cup full of water/dry ice and put the stem in that. The cold will shrink the stem enough to break the surface tension and allow the PV blaster you’ve been spraying in there to travel further. I’ve had great success with this. I’ve had bike shops bring me bikes before to do just this. Works on steel, aluminum and carbon.


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## borgward (Mar 26, 2022)

Tim s said:


> I have been trying to get an aluminum stem out of a steel steerer tube. The bike is a 84 Raleigh Competition. I have been spraying it with PB Blaster trying to get it to move side to side and hitting on it with hammer with a block of wood as a buffer. I have been working on it for a couple of weeks on n off. Any suggestions?Thanks Tim
> 
> View attachment 1592461



PB Blaster OK. WD40 just better than pouring water on it. Try LPS 1. Very good and expensive. $16 a can. It's for when nothing else works. Meets MIL specs. You could somehow chill the stem (dry ice?) then heat the external tube. Time and patience are the main ingredient.


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## Tim s (Mar 26, 2022)

Got it! Leverage broke it free then used a hammer and block of wood to drive it out. Tim


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## Jesper (Mar 26, 2022)

As a late note to this problem relating to items stuck one in another. My ignorant mind always pondered what was going on in my old Jaguar engines which had an aluminum alloy cylinder sleeve pressed into the steel engine block when starting the car at a temperature around 30°F and which then quickly would reach approx. 200°F or more. It just kind of scared me thinking about it.
Anyways, dealing with removing and/or installing bearings, sleeves, tubes, shafts, etc. over the years I have, as the last couple previous posts mentioned, used temperature differential as a primary method to obtain the desired results whether on brand new parts or old rusted/corroded parts. Especially on old parts "welded" via galvanic action or oxidation that did not readily come apart with reasonable normal effort before applying any excessive force (e.g. hammering, leveraged twisting, etc.) that could possibly damage one or both parts in question; and before adding any solutions that might also cause damage to parts, but also damage finishes (paint, plating, decals, etc.). I would also include the use of excessive heat that could cause any damage to finishes (especially paint, decals) or possibly change the temper of the part(s) involved (should not be an issue with cooling; unless using liquid nitrogen!).
The nice thing is that most of us already have, or can easily obtain a means of heating and cooling the project in question at a fairly low cost.
Even though steel on steel, and aluminum on aluminum expansion/contraction is going to be minimal between parts (unless of identical alloy composition; and even then the molecular "grain" still has an effect), heating and cooling will still help to weaken a corrosive bond. It can also allow certain chemical products to function better due to increased penetration (spacial differential/capillary action). With aluminum on steel, given aluminum has a substantially greater (in relative terms) amount of expansion/contraction than steel, it stands to reason that a corrosive bond will be disrupted much more than steel on steel/aluminum on aluminum, and I really don't worry about heating very much with an aluminum part in a steel tube (seat post or stem) because it will only make it a tighter fit (though it possibly affects the bond integrity slightly). Even at an ambient starting temperature (unless you working in the cold already), if you cool the parts to freezing or below you should have reduced the size of the aluminum part more than the steel part, and allow better penetrating of your pretreatment (zip lock bag or plastic wrap parts to prevent water intrusion unless you desire it). Keep it as cool as possible by working quickly before it warms back up and then try different removal methods. Cooling and allowing to rewarm multiple times is preferrable before applying physical means to separate parts.
Heating: In many cases a hair dryer on high provides sufficient heat without any ill effects; next an oven (at lower or higher temps if you can fit parts in it) or a heat gun at low or high; lastly the torch (I have at times used a micro torch as a means to focus heat in a smaller area).
Cooling: bucket/tub/pool of ice water or freezer it parts will fit in it; next dry ice (a CO2 fire extinguisher can work for this also).
Warning always wear proper safety gear for high and low temp., and chemical methods. Remember some cjemicals readily ignite with open flame and high heat!

Pretreatments: I have used WD40, PB Blaster (better), and Kroil (best, at least for steel/iron). No experience with LPS-1.

I have used these methods for commercial and personal work. I have yet to damage any parts or frames over the past 30 years. I have damaged paint, but not on a project where that was a concern be it for a client's project (get permission first!) or my own.


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## Tim s (Apr 12, 2022)

To say that this bike has been a difficult build up from a frame would be an understatement. I won’t go into it all but let’s just say I am happy it is done. I cannot say that the white seat, bar tape and pump were my ideas. I copied them from a bike Kurt K has on his Headbadge website, hope he doesn’t mind. Tim


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