# '74 LeTour



## Real1 (Mar 19, 2021)

I'd like to remove the stock pedals on this bike, clean/polish and repack. Most pedal disassembly I can figure out. I assume those end caps come off somehow. But before I go all Medieval on them, I'd like some feedback.

There is a faint ring on the outermost end cap.....does that pry off?

In the pedal identification thread above, they look like the ones in the last(10th) pic group.

Kevin


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## GTs58 (Mar 20, 2021)

Sorry I can't answer your question with a definite, but I'll post the pictures for others to see.


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## juvela (Mar 20, 2021)

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one technique followed by some enthusiasts on pedals not designed to be disassembled is to drill small hole in the outer end cap and use this to pump grease through with a grease gun

the procedure is to keep pumping until clean grease begins it issue from around the inner end of the spindle

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## Real1 (Mar 20, 2021)

Interesting. That's a great way to get grease IN, but it doesn't allow you to preload old bearings once cleaned and reinstalled. 

I've heard about these pedals that weren't meant to be disassembled. You'd think that end cap had to be pressed on somehow? 

Thanks for posting that pic for me, BTW!

Kevin


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## juvela (Mar 20, 2021)

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have seen this model designated as the RT-E

do not know if that is correct...

some ffolke seem to consider them rather dear for an all-steel stamped pedal IMHO:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-KK...eflectors-RT-E/363184683207?campid=5335809022
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-KK...-Reflectors-M4/254777702473?campid=5335809022
regarding the endcap -

do not have a set handy to examine in person

in the course of enlarging images available online it appears that the inner most ring is just a stamping in the larger piece rather than something separate

the outer piece may be separate; if so it looks like it may be soldered to the wraparound

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## Real1 (Mar 20, 2021)

Yeah, I think you're correct on the inner most ring on the end cap....it's just an adornment.

If I knew I'd have to destroy the end caps to get them off, I'd just do the small hole thing and grease them. Better than nothing and I have grease 'needles' that would work. 

Kevin


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## Real1 (Mar 20, 2021)

I just took a high powered light and a sharp pick....I see no real seam. So yes, I suspect those end caps are soldered on. 

I wished I had some others to play with....take a propane torch to them and see if I can de-solder a seam. 

I sneaked in aftermarket toe clips under one of the reflectors with spacers. Worked great all these yrs. I feel some slight play in both pedal bearings. With some grease shot in there, they'd probably soldier on for many yrs yet. Honestly, these aren't premium quality pedals and really not deserving of a lot of labor. 

Kevin


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## GTs58 (Mar 20, 2021)

Real1 said:


> I just took a high powered light and a sharp pick....I see no real seam. So yes, I suspect those end caps are soldered on.
> 
> I wished I had some others to play with....take a propane torch to them and see if I can de-solder a seam.
> 
> ...




That was the status quo starting in the mid 60's on production bikes. They quit making automotive U joints with grease zerks also. So run it till it's dry and it breaks were the new wave of the future. I had a late 80's Schwinn 5 speed cruiser that was from Florida and the block Union pedals were shot. I picked up a brand new set of the same Union pedals and the only difference was the end caps were stamped with the U. They were 8 bucks a pair at the local bike shop in 2010.


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## Real1 (Mar 20, 2021)

I'll make a hole for a needle zerk tool. If I get really ambitious someday, I'll buy a couple of used pedals exactly like these and see what it takes to get those end caps off.

I actually saw U-joints with screw caps in place of zerk nipples. Then no hole at all, but still the reinfoirced portion where it would go. Replacement U-joints almost always had the zerk nipples...later, you had to ask for them. Nothing worse than a truck with no zerks for upper and lower ball joints too, but I digress.  

Kevin


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## juvela (Mar 20, 2021)

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there are threads here on the forum from members who rebuilt pedals not intended to be disassembled

these efforts were performed to retain historically correct pedals on a vintage machine receiving restoration

certainly makes no sense from a practical mechanical standpoint given the cost of functional replacements...


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## Real1 (Mar 20, 2021)

I tried about every conceivable derivation of 'pedal restoration'...including Schwinn. Not finding anything in 'Search'. I'm sure it's come up before, but I can't find it. 

There are a few on eBay if I wanted to experiment. How did the term 'rat trap' come into being?

Kevin


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## juvela (Mar 20, 2021)

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other search terms to essay -

"pedal rebuild"

"pedal restore"

"pedal restoration"

"pedal repack"

"pedal servicing"

"pedal refurb"

"pedal resurrection"

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## Real1 (Mar 20, 2021)

OK, so I did find this;




I have something similar in tabs on the bike side of the pedal cage. That should make the pedal come apart. What I'll find inside, who knows. The guy in the video didn't think there were any bearings in his pedals, just pressed in metal discs. 

I'll post some pics when I get to this. Might be towards summer.

Kevin


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## GTs58 (Mar 20, 2021)

No bearings huh? Well then, it's not suppose to come apart so they said hey, lets not install any balls.


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## Real1 (Mar 20, 2021)

Lol....I'm not sure on my pedals.....until I get in there.

LeTours were for people who wanted a Schwinn lightweight 10spd but couldn't go the Paramount. Hopefully, it has ball bearings. If not, I'll just upgrade the pedals.

Kevin


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## FICHT 150 (Mar 20, 2021)

When I did my 1974 Le Tour (now my Son’s) Sheldon Brown was still alive, and was selling a Japanese replacement pedal that was rebuildable, for slim money. I’d bet they have something similar, today.

I bought new Sun rims, laced them with stainless spokes onto the original hubs, the aforementioned pedals, a really cool Truvativ crankset and bottom bracket, an aluminum seat post, a set of Gatorskins, that are still on the bike, a generic, Shimano 6 speed freewheel, and a cheap, but, better seat, and was rewarded with a bike that weighed 22 lbs, with a Greenfield kickstand. I have no desire to return it to what it was. It would be like comparing an F16 to a Saber jet. Dramatically better bike to ride and use.

I suppose a first generation Le Tour could be collectible some day. But, I’ll bet I’m dead when it happens.

Somebody will probably appreciate being able to service the pedals,

Ted


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## juvela (Mar 21, 2021)

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thanks very much for this informative post!

getting a LeTour down to twenty-two pounds is a major accomplishment.

have never known the vendor for the LeTour series of models.

recall Giant doing the World series of models beginning in '78 and Panasonic/Matsu**ita doing the Voyageur series beginning in 1973.

was there a single vendor for all of the LeTour series of bicycles?


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## FICHT 150 (Mar 21, 2021)

That, I don’t know. That name got hung on a bunch of different bikes. But, the first series, called “Le Tour” that replaced the US built fillet brazed Schwinn Super Sport model, and a later version, called “Traveler” were Panasonic bikes. 
I owned both, a 1972 Super Sport, and a 1973 Le Tour, that was probably sold as a 1974 at Christmas of 1973 (the neighbor kid got it as a gift, we still have it, he has forgotten about it, I’m sure) and the Le Tour fit me better. I sold the Super Sport. The only thing I would say was better about the SS was the factory issue Brooks B15. Everything else was steel kid stuff.
Ted


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## momo608 (Mar 21, 2021)

When I do one of my restos, I usually simply oil with the pedal in a paint mixing cup threaded side up. Let gravity do its work to get the innards lubed up. I don't see any good reason to potentially destroy the end caps on rare pedals to grease them. Its not like pedals see a lot of rpm anyway, so if their not seized or binding up why risk it. 

BTW, pretty sure the pedals in question have crimped in end caps, these were mass produced inexpensive pedals used on many bikes at the time. Soldering doesn't make much sense in light of that. Those pedals in the photo are mine, can't see any traces of solder.


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## FICHT 150 (Mar 21, 2021)

The crimped Raleigh pedals respond nicely to a mix of kerosene and ATF, flushing them with a turkey baster, in an old coffee can, blowing that out with compressed air, and a week or so of sitting vertically, with some 80W90 gear oil squirted on the upper bearing near the shaft.

That said, I do prefer rebuildable pedals.

Ted


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## Real1 (Mar 21, 2021)

Lots of idea, thanks. As far as getting the bike lighter, I already put alloy rims on....the crank is alloy on the '74......aluminum or alloy seat post is a great idea. It's wearing Trisport Flack Jackets which wear like cast iron.  I don't really care that much about originality as the bikes are not extremely valuable and improvements to make the bike lighter that look somewhat period are fine with me.

The pedal end cap seam is invisible which means it's soldered and or cast into the cage. If you looked at the video I posted, the pedals come apart where they are crimp twisted. I'm sure that was common on cheap pedals. I would love to get rebuild-able replacements.  If I were to use oil, it would be Phil's Tenacious Oil. But if I get them apart, they'll get grease.

Some frames were Giant, some were Panasonic. Mine says "Approved Japan" on the headstamp. The serial #' were often on the lower portion of the headstamp, but also appeared on the left dropout or right dropout......all having to do with frame origin. Mine is on the left dropout and starts with 'G'. One source says that means Giant.....another source says that is the month of manufacture;second character means year which on mine is 4. No designation between 70's frames and 80's frames....you're supposed to know the difference. What's confusing is that my serial also has '77' on it.

So the info on serial identification is kinda muddled. There's a guy on YouTube who is restoring Schwinn bikes of many models. He restored a red '74 that looks identical in every way to mine....that's why I'm guessing mine is a '74 along with the serial #.

They were a good mid-priced Schwinn 10spd back in the day. The Paramount's were ridiculously priced;the LeTours were a good counter option with light components and aftermarket stuff could only improve it. I was looking at a Super LeTour frame which is supposed to be even lighter.....thinking of swapping everything onto it from my LeTour......but it sold.

Kevin


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## Real1 (Mar 21, 2021)

Ted, I just weighed my bike. It's exactly 30lbs. I don't know how you got yours to 22lbs with what you stated. I even took the kickstand off....don't like the frame stress they potentially cause. Alloy seat post is not gonna shave off the 8 additional lbs. Hmmmm....I've had the crankset in my hands and it was very light...be splitting hairs there for weight improvement. The aftermarket seat is svelte and not heavy. The rims are are Weinmann Rm19 aluminum alloy.

The bike had one owner before me. It has a surprising lack of stickers and decals. What's on the bike looks like silk screened and almost 100% there. If it had stickers and decals I would think there would be remnants somewhere. The BB had original grease in it and it looked like new in there. This bike was hardly ridden and scratched up in his garage moving it around, not on the road.

Kevin


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## FICHT 150 (Mar 21, 2021)

If you pull your seat post out, it will have a date code stamped in it. Actually, almost all the components on mine had a date code on them, but, the seat post was easy to get to. If you remove it, don’t lose the steel shim for it, and, if you replace it, make sure you get the exact size you need, so you don’t need the shim.

I weighed my bike on the postal scale where I worked at the time. Looking back, it has been about 15 years since I did that bike, maybe 22 is wrong, but, it isn’t 30. Also, I did not use the original hubs, I did actually replace those as well. Bike has 30” of standover height. There is no stress from the kickstand, the bolt runs through the center of a steel plate welded between the chain stays, and into the kickstand.

My bike was ignored when it wasn’t being abused. The top bar had a bend in it, which I straightened with trammel bars and C clamps, with an assist from a persuader (hammer). You wouldn’t notice that had been done. I always liked the colors those bikes were painted, the blue, red and yellow look good to this day.
Anyway, when you are done with it, you will have a seriously nice, light rider. There isn’t really anything new that will compare for less than about $750. Just the alloy wheels and pedals would make a big difference.


Ted


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## Real1 (Mar 21, 2021)

I don't agree on the kickstand. Yes, it has that welded plate, but they are still _evil..._lol 

The best weights published for the Super LeTour were 26 1/2lbs. I don't see how you got to 22lbs with what you did. If I could get to 26-27lbs, I would be ecstatic. 

My bike has the 25" frame which would logically be heavier than a smaller frame.....more steel. I don't have any stand over clearance...it's right against my privates.....I don't like that for fit, but it is what it is. The doctor who owned the bike isn't taller than me...but I do have a long torso.  

Thanks for the tip on the seat post dating. I've read about the LeTour and Super LeTour until my eyes bled. I'm thinking of starting a thread on those guys. 

I was basically done with the bike yrs ago(I've had it about 15yrs now), but would always welcome a way to make it lighter like the Super. Until I get my Raleigh Competition GS restored, it has become my default 10spd. I supposed I could go to a 6spd freewheel if everything else would stay the same. But I don't wanna be hunting components for the switch just to get two more gears. I tool around with it out in the country on beautiful two-laners. I don't bike with other people and not interested in any 'event' bicycling. 

Kevin


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## FICHT 150 (Mar 21, 2021)

Mine has the factory derailleurs on board. They have enough adjustment for both gears. I did replace the chain (Whippermann?) but, I don’t believe that was required. It seems like the extra gear in the sprocket was in the middle of the cluster, and my chain length wasn’t really going to change. I figured I was in there, just do it. 
The only thing you need is the Shimano freewheel.
The bike is at my Mom’s for winter, and she is in the hospital, so I won’t be there today, but, I’ll get some pictures when I have a moment. The bikes stored at her house don’t usually come home until after the Lake Pepin three speed tour, mid May, but, we will see.
I gave the bike to my kid because drop bar ten speeds have been uncomfortable for me to ride for a few years. Nobody would ride with me as I would be pretty slow. My kid and my wife, mostly my kid, are my riding partners, and my kid just tolerates my style.
My wife has the nickname of “ Miss Slowpoke”, even worse then me. I ride alone, a lot.
I also have a Peugeot UO-8 that still has drop bars, but, I seldom ride it, same reason. It got alloy wheels, Suntour AR group, and the standard fix to the shifters that involves disassembly, clean and roughen the plastic and the metal sleeves, and using 3M 2216 structural adhesive to make them rigid. The Peugeot didn’t lose as much weight, but, it lost plenty, just off the wheels.
I seem to think the Peugeot had better brakes and pedals, and I kept those. I used two position brake levers on it, may have been off a Schwinn, can’t remember.
My ten speed phase is pretty far behind me, I was messing with this stuff 15-20 years ago.

Ted


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## Real1 (Mar 21, 2021)

Interesting. My two mountain bikes(Yokota, Trek ), even though they have more rolling resistance, are more fun than the 10spd. Maybe that will change with the Raleigh...dunno. But it's really ridiculous to have drops since I mostly ride up on top. I have the double brake levers so I can use them on top easily. My shifters are on top too at least. I don't see many people near my age down in the drops if they have them. I have one hill I like to use the drops on....just for the speed. On my Yokota I've hit 37mph on the electronic speedo and I think I'm doing more than that with the LeTour. It will probably be the death of me someday. Biking accidents over 30mph can be very horrific, especially if you go over the front of the bike.

I'd think you'd need the smaller chain for the 6spd freewheel, but nice to know I don't necessarily. I think the whole issue with the old 10spd are the drop bars;are you gonna use them at least most of the time or not? Definitely a carryover to another time for us Boomers. When I was in college and had a 10spd for my source of transportation, I think I was down in the drops a lot. But that was a young back, a young body and the racing 'image'.

Kevin


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## FICHT 150 (Mar 23, 2021)

I think there are about 19 bikes around the place, and I don’t know that I ever considered one bike more “fun” then another. For me, it seems like the ride or the company is what makes it fun. Some bikes attract attention when you ride them, the Raleigh 20s are good for getting looks and thumbs up from civilians we meet. I will ride an old 10 speed, just not far or fast. It gets unfun after about 8-10 miles on drop bars, for me. Same with my ballooners. Close to home, easy rides.
Fun.

Ted


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## Real1 (Mar 23, 2021)

Yeah, there's a lot of wisdom in that. I just ride for the exercise...close to daily depending on the weather. Nothing would make me want to ride in the rain or extreme wind. I have six bikes, but only three fully functional. I like to mix it up....that's the 'fun' of it for me. The other part of the 'fun' factor is fixing them up and tinkering with them. Most people are better at 'finding' bikes than I am. They scrounge the alleys, knock on doors...try to get phone numbers, glean Craigslist and Facebook daily etc.. And some people are lucky enough to live near bike co ops like the one in Boulder etc.

Kevin


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## Eric Amlie (Mar 23, 2021)

About the only time that I'm in the drops is if I have to fight a bad headwind, but I like them for the variety of different hand positions that they offer.
I hate being stuck with only one position, as with a straight bar.
Edit: Looks like I put this in the wrong place somehow. Not sure how that happened, and not sure where it belongs.
Apologies.


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## FICHT 150 (Mar 24, 2021)

Looks like the right place to me...

Ted


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## RRH48 (Apr 18, 2021)

FICHT 150 said:


> When I did my 1974 Le Tour (now my Son’s) Sheldon Brown was still alive, and was selling a Japanese replacement pedal that was rebuildable, for slim money. I’d bet they have something similar, today.
> 
> I bought new Sun rims, laced them with stainless spokes onto the original hubs, the aforementioned pedals, a really cool Truvativ crankset and bottom bracket, an aluminum seat post, a set of Gatorskins, that are still on the bike, a generic, Shimano 6 speed freewheel, and a cheap, but, better seat, and was rewarded with a bike that weighed 22 lbs, with a Greenfield kickstand. I have no desire to return it to what it was. It would be like comparing an F16 to a Saber jet. Dramatically better bike to ride and use.
> 
> ...



I love the Le Tour, bought one new in 1977 in red, found one all original except tires a few months ago, going to ride it this summer, a lot. It’s a 1977.


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## Real1 (Apr 18, 2021)

Sweet ride! It's the Super too....which was lighter than the LeTour by some pounds. At least two of the frame tubes are double butted on the Super. Original rims on the Super should be alloy as well.

What size frame?

Kevin


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## RRH48 (Apr 18, 2021)

Real1 said:


> Sweet ride! It's the Super too....which was lighter than the LeTour by some pounds. At least two of the frame tubes are double butted on the Super. Original rims on the Super should be alloy as well.
> 
> What size frame?
> 
> Kevin



It’s 25”. New Gatorskins soon and we will ready to ride


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## Real1 (Apr 18, 2021)

I thought it looked tall like mine.

I put on Trisports Flak Jackets and love 'em. And I just put a Brooks B-17 on mine last week.

Kevin


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## RRH48 (Apr 18, 2021)

Mine has an older Brooks saddle on it.


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## Real1 (Apr 18, 2021)

I saw that....that's why I said something.

Kevin


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## FICHT 150 (Apr 19, 2021)

My bike for many years, my Son’s bike, now. Everything was dated 1973, and the neighbor kid got it for Christmas, that year. Original brakes, derailleurs, bars and stem, and that is about it. 
Very nice bikes.
Ted


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## RRH48 (Apr 19, 2021)

Very nice


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## Real1 (Apr 20, 2021)

Interesting color.....don't know that I've seen that before.

Kevin


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## Arthur Roy Brown (Jan 17, 2022)

1974


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## Quakertownrich (Jan 18, 2022)

I replaced stock crappy pedals with KKT ones. Wish it was my size.


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## Eric Amlie (Jan 19, 2022)

Other than the obviously older saddle, it looks like it just came off the dealer's floor!
Amazing condition for a bike that old.


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## Quakertownrich (Jan 20, 2022)

Ty Eric. That is my goal on my restorations, much appreciated. I bought from orig owner(nice lady) in NC.


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## Arthur Roy Brown (Jan 20, 2022)

1974


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## Cooper S. (Jan 20, 2022)

Step 1: throw out old pedals
Step 2: upgrade


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## Arthur Roy Brown (Jan 20, 2022)

Real1 said:


> Sweet ride! It's the Super too....which was lighter than the LeTour by some pounds. At least two of the frame tubes are double butted on the Super. Original rims on the Super should be alloy as well.



12.2 Kilograms on the 1977 Super Le Tour (small frame, IIRC), hence the 12.2 just as the Voyageur 11.8 was 11.8 Kilograms and they were only different weights due to the specs.  On the 25" frames fabbed by Panasonic, the down tube was straight gauge.  IMO, the "Super Lite" tubed frames ride more nicely than the "Ultra Lite" tubesets that followed.  The OE rims on the 1977 SLT I had were not hooked and only Continental branded tires stayed easily put with the higher pressures required for road tires.  Even so, I like the Panaracer Paselas and ran them anyway.

My 1977 Super Le Tour 12.2 before a felonious driver destroyed it and sent me to the ER in September 2007.


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