# Iver Johnson French Gray



## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

I have a IJ Model 90 Special Racer. Someone at some point stripped the paint of when they repainted it poorly decades ago. I’m wanting to restore it and since there is no evidence of original paint, it leaves me open to other factory colors. French Gray and maroon were the factory option colors.
Was curious if anyone has pictures of French Gray. Seen a few of the maroon.


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## Jesse McCauley (Sep 21, 2019)

It just so happens I do-

I can’t post pics from my phone apparently because I’ve posted my “cap” this month but if you lookup my Racycle Rideabout Model 172 you’ll see French Gray in strong color.


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

Jesse McCauley said:


> It just so happens I do-
> 
> I can’t post pics from my phone apparently because I’ve posted my “cap” this month but if you lookup my Racycle Rideabout Model 172 you’ll see French Gray in strong color.
> 
> ...



Thank you


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

Jesse McCauley said:


> It just so happens I do-
> 
> I can’t post pics from my phone apparently because I’ve posted my “cap” this month but if you lookup my Racycle Rideabout Model 172 you’ll see French Gray in strong color.
> 
> ...



It’s a much lighter gray than I expected


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## Jesse McCauley (Sep 21, 2019)

I've been doing a little research on the color, apparently goes back to "high" homes of the 1700's. 
What is really funny about it is that historically it is a color that cannot be described effectively. 

There are a handful of colors that fall into this category but it seems this sheds light on the failings of our language. 

An interesting image though (now that I'm on my computer I can share) is a microscopic view of "French Gray".


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## Jesse McCauley (Sep 21, 2019)

OHH and regarding your bike, have you pulled the bottom bracket and headset cups? 
Those are areas that tend to hold on to original paint samples pretty well.


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

Jesse McCauley said:


> OHH and regarding your bike, have you pulled the bottom bracket and headset cups?
> Those are areas that tend to hold on to original paint samples pretty well.





Jesse McCauley said:


> I've been doing a little research on the color, apparently goes back to "high" homes of the 1700's.
> What is really funny about it is that historically it is a color that cannot be described effectively.
> 
> There are a handful of colors that fall into this category but it seems this sheds light on the failings of our language.
> ...



That is an interesting picture.
I find most specific named colors will have different variations(unfortunately).

I haven’t gotten the bottom bracket or the headset apart yet.


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

It would look sharp in a close as possible gray with the factory double gold pinstripes


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

@Jesse McCauley 
Here is a 1915 Iver Johnson motorcycle. Wonder if they used the same color paint and suppliers as the bicycles. 
Dark picture. I’m sure it makes the color darker than it really is.


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)




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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

In this photo it shows more of the khaki undertone which is sometimes described. From what I’ve read.
Confusing.


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

With all of these pictures, there was no description of color other than “gray”.


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## corbettclassics (Sep 21, 2019)

I've often wondered if this Iver Johnson was French Gray when it was restored:


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

corbettclassics said:


> I've often wondered if this Iver Johnson was French Gray when it was restored:
> 
> 
> View attachment 1066858



I wonder that also. But I don’t think much effort was put into research since they painted everything gray.
BUT maybe they did, who knows.


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## ivrjhnsn (Sep 21, 2019)

This is my interpretation of it .


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## Craig Allen (Sep 21, 2019)

Google search Vintage Paint:34. French Grey- De Oude Bank for a paint chip sample. I recall seeing a Racycle painted French Grey with blue pin striping. French Grey is more an earthy tone.


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## Handyman (Sep 21, 2019)

I have never actually seen an original Iver Johnson bicycle in French Gray.  I hope one surfaces one day.  I've always thought that the bicycles most probably were painted with the same paint as their motorcycles, but I'm not 100% sure of that.  So many unanswered questions and unfortunately no codes to go by.  
Pete in Fitchburg


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

Craig Allen said:


> Google search Vintage Paint:34. French Grey- De Oude Bank for a paint chip sample. I recall seeing a Racycle painted French Grey with blue pin striping. French Grey is more an earthy tone.



Seems much darker than anything I’ve seen painted French Gray.


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

Handyman said:


> I have never actually seen an original Iver Johnson bicycle in French Gray.  I hope one surfaces one day.  I've always thought that the bicycles most probably were painted with the same paint as their motorcycles, but I'm not 100% sure of that.  So many unanswered questions and unfortunately no codes to go by.
> Pete in Fitchburg



That’s my hope. They offered it for a few years. Seems like one would surface. There are a few maroon ones.


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

All 3 of the motorcycles I posted above are different colors. Would be nice to know if there was any evidence of the gray on one before they were restored.


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## Jesse McCauley (Sep 21, 2019)

@s1b
This one appears unrestored?

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-1nTkc8tsYWo/TcIvrBtX5aI/AAAAAAABh2I/ycVHs-Uo2C4/s1600/DSC_0180.JPG


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

Jesse McCauley said:


> @s1b
> This one appears unrestored?
> 
> http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-1nTkc8tsYWo/TcIvrBtX5aI/AAAAAAABh2I/ycVHs-Uo2C4/s1600/DSC_0180.JPG
> ...



Definitely!!
Seems a bit darker


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

@Jesse McCauley
This is from a 1915 catalog. All it says is enamelled gray.


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Sep 21, 2019)

I nearly bagged this rare 1912 IJ, but the owner was trying to scam me. He wanted me to send a PayPal friends & family payment, even though I didn’t know him and I offered to pay all fees. Not very good photos, but correct color.


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## s1b (Sep 21, 2019)

GiovanniLiCalsi said:


> I nearly bagged this rare 1912 IJ, but the owner was trying to scam me. He wanted me to send a PayPal friends & family payment, even though I didn’t know him and I offered to pay all fees. Not very good photos, but correct color.
> 
> View attachment 1067192
> 
> ...



That is interesting, but hard to say what color that is. Does look like a single coat on the BB and gray.


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## s1b (Sep 22, 2019)

Jesse McCauley said:


> I've been doing a little research on the color, apparently goes back to "high" homes of the 1700's.
> What is really funny about it is that historically it is a color that cannot be described effectively.
> 
> There are a handful of colors that fall into this category but it seems this sheds light on the failings of our language.
> ...



I found the page that has that picture. Interesting read, but leaves me even more confused.

http://patrickbaty.co.uk/2012/06/04/french-grey/


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## Duchess (Sep 23, 2019)

From what i remember about the history of paint color from design school, you won't have an exact standard as there wasn't one. Paint was made up in batches and new batches would be hand mixed to probably a pretty close match to the previous, but not exactly. The usual listed reasons for the Model T being changed to only being offered in black (at the beginning and ends of their run they were offered in other colors) is that it dried fastest and didn't require any kind of changeover or extra equipment for different colors, but another one they told us was that, since batches were hand mixed and approximate, if a batch of paint ran out on a particular car, the next batch wouldn't quite match, requiring a whole repaint, which was obviously a hindrance to maximum production. I believe it wasn't until the late 10s or early 20s that someone established a standard that the industry pretty much adopted (there were competing standards for a few years), but last time I googled this to refresh my memory, I couldn't find it.


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## stezell (Sep 23, 2019)

Another thing you have to factor in is what they used as a primer, could have been gray, red, black, etc.. The lighter the primer the lighter the top coat and vice versa.


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## s1b (Sep 23, 2019)

The only thing I keep reading is there was “khaki” in it.


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## s1b (Sep 23, 2019)

Jesse McCauley said:


> @s1b
> This one appears unrestored?
> 
> http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-1nTkc8tsYWo/TcIvrBtX5aI/AAAAAAABh2I/ycVHs-Uo2C4/s1600/DSC_0180.JPG
> ...



@Jesse McCauley 
Would be nice to get ahold of the owner somehow. Maybe get some good pictures.
What is the name of the blog?


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## s1b (Sep 23, 2019)

Two very original Iver Johnso motorcycles.
1912 and 1913. To me the 1912 has the khaki to the gray that I’ve read about a few times. Makes me wonder if that is what they considered French Gray.

1912





1913


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## s1b (Sep 24, 2019)

GiovanniLiCalsi said:


> I nearly bagged this rare 1912 IJ, but the owner was trying to scam me. He wanted me to send a PayPal friends & family payment, even though I didn’t know him and I offered to pay all fees. Not very good photos, but correct color.
> 
> View attachment 1067192
> 
> ...



@GiovanniLiCalsi 
Wish you got this bike. Then maybe we could’ve put the mystery to rest.


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