# Saxon



## dnc1 (May 29, 2018)

Thought you might like to see a friends Saxon "Twin Tube" model at our little festival display.....



 

 
Interesting frame design, with some great local provenance.....


 

Can anyone point me toward other manufacturers with split seat tubes?
I'm aware of "Mecacycle", but no others.
I'm sure that others might have tried this design to achieve the same goal.
Thanks,
Darren.


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## bulldog1935 (May 29, 2018)

certainly that BB lug is the coolest thing ever
there are bound to be many racing examples, since two ways to get a shorter wheelbase are curved seat tubes and split seat tubes

you'll find quite a few in addition to Saxon on CL
Apparently Claud Butler built the Saxon frames.
http://www.classiclightweights.co.uk/bikes/granby-eric-rb.html
Granby if downtube counts



http://www.classiclightweights.co.uk/builders/success.html
Success - twin tubes everywhere



http://www.classiclightweights.co.uk/builders/waller-builders.html
Waller - offset twin seat tubes



http://www.classiclightweights.co.uk/hobbs.html
Hobbs



http://www.classiclightweights.co.uk/elswickhopper.html
Elswick-Hopper




Others include Gilliot, Hill, Joe Cooke (twin downtubes), many tandem designs and just about all women's bikes with split lateral stays,



searching the site, http://www.classiclightweights.co.uk/ turned up 5 pages, so you can stay busy there


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## juvela (May 29, 2018)

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One relatively modern twin tube manufacturer was Rigi of Italy.  During the 1980's their U.S. agent was Bicycle Parts Pacific of San Diego, California.  Despite the short rear triangle they were able to offer multi-plateau gearing courtesy of a specially designed braze-on front mech proudced by Gian Robert.


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## RidgeWalker (May 30, 2018)

1938 Saxon Tandem that has been on the Lake Pepin 3-Speed Tour in years past.


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## fat tire trader (May 31, 2018)

The America

http://www.oldbike.eu/iverjohnson/?page_id=582


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## dnc1 (Jun 2, 2018)

......and then just look what turned up on our V-CC fixed wheel ride today.....


 

 

 

 
Check out that Bartali  'grimpeur le roi' lever too!


 
Stunning machine!


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## juvela (Jun 2, 2018)

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WOW!

What a wonderful sighting.  

Its "chainstays" appear to be road blades.

Thanks so much for posting.  

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## Duchess (Jun 3, 2018)

That RO Harrison is gorgeous! Love the color and the frame design is both interesting and looks like it would be a supple ride with the seat tube angle, yet it has a short wheelbase and I imagine the BB is very rigid. I would love to take that for a spin and see how it rides (it even looks about my size).


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## dnc1 (Jun 3, 2018)

Duchess said:


> That RO Harrison is gorgeous! Love the color and the frame design is both interesting and looks like it would be a supple ride with the seat tube angle, yet it has a short wheelbase and I imagine the BB is very rigid. I would love to take that for a spin and see how it rides (it even looks about my size).



Unfortunately the photo doesn't do justice to the colour, it's much more purple 'in the flesh'. The owner had it repainted using the only original paint that was left on the lower half of the steerer tube. Owner states it is incredibly stiff at the rear end, saddle is hard and with 140 psi in the tubs he wasn't enjoying the harsh ride along our bumpy backroads!


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## fat tire trader (Jun 19, 2018)

Another bike with a split seat tube, Royal Stella.


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## bulldog1935 (Jun 19, 2018)

dnc1 said:


> ...Owner states it is incredibly stiff at the rear end, saddle is hard and with 140 psi in the tubs he wasn't enjoying the harsh ride along our bumpy backroads!








unless he weighs 250 lbs (130 kilos or 18 stones), there's no reason to pump his tires to 140 psi - he may be able to quadruple his tire life by following this chart


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## bikemonkey (Jun 20, 2018)

Never seen these before...if I don't see something new (to me) and cool on the CABE everyday it's because I didn't look very far...


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## dnc1 (Jun 20, 2018)

bulldog1935 said:


> View attachment 826354
> 
> unless he weighs 250 lbs (130 kilos or 18 stones), there's no reason to pump his tires to 140 psi - he may be able to quadruple his tire life by following this chart



Valid point, but with tubs I think the high minimum pressures maybe more to do with keeping them actually on the rims so they don't roll off whilst cornering, this was mentioned by the Harrisons' rider. Idon't think he weighs more than 190lbs.
My Vittoria 'rally' tyres have a minimum pressure of 7 bar, maximum 9 bar.
It scares me to inflate them to 9 bar on antique wood rims, so I don’t go beyond 7.5 bar personally.


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## bulldog1935 (Jun 20, 2018)

dnc1 said:


> ...My Vittoria 'rally' tyres have a minimum pressure of 7 bar, maximum 9 bar.
> ....



no offense, but those are hateful tires, butyl tubes, thick rubber - I had one on a gratis wheelset that was like riding on solid rims.  I can strongly recommend the high-grade Vittoria tires and, even better, the Veloflex tires, which use all the same components as Vittoria and are made in Italy by former Vittoria employees (since Vittoria moved operations to Thailand). They also retail for about 20% cheaper than equivalent Vittoria, and when you find them on closeout they're dirt cheap - spoil you.
You'll think your tires disappeared and you're riding on clouds.

I also like Challenge tubulars, but they're more work to stretch when mounting.  Challenge tubies have a low profile and their wider tires will nicely clear low brakes



I don't recommend Challenge clinchers, because they're the dickens to mount, and the bead stretches out and quits before the tread wears out.
Though I'll admit a pair of 25mm Challenge Strada I removed from my daughter's bike (replaced with Veloflex) has lasted admirably on the bike of my buddy's daughter, where they don't need more than 70 psi.  The low profile was also a particular advantage on her '85 Shogun, which otherwise only had vertical clearance for 21mm tires (delivered new with 19mm) - they vastly improved her ride. 

more Veloflex at Ribble - https://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/brand/veloflex/


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## dnc1 (Jun 20, 2018)

bulldog1935 said:


> no offense, but those are hateful tires, butyl tubes, thick rubber - I had one on a gratis wheelset that was like riding on solid rims.  I can strongly recommend the high-grade Vittoria tires and, even better, the Veloflex tires, which use all the same components as Vittoria and are made in Italy by former Vittoria employees (since Vittoria moved operations to Thailand). They also retail for about 20% cheaper than equivalent Vittoria, and when you find them on closeout they're dirt cheap - spoil you.
> You'll think your tires disappeared and you're riding on clouds.
> 
> I also like Challenge tubulars, but they're more work to stretch when mounting.  Challenge tubies have a low profile and their wider tires will nicely clear low brakes
> ...



Many thanks for the advice, I'm newish to the world of tubs, I only got the 'Rallys' for a, cheapness, b, durability. 
I'll go for an upgrade when this set splits/punctures definitely.


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## bulldog1935 (Jun 20, 2018)

dnc1 said:


> Many thanks for the advice, I'm newish to the world of tubs, I only got the 'Rallys' for a, cheapness, b, durability.
> I'll go for an upgrade when this set splits/punctures definitely.



for closeout prices like I linked, might want to grab a couple to stock for later


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## juvela (Aug 18, 2018)

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In the course of today's web wander came upon another twin seat tube machine.  This time of the wishbone pattern  -





https://www.pignonfixe.com/topic/52...t-caceg-mistral-bitube-ajout-guy-seyve-chromé

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