# Is the old bike hobby growing or will it die out?



## squeedals (Oct 28, 2013)

Like any thing, we tend to be drawn to familiar objects that remind us of our youth, although, I'm attracted to anything older than me and I'm 60-ish. Fairly new to the hobby, over 3 years now, but I've always liked the old bikes. Recently I bought my 1st TOC bike and I'm rounding the corner on the resto and I'm sure there will be more to come. Somehow, though, I wonder just how far this bike collecting hobby will go. Is the younger generations into them like we are? Prices seem to go with demand. The wife and I have been collecting antiques for many moons and I wonder if that hobby or passion will die with the people that love them? I remember my parents HATING antiques, dad born in 1913 and mom, 1920. They bought an old house when they got married in 1943 and mom cleared out all the antiques in a yard sale......and filled the house with contemporary stuff. Now those antiques are once again, "in" but for how long? I have a feeling some day our cherished bicycles will be unwanted relics (I truly hope not). Thoughts?


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## Gary Mc (Oct 28, 2013)

I see younger members continuing to come into the hobby so I don't think it's going to die anytime soon. I actually think we may see it grow.  The economy and where it's headed will play a role in how tight peoples money is.  Look at the California scene, it seems to be growing there.  People get their kids involved in it today and those kids will continue it as they grow into adulthood as they reminisce about childhood memories of biking with their families.  With fossil fuel costs rising, we may at some point see a resurgence in bicycling period as well as smaller villages with city centers. There is a neat trend going on in certain areas of America such as the Florida panhandle with small city centers and surrounding villages that make cycling fun, easy, and attractive.  Florida's Hwy 30A is an example of around 10 town centers along the coast such as Seaside & Rosemary Beach along a 19 mile connected bicycle route.  People go to this area specifically to slow down to a much slower pace and to step back in time, where they can bike for entertainment/relaxation, bike to get to the pub, bike to a restaurant, or bike to shops, and generally just to go back to a simpler way of life if only for a week at a time.  There are literally thousands of bikes there.  While this is a tourist destination at this point, developers are starting to spread the idea across America where we will see a resurgence in both smaller old and new town centers where goods, restaurants, and services most needed are available locally by bike or walking.  This is beginning to happen in Atlanta as old town centers are seeing a resurgence and a subsequent resurgence in biking.  Here so far it's mostly new road & city bikes but that is mostly because there are so few antique bicycle collectors here which I think will change over time.  This may take years but I think it is largely where we are headed long term if the country survives & prospers.  When people in areas such as these see old bikes, they are amazed, so us just riding our old bikes in areas such as this will help the hobby grow.  You know there will always be people out there who think these old bikes are just cool, I want one, and will seek us out as they see them…..

My rambling 2 cents on this …….

PS, I'm 53 and drawn more to TOC-1930 bikes long before my time as well.


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## squeedals (Oct 28, 2013)

While I agree Gary on the growing biking trend.......I think that is mostly the modern bikes (mountain, racers, beach cruisers). There are some younger folks joining the CABE, I have a feeling most of us are...well.....the older variety. This is what I was talking about. 10 or 20 years ago......yes, not a lot of classic and TOC bike enthusiasts and I'm sure you could buy an old bike for a song, ones we would pay BIG bucks for today (like the old car hobby) and now, with the NET and eBay, prices are climbing, but for how long. Supply and demand. Where will the hobby be in 20......30 years.


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## tailhole (Oct 28, 2013)

*Growing*

I sold a few old bikes to a kid in high school recently.  He brought over 2 other high school friends, they all collect and have 20 bikes between them.  They are eager to learn and save their money for bicycles.  It's refreshing to see new, young folks interested.  Not just us grouchy old farts.  And I like these guys cause they ride the bikes.  I'll always be a rider first, collector second.


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## Dan the bike man (Oct 28, 2013)

I'm 28 and I own bikes from 1916-1971. I love the 50's balloon tank bikes, but I also love the 1800's to 1930 wood rim bikes! Dispite my young age these DO remind me of when I was a kid! My dad collected old bikes and he let me ride them as he knew I would be careful with them. I would say the hobby will keep going strong, HOWEVER I feel the bikes $1,000-$5,000 will come down in value a little, at least for a short time as older collections are sold and younger buyers don't want to spend that much. The top-end mega rare bikes will stay up and the lower value bikes (under $1,000 ) will also stay strong. I have seen this with other hobbies. I for one stand ready with cash to buy bikes, but I'm looking for a really good deal! I think that's the trend.


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## Obi-Wan Schwinnobi (Oct 28, 2013)

Dan the bike man said:


> I'm 28 and I own bikes from 1916-1971. I love the 50's balloon tank bikes, but I also love the 1800's to 1930 wood rim bikes! Dispite my young age these DO remind me of when I was a kid! My dad collected old bikes and he let me ride them as he knew I would be careful with them. I would say the hobby will keep going strong, HOWEVER I feel the bikes $1,000-$5,000 will come down in value a little, at least for a short time as older collections are sold and younger buyers don't want to spend that much. The top-end mega rare bikes will stay up and the lower value bikes (under $1,000 ) will also stay strong. I have seen this with other hobbies. I for one stand ready with cash to buy bikes, but I'm looking for a really good deal! I think that's the trend.




I hope it dies.. Then ill get all the cool stuff for cheap and hoard it away!


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## bricycle (Oct 28, 2013)

Crap.... you stole my idea.......


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## redline1968 (Oct 28, 2013)

I've been in to bikes for 25 yrs now. Seems. Like more  interest in toc moto bikes and track bikes now. Use to be I could pick them up for 200 complete. Everything else has stayed close to the same I price except the ultra rare bikes in my opinion.


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## Obi-Wan Schwinnobi (Oct 28, 2013)

bricycle said:


> Crap.... you stole my idea.......




These are not the bikes you are looking for.....


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## bikewhorder (Oct 28, 2013)

Obi-Wan Schwinnobi said:


> I hope it dies.. Then ill get all the cool stuff for cheap and hoard it away!




That's why I've been working so hard to drive away new members to the Cabe!


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## Obi-Wan Schwinnobi (Oct 28, 2013)

bikewhorder said:


> That's why I've been working so hard to drive away new members to the Cabe!




I was letting you do my dirty work...  my private massad... Then ill look saintly in the eyes of the world..


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## bricycle (Oct 28, 2013)

Obi-Wan Schwinnobi said:


> These are not the bikes you are looking for.....




careful "glow stick" boy, or you feel the wrath of my trusty Winchester.......... or was that Chester the Molester...?


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## kos22us (Oct 28, 2013)

i've only been collecting for about 4 years and from what i can tell prices have at least doubled, its hard to to figure out wether thats due to alot more people getting into the hobby or just fewer bikes offered or a combo of both, but generally speaking i think alot more younger people are collecting as its so easy to get into the hobby now with all the different outlets to either buy or discuss old bicycles or even simply observe that people actually collect them as a hobby, for some it will be a fad or something they get in & out of several times through out their lives, for others this hobby is just one of many and may not be their main hobby, others grow old and pass away ... will the hobby be replenished with new blood ?  only time will tell but i strongly feel this will always be a solid hobby, as far as prices go even if the amount of the new blood levels off or even drops i dont see prices dropping drastically, there are only so many antique/vintage bicycles out there to be found & some wont be found as they lay hidden half buried in the field or whatever or end up at the scrap yard, out of all the bicycles we currently own & collect one of them gets repainted or parted out everyday dwindling down the stock so long term this will balance out the market should there be a lack of new collectors  

then again i only have 4 years experience where as a long time collector who has watched the hobby evolve would be in a much better position to make predictions


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## Obi-Wan Schwinnobi (Oct 28, 2013)

bricycle said:


> careful "glow stick" boy, or you feel the wrath of my trusty Winchester.......... or was that Chester the Molester...?




Feel the power of the Schwinn side... Id just will the gun over to me and pistol whip you with it....


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## bricycle (Oct 28, 2013)

Obi-Wan Schwinnobi said:


> Feel the power of the Schwinn side...




I feel it!...I feel it!  I feel the warmth...Oh crap, I pee'd on myself! YOU SCARED me......


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## ReVo (Oct 28, 2013)

Well, I'm 23 and just started with my first Schwinn earlier this year. I restored my first classic bike this year as well. I can say for sure that after I finish this project I will find another to fix up. 

To be honest I can't stand new age Chinese throw away bikes. They don't ride the same as old bikes do. They feel cheap and flimsy. Plus there is no creativity put into them. Nothing to make it "yours". 
My friends and I both are starting to collect them and fix them.
I can bet this hobby will hold on for a long time to come. The prices.... Not so sure.

-Ron-


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## Obi-Wan Schwinnobi (Oct 28, 2013)

bricycle said:


> I feel it!...I feel it!  I feel the warmth...Oh crap, I pee'd on myself! YOU SCARED me......




Haha...here ya go Chester
View attachment 120014


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## squeedals (Oct 28, 2013)

Encouraging to see some youngsters posting here for sure. I look at the bikes as works of art that are no longer being made, although I hate the re-issue bikes out there being passed off as "originals" SOB's. I suppose it won't matter after I'm gone, if the hobby survives. What will become of my hoard.....? One would like to think they end up in a museum......but that is wishful thinking, unless I donate them.....and even then, some museums sell off part of their collection........who really knows.


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## SirMike1983 (Oct 28, 2013)

I think it will shift directions somewhat. I think old lightweights and 3-speeds will come up in value quite a bit, with a slight drop to old balloon tire bikes. I think bikes like Paramounts, New Worlds, Sports Tourists, and Superiors are all going to go up pretty heavily in value and find more collectors. I think the ballooners will be flat or maybe have a slight drop (though not a whole lot). The trend among the younger people in the hobby I've bumped into is getting a vintage bike you can tour with or ride a lot. The ballooners work great in flat areas, but they're more limited than a light weight with 3, 5, or even 10 speeds. Raleigh and Schwinn lightweights are particularly popular lately. When I started getting into Raleighs 10 years ago, after awhile of Schwinn and Columbia focus, you could buy a nice 3 speed for $20-30. Now prices are over $200 for a nice 3 speed Raleigh here in the DC area.


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## bricycle (Oct 28, 2013)

SirMike1983 said:


> I think it will shift directions somewhat. I think old lightweights and 3-speeds will come up in value quite a bit, with a slight drop to old balloon tire bikes. I think bikes like Paramounts, New Worlds, Sports Tourists, and Superiors are all going to go up pretty heavily in value and find more collectors. I think the ballooners will be flat or maybe have a slight drop (though not a whole lot). The trend among the younger people in the hobby I've bumped into is getting a vintage bike you can tour with or ride a lot. The ballooners work great in flat areas, but they're more limited than a light weight with 3, 5, or even 10 speeds.




I think you're spot on.


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## Dan the bike man (Oct 28, 2013)

squeedals said:


> Encouraging to see some youngsters posting here for sure. I look at the bikes as works of art that are no longer being made, although I hate the re-issue bikes out there being passed off as "originals" SOB's. I suppose it won't matter after I'm gone, if the hobby survives. What will become of my hoard.....? One would like to think they end up in a museum......but that is wishful thinking, unless I donate them.....and even then, some museums sell off part of their collection........who really knows.




 You can donate them to my museum! I'll care for and ride them!


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## squeedals (Oct 28, 2013)

Dan the bike man said:


> You can donate them to my museum! I'll care for and ride them!




I was waiting for that.....LOL!


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## 2jakes (Oct 28, 2013)

"...it's old, missing parts & rust all
over...it's worth mucho $$$...."

I know this for a fact cuz I seen it
on "American Pickers"...


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## Gary Mc (Oct 28, 2013)

SirMike1983 said:


> I think it will shift directions somewhat. I think old lightweights and 3-speeds will come up in value quite a bit, with a slight drop to old balloon tire bikes. I think bikes like Paramounts, New Worlds, Sports Tourists, and Superiors are all going to go up pretty heavily in value and find more collectors. I think the ballooners will be flat or maybe have a slight drop (though not a whole lot). The trend among the younger people in the hobby I've bumped into is getting a vintage bike you can tour with or ride a lot. The ballooners work great in flat areas, but they're more limited than a light weight with 3, 5, or even 10 speeds. Raleigh and Schwinn lightweights are particularly popular lately. When I started getting into Raleighs 10 years ago, after awhile of Schwinn and Columbia focus, you could buy a nice 3 speed for $20-30. Now prices are over $200 for a nice 3 speed Raleigh here in the DC area.




I too agree with you Mike.  I also think Schwinn's such as Collegiates & Varsity's with gearing will grow in popularity in the future similar to what you are seeing with Raleighs.  Not to mention Italian & French bikes such as Bianchi & Automoto or Peugout.  These are great bikes to RIDE, easy to ride, and pretty plentiful today but still retain the vintage feel.  If I had the money & space I'd be socking away nice original Schwinn Collegiates & Raleighs.


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## Obi-Wan Schwinnobi (Oct 28, 2013)

Gary Mc said:


> I too agree with you Mike.  I also think Schwinn's such as Collegiates & Varsity's with gearing will grow in popularity in the future similar to what you are seeing with Raleighs.  Not to mention Italian & French bikes such as Bianchi & Automoto or Peugout.  These are great bikes to RIDE, easy to ride, and pretty plentiful today but still retain the vintage feel.  If I had the money & space I'd be socking away nice original Schwinn Collegiates & Raleighs.




Already seeing it with bmx ....


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## squeedals (Oct 28, 2013)

Maybe the key word here is "ride". Some classics and TOC's are not practical riders and maybe those bikes will fall out of favor with the majority, with the minority collecting them for historical reasons. Collecting trends never stay the same......


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## Gary Mc (Oct 28, 2013)

squeedals said:


> Maybe the key word here is "ride". Some classics and TOC's are not practical riders and maybe those bikes will fall out of favor with the majority, with the minority collecting them for historical reasons. Collecting trends never stay the same......




Think that's it with "ride" & you are right, every collecting boom/bust is cyclical, nothing stays the same.


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## scrubbinrims (Oct 28, 2013)

In my opinion, the lesser bikes as 3-speeds, middleweights, & "vintage" lightweights are gaining popularity being #1 available, #2 less expensive, and #3 practical...I doubt there are many that collect them, mainly appealing to a crowd wanting an older bike with character to maneuver.  

I see a number of new folks (young and old) on here and in the hobby which is critical to our hobby growing, but what I don't see a lot of are the folks coming in to amass a significant collection.
What is dwindling are the mega collectors/collections...most newcomers having a modest cache and not into display cases, dedicated areas of the house for show, and peripherals like advertising.
So, I see a rising casual interest hobby, content to wait for a bargain, just not a rise in what I would consider serious collectors that go after it.
Chris


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## DJ Bill (Oct 28, 2013)

The newer lightweight Chicago built and a few imported Schwinns are just so easy to work on, plentiful, and just look like a well built bike that they can't go anywher but UP. In certain college towns and resort towns they are already in the $200 and up range for nice ones. But...you can still find solid examples for $20 all day long in other areas. I have a hunch they will be the next craze too, and am stocking up all I can find that have the upright bars. Us older guys can't ride the race position anymore and the folks that just want to tool around town on a nice bike don't want wrapped bars either. 
      And the trash they pass off as a Schwinn at Wallyworld does nothing for the name except make people long for the good old days, so smart guys buy a used old one and restore it to what they remember. 

  From what I have seen the higher end Stingray prices are way lower than a few years ago, so maybe that fad is over...Nothing wrong with a good Stingray, mind you, but the prices were in my own opinion, nuts. Now you see people going for the off brand musclebikes, and restoring them to similar quality levels to the Stingray crowd, which is cool. 


    And then you have the moneyed crowd that buys at places like the Copake Auction. I do not see them slowing down one bit on the good stuff. You won't see me at Copake but I'm a low end guy anyway. 

Pickers and all the PBS shows and Discovery/History channel stuff have brought new folks to the hobby.They even did a bike on Fast and Loud once... Whether that is good??who knows. We have more eyes out there searching for the good stuff in the back alleys, so that will keep stuff away from the scrap  man. There is an element of the "I saw it on TV so it is worth a ton of money" crowd too...which stinks...

    My opinion anyhow. Worth exactly what ya paid for it , no more, no less. Hope I didn't step on too many toes.


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## bike (Oct 28, 2013)

*2 Groups*

NOSTALIGIC want what they had or could not have- BIG bubble
Collectors- like the stuff but dont care when made- smaller group.
I have seen the hobby cycle() through a few times...


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## dougfisk (Oct 28, 2013)

bike said:


> NOSTALIGIC want what they had or could not have- BIG bubble...
> ...




Uh Oh...  :eek:


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## bike (Oct 28, 2013)

*Highweel guys, Hard tire saftey guys early pnuemaic*

DEAD- pre war balloon that got NEW 30s bikes mostly dead (sorry to those out there) or too old to buy- these markets are driven by collectors

Mws stinkrays bmx and later roadbike- nostalgic- stingrays bubble may have already burst- not into that market - oldly we used to wonder why MWS got passed over for stingrays but they seem to be stronger than ever now.


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## bricycle (Oct 28, 2013)

I have absolutely NO desire to have my old 1964-5 Typhoon...YUCK!


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## cyclingday (Oct 28, 2013)

The pinnacle bikes from the various manufacturers during the classic bicycle era, will always be desireable.
Values will fluctuate just as with anything, but I can just about guarantee, that an Elgin Bluebird will still be just as revered a hundred years from now as it is today.
How much one has to pay to acquire one is anyones guess.
They cost $90 dollars when new and now they cost upwards of 10 grand!
A hundred years from now, who knows?


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## bikewhorder (Oct 28, 2013)

cyclingday said:


> The pinnacle bikes from the various manufacturers during the classic bicycle era, will always be desireable.
> Values will fluctuate just as with anything, but I can just about guarantee, that an Elgin Bluebird will still be just as revered a hundred years from now as it is today.
> How much one has to pay to acquire one is anyones guess.
> They cost $90 dollars when new and now they cost upwards of 10 grand!
> A hundred years from now, who knows?




I agree, people will always want to own cool S*&t, and these early bikes are just dripping with coolness.  The demand will always be there, but the value will be driven by the health of the economy.


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## MrColumbia (Oct 28, 2013)

I don't think zombies can ride bicycles so they will probably be mainly into collecting and restoring. They may not even remember what bike they had as a kid so nostalgia won't be that big for them.

Before the zombie apocalypse happens the trend for collecting rustriginals will continue to gain momentum. In climates warmer than mine ratrods and other ride-able vintage bikes will grow in popularity. Especially among the newer collectors and younger crowd. They can ride with far less pain than us old farts can. Once it hurts to even throw your leg over a bike then you have to just look at them lined up in your garage. 

I think the Highweeler stuff is going the way of museums in the next 20 or 30 years. Maybe sooner. The Wheelmen are a great organization and a great bunch of guys but membership is never going to climb to any great extent in the future. Probably just the opposite. 

I have a difficult time envisioning vintage bike meets featuring 70's mass produced 10 speeds or the like. I think even the "muscle bike" balloon already popped after a way too short run. 

Maybe BMX and mountain bikes will be collectibles once they are old enough. How collectible is anybody's guess. Probably small niche markets but for those into them they will be passionate about them. These are the guys who rode the piss out of their machines. A lot of personal history translates into a boat load of passion. 

Markets for each part of the hobby will start as they always do with true interested collectors. Then not too long after, the greedy will take over that part of the hobby. Then a big bubble as more and more of the greedy try to cash in until the bubble bursts and then the few true interested people in that niche inherit the remains. 

Bicycles in general are the single most perfect mechanical invention of all times. They will be around forever. Don't believe me? Think about it, of every mechanical device ever made, has any lasted like the bicycle? The concept is pure. Two wheels, a rider and rider power. The combustion engine automobile will go away. It has to. Eventually all forms of transportation as we know them today will be replaced with better more efficient forms. 

Two wheels that are rider powered will never need to go away. Ergonomics will demand that the general shape, size and layout of a bicycle remain close to what it is now as it has for 120 years. Better materials, sure. New inventions to make pedaling or changing gears easier, no doubt. In 500 or 1,000 years anyone of us will still be able to recognize a bicycle right away and be able to ride it without instruction. The same wont be true for their thought powered hover-cars.


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## SJ_BIKER (Oct 28, 2013)

*it all depends*

yesturday I ran into a guy(older gentleman) out in the santa cruz CA  who i met while walking in the fleamarket (he was holding 1930s columbia fenders that he just bought) and he talked to me about the good old days(as little as 20 to 25 years) when old balloon bikes and parts could be bought in the very same flea market where we were both standing and he talked about all the collectors/dealers that sold there and how much fun it was...and hes still looking for a nice original....however the only old bikes i saw yesterday were parted out 1970s stingray schwinns and some 1950s cranks and im not holding breath that it will ever get back to the good old days as no younger guys are selling them in this fleamarket.  pretty bland people.....its no fun when one has to piece together a 1930s schwinn when people are asking high ammounts for their parts....it must have been nice to get an aerocycle for less than 1000.00 complete very nice indeed.....im in my lates 30s and i have owned well over 60 schwinns all from 1936 to 1953 specifically....its been fun and theres no stopping for me....might slow down if im in crunch but rest assured i have books and magazines to keep me educated.....its a great hobby....sometimes i wish all the older collector folk wouldnt hoard so much of the nice originals....i may try to sell them old bikes out there soon enough....question is will they pay what ill be asking for??? .seems like the trend out here right now is a demand for high end mountain bikes and super lightweight light weight bikes....they are easy to disassemble and dont take up  much space and they are easier on the back i guess....its amazing how fast people hand over cash for the newer stuff.....still though theres something about fenders and balloon tires that brightens up a face when ever i ask you got any older stuff such as.......


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Oct 28, 2013)

The 1800 ordinary bicycles used to be very affordable but are now very expensive. A nice entry level ordinary is around $3,500.00. A high end Star is around $15,000.00.
I think that the TOC bicycles will go up in value in the next ten years.
Balloon tire bicycles will level off in value as a lot of the baby boomers die off but will eventually go up in price as more cities accommodate bicycle riding and limit automobiles.
Anyway you look at it, antique and collectable bicycles will be collected for many years and less and less will be available for sale.


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## Freqman1 (Oct 28, 2013)

MrColumbia said:


> I think the Highweeler stuff is going the way of museums in the next 20 or 30 years. Maybe sooner. The Wheelmen are a great organization and a great bunch of guys but membership is never going to climb to any great extent in the future. Probably just the opposite.




At one time I took an interest in the earlier stuff and sent at least three emails to the Wheelman site about membership--no response at all. Its hard to get new blood if you can't even respond to a simple request to join your site. V/r Shawn


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Oct 28, 2013)

The Wheelman forum site uses funky software and the administrators are very slow to respond to anything. The personal message does not work all of the time.
It took a few weeks before my paid membership was accepted and I was able to fully use the forum.
A lot of the members are really lost in the last millennium and do not understand how to register for a Photobucket account and post photos on the forum.
You just have to be patient with the forum.


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## Gary Mc (Oct 28, 2013)

Freqman1 said:


> At one time I took an interest in the earlier stuff and sent at least three emails to the Wheelman site about membership--no response at all. Its hard to get new blood if you can't even respond to a simple request to join your site. V/r Shawn




Shawn, I did the same thing & got the same result, NO response.  Also when researching for my little New Departure/Corbin project on the beginnings of the coaster brake, pelletman, a wheelman posted over there trying to get help, very little response and what he got was proved partly wrong.  Tried to contact an "expert" on New Departure over there, NO response, turned out I had already learned more than he knew.  They seem to me to be very closed to growing their organization and God forbid they share any knowledge.  Needless to say I love the old TOC stuff and thought the Wheelman would be a good organization to be a part of but they seem stuck forever in their own little world and are not desiring of letting outsiders in.  So be it, I don't want in anymore.


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Oct 28, 2013)

I'm a paying Wheelman member.
You are correct in saying that they are not actively participating in the forum but the members do spend a lot of their time on bicycle events and promoting the hobby.
At times they can seem snobbish and closed off and are not very welcoming to new members.
I have been there a while and sometimes not acknowledged when I'm asking for information about a bicycle or part.
Also most ordinary owners are not interested in TOC bicycles.


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## Obi-Wan Schwinnobi (Oct 28, 2013)

Is it dead yet??? I want my five dollar buckets of seiss lights, Pogo saddles, hanging canti tanks, drum brakes and dd forks already... Oh and free worthless fender bombs..


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## dougfisk (Oct 28, 2013)

Gary Mc said:


> Shawn, I did the same thing & got the same result, NO response....




Too funny, I "registered" about 2 weeks ago and still have not been "accepted"...


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## Gary Mc (Oct 28, 2013)

dougfisk said:


> Too funny, I "registered" about 2 weeks ago and still have not been "accepted"...




Too funny Doug, and here I thought they were just ignoring Southern Rednecks like me…….

PS, maybe they saw my name on RRB too, maybe I got snubbed for that too…..

Damn, 2 strikes against me, can't be a Wheelman!!!!!!!!!!


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## Crazybikelady (Oct 28, 2013)

I see it continuing on for sure! I've got four little boys and each time I come home with a new bike they love learning about it. What year, who made it, what parts does it need etc etc. I totally should've been raised in the fifties...i love telling them about the GOOD OLD DAYS. Now that it's cold out we detail bikes in the kitchen, lol! I'm trying to convince my husband to let me hang a bike on the kitchen wall  .


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## OldRider (Oct 28, 2013)

Gary Mc said:


> Too funny Doug, and here I thought they were just ignoring Southern Rednecks like me…….
> 
> PS, maybe they saw my name on RRB too, maybe I got snubbed for that too…..
> 
> Damn, 2 strikes against me, can't be a Wheelman!!!!!!!!!!



Two years ago  I put in a request to become a member.....apparently they don't like Canadians either.


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## SirMike1983 (Oct 28, 2013)

OldRider said:


> Two years ago  I put in a request to become a member.....apparently they don't like Canadians either.


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## Gary Mc (Oct 28, 2013)

SirMike1983 said:


>




Too funny!!!!!!!!!!!


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## OldRider (Oct 28, 2013)

Haha love it Mike!


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## fordsnake (Oct 28, 2013)

*Don't feel bad Canadians...*

It took me a while to get the Wheelman's hint, after 3 years and 4 requests! I guess I'll never get a drink of their water.


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## 2jakes (Oct 28, 2013)

I've noticed the same situation on other forums .
I have a '63 VW beetle, a 39 Ford. I decided to sign up.
Not sure if I can mention them by name...but every time 
I log in , it's like going to an empty vacant house & no
one around.No response.And not just towards me, but
everybody. 

Replies: 0
Views: 172
Replies: 0
Views: 226

It's eerie...but around this time of the year...very appropriate


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## 2jakes (Oct 28, 2013)

fordsnake said:


> It took me a while to get the Wheelman's hint, after 3 years and 4 requests! I guess I'll never get a drink of their water.




...and all this time I thought it was the urinal for non-whites...

"sorry bout dat "...:o


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## Hermanator3 (Oct 28, 2013)

No one has mentioned high end road bikes from the 1950's through the 1970's as collectibles.  I'm interested in getting an English built, full 531 Reynolds frame from the 1970's.  I've been checking ebay & believe me they are not giving them away.  Part of my problem is that I need a small frame, 52 cm c to c.  Big frames are much easier to find.  The best of the Italian & French road bikes of the same period are also in demand.  If you have ever seen an English Mercian with the elaborate lugs of some of their models, you would know why they are lusted after.

I'm an old fart @ 74 but I still prefer dropped bars for distance riding.


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## slick (Oct 28, 2013)

Well, i guess i will speak for the younger generation of collectors even though i am a soon to be an over the hill age of 36 in a month. In my opinion 35 is the top of the hill. 

So here is how i see it as most of the younger bunch i hang out and RIDE our vintage bikes with. The vintage bike realm would be great to carry on but there are some factors to be considered which most of the guys on here are accusable of. 

The first fact is that parts are unobtainable to finish the bike if these guys who have multiple of the same part refuse to give them up because they look better in their display case. 

The price on the collectible bikes are so far out of reach for us young guns compared to what the cost of living is. To bust your ass on a daily basis, raise a family, and live does not leave enough money behind to afford a $3k + bicycle. So the odds of one of us getting it is simply out of reach. Sure you might have gotten it at a deal 20+ years ago, and sure their is inflation to factor in but to ask an obscene amount is just unobtainable leaving the youth to move onto another hobby in a more affordable range for us even though we love the bike world. I for one am in this world. I'm pretty much over trying to find anymore mens bikes. Damn near all the prewar mens tank bikes are $1k on up. Girls bikes on the other hand, $300-500. So it looks like Karlas collection will grow as mine dwindles in the twillight. I'm happy with what i have. It's bad enough i had to sell my child hood dream real henry steel 32 ford 5 window coupe to make me Shelby Speedline a reality to own. That right there is pretty damn sad. What was i thinking???


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Oct 28, 2013)

Better to have a $3,000.00 bicycle than ten $300.00 bicycles.
It is untrue that the one who dies with the most bicycles wins.
The dead just go to an afterlife without there bicycle collection.


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Oct 28, 2013)

fordsnake said:


> It took me a while to get the Wheelman's hint, after 3 years and 4 requests! I guess I'll never get a drink of their water.




Believe me. It has nothing to do with anything other that their website is screwed up and the administrator is asleep at the wheel and mostly likely needs their license revoked!
But when I posted a G rated German video ad, made by the German government, the Wheelman administrator promptly removed it, saying it was unsuitable for children! Go figure.
She was a female administrator.

http://youtu.be/ZNGSnLZrLYg


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## MrColumbia (Oct 29, 2013)

I've been a paying member of the Wheelmen for a few years now. I don't think racism or snobbishness has anything to do with the membership problems people have had. When I was looking to join I asked if I could since I did not have a high wheel bike. The answer..."of course, we are happy to take anyone's money and send out the newsletters." Their policy is to accept anyone who pays the membership fees into their club, period. They do not pick and choose members. 

When I send my check in for my yearly membership renewal it usually takes a bout 3 to 4 months for them to cash it. At times they have lost it. This speaks volumes about those who administer the organization. The membership department is not very organized. I've never tried to renew online. I'm not sure you even can but would not trust it. The members do what they do well but the organization is stuck in the 70's...maybe 1870's. It's amazing they even have a web site that is good as it is. Many of the members seem technologically challenged as well. I have responded by email to adds placed in their newsletter and never get a response. I call and eventually get the person and the excuse..."I never check my email". Really! Why put one in your ad then?

Lets face it, the high wheel bikes are a different world than what most here are in. Riding them is a completely different experience and the prices and level of expertise to work on them bring the whole thing to another level that is not for everyone. As the older Wheelmen pass on newer and younger riders will be few and far between. It's kind of like the guys who were into the brass era automobiles years ago. They had strong clubs and great meets. Eventually those old guys died off and the younger guys were into newer more affordable cars that could be used on modern roads in modern traffic. The Brass era cars all went into private collections and museums and the brass car clubs went the way of the Dodo Bird. They are fewer in number by far even at big meets like Hershey. Everything has it's time. The same for the earliest of bicycles.


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## squeedals (Oct 29, 2013)

I refuse to PAY for a bike site that is mediocre and unresponsive......when we can hang here with a great bunch, have our problems addressed almost immediately ( I have) for FREE! I regerstered with The Wheelman a while back and have not heard a peep.......so who needs that when we have this WONDERFUL SITE? Not to dis any Wheelmen and I know a few CABE members are, but I'm sorry, momma always said NEVER pay for what you can get for nothing. 

GREAT responses BTW guys and gals. Averaging them all out I'd say old bikes will be popular, with someone, somewhere at some time.


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## 2jakes (Oct 29, 2013)

MrColumbia said:


> I've been a paying member of the Wheelmen for a few years now. I don't think racism or snobbishness has anything to do with the membership problems people have had. When I was looking to join I asked if I could since I did not have a high wheel bike. The answer..."of course, we are happy to take anyone's money and send out the newsletters." Their policy is to accept anyone who pays the membership fees into their club, period. They do not pick and choose members.
> 
> When I send my check in for my yearly membership renewal it usually takes a bout 3 to 4 months for them to cash it. At times they have lost it. This speaks volumes about those who administer the organization. The membership department is not very organized. I've never tried to renew online. I'm not sure you even can but would not trust it. The members do what they do well but the organization is stuck in the 70's...maybe 1870's. It's amazing they even have a web site that is good as it is. Many of the members seem technologically challenged as well. I have responded by email to adds placed in their newsletter and never get a response. I call and eventually get the person and the excuse..."I never check my email". Really! Why put one in your ad then?
> 
> Lets face it, the high wheel bikes are a different world than what most here are in. Riding them is a completely different experience and the prices and level of expertise to work on them bring the whole thing to another level that is not for everyone. As the older Wheelmen pass on newer and younger riders will be few and far between. It's kind of like the guys who were into the brass era automobiles years ago. They had strong clubs and great meets. Eventually those old guys died off and the younger guys were into newer more affordable cars that could be used on modern roads in modern traffic. The Brass era cars all went into private collections and museums and the brass car clubs went the way of the Dodo Bird. They are fewer in number by far even at big meets like Hershey. Everything has it's time. The same for the earliest of bicycles.




With regards to your reply as a paying member for a few years to a "department that is not very organized".
"Organization that is stuck in the '70s". Whose "members seem technologically challenged as well". Zero response
to your emails...makes me wonder... are you still a member & why


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## Iverider (Oct 29, 2013)

I'm registered on their website, but not a paying member. It's  often very quiet with random explosions where long-time members disavow  the site and leave. The only way to make it better is to join and get to  know people. It's more of a social/history club than a web forum. Find  your local chapter and see if you can go to a meeting. I know that means  leaving your keyboard, but sometimes these things must be done.

I've  met a few members I really like and a few I don't so much. It's like  any national/international club, the cross section is huge and keeps  things fairly impersonal (as far as making long lasting friendships).  I'll probably join my local chapter as a paying member sometime, but  it's not a priority currently. When the old guys go, someone has to fill  their shoes or early safeties and ordinaries will be filling museums  instead of being in the hands of hobbiests.


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## MrColumbia (Oct 29, 2013)

2jakes said:


> With regards to your reply as a paying member for a few years to a "department that is not very organized".
> "Organization that is stuck in the '70s". Whose "members seem technologically challenged as well". Zero response
> to your emails...makes me wonder... are you still a member & why




I am still a member. Some of the why's are as follows; 

They have a good newsletter that I am interested in getting. 

There is a huge gap in my knowledge when it comes to bikes and Columbia's history and that is pre-1900. Members of the Wheelmen have been very gracious with information to help fill in the gaps I have.  

Members of the Wheelmen have gone out of their way to help me on my quest for information in the areas I lack. Ross Hill, the Wheelmens historian has been to my house on more than one occasion just to talk bikes. He lives in the Chicago area and I live in Massachusetts. I owe a lot of credit to Ross for information I have on my site.

Dave Toppin who is the Massachusetts chapter president has gone out of his way to help in my quest as well. He has also given me part of my dream and started teaching me to ride High wheel bikes. An experience not very similar to riding modern bikes to be sure. He does this for a lot of people who want to learn. 

The dues are not very expensive to begin with and the newsletter is worth what you pay.

Last time I looked the Wheelmen web site was free. Anyone can use it and the "bicycle brands" section alone is antique bicycle gold. 

In summery, if something is of interest to you then take the good with the bad and stop complaining. That is something many on this site have a very difficult time doing. (I'm *not* accusing the person I am directly replying to here) _"It is what it is"_, an old saying but one to live by. As the younger generation who grew up with computers take over the world there will be less tolerance for those who did not grow up with this type of technology.  We will be gone someday. Then everyone can tweet and text until their finger bleed. I don't care. I have what I came for.


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## reginald (Oct 29, 2013)

*The kids are alright....*

I'm not worried.   I see ratrodding growing....look at the lust for parts.  Some bikes will get painted/parted along the way, but people will always want cool townies built for comfort and style.  Just get out and ride the damn things.   No kids curiosity will be peaked if they never see these bikes, because they are hanging out in your basement.  How will they regret buying that Felt or Electra if they never see your bike?


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## 2jakes (Oct 29, 2013)

MrColumbia said:


> I am still a member. Some of the why's are as follows;
> 
> They have a good newsletter that I am interested in getting.
> 
> ...




Please understand that I was basing my question on your reply # 58  which caused me to wonder.
Had I read  only your second reply which has much positive input . I would not have asked.

 You mentioned that many on this site have" a very difficult time in taking in the good with the bad 
and stop complaining".

It seems to me that is good advice... & which I saw lacking in the initial reply (#58) with regards
to the Wheelmen.


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Oct 29, 2013)

Mr. Columbia,
Im voting you in to be our representative for diplomacy!
You wrote very good thoughts for members.
I would like to know how your ordinary lessons go.
I would like to learn how to ride, too.
Greg Barron tried to give me some quick lessons before the Fourth of July parade but was not enough confidence builder for this 63 year old guy.


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## Freqman1 (Oct 29, 2013)

Krautwaggen said:


> I'm registered on their website, but not a paying member. It's  often very quiet with random explosions where long-time members disavow  the site and leave. The only way to make it better is to join and get to  know people. It's more of a social/history club than a web forum. Find  your local chapter and see if you can go to a meeting. I know that means  leaving your keyboard, but sometimes these things must be done.
> 
> I've  met a few members I really like and a few I don't so much. It's like  any national/international club, the cross section is huge and keeps  things fairly impersonal (as far as making long lasting friendships).  I'll probably join my local chapter as a paying member sometime, but  it's not a priority currently. When the old guys go, someone has to fill  their shoes or early safeties and ordinaries will be filling museums  instead of being in the hands of hobbiests.




I think your post gets to the heart of the original question. Ok so the Wheelmen don't want to answer email or do the 21st century things to grow their ranks. So yep those bikes will be relegated to museums. V/r Shawn


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## MrColumbia (Oct 30, 2013)

GiovanniLiCalsi said:


> Mr. Columbia,
> Im voting you in to be our representative for diplomacy!
> You wrote very good thoughts for members.
> I would like to know how your ordinary lessons go.
> ...






I simply state what I observe. From my perspective of course just like anybody would. How could anyone do differently. Personally, I have been feeling a bit tired as of late with the whole bicycle thing. Between my new business venture, a steady stream of rude, ignorant people contacting me through my web site and the constant bickering that seems to spring up on this site I've had just about enough. I'm fast approaching 1000 posts. After that I will probably move on. Mom always said not to overstay your welcome.  

I only had one ordinary lesson and got to ride for about 15 minutes. I have pretty bad tendentious in both arms and was having difficulty mounting the bike so I could not continue. I'm not sure if I will ever be able to go further but that time I had doing figure eights in the parking lot was worth the world to me.


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## MrColumbia (Oct 30, 2013)

2jakes said:


> Please understand that I was basing my question on your reply # 58  which caused me to wonder.
> Had I read  only your second reply which has much positive input . I would not have asked.
> 
> You mentioned that many on this site have" a very difficult time in taking in the good with the bad
> ...




I was responding to several negative comments about the Wheelmen with the intention of pointing out that the flaws in their organization were more benign than was insinuated by some. The direct insinuations that they are deliberately discriminating against people of color or status of life is repulsive to me.

 I've bit my tong quite a few times lately and still feel I've said too much at times. This is what happens with this type of technology. The impersonal yet too personal medium of web forums. We sit at our key boards without facing the person we are talking to. There are no real life ramifications in this perverse world of our making.  We say things we never would to someones face. We are a brave lot staring at our glowing screens. I am as guilty as everyone else. For that I do apologize.

Getting back to the topic, I still maintain that the whole Highwheel/Ordinary thing is simply too complicated for most in the hobby and for that reason alone these bikes will suffer the fate/retirement I predicted. It will always be a niche in the hobby but always a small one.


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## mike j (Oct 30, 2013)

Only ten more posts? You're not ready to move on yet Mr. Columbia, still needed down here at the CABE. You are a very positive asset & you're website is a fantastic source of information. Let's give it one more for the Gipper.


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## squeedals (Oct 30, 2013)

Interesting segue from my original question, for sure. Who needs any other old bike site anyway, when there are so many great folks right here? This site has: 1. taught me a lot. 2. saved me a ton of money. 3. Is absolutely FREE! So.......there ya be.


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## MrColumbia (Oct 30, 2013)

mike j said:


> Only ten more posts? You're not ready to move on yet Mr. Columbia, still needed down here at the CABE. You are a very positive asset & you're website is a fantastic source of information. Let's give it one more for the Gipper.




This is what a grotesque lack of sleep for an extended period of time will do for you. I recommend it to anyone with the desire to hallucinate and then ramble incoherently on web forums all night.


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## Obi-Wan Schwinnobi (Oct 30, 2013)

MrColumbia said:


> This is what a grotesque lack of sleep for an extended period of time will do for you. I recommend it to anyone with the desire to hallucinate and then ramble incoherently on web forums all night.




your ascension to a higher plain of bike is almost complete.. Bhaaahaaha


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## SJ_BIKER (Oct 30, 2013)

*.........*

theoretically it will die out unless the upcoming generation can see these works of art ...appreciate them and maybe have a chance at buying them.....im still waiting for my chance.....to get a speedoed out autocycle, aerocycle, dayton streamline, robin, etc......at decent rates of course.....


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## 2jakes (Oct 30, 2013)

MrColumbia said:


> I was responding to several negative comments about the Wheelmen with the intention of pointing out that the flaws in their organization were more benign than was insinuated by some. The direct insinuations that they are deliberately discriminating against people of color or status of life is repulsive to me.
> 
> I've bit my tong quite a few times lately and still feel I've said too much at times. This is what happens with this type of technology. The impersonal yet too personal medium of web forums. We sit at our key boards without facing the person we are talking to. There are no real life ramifications in this perverse world of our making.  We say things we never would to someones face. We are a brave lot staring at our glowing screens. I am as guilty as everyone else. For that I do apologize.
> 
> Getting back to the topic, I still maintain that the whole Highwheel/Ordinary thing is simply too complicated for most in the hobby and for that reason alone these bikes will suffer the fate/retirement I predicted. It will always be a niche in the hobby but always a small one.




There's no need to apologize. You are expressing your opinion &  while I may not agree at times,
I respect your right to say it.

I do agree with you with regards to the impersonal/personal medium.


 Btw: Any recommendations for healing a bleeding tongue which I have also acquired...

 Regards,
 Jake


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## stoney (Oct 31, 2013)

I've been into old bikes since 1986 and there was a pretty good interest in bikes before that. Your looking at 30 years +. I am sure the interest will continue. The older guys back in the 80's may have thought the same thing, will this die out. We were the younger guys back then. Some of you may not of even been born yet. I believe hobby will continue to grow. Hopefully the preservation, and history will continue, we may see some variation on how people will do there bikes. Will they be restored, left totally original, or done to their own taste, just as things are now.---- Here comes the scab pick,----- I am somewhat afraid of the professional sellers who see the bikes just as dollars and NOTHING else. We are seeing it more and more especially with the internet opening things up to the world. They pick every bike apart and take it to it's last non wanted crumbs. I know we all need parts from time to time, me included. They have to come from somewhere, I always hope that the parts were just kicking around in someones shed or garage for years and years. It's like any hobby, cars, bikes, motorcycles, radios, etc. etc.  It's a double edge.


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## squeedals (Oct 31, 2013)

stoney said:


> I've been into old bikes since 1986 and there was a pretty good interest in bikes before that. Your looking at 30 years +. I am sure the interest will continue. The older guys back in the 80's may have thought the same thing, will this die out. We were the younger guys back then. Some of you may not of even been born yet. I believe hobby will continue to grow. Hopefully the preservation, and history will continue, we may see some variation on how people will do there bikes. Will they be restored, left totally original, or done to their own taste, just as things are now.---- Here comes the scab pick,----- I am somewhat afraid of the professional sellers who see the bikes just as dollars and NOTHING else. We are seeing it more and more especially with the internet opening things up to the world. They pick every bike apart and take it to it's last non wanted crumbs. I know we all need parts from time to time, me included. They have to come from somewhere, I always hope that the parts were just kicking around in someones shed or garage for years and years. It's like any hobby, cars, bikes, motorcycles, radios, etc. etc.  It's a double edge.




Thanks Stoney.......for getting back on subject. I think any real old bike enthusiast feels the way you do, as do I and most here, but time is a fickle creature and after we are gone, we will have zero control over our hoards. One can remember when nice old original cars were cannibalized or turned into Rods. The same thing is happening to the old bikes....."rat rod" comes to mind, but again, no control, other than folks scarfing up good examples and preserving them, through restoration, or just leaving them alone as survivors. One thing I have noticed, when I break out my collection for friends and family, they are impressed in many ways. This hobby is a small niche compared to the old car hobby, I know, I've had a dozen old cars and trucks in the past 40 years and when you show these bikes, most ordinary folks unfamiliar with the hobby, have never seen anything like them, or they haven't seen one since they rode one as a kid. Every bike we find and keep is one less bike the greedy bastards can exploit for money and if I were a millionaire, that would be a quest of mine. Every time you hear "part-out" I would swoop in and buy it whole. But I'm not a millionaire, just a working stiff getting close to retirement that has a few prime examples of what we all love.


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## Euphman06 (Oct 31, 2013)

I for one think it will stay pretty constant since guys (and girls) love things that have wheels on them. I'm 29 and pretty new to the bike craze, but I love buying and fixing these old bikes. I teach my 3 year old son about bike parts and how to repair them and use the tools neccesary for building a bike. I teach elementary school and you wouldn't believe how many kids don't even know what a spoke is:eek: It's a great hands on hobby that in it's simplist form doesn't take many specialized tools or skills to do the basics but it's also one that can get specialized if you chose to explore things like painting, wheel building, hub rebuilds, etc. I enjoy it, and while I have no money to keep most of the bikes I come across, I atleast get to own a piece of history for a little while, get my hands dirty, and teach my son about bikes, tools, history, and things of that sort.

It's also great that there are different kinds of collectors to diversify the hobby. I'm in to ballooners, but you also have the middleweight, lightweight, TOC, pre war, guys as well so it's a vast hobby with many different paths to explore. Makes it fun!


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## Dan the bike man (Oct 31, 2013)

Euphman06 said:


> I for one think it will stay pretty constant since guys (and girls) love things that have wheels on them. I'm 29 and pretty new to the bike craze, but I love buying and fixing these old bikes. I teach my 3 year old son about bike parts and how to repair them and use the tools neccesary for building a bike. I teach elementary school and you wouldn't believe how many kids don't even know what a spoke is:eek: It's a great hands on hobby that in it's simplist form doesn't take many specialized tools or skills to do the basics but it's also one that can get specialized if you chose to explore things like painting, wheel building, hub rebuilds, etc. I enjoy it, and while I have no money to keep most of the bikes I come across, I atleast get to own a piece of history for a little while, get my hands dirty, and teach my son about bikes, tools, history, and things of that sort.
> 
> It's also great that there are different kinds of collectors to diversify the hobby. I'm in to ballooners, but you also have the middleweight, lightweight, TOC, pre war, guys as well so it's a vast hobby with many different paths to explore. Makes it fun!





I am also 29 and its great that so many people in our group are into vintage bikes! I dont have kids yet but I was like your son watching my dad at 3 fixing old bikes, and later on I got to ride some cool old bikes of his. Then I started buying my own. People have to be hands on and teach younger people if its your kids, a niece or nephew, who ever! If we keep teaching younger people, the hobby like any, will keep going!


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## bricycle (Oct 31, 2013)

It had already died... We have revived it!!!!!


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## bricycle (Oct 31, 2013)

MrColumbia said:


> This is what a grotesque lack of sleep for an extended period of time will do for you. I recommend it to anyone with the desire to hallucinate and then ramble incoherently on web forums all night.




Congrats on your One Thousandth!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Obi-Wan Schwinnobi (Oct 31, 2013)

Dan the bike man said:


> I am also 29 and its great that so many people in our group are into vintage bikes! I dont have kids yet but I was like your son watching my dad at 3 fixing old bikes, and later on I got to ride some cool old bikes of his. Then I started buying my own. People have to be hands on and teach younger people if its your kids, a niece or nephew, who ever! If we keep teaching younger people, the hobby like any, will keep going!




Then you come home one day to find your 10 yr old standing over your 39 super deluxe dismantled and spray painted ... Bah humbug to kids lol..


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