# What am I? Schwinn, CWC built?



## jpromo (Jul 30, 2011)

I bought this thinking it was an Autocycle from the red pinstriped dart that had just been pieced together to resemble a bicycle--given the chainring and rear fender that are non-Schwinn. But then the fender stuck out as Cleveland welding which the chainring also jives with. Then I checked the serial which looks distinctly Schwinn F80716.

So I don't really know.. oh yeah, blackout Skiptooth Morrow rear with a blackout New Departure up front. Painted drop centers with a rear facing dropout. Any help is appreciated!


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## StevieZ (Jul 30, 2011)

Well I can not help u much on the bicycle. But whats the deal with the Z34 Lumina under the cover?????????????


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## jpromo (Jul 30, 2011)

You noticed that? Very nice! It's a fun car; was my first when I was 16 but I tend to get a different daily driver every year or so. My dad bought it off me and will probably be selling it soon. Fast and good looking car for an early 90s vehicle  You don't see too many of them around.


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## scrubbinrims (Jul 30, 2011)

*Almost certain...*

That is a CWC Roadmaster as I had the exact bicycle in that color scheme and fork dart, navy/white painted wheels, even down to the blackout hubs.
Chainwheel and SN symbology leads to this assumption as well.
Chris


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## jpromo (Jul 30, 2011)

That's what I've been leaning towards especially once I noticed the welds are definitely not Schwinn.
The Serial just seemed awful similar to prewar Schwinns but I don't know what earlier CWC looked like before the A CW or whatever they used.
Early postwar or wartime I assume?
Thanks Chris


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## scrubbinrims (Jul 30, 2011)

*and another thing...*

I gotcha covered (I haven't cleaned it at all)!



Chris


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## jpromo (Jul 30, 2011)

You always seem to have me covered! What kind of price on that pretty thing? I just looked and there's an NOS one on ebay for 19$ free shipping but this bike wouldn't do an NOS item justice.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ROADMASTER-BIKE-HEAD-BADGE-FITS-MANY-MINT-NOS-RARE-/120654121562?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1c178bca5a


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## Larmo63 (Jul 30, 2011)

Looks like a Schwinn fork to me.


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## scrubbinrims (Jul 31, 2011)

*badge*

Well, I think we should wait for Phil to chime in to be sure and measure your hole distance as well.
I would go 18.50 shipped and it includes the original rivets to reattach.
The NOS is hard to beat at that price though.
Thanks, Chris


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## jpromo (Jul 31, 2011)

Larmo63 said:


> Looks like a Schwinn fork to me.




That's a definitely yes. This is the last thing I needed as far as an incomplete project but the seller basically threw it in with another bike and I ended up liking this one better after getting it home 



scrubbinrims said:


> Well, I think we should wait for Phil to chime in to be sure and measure your hole distance as well.
> I would go 18.50 shipped and it includes the original rivets to reattach.
> The NOS is hard to beat at that price though.
> Thanks, Chris




I'll definitely measure, knowing CWC shared their frames with everyone and their dog. I know I've seen some CWC-built Western Flyers with that same dart at the headtube and curved fender braces. But that would be a different chainring.. hmm.

It's almost worth picking up that head badge at that price. Good trade material.


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## scrubbinrims (Jul 31, 2011)

*wf*

This badge does have a lesser distance...again, got you covered!
Chris


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## jpromo (Jul 31, 2011)

And the measurement is 2 7/8"!
Any winners?


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## scrubbinrims (Jul 31, 2011)

*and the winner is...*

The Roadmaster badge is 2 7/8!


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## Adamtinkerer (Jul 31, 2011)

Accodring to my Phil notes, F was used prior to 1941, as well as 1945. The blackout parts would suggest 45, the Morrow hub is dated, I think O is '45, it'll be a letter followed by a # from 1-4. I have a very similar Roady with that fork, and I thought the same thing, Schwinn replacement, but it's just a coincedence they're so similar.


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## jpromo (Jul 31, 2011)

Awesome, thanks Chris. It's funny how there's such a fine line between some of these bicycles, so much as the measurement of the headbadge. I'll take it and send some money your way in a day or two as I need to deposit some in my checking account.

And thank you as well Adam with the dating and the enlightenment on the fork; I'll have to check on that hub code but 1945 is probably about where I would have put it as well.

It's a neat bike for what I got it for so I'm on the fence with what I should do with it. On one hand, there are no deluxe options (though it appears there are some wear lines for a tank)--on the other, it's just a neat bike to at least put together correctly.

Anybody with a front peaked fender that would fit this? My rear is pretty rough too though so a set wouldn't be the worst thing to buy. Tank, maybe? And then what type of seat would have come on this? I have some ladies Troxels but those might have come a few years later. Thanks!


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## RMS37 (Jul 31, 2011)

I’ll be interested in knowing the date code on the Morrow hub because this is one of the best tools available to help pin down the build dates for wartime and early post-war CWC built bikes. It is not as good as factory records for serial numbers would be, as wheels get changed out and the period of time between the manufacture of the hub and its incorporation in the bike build are unknown. Still, it is part of the information I have used to build my production model for these bikes.

Most of the bike is definitely CWC and this frame style was only offered for a short time after post-war production resumed. It is based on the new style girl’s frame introduced for 1941 which included a new and unique tank design. Interestingly the postwar versions of the frame have a repositioned brace between the top and down tubes and *no* tank was ever produced to fit this variation of the frame.

As a whole the first bikes produced after WW2 were made to a very basic specification and did not have tanks or springers. In the case of bikes like this one the second set of rear fender braces shows the bike was supplied without a rack. Deluxe features were added to the line in about 1947 at which time a new postwar girls frame was developed for the Luxury Liner and that frame replaced the use of this frame for all models from the base to the top-of-the-line.

I believe the production of postwar “F” series bikes spans the end of 1945 and the first portion of 1946 so considering this is a relatively “high” numbered F bike, I would guess it dates to winter/spring 1946.

Is the original fork bent? The one currently in the bike shows signs of a strong hit to the front and, as is common with forged forks, most of the damage shows up as a stretched and bent steerer tube since the blades don’t deform. Many companies used forged forks on some of their production including Schwinn, Murray, Colson and CWC to name a few. CWC used a very unique version in 1941 and early after the war that has tall shoulders “pinched” up from the crown. By the time this bike was made they were using a more conventional forged fork. Most of these forged forks look similar and in some cases may have been produced for the manufacturers by the same outside supplier.

Other than the bent fork and missing front fender you don't need much to build the bike correctly as it didn't come with much to go missing. If you PM me an email address to send it to, I can forward a picture to you of another similar and complete bike


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## jpromo (Aug 1, 2011)

Wow, thanks for all the information. Sometimes the history is just as cool as the bike itself. I checked the date on the Morrow and it's... drumroll... O1. There are what I believe the model numbers after that which read 36 13. What does the 1 entail? Because I may have just ID'd a lone blackout Morrow-laced painted drop center that I've had lying around for a while which is dated O4.

I noticed about the rack as well when I was looking for reference photos. The rack would have had a curved brace to take the place of the top fender brace. I've always been a fan of the clean, simple look on bikes and knowing this one probably came about as basic as can be is kind of exciting (cheaper to make complete too!).

Thanks for the help; I'll message an email address to you.


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