# 1946 Schwinn Continental...maybe '47 or '48...



## HARPO

I just picked this up a couple of hours ago! I'm thinking it's a '46 (first year of the Continental) due to the fact it has the sought-after dual neck like on the Aerocyles, etc. If I'm wrong, please let me know!

The bike, with the exception of the tires, is all original (and missing the wheel for the cable for the shifter). Even the "toupee" seat...I call it that because the top is no longer connected to the frame...is all there. Decals are in pretty decent shape also, but the shifter is frozen shut in its present location. The rear rack appears to have been added a long time ago, possibly when the bike was new??
It isn't without the dings in the fenders and of course the rust, but wow. I love it!! 

Condition is the opposite of the one @SirMike1983 has, but at least I now have one to work on. I love owning a bike older than I am, especially an early Schwinn. What do you think of this find @bulldog1935 ?

More BEFORE photos to come!


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## HARPO




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## HARPO

I have to be extremely careful when cleaning by some of the decals, especially on the seat post. In one of the photos you can see where it's flaking.


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## SirMike1983

Mine with basically the same set up is a 1947 based on my hub date code. The dateless Sturmey hubs are from right around WWII, some from right before and some from right after. The tapered kickstand on the Continental is a red herring - tapered stands are used to date ballooners to 1946, but the Continentals used a tapered stand at least into late 1947. 1946-48 would be my guess. Eventually the quadrant was replaced by the Silverface click shifter on the handlebars. That seems to have happened over the course of 1948-49, at least based on the ones I've seen. That project should clean up fine and is pretty much all there. I love mine but am looking at selling it because I may have to move later this year (some serious belt tightening to get everything into the pod and moved, I would think). We'll see how it goes.


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## 49autocycledeluxe

cool bike! I have a 1960 Racer, which has me noticing these older lightweights. some day I'll get an older one.


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## HARPO




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## SirMike1983

Hopefully these notes are helpful to you/anyone else interested in these bikes. They're what I have in a notepad file (I have to look to see if I have any other notepad files on Schwinn lightweights, I may have others I put in different folders).

Cottered Bottom Bracket:

-The bottom bracket uses British-type equipment at 24 threads per inch. Schwinn-made parts are scarce. I've used Birmingham Hercules and Phillips parts in the past as substitutes when needed. There are cheaper, oriental parts made today that some low end bikes use. These will often fit, but the hardening and tolerances are poor compared to old stock US or British production.

-The spindle is not a standard 16GC size, but is a smaller size in terms of length. An English production #16 plain or non-GC should be close. A 16GC will work OK but will be a bit long and may have trouble over shooting the chain guard. Again, Schwinn-made parts are scarce here. Look for non-GC #16 spindle as a replacement.

-The bottom bracket lock ring metal is softer on the Schwinn than on the Raleigh or Birmingham production. Be very careful trying to loosen a seized Schwinn locking. Apply gentle heat and Kroil if needed. They don't respond to a forceful shot from punch and hammer as well as the English parts (notches tend to shear).

-The Schwinn cranks are of a unique profile (small oval). Closest are old-type Birmingham Hercules cranks (slightly larger oval). Cranks are relatively soft and can be bent using a vise and frame straightening arm or appropriately sized steel pipe.

-Drive side crank is swaged/pressed to the chainring (similar to Raleigh 3-speeds). If it is very loose, it can be tightened using an anvil and hammer banging on the inner swaging lip. Always double-check for tightness before re-attaching to the bike and using. The chainring is detachable from the spider but make sure your socket/wrench fits the chainring bolts/nuts snugly (they are usually stubborn). It's a good idea to remove the chainring before banging on the anvil to tighten the spider to the arm. Most chainrings are 46 teeth, but other sizes were available.

-Old Continental chainrings have no trouble with modern SRAM-type bushingless chains. They run smoothly when set up properly with a fresh chain.


Brakes:

-Brakes are unique to the early Schwinn. There are actually a couple types - some with spring stops on the brake caliper arms, and some with no stops that instead use a "hooked" spring in the style of an English 3-speed. The Continentals usually appear with the arm-stop type brakes, whereas the New Worlds usually have the "hooked spring" type.

-Stock brake set up was the same on female and male frames, where the rear brake cable ran down and clipped to the top of the chain guard. I see this as a production convenience only so the factory could do both male and female frames the same way. I recommend converting to standard routing on the men's with new cables and housings as a safety precaution. The issue with the Schwinn-style set up is that water tends to run down into the rear cable housing/cable because it's upside down.


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## HARPO

As usual, @SirMike1983 , thank you for all the useful info! 

Oh, and I did see, while working on it this morning, that one of the brake shoes was replaced with a smaller one. The originals are actually quite long!


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## HARPO

Cleanup continues, and I still need to get into crevices for the baked in dirt and grime. Still, it's looking a whole lot better! Happy so far as work continues...


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## sam

the s/a hub has a date stamp on it


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## HARPO

sam said:


> the s/a hub has a date stamp on it




Nope. It's all cleaned up now and it's date free.Earlist dated hub I've ever had was on a 1952 Rudge.

Someone said that they weren't dated until after WWII, so I believe that what I have is a first year Continental...1946. Hub would have been a leftover.


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## SirMike1983

1936-39 would be single digit code for year. A 1935 model K would have "5", and a 1936 AW would have a "6".

At some point around the start of WWII, they dropped the date code. They resumed it after the war. No date code would be a hub from around WW2. That would be consistent with an immediate post war bike: 1946 or early 47.


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## HARPO

BTW...does anyone recognize what make the rear rack is? Doesn't look like anything Schwinn made, but it had the same "patina" that the rest of the bike had.


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## mbstude

Harpo.. Those early post WWII Continentals are my favorite bicycles, period. I've got a black tall frame '47, and it looks like I just bought SirMike's blue '47 (this makes the second time I've owned that one.)

Looks like you've got a nice one. Keep up the good work.


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## HARPO

Still working on it, and next is the wheel guide for the 3-speed...which luckily I have one...


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## SirMike1983

It cleaned up well. The Continentals are great bikes, as are the New Worlds. These bikes are among the few light roadster-style bikes that can go head-to-head with a Raleigh or Hercules or Phillips. The graphics on these (and the 1950s-era bikes with winged graphics) are great.

The English were generally more serious about their adult sporting and utility bikes than the Americans were, but Schwinn soldiered on producing some really good 3-speed bikes into the early 1960s.

The collectors seem to favor the pre-war Schwinn Superiors and Paramounts, but my personal opinion is that Schwinn's golden age for lightweight 3-speeds started right after the war, and into the 1950s (I also think this is true of Raleigh). They offered some neat choices - New Worlds; Superiors; Continentals; and the Paramounts. You'd expect that kind of choice from someone like Raleigh or Hercules, but not so much an American company (the automobile ruled America in that time).


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## HARPO

More to do (like maybe trying to _"pinch"_ the rear fender tighter in the back) and add the reflector off of the rack that came on the bike. Next is to pull the wheels off and clean under the fenders and the drops. Of course I still need to add the proper oil to the wheels and bottom bracket. It's not smooth moving, even a bit stiff, holding the bike up and turning the crank, but once up on the rack and I can see how it spins.

So...more photos coming soon...


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## Oilit

That's a really beautiful bike! Lucky you!


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## HARPO

BTW...did I mention I only paid $50 for it...


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## Tim the Skid

Great job on the cleanup! Nice looking bike . I really like the shifter and the adjustable stem for the handlebars. Good save!


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## HARPO

This is a BEFORE photo of the rack on the bike as I got it. Any ideas as to who made it? The reflector is plastic and came on it, attached to the rivited piece on the back of the rack. BTW, it's all chrome...


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## Kramai88

I came across this girls version today. I think it’s a 48 or 49 thanks to the great info @SirMike1983. I’m going to do some cleaning and see how it come out













Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Jim Barnard

Just joined the club!


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## GTs58

Jim Barnard said:


> Just joined the club!
> 
> View attachment 1068580
> 
> View attachment 1068581
> 
> View attachment 1068582





NICE!  

Is your rear hub dated 47? Like the one posted above your post the serial number is hand stamped. I believe Schwinn started machine stamping the BB shell on these in 1948. My theory on these early Conti serials is they were stamped using the method used on the Paramounts. If my "theory" is fact the serial dates your frame to October 1947 and it was 171st frame made that month.


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## HARPO

Kramai88 said:


> I came across this girls version today. I think it’s a 48 or 49 thanks to the great info @SirMike1983. I’m going to do some cleaning and see how it come out
> View attachment 843471View attachment 843472View attachment 843473View attachment 843474View attachment 843475
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk




The bike is in beautiful, original condition and will clean up quite well! Great find!!!  (Pedals and saddle appear to have been replaced).


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## Alan Brase

Let the record show that I am now the custodian of the burgundy 1946 Continental from Jim B. K7171
It is now at my friend, Greg Young's shop, Waterloo Bicycle Works, Waterloo, Iowa.
Greg is a pretty skilled mechanic and has actually used a Park Frame straightener before.
Yes, the frame has a slight damage from a front impact.I think this was discussed on another thread. We will probably have to BUILD such a tool. Unless I can find one somewhere.
But I will endeavor to get the damage minimized without much more damage to the original paint.
This K7171 fits right in with the  other 1946es in that it has the undated S-A hub. Brakes and cables and levers are similar.
BTW, does anyone have a source for the black fabric covered cable housing?
It is sporting a 1955 Corvette saddle and that needs to find a new owner that treasures it more than me.
I intend to ride this thing and that means a REAL leather saddle. Likely Brooks or Ideale, slightly wider than the one fit to drop bar bikes.
And last, I seek an original front hub and possibly a real Schwinn period correct S-6 rim. It would not bother me too much to allow a modern rim and tyre to hold that space till the right original comes along.


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## SirMike1983

Park made a tool specifically made to remedy the type of damage that was present on that frame - the HTS tool. It involved running a bar through the head tube, and then a jack-like apparatus pushed against the bottom bracket in such a way as to gradually correct the downward bends in the top and down tubes. This was back when Park also made the fork straightening jig and a few other tools for straightening steel frames that no longer exist. 

One of the worst developments over the years was the disappearance of these tools, because a decent steel frame can certainly be straightened, within reason. But with the proliferation of aluminum and carbon frames, and with legal liability issues for the shops, the tools disappeared. 

The frame and fork straightener sold by Park today is more a "frame arm" type device. What you're probably looking for is that older tool that screwed into the head tube and then was jacked against the bottom bracket. There is an HTS on sale on ebay for like $350, I think. At least last time I looked, there was.

The HTS tool is capable of producing immense force, to the extent it could tear soldered/brazed joints. But if you were working within reason, the tool could certainly straighten the frame angles back to normal.


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## Alan Brase

Thanks for the picture.
There was one of those Park HTS tools at a local shop where Greg worked some years back.
I will make a nicer tool than that. And for a lot less money. Finding a  fine threaded turnbuckle would be the main obstacle.
Not damaging the original paint further is paramount. (no pun intended, actually)
I have extensive experience in auto body straightening, shrinking/ planishing/metal finishing.
I'd have to decide if a little localized heat on the buckle while under tension might be a good idea. I believe there now exist modern induction heaters that will concentrate heat in a 1/4" spot.
Or maybe I should work it cold? 
Still working out a plan.
Nice frame in your picture, by the way: Nervex lugs? Who is the builder?


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## Vicious Cycle

HARPO said:


> I just picked this up a couple of hours ago! I'm thinking it's a '46 (first year of the Continental) due to the fact it has the sought-after dual neck like on the Aerocyles, etc. If I'm wrong, please let me know!




I wouldn't use the stem by itself to date these. I have 5 in the stable , mens and womens, and they all have the adjustable stem. BTW the fenders are stainless and the same as found on the Paramount tourist. They can crack if you tweak them too much.
 Great bike.


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## detroitbike

I have the Early heavy duty version of the tool that I would LOAN OUT if you contact me at the shop : 313-884-BIKE .
  Yes It will rip the frame in 2 if not used correctly...


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## SirMike1983

Borrowed that photo from the old 10 speeds webpage - not my frame. It's a looker though, yes.

I've acquired a few of these old tools over the years, but not the HTS tool. I considered buying one off eBay awhile back, but it would see limited use with a hobbyist like me, so I decided not to. buy.

You probably could indeed make a tool like that. It's not overly complicated, just need to get the correct dimensions and a good, tight and precise threading befitting the force you'll need to exert to straighten a frame and the ability to get a close, precise adjustment on the frame straightness. I'm not sure whether or not you'll need heat. The frame definitely looks bent, but not necessarily kinked or folded up. As great as the paint is, I would be inclined to go to bare metal around the damaged area to look for folds or stress marks/cracks. Paint hides many sins (and damage sometimes). I would totally ride a straightened frame where it was just bent before, but I'd avoid a frame with visible stress marks or hairlines.

Straightening a steel frame is part science and part art. You have the science of the materials and physics forces at play, but you also need a "feel" for how much force is being exerted, and what the area of the bend needs to look like when you're done. There was a time when bike shops would strip down to the frame and do the straightening needed (within reason). Or they'd straighten a bent or tweaked steel fork.  But many shops won't touch that work now. Glad to see detroitbike still does it at his shop. Generous offer too.


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## HARPO

Vicious Cycle said:


> I wouldn't use the stem by itself to date these. I have 5 in the stable , mens and womens, and they all have the adjustable stem. BTW the fenders are stainless and the same as found on the Paramount tourist. They can crack if you tweak them too much.
> Great bike.




I'm also going by the fact that the 1946 rear hubs weren't dated. Hopefully all this adds up to a first year Continental.


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## Oilit

HARPO said:


> I'm also going by the fact that the 1946 rear hubs weren't dated. Hopefully all this adds up to a first year Continental.



Harpo, Going by the theory that @GTs58 put forward in post #24, if yours is 1946 the serial will begin with a letter for the month, then a "6" for 1946. Does this square with what you see? I don't know if he's right, but it's an interesting idea, and it's got me wondering.


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## GTs58

Oilit said:


> Harpo, Going by the theory that @GTs58 put forward in post #24, if yours is 1946 the serial will begin with a letter for the month, then a "6" for 1946. Does this square with what you see? I don't know if he's right, but it's an interesting idea, and it's got me wondering.




That was my theory before @Miq started the War Time New World thread. The theory (Paramount method) did work on a few Continentals, but now I can see what Schwinn did starting with the prewar New Worlds and other 1939 lightweights with the three piece cranks. All those had hand stamped serial numbers where the letter coincided with the Balloon machine stamped numbers but only used 4 digits. The K series serials started war time I believe and then they were also used in early post war starting sometime in 1945 into 1946 along with the J series numbers. In 1949 or maybe earlier Schwinn pre-stamped the BB tubes with serial numbers for the Tandems that had the T00 serials and some of those BB shells were used on Continentals and Superiors with the three piece cranks. The serial list shows these starting out Jan 19, 1949 with the number T001000. From what I have seen the early post war Tandems had hand stamped numbers with no letter and only had 3 digits.


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## Oilit

GTs58 said:


> That was my theory before @Miq started the War Time New World thread. The theory (Paramount method) did work on a few Continentals, but now I can see what Schwinn did starting with the prewar New Worlds and other 1939 lightweights with the three piece cranks. All those had hand stamped serial numbers where the letter coincided with the Balloon machine stamped numbers but only used 4 digits. The K series serials started war time I believe and then they were also used in early post war starting sometime in 1945 into 1946 along with the J series numbers. In 1949 or maybe earlier Schwinn pre-stamped the BB tubes with serial numbers for the Tandems that had the T00 serials and some of those BB shells were used on Continentals and Superiors with the three piece cranks. The serial list shows these starting out Jan 19, 1949 with the number T001000. From what I have seen the early post war Tandems had hand stamped numbers with no letter and only had 3 digits.



That makes sense. So any Continental with a "J" or "K" serial is early post-war, '45, '46 or maybe '47 at the latest?


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## GTs58

Oilit said:


> That makes sense. So any Continental with a "J" or "K" serial is early post-war, '45, '46 or maybe '47 at the latest?




Very possibly Just the K could have run into the 47 model year. I'm pretty sure the Conti that Sir Mike purchased from mbstude had a K serial and a 47 dated hub.

Yah, found it. Here it is.










Since these were hand stamped, I doubt the same situation applies to the post war Balloon models or one piece crank lightweight models.


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## SirMike1983

GTs58 said:


> Very possibly Just the K could have run into the 47 model year. I'm pretty sure the Conti that Sir Mike purchased from mbstude had a K serial and a 47 dated hub.
> 
> Yah, found it. Here it is.
> 
> View attachment 1412458
> 
> View attachment 1412461
> 
> Since these were hand stamped, I doubt the same situation applies to the post war Balloon models or one piece crank lightweight models.




Yeah, that was a 1947. He bought it back when I sold off some bikes in my move back north. I would guess it was built in the closing months of 1947, based on the hub date.  The color and images on it were really, really nice. I was a little more attached to the black New World though because it was a rescue job. I think the Continental also had a tapered kickstand, if I recall correctly. I think they used those on the lightweights slightly longer than the balloon tire bikes. I put a rubber tip on it to keep the wear minimized.


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