# ELGIN Falcon SN and T on Head Tube ????



## carlitos60 (Jun 21, 2013)

Please, Professional Expertise on my Falcon:
I was Sanding It and I Noticed:

Serial Number and what seems like a Symbol Under It?

Bu the Big Question is a Letter " T " on the Head Tube?

What Could They Mean?

Any Help Will Be Appreciated!


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## popawheelie (Jun 21, 2013)

*Focus*

It's really hard to read the numbers. Perhaps photos that are in sharp focus would be a big assistance to us.

Then the well-versed should be able to figure that all out for ya.

Mike


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## jpromo (Jun 21, 2013)

Put the camera in macro (flower) mode!


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## jpromo (Jun 21, 2013)

Though, an L serial should be a '33 built frame if it's a Westfield bike. But Falcons weren't made in '33 so that logic is flawed. Is it an early Oriole?


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## carlitos60 (Jun 21, 2013)

*Letter "T" on Head Tube?*



jpromo said:


> Though, an L serial should be a '33 built frame if it's a Westfield bike. But Falcons weren't made in '33 so that logic is flawed. Is it an early Oriole?




Thanks,,,,But, What would a Letter "T" Means on Head Tube?


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## MrColumbia (Jun 22, 2013)

It's highly doubtful it means anything as far as date or bike id. It probably was a mark to identify that specific head tube from others in the frame department of the factory. You find these seemingly meaningless marks on crank hangers as well. Just a way to keep similar looking parts from getting mixed up.


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## carlitos60 (Jun 22, 2013)

*L #?*



MrColumbia said:


> It's highly doubtful it means anything as far as date or bike id. It probably was a mark to identify that specific head tube from others in the frame department of the factory. You find these seemingly meaningless marks on crank hangers as well. Just a way to keep similar looking parts from getting mixed up.






Thanks!

Then, Is an L serial # a good number for a Twin Bar????? 1933

What Brand, if Not an Elgin Blackhawk!


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## jpromo (Jun 22, 2013)

Post a picture of the whole frame and we can tell you what it could have been.


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## BlueTarp (Jun 22, 2013)

jpromo said:


> Though, an L serial should be a '33 built frame if it's a Westfield bike. But Falcons weren't made in '33 so that logic is flawed. Is it an early Oriole?




The Westfield produced, Twinbar framed, Elgin Falcons and Blackhawks _were_ available in 1933.


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## carlitos60 (Jun 22, 2013)

*1933? Pictures*



BlueTarp said:


> The Westfield produced, Twinbar framed, Elgin Falcons and Blackhawks _were_ available in 1933.




I Pulled the Crank and It has what Looks like a (w) in a Small Circle then, an L  Next to It!!!!!











Now,  I feel More Comfortable saying It is a 1933 Westfield Blackhawk.


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## jpromo (Jun 23, 2013)

The Blackhawk model was produced from 34-36 so it could be a very early one, with a frame produced maybe late 1933 for the 1934 model year. Either way, an awesome frame that will make a cool bike as original or a rider. Good luck!


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## BlueTarp (Jun 23, 2013)

jpromo said:


> The Blackhawk model was produced from 34-36




Check your Sears Catalogs; The Blackhawk and Falcon models are listed in the Fall 1933/Winter 1934 issue of the big consumer catalog. This catalog would have come out in late Summer/early fall of 1933 and the bikes would have had to have been designed and in production well before that to make production dates for the catalog itself.


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## carlitos60 (Jun 23, 2013)

BlueTarp said:


> Check your Sears Catalogs; The Blackhawk and Falcon models are listed in the Fall 1933/Winter 1934 issue of the big consumer catalog. This catalog would have come out in late Summer/early fall of 1933 and the bikes would have had to have been designed and in production well before that to make production dates for the catalog itself.





That is the Best Part About This Site "The CABE"!

Shearing of Information and Knowledge!!!!!!!

Great People Ready to Help Out!!!!!

Thanks Everyone!


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## bentwoody66 (May 27, 2015)

I just picked up one of these frames, my confusion is the serial number starts with a "C". What is it?


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## pedal_junky (May 27, 2015)

Post a pic, let's see it.


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## bentwoody66 (May 27, 2015)

It is defiantly a C


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## Robertriley (May 27, 2015)

C would be a 1938 but I don't think they were still being made in 1938


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## bentwoody66 (May 27, 2015)

From what I've researched 38 would have been 6 numbers instead of 5


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## bentwoody66 (May 27, 2015)

This doesn't jive with any of the threads I've read, here or elsewhere


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## bentwoody66 (May 27, 2015)

I kinda wish Phil (RMS37) was still lurking here.


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## pedal_junky (May 27, 2015)

Yeah, def a C. 1st reply edited.


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## bentwoody66 (May 27, 2015)

Did they use different numbering for Columbia vs. Elgin?


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## bentwoody66 (May 27, 2015)

Is it possible they made a Blackhawk in 38?


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## Conkity (May 28, 2015)

All of the Westfield/Elgins that I have owned have all followed the WF numbering.

Robertriley (using my sons account)


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## bentwoody66 (May 28, 2015)

Did they have a Westfield twin bar in 38?


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## bentwoody66 (May 28, 2015)

So do I have the one and only elusive 1938 Elgin Blackhawk?


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## carlitos60 (May 28, 2015)

bentwoody66 said:


> Did they use different numbering for Columbia vs. Elgin?




Westfield Built the SAME Frame Design for Columbia at Some Point, So it Could be That!!!  Also,
I Just Noticed that the SN is Facing the Opposite Direction from My Falcon on the 1st Pages!!!!
Check That Out!!!


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