# Spokes too long after new hub install



## Cyclelogical (Mar 13, 2022)

I removed the ND model D from my 41 Hawthorne and installed a SA S2C in its place. The flange on this thing is much wider than the old ND hub and despite lacing it cross 4 they come up just slightly too long. Is there a way of fixing this without having to tear it all down and relace with shorter spokes? I thought that perhaps I could use those shims/nipple washers but wasn’t sure about the opinions on using those. Thanks for any advice


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## guzziworksman (Mar 13, 2022)

Too long...meaning, they're protruding a bit from the nipples?  If that's the case, you could just grind them down with a Dremel.


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## J-wagon (Mar 13, 2022)

Possible to post pic?


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## Cyclelogical (Mar 13, 2022)

guzziworksman said:


> Too long...meaning, they're protruding a bit from the nipples?  If that's the case, you could just grind them down with a Dremel.



Why didn’t I think of that? That’s too easy! I’d rather have a more complicated and expensive answer, lol. Thanks I think this should work


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## Cyclelogical (Mar 13, 2022)

J-wagon said:


> Possible to post pic?



Here’s a pic of them. Once they bottomed out on the spoke (or sat flush) I figured that was that and I needed to buy shorter ones. I guess if tightening through the top of the nipple and cutting it off is kosher I can easily do that.


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## Andrew Gorman (Mar 13, 2022)

Those spokes look fine to me- the ends are inside the nipple.  Are the nipples not seated in the rim? Bounce the wheel a few times and squeeze pairs of spokes and they may seat better.  All I see you need is a rim strip or a few wraps of cloth tape to cover the heads. Or are the spokes in the picture not tightened completely?


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## J-wagon (Mar 13, 2022)

Thx for pics. It looks ok to me. I don't think you need to grind anything.


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## Cyclelogical (Mar 13, 2022)

They’re not tightened completely because some of them would stop tightening (bottom out in the nipple) once the top of the spoke sat flush in the slot. When the ND was installed I didn’t encounter this issue because it tightened up fully before reaching that point. I didn’t realize I just needed to keep tightening the nipple past the point it sat flush (perhaps there were burrs or the top was staked)

I definitely think once I tighten them all down to the point of getting it fully trued they might poke out above the top surface of the nipple. If that happens should I dremel the tops and then maybe debur them with a die grinder? Or is that overkill? I do have the rim strips to cover them afterwards


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## GTs58 (Mar 13, 2022)

Has the wheel been trued?

posting at the same time. 🙃    I wonder if you'll have enough threads?


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## Cyclelogical (Mar 13, 2022)

GTs58 said:


> Has the wheel been trued?
> 
> posting at the same time. 🙃



No not yet. When they stopped I stopped. Almost all of them are seated against the rim but I’d say another 2-3mm max should get it trued up


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## Cyclelogical (Mar 13, 2022)

GTs58 said:


> I wonder if you'll have enough threads?



That was another concern- that perhaps the nipples ran out of threads for the spoke.


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## srfndoc (Mar 13, 2022)

The SA S2C should take 10 5/8" spokes just like the original hub.  Are you sure you have them laced 4x?

Here's the same hub I laced in a while back:


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## Cyclelogical (Mar 13, 2022)

srfndoc said:


> The SA S2C should take 10 5/8" spokes just like the original hub.  Are you sure you have them laced 4x?
> 
> Here's the same hub I laced in a while back



They are definitely laced 4. I’m not sure if these are 10 5/8” spokes. That was a while ago and I had these new spokes in a box and used them and they worked. I removed the original spokes that came on the wheel (installed with the ND) years ago. They were junk so I cut them and tossed them. Here’s a pic of them now that I’ve tightened them. Haven’t trued them yet but I think this is as high as they’ll ever need to get


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## J-wagon (Mar 13, 2022)

Yup, some protrusion. As for me, I'd put rubber rim strip and ride. But probly better to grind flush.


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## Cyclelogical (Mar 13, 2022)

Thanks. I’ll try it and see how it goes


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## The Spokemaster (Mar 13, 2022)

Spokes ? ....got 'em = you name the length = can do ! = misterbshakey595@gmail.com


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## piercer_99 (Mar 13, 2022)

I've had that happen, knowing the spokes are the right length, after further inspection, finding out I had laced up the other side, one hole off, making everything seem wrong.   Took it apart and viola, everything was fine.


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## Cyclelogical (Mar 13, 2022)

The Spokemaster said:


> Spokes ? ....got 'em = you name the length = can do ! = misterbshakey595@gmail.com



Awesome, thanks! I’ll keep you in mind for this and future projects


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## Cyclelogical (Mar 13, 2022)

piercer_99 said:


> I've had that happen, knowing the spokes are the right length, after further inspection, finding out I had laced up the other side, one hole off, making everything seem wrong.   Took it apart and viola, everything was fine.



Thanks for the advice. I’ve checked my lacing and it’s good. I think these spokes are just a bit long but should work out. I remember removing the old ND hub from this earlier today and it was trued up fine but didn’t take many turns for tension to break on those spokes. 
I get the feeling that when I originally installed these spokes with the ND hub they were probably about at their max, with no room for error. Because of the size of the new hub flange it put the spokes above that limit. 
Hopefully all I need to do is true it, grind it and call it a day


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## bloo (Mar 13, 2022)

Well ideally you WOULD want the spoke up in the head. It is strongest that way, not that it matters on a ballooner with brass nipples, it doesn't. Nothing is perfect and I would expect to have to grind down 2 or 3 of them when they are exactly the right size. You cant have them sticking up, it will puncture the tube.

The danger is if you have to take too much off. It is easy to run out of threads and not be able to true the wheel and bring it to proper tension, maybe now, maybe in the future. If it looks like you will need to grind all of them I would get different spokes.


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## Archie Sturmer (Mar 14, 2022)

Looks like spoke-washers would work too.


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## The Spokemaster (Mar 14, 2022)

Spokes ? ....got 'em = you name the length = can do ! = misterbshakey595@gmail.com


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## Cyclelogical (Mar 14, 2022)

bloo said:


> Well ideally you WOULD want the spoke up in the head. It is strongest that way, not that it matters on a ballooner with brass nipples, it doesn't. Nothing is perfect and I would expect to have to grind down 2 or 3 of them when they are exactly the right size. You cant have them sticking up, it will puncture the tube.
> 
> The danger is if you have to take too much off. It is easy to run out of threads and not be able to true the wheel and bring it to proper tension, maybe now, maybe in the future. If it looks like you will need to grind all of them I would get different spokes.



Thanks for this. I’ve trued it up and only two spokes have protrusions, and only by barely a mm, if even that. I’ll grind them flat


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## Cyclelogical (Mar 14, 2022)

Got it back on the bike! I’ll be glad to convert over to 1/2” pitch chain, too. I’ll probably use the skiptooth from this bike on the ladies Schwinn Spitfire that I plan on repairing. Thanks for all of your help, folks. Now I need to widen the holes on the rear fender braces since they don’t fit the new axle…fercryinoutloud


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## The Spokemaster (Mar 15, 2022)

Spokes ? ....got 'em = misterbshakey595@gmail.com


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## coasterbrakejunkie1969 (Mar 15, 2022)

The Spokemaster said:


> Spokes ? ....got 'em = misterbshakey595@gmail.com



Post them in sales, this is not a sales thread


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## The Spokemaster (Mar 15, 2022)

Washers under the nipple heads is not a 'bad' idea as the washers will actually help distribute the load from spoke tension over a wider area at the rim -that's a good thing

Be sure to use a really solid ( thick ) rimstrip to prevent your tubes from being 'chafed' by the nipple heads


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