# Possible Major Taylor?



## ohdeebee (Jul 13, 2011)

Acquired this bike last night from an elderly lady. The story was that it was given to her husband by a "big time racer" about 60 years ago as a gift while they lived in Chicago. Supposedly the previous owner (the "big time racer") was given the bike from Major Taylor. The lady brought up the name of Major Taylor, I never did. Some things about the bike seem off, like the seat and seatpost, but its surprisingly lightweight and has all the fixins of a turn of the century track racers bike. The only stamping found so far is under the bottom bracket and is A4, but it's stamped with small dots not as solid letters. I couldn't get a good pic through the paint but I will post a pic of this once the paint is stripped off. Any info would be greatly appreciated.


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## RMS37 (Jul 13, 2011)

Marshall “Major” Taylor’s racing career spanned the years from the mid 1890 through 1910 when he retired from track racing. While he earned a large amount of money during that time, he died as a pauper in 1932 at the age of 52. 

The bike you have acquired is definitely later than the period during which Major Taylor raced. It looks like a standard 1930’s track machine more than something from the twenties or earlier and appears likely to be European made. 

While much of Taylor’s later career was spent racing abroad and given the fact that bicycles were often awarded as part prizes at racing events, I think the years go against a connection between this bike and Major Taylor, though I suppose it is possible he received the bike as a gift late in life and passed it on.

A side note is that the adjustable track stem with a square extension is known as a Major Taylor stem. He is credited with the invention of using a square tube and adjustable slide in place of a round one (like an early Paramount stem). The results of not cinching the bolt tight enough on a round tube, adjustable stem before a sprint are obvious


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## ohdeebee (Jul 13, 2011)

Thanks for the input Phil. I really thought the bike to be earlier due to the collar around the base of the stem. The stamp on the rims also has a date stamped on them that looks to read May 3 (or 8) 1893 (or 8). I really can't claim to know much about these bikes, but judging from the 1890's bike I do have, a lot of the parts seem to match up better with that bike than anything later. I think the bike is really cool either way and plan on restoring it for display purposes. Again, thank you for your insight Phil.


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## RMS37 (Jul 13, 2011)

I’m glad to help, I can be something of a bubble-burster in some cases, but I always think it is most important to ferret out the truth. As I noted it is possible to write a story around a possible link to Major Taylor but it doesn’t fall into place easily and to document such a provenance would also a time consuming journey and not likely to have that intended outcome. Still research always turns up interesting information outside the boundaries of the specific focus of the search and it is safe to say that this is a high quality racing machine that has worthwhile provenance tied to someone.

If it is not a “Major Taylor Bike” the upside is that you probably have more latitude concerning what you do with it.

As for the items you noted; the clamp around the stem is part of a typical European or more likely British headset. They were designed to clamp binder-less stems which were popular in the 20’s through the forties. You may find a makers mark on the headset parts or on the crank set or crank spindle. These pieces along with the hollow seat post are part of what makes the bike appear to be most likely from the thirties. 

The other features that look very Brit/Euro are the tubes themselves and the lugs, the fork crown and the front dropouts. The tapered seat stays in particular do not have an American or pre-1930 feel to them and the geometry is generally more vertical than is typical for early American racing frames. The rest of the bike (and the geometry) is similar to a late thirties Paramount but a little coarser which leads me to date the bike as late twenties to mid to late thirties.

The rims may be older than the frame but they are certainly not from 1893 when Pneumatic tires were only just entering the mass-market. 1898 would be possible for the rims but I imagine the date may be an early patent date or a company date that precedes the rims production by a number of years.  

Despite, what I believe is the unlikelihood of this frame having a real connection to Major Taylor beyond the use of the Major Taylor type of stem on the bike, It is a really great find and well worth restoring. To be restorable it the true sense of the word it is important to determine what the bike is, at least down to the general period it dates to so the choices you make (chrome vs nickel for example) match the true age of the bike.


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## ohdeebee (Jul 13, 2011)

I was ready for the bubble to burst =)

As of right now I think the plan is to restore it as an early 1900's track racer. I like the look of nickel plating more so than chrome anyway and I don't think the parts are too far fetched to date from the time period. At any rate, it will be primarily used as a display in my shop anyway. Thanks again for the info. I'll post more pics if anything comes up during the tear down and paint stripping process.


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## RMS37 (Jul 13, 2011)

Beyond the actual provenance of the ownership of the bike, the frame was obviously manufactured at a specific point in time. Without proof via documents or positive identification and serial number verification, that date or even the exact year of mfg, will never be known. Still the characteristics of the frame do portend to the period from which it comes.

I’ve noted my reasons for believing the bike dates to approximately the early thirties give or take a few years. From my knowledge of the characteristics of racing machines from the mid 1890’s through modern times I find it well nigh onto impossible to believe it was produced previous to the window of time I mentioned.

I may be going a bit far or splitting semantic hairs but restoration means to return something to an original state which is not the same as rebuilding a thirties bike as one from 1905. That would be akin to attempting to restore a 1980 Vette as a 1955 Vette. A custom along those lines is possible but not a restoration. Knowing the difference is most important perhaps if you display the finished product in a bike shop, misidentified, it is ultimately harmful to spreading an accurate understanding of bicycle history.

Anyway a key part of this puzzle will reveal itself when you disassemble the bottom bracket and check the cup threading.


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## Andrew Gorman (Jul 13, 2011)

The chainring looks like a Williams product, and may have a date code somewhere on it.  Check out:
http://www.classiclightweights.co.uk/williamsdating.html
and the rest of the classic lightweights site for more information. The frame could be imported, or it could be domestic.  There were a lot of small shops making racing bikes, and many US built bikes used British components like BSA and Williams.  Even lightweight Schwinns used Williams bottom brackets in the late 30's.  The vertical geometry does make it look more like the 1930's than any earlier to me too.


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## LeSarthois (Jul 14, 2011)

That's a nice old bike! He certainly look European, but, I don't think it's French. There is a mix of parts on this bike that doesn't fit together for a French bike; like the frame itself would be from the mid-20 or later, but this chain was abandoned after the First War.

Maybe track bikes used "old-fashioned" techniques that dissapeared from everyday bikes. But it still look odd to me :o

Check on the cranck, most European brand used to put their name on it, sometime in very small letters.
Look on the chain itself, if it's still the original chain, you may got a name on it.

You can also look under the bottom bracket "box", there is often a number engraved here (then after you'll have to find what those numbers are about...)
You can also find numbers at the top of the seat tube, and on the fork end.

About the "Williams Chainring" you can still check, but I have seen this chainring on European bicycles... from the 20's to the 60's! and from every brand! Quite a large panel of choice to find your brand.


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## oldy57 (Jul 17, 2011)

Check the crank arms and chainring for letters and numbers. Williams used a letter/number code that can be dated. The headset looks like a lot of British bikes used. Still a very nice find.


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## ericbaker (Jul 19, 2011)

LeSarthois said:


> Maybe track bikes used "old-fashioned" techniques that dissapeared from everyday bikes. But it still look odd to me :o




Track bike technology sort of craws when compared to other bikes evolutionary lines... It was not at all uncommon to find wooden wheels and an inch pitch chain on track bike well into the 40s and 50s


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