# help ID Colson ?



## zephyrblau (Jun 11, 2012)

all I have so far is a frame & fork. the fork has "waterfall" style truss rods. no head badge, but the mount holes are drilled top & bottom & are 2 7/32" on center. there is wear to the bottom bracket & unless that's too heavy I can make out 77971 stamped kinda randomly. 
happy to post pix. any help appreciated. 
thanks! 
jerry


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## Boris (Jun 11, 2012)

zephyrblau said:


> all I have so far is a frame & fork. the fork has "waterfall" style truss rods. no head badge, but the mount holes are drilled top & bottom & are 2 7/32" on center. there is wear to the bottom bracket & unless that's too heavy I can make out 77971 stamped kinda randomly.
> happy to post pix. any help appreciated.
> thanks!
> jerry




Is there a second row of numbers with a letter. Please do post a picture.


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## zephyrblau (Jun 11, 2012)

hello Dave; 
appears as though the damage gets progressively worse from left to right, but if there is anything to the right of the '1' I can't make it out. 
in the opposite direction (kinda upside down) in a smaller font is stamped the letters S A 
owners initials ? Sam Adams ?  should I get out the file & go after it more ?


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## Boris (Jun 11, 2012)

Do you think that possibly the "S" could be an "8"? If so, your frame would most likely be a '38.


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## zephyrblau (Jun 11, 2012)

the "S" is definitely just that. has the little "ticks" on each end. looking @ the numbers from another angle I now see that the "1" is actually the letter "F". 
so it actually reads 7797F. again, if there's any more to the right of that it's too far gone for me to make out. the frame was represented as a '39 so maybe that's really what it is.


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## Boris (Jun 11, 2012)

Wish I could be of more help, but I can't figure it out with that serial number. Not that this will help any, but could you post a picture of the bike?


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## zephyrblau (Jun 11, 2012)

all i have so far is the frame & fork. (slab tank arrived this afternoon, but I'm having a bear of a time getting it to fit)


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## pgroah (Jun 11, 2012)

*frame id*

looks like an elgin frame


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## Adamtinkerer (Jun 16, 2012)

The top bars are too close to be a Colson frame, I think it's an early Cleveland Welding frame. They later modified their design around 38 or 9 to accomodate a tank.


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## old hotrod (Jun 16, 2012)

Adamtinkerer said:


> The top bars are too close to be a Colson frame, I think it's an early Cleveland Welding frame. They later modified their design around 38 or 9 to accomodate a tank.




It is a Colson non-tank double bar frame...


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## zephyrblau (Jun 16, 2012)

probably explains why I had a hell of a time getting the tank to fit... had to pull the horn... not the recommended method :eek:
live & learn. 
thanks all!


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## RMS37 (Jun 16, 2012)

This is a Colson frame. It is one of the short wheelbase, no-tank double bar roadsters. Variations of this frame were produced from late 1937 through at least 1940 and the space between the top tubes is too small to fit the Colson three rib tank (or any other tank, unless you break out a bigger hammer.)

Colson serial numbers _generally_ follow a pattern that we moderns have “_decoded”_. There are no known factory documents to back our interpretation so a best practices approach would be to use the pattern with the understanding it is really just made up and keep an open mind to other possibilities. This is especially true in the cases of frames that have numbers that you have to work at to fit the pattern. I think in those cases it is best to try to date the frame by its characteristics rather than trying too hard to justify an elaborate reading of what is present.

In spite of all that, the secret Colson handshake is still held in good stead.


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## zephyrblau (Jun 16, 2012)

secret handshake ??!! :eek: 
this pic is probably enough to keep me banished from the club for life. (I figured there was something wrong when I tried to fit the tank) guess I'll have to be a little more careful next time. I'll build this up w/o the tank & continue to look for that mysterious long rear triangle frame that I've already missed *TWICE


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## Boris (Jun 16, 2012)

This is GOOD! I knew some "rainbow" frames didn't have tanks, but didn't know that tanks didn't fit in some of the frames. Thank you!


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## zephyrblau (Jun 16, 2012)

for future reference the space between the bars is 2" in front tapering to 2 3/16" in back. does anyone have some examples of how this frame could have been badged ?


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## RMS37 (Jun 16, 2012)

Dave is so excited by this news I imagine he is at home practicing the secret handshake as I write...



zephyrblau said:


> secret handshake ??!! :eek:
> this pic is probably enough to keep me banished from the club for life. (I figured there was something wrong when I tried to fit the tank) guess I'll have to be a little more careful next time. I'll build this up w/o the tank & continue to look for that mysterious long rear triangle frame that I've already missed *TWICE




Meanwhile, the caveat is that only the long wheelbase straight-bars will take a tank, the double bar roadster (rainbow) versions also have bars too closely spaced for the 1938+ 3-rib tank.


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## old hotrod (Jun 16, 2012)

zephyrblau said:


> for future reference the space between the bars is 2" in front tapering to 2 3/16" in back. does anyone have some examples of how this frame could have been badged ?




The one I have was badged "Colson" with the round winged "C" badge.


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## Boris (Jun 16, 2012)

RMS37 said:


> Dave is so excited by this news I imagine he is at home practicing the secret handshake as I write..




All these years and I never knew THAT was called the COLSON SECRET HANDSHAKE. I just keep learnin' and learnin'.


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## zephyrblau (Jun 16, 2012)

how many Colsons do you have ? are you blind yet or do you just wear glasses ?


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