# Vintage Three Speed Gearing



## Schwinny (Feb 28, 2021)

I was wondering if any folks here play with the gearing (sprocket and or chain ring) on their 3 speeds? I recently experimented on mine and found that the gearing simplexes from cars do not cross over to bicycles. I still think it would have worked if I had the horsepower to back it up!! 
Im interested in any changes folks may have made and why.
I'm partial to the Sturmey Archer, but I've always thought that the 25% and 30% spacings in the standard Sturmey Archer were a bit wide, stock geared 1st isn't so bad (using 46/18), but 3rd gear is only for downhill by daredevils. Not a safe speed on my clatter trap. The top of first, bottom of 2nd, is a good cruising speed for me.
Considering breaking down gearing into inch feet, Ive heard that getting 1st gear in the mid to high 40's is an easier range for "elder statesmen" that still want to haul ass on occasion.
Any thoughts?


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## SirMike1983 (Feb 28, 2021)

The AM hub was offered as an alternative for tighter ratios than the AW. Then there's the FW and the S5 if you want more gear options.

But I modify all of mine. 

I like 46/22 and 48/22. I don't kill myself going downhill, so I can lose a little top-end.

You could take it all the way out to 46/23 and 48/24, but I don't take it quite that far because you're trading out a lot of top-end in the AW and FW once you go there. The S5 is a little better in that regard.





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						Sturmey Archer Hub Gear Ratio Notes
					

A blog devoted to vintage bicycle repair and cycling in general.




					bikeshedva.blogspot.com


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## FICHT 150 (Feb 28, 2021)

All of the English bikes around the house, about ten of them, are wearing 20 or 22 tooth sprockets, including the Raleigh 20s. The Wife’s bike, a Robin Hood badged Sprite 5 speed S5 hub, wears a 23 tooth, 46 on the front. She is not a strong rider.
Shimano makes pretty nice sprockets for the Nexus 3 speed hubs, that interchange with Sturmey sprockets.
Ted


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## Schwinny (Feb 28, 2021)

SirMike1983 said:


> The AM hub was offered as an alternative for tighter ratios than the AW. Then there's the FW and the S5 if you want more gear options.
> 
> But I modify all of mine.
> 
> ...



I actually started out trying to choose gearing for a S2C I just put on a 27"r and saw this reference here:





						Sturmey-Archer Bicycle Hubs
					

Technical information about Sturmey-Archer internal-gear hubs



					www.sheldonbrown.com
				



...I noticed that the newer hubs use the bikes gearing as 1:1 and increase, whereas the English hubs use 2nd gear as 1:1 and reduce for 1st and gain for 3rd. 
I'd like to try a new version to compare. 
This then led me to start looking at the Schwinn standard 46/18 so thinking like a car gear head, I went to 46/14 but it didn't do what I thought it would.
After spending too much time graphing out all the ballpark combinations, I think I will try the 46/22 you recommended on my Schwinn with 700s and a TCW. I've got to order the sprocket though. The one I have came with the S2C and is a 1/8" version. I have switched its driveline to 3/32.


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## Schwinny (Feb 28, 2021)

FICHT 150 said:


> All of the English bikes around the house, about ten of them, are wearing 20 or 22 tooth sprockets, including the Raleigh 20s. The Wife’s bike, a Robin Hood badged Sprite 5 speed S5 hub, wears a 23 tooth, 46 on the front. She is not a strong rider.
> Shimano makes pretty nice sprockets for the Nexus 3 speed hubs, that interchange with Sturmey sprockets.
> Ted



Thanks, I'll look into that !


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## Schwinny (Mar 7, 2021)

All done with the gearing on my 27" wheel lightweight.
I bought an assortment of cogs and ring gears for the 3/32 drivetrain using a Sturmey Archer S2C rear hub. On this hub, 1st gear is 1:1 with the bikes gearing, wheel and stroke diameters and 2nd gear is a 30% step up.
I started with a 46/16 ring to cog ratio which gives a first gear of 79.06 inch feet. this was too tall.
Then I went to the 46/22 recommended above.
Wow. such a difference !! But a little too easy.
Then to 48/22... better but still a bit too slow of a cruising speed or the effort.
I looked for a 21 tooth sprocket but SA doesn't seem to make one in a 3/32" variety, at least I wasn't able to get one at first look, so I checked out the Shimano Nexus offerings mentioned above and found that a 48/21 is just about perfect. That comes out to 62.85 first and a 83.8 second gear.
For me, its a real good balance of cruising easily at 10mph or clipping along at 20mph on a flat with not much effort.
Im never going to make a wish on a bikes stock gearing again.

Now its on to the three speed Schwinn lightweight next. A little harder to balance as well on the older Sturmey three speeds. Getting a 1st gear of 62if. would make 2nd around 90if. and 3rd waaay over 100. Nearly impossible to use on a street bike as far as me riding it is concerned. Stock gearing for the average 26" tire 3spd Schwinn is 46/18 giving ratios of 1st-44.3, 2nd-66.4, 3rd-88.6. The Schwinn's tires are now 700Cx35 measuring a 27.25 tall ride heightso that will make a big difference.
Something interesting I see when looking at all the ratio charts and whatnot for the Sturmey Archer Hubs is that they were re-designed after SA was sold in the 00's and now use 1st gear as the 1:1 wereas All the older 3spd models use 2nd gear as 1:1 and reduce for 1st gear. This makes gearing easier yet the same.
I think a good city hub would be a closer ratio model with around 20% steps.
Anybody got a SA KSW hub lying around?


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## SirMike1983 (Mar 7, 2021)

I have a pair of Schwinn 3-speeds - a 1960s Racer and a 1940s New World. The Racer has the 46 tooth front clover sprocket, with a 22 tooth 1/8" cog in back. The New World has a skip tooth 3-speed set up - 24 tooth front (so 48) and 11 tooth rear (converts to 22). Both have AW hubs. The hubs work well and spares are plentiful enough so that I can keep them on the road.

On my ride route there are four steep hills, one of which is particularly tough. So I'm using Low/1 and Normal/2 as my climbers, with High/3 being my cruiser and downhill.  I run stock steel or stainless steel rims, stock calipers on all of them, so you only go so fast before you're substantially out-riding your braking ability.










Back when I lived in a flatter area down south, I ran 48/20 on a couple of bikes, and it went fine. The 48/20 can be especially nice on a bike with the S5 hub. If you're lucky enough to live where it's flatter, you can dedicate High/3 as a speeder downhill gear and run Normal on the flat. I lived for awhile in a place like that - lots of fun riding to be had there.

I do recall seeing 21 tooth cogs on eBay, at least as of a couple of years ago. There seems to be somewhat less of a demand for them than the 20 and the 22. The cogs are cheap enough so that you can buy a bunch and experiment with them. Swapping on the splined type drivers is not hard. Some of the old, threaded ones have the cogs on very tightly. All I can say is experiment until you like what you have. It's worth the time to get the ratio you're comfortable with.


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