# help needed 1901 Columbia model 74



## mtnbikeman (Sep 5, 2019)

Just purchased this bike from a local collector . It is posted in buynsell. I am very excited to own this bike but am wondering about a few things being period correct or not. It definitely has an older repaint on it and black paint can be seen under the green.




It does have chain tread single tube tires but they are on these metal rims. And the front hub is a new departure model WL. I know that's not correct but what about the rims?




Are theses pedals correct?




The handle bars have Schwinn grips. But are the handle bars themselves correct.




I found an ad that said Christy saddles were an option back then.




The rear hub has ball end spokes. Does anyone make these still if i decide to get wooded rims?


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Sep 5, 2019)

Very nice!
There is someone making ball-end spokes.
You could salvage the spokes and have Stutzman make new rims.


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## mtnbikeman (Sep 5, 2019)

My experience with salvaging spokes is some wheels they all come loose other wheels they all break others are 50/50. And then would they be the right length for a wood rim. If anyone has a supplier. I think I would also need a matching front hub. But when collectors who have been in the hobby for a while use term "hens teeth" I know it will be difficult.


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## David Brown (Sep 5, 2019)

Use an electric soldering gun on the nipples to heat them up and they will come off easy, just take your time. I would say the spokes will be the right length for wood rims because that was what was more than likely on from new and they are the same spokes  They Had just changed the rims at some time in the last 100 years.


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## locomotion (Sep 5, 2019)

the shape of those wood rims is pretty early, I don't know if Columbia offered steel rims in 1901, but someone with a catalogue could help
yes the seat is most likely original or older


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## David Brown (Sep 5, 2019)

The rims on his bike are steel .At least thats what i see.   A lot of things can change in like I said 100 years or more.


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Sep 5, 2019)

It’s possible to find stainless steel beads, that can be soldered to stainless steel spokes.


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## olderthandirt (Sep 7, 2019)

if someone is making a correct ball end spokes i am interested ? the little tit that extends past the ball is to keep them from coming out of the hub , nothing worse than to stand up and push down on the crank and have all your spokes come flying out and killing your neighbors poodle who was just glad to see you !


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## Barnegatbicycles (Sep 7, 2019)

Here's one way of doing it... There are definitely easier ways. 

http://thecabe.com/forum/threads/columbia-chainless-spoke-advice.80143/


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Sep 7, 2019)

It’s easy to solder these SS beads onto stainless steel spokes. The correct sizes can be found.
Use a citric acid solution for cleaning the beads and spoke ends, to be silver soldered. Use a high-temperature borax flux and 56%  silver-based solder.

https://www.amazon.com/50pcs-round-stainless-smooth-diameter/dp/B01GWHNI7G


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## Rusty McNickel (Sep 8, 2019)

The rims could very well be original. According to the ABC 1900 Paris Expo catalog bicycles, Columbias included could be furnished with four different types of steel rims for these tires; Dunlop, GJ, Westwood or Continental. Attached is page stating that. Also attached is a 1900 Columbia chainless 65 for reference. The handlebars could look the part although displayed turned down. The pedals are mid century.


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## Rusty McNickel (Sep 9, 2019)

Hard to tell from the photo. Are the rims matched? They look like they may be different.


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## mtnbikeman (Sep 14, 2019)

They are matched but the front hub is a New Departure. And on the rear the spoke threads are exposed by about 1/4". So someone has changed something over the years. These rims are definitely made to hold single tube tires. Westwood rims we see a lot of those up here in Canada they were used by CCM into the 60's, and they hold modern tires. I could not find any images for the Continental steel rims and can't see any manufacturers stamps.


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## locomotion (Sep 14, 2019)

David Brown said:


> The rims on his bike are steel .At least thats what i see.   A lot of things can change in like I said 100 years or more.




Sorry. You are right. I mistyped .... Freudian slip I guess!


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## Rusty McNickel (Sep 15, 2019)

@mtnbikeman, I missed your mention in original post that these wheels were single tube steel rims/tires.

Of all the various steel rims offered in the 1900 ABC catalog, they seem to be of some type of clincher design, specific the the manufacturers mentioned. I seem to recall there was a tire war going on at the time or at least the aftermath of one. Also stated earlier in that catalog was that these steel rim offerings were to accommodate various European markets where they were favored.

Having said that, I suppose it's not out of the realm of possibility that steel single tube rims were available in 1901, I just can't confirm it from any text I have scoured.


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## mike cates (Sep 18, 2019)

I would be glad to answer your questions.
I have both the matching Man's and Ladies 1901 Columbia shaft drive models in restored condition for sale.
All wheels are laced with NOS Columbia ball end spokes found years ago.
Man's is complete even though shown here without hand grips, cranks and rat trap pedals in this photo.
I'm not on The Cabe that much so questions are best answered by phone or email.
Mike Cates, CA.
(760) 473-6201 (NO TEXTS)
cates0321@hotmail.com


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## gkeep (Sep 18, 2019)

Nice looking bike, congratulations! The flat profile of those rims reminds me of the 28 inch rims on my mid teens Pierce. They have a very flat profile but they are clinchers. Could your rims be early clinchers and the single tube tires were put on for display or because ISO 642 tires are not available in North America? I had to order mine from a bike shop in Canberra Australia. Australia manufactured bikes with 28" (iso 642) rims up to the early 1970s so they are still in demand down under.  Good luck with your nice bike!


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## olderthandirt (Nov 4, 2019)

i have a couple of  sets of  these early clincher steel rims that have only about 1/4 inch rim side height, i bet that s exactly what mine are one set came on an early mead and the other came on an early iver johnson  thanks for the lead guys


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## mike cates (Jul 2, 2020)

The tedious part on Columbia ball end spokes is machining the two opposing flats at the top of the ball that precisely lock the spoke in the keyhole opening of the Columbia ball end spoke hubs. These flats secure the spoke from spinning when the nipple at the rim is being tightened or loosened. The extended "tit" at the end of the spoke is also important as this is what locks the ball end into the hub vertically when it is inserted in the slot and brought into correct position. 
Mike Cates, CA.


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