# Elgin Miss America variations



## fullcircle (Mar 11, 2020)

So just curious I have heard a few opinions about Elgin Miss America's seems there were two versions with and without the Elgin stamped in the skirts.  Was it a early and late version or the fact that they were made by both Murray and Westfield?


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## Pedals Past (Mar 12, 2020)

Its a good question so I recently got a original with the decal it had both floating hub and cushion goose neck .... so i have built one up restored and sense the BB saddle was still offered as an accessory i used a skylark saddle black grips.... i now since have had a white troxel made and white grips ..... since the safety pedals blocks are black i tend to say I prefer it super deluxe with the skylark saddle ..... ND 2 speed.... cushion goose neck.... floating hub....... ww tires....... chrome rims 







which way do you prefer? as a restored bike i dont really want to here the critic about correct they are all 39-41 available parts ..... the color i like orange


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## Oldbikes (Mar 12, 2020)

Personally, I think I’m leaning towards the Skylark saddle and black grips. 
I think the white seat detracts from the beauty and flow of the frame, with the black option the colors and frame design take focus...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## fullcircle (Mar 12, 2020)

Yes I agree with your colors I like the black


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## mrg (Mar 12, 2020)

Still wondering about the original question?


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## Sandman (Mar 13, 2020)

This 39 came with no stamp or head shroud , but it did come with a train light design for the pinch fenders ? I'm would like find some more info also .


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## Freqman1 (Mar 13, 2020)

I think it may be helpful for those that have these to look and see whether they have decal or embossed and whether it is Westfield or Murray built. This may help answering the original question. If you have other questions about these or your particular bike you should probably start another thread. V/r Shawn


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## mrg (Mar 13, 2020)

Sandman said:


> This 39 came with no stamp or head shroud , but it did come with a train light design for the pinch fenders ? I'm would like find some more info also .
> View attachment 1155226



Ya, think you need to start your thread but I think your bike lost it's tank & shroud over the years and looks like a Colson rack! back to original question Westfield vs. Murry, never thought about it just figured all mine have been Murry's but knowing alot of other Elgins were bi-produced who knows, only thing I've thought I knew were the year difference in front suspension, cushion stem 40, floating hub 41. never seen them together.


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## Pedals Past (Mar 13, 2020)

i think the 39 worlds fair bike had both .... embossed 39-40 ..... decal 40-41


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## prewarbikes4sale (Mar 13, 2020)

The Original 39 Worlds fair Bike was not a Miss America it is a Elgin Sport


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## piercer_99 (Mar 13, 2020)

hear are catalog pages for 1940 and 1941


1941





1940


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## PCHiggin (Mar 13, 2020)

Wasn't Miss America" a nickname given to the '39 W/F bike?


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## Pedals Past (Mar 13, 2020)

Reading this literature closer after looking at it for 30 years i ve never seen one of the pre war cone lenses with a blue dot in it .Anyone have one and can post a photo..... I remember now Mike is right it was the sport bike that was the WF bike Don Vaughn had which i think he owns


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## Sandman (Mar 13, 2020)

Does anyone have a pictures of this illusive Worlds fair bike ' to show if has the script on the skirt guard ?
Or a copy of the manufacture's  literature showing what variations were available ? 
Otherwise I think it's all just hearsay ?


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## TieDye (Mar 13, 2020)

piercer_99 said:


> hear are catalog pages for 1940 and 1941
> 
> 
> 1940
> ...



Notice the position of the Elgin on the Fender. One is higher than the other.


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## saladshooter (Mar 13, 2020)

Post #7 on this thread has a picture of an "Elgin Sport".









						Identifying Elgin Bicycle | Classic Balloon Tire Bicycles 1933-1965
					

Hello All!  I am looking for a restoration project for the cold New England winter. I found an "Unknown" Elgin ladies bike that looks like a good fit. Can anyone help me identify a Model and/or approx year? As I cannot seem to find it!  Looking online for some info, I guess there is a difference...




					thecabe.com
				






Sandman said:


> Does anyone have a pictures of this illusive Worlds fair bike ' to show if has the script on the skirt guard ?
> Or a copy of the manufacture's  literature showing what variations were available ?
> Otherwise I think it's all just hearsay ?


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## mike j (Mar 13, 2020)

1939 Westfield, I think, not embossed Elgin.


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## mrg (Mar 13, 2020)

piercer_99 said:


> hear are catalog pages for 1940 and 1941
> 
> 
> 1941
> ...



Think you got the years backwards there, 40 cushion stem, 41 floater in my sears catalogs & TieDye's post


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## fullcircle (Mar 16, 2020)

So after looking at the ads for the 100th time I just noticed something in the 1940 ad it mentions the new streamline skirt but in the 1941 ad it mentions the patented streamline skirt. Could that be the time they started stamping them since they were now patented?? Makes sense.


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## Bikes62557 (Apr 15, 2020)

.


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## Bikes62557 (Apr 15, 2020)

It took me many years to gather this information. It seems that the material used in lens was not stable and even NOS parts found on the shelves also went bad. 
I hope this will help.


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## Bikes62557 (Apr 15, 2020)

The question about Embosed "Elgin" or not on Skirt. I have restored two different "Miss America" Elgins, both were definitely mfg. by Murray, both were complete, original and not modified over the years, the second one had been repainted with a brush but was all there.



The first had a Finned Front Hub, Jeweled Pedals and a Cushion Stem, a single cell tail light with screw on lens, no rear reflector and NO embossed letters. From research we came to the conclusion that it was a 1940 sold in Stores, not Catalog as it had an original Color scheme that was not ever listed in the Catalog. The second one I did several years later had a cushioned Stewart Warner front hub, regular pedals, a two cell tail/stop light with twist lens (with Blue Dot) that locked on with tabs, a rectangular rear reflector and no cushioned Stem. It had the "Elgin" letters Embossed on the Skirt. From Catalog listings we concluded that it was probable a 1941 as the Stewart Warner Hub was not available earlier. Again they both had Murray frames and I have been told that the skirts will not interchange from Murray to Westfield frames. Restoring the second one I took the liberty to add a Cushion Stem (hand made) and Torrington Jeweled Pedals (modified reproductions) just to give it a little more Class! The complete story of the second "Miss America of Bicycles" was chronicled here on the C A B E a couple of years back.


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## mrg (Apr 15, 2020)

So what are the differences between Westfield & Murry, any pictures, seems like most I've had or seen were Murry!


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## Bikes62557 (Apr 16, 2020)

Anyone on here please correct me if I am wrong as I have never had a Westfield bike and got this information second handed but here is a photo  of one difference.


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## mrg (Apr 16, 2020)

If so, all I have seen and owned have been Murry, so does the Westfield have a combo stand/ears unit?


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## Bikes62557 (Apr 16, 2020)

I hope someone else on here can help, as I said my Westfield info is second handed.


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## Bikes62557 (Apr 16, 2020)

Pedals Past said:


> Its a good question so I recently got a original with the decal it had both floating hub and cushion goose neck .... so i have built one up restored and sense the BB saddle was still offered as an accessory i used a skylark saddle black grips.... i now since have had a white troxel made and white grips ..... since the safety pedals blocks are black i tend to say I prefer it super deluxe with the skylark saddle ..... ND 2 speed.... cushion goose neck.... floating hub....... ww tires....... chrome rims View attachment 1155057
> View attachment 1155058
> 
> which way do you prefer? as a restored bike i dont really want to here the critic about correct they are all 39-41 available parts ..... the color i like orange



You mentioned that you have a "Miss Ameica" with original Decal. If so could you post a good photo of it and it's location on bike. Thanks


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## Freqman1 (Apr 24, 2020)

Here is the decal on my '41 Westfield built MA. V/r Shawn


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## Freqman1 (Apr 24, 2020)

Dropout--integral ears. The above pic of the Westfield dropout does not look like mine and mine has the banjo axle adjusters as shown on the Murray style. Without removing the shroud it is hard to see the exact differences. V/r Shawn


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## fullcircle (Apr 24, 2020)

So my 1940 Murray built Miss America showed no evidence of a model decal. It does have the embossed skirt and is stamped 502-173. I did notice that the seat post clamp is part of the frame and not a separate clamp like the bikes above.


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## Pedals Past (Oct 2, 2020)

I think ....... ....... no one really knows so the 39-40 f/w catalog or xmas flyer shows the cushion neck most of those had decal on guards and suspect those might havve been Westfield builds..... suspecting the 40-41 had the floating hub and were embossed skirt guards and Murrey build ...... then there might be the case that the embossed was first with cushion neck and they had left overs and just used up the run on the 40-41 with floating hub ...... then there is the case like the mussleman 2 speed in the catalog where you could order the bike with it for the extra cost so there might be bikes out there that have both ..... more than likely though they been put together like changing clothes on the barbie doll by us collectors ...... like me i switch the stuff on this bike quite frequantly because all my bikes are fake restored and most the parts are made in my garage just to rattle everyone ...... but truthfully I think it applied to use what was there the day the bike was ordered or built for  display ...... on this case the bike was never sold at a bike shop so more than likely they were upgrades and dressings by owners and  then collectors i just dont see some guy in a shop coat building a bike at a department store. This bike the major portion sold was more than likely ordered ..... and each addition still having the last edition parts available as well. Anyway I think its one of the sexist five top girls bikes ever made 

1. Elgin Skylark 
2. shelby airflow
3. Ms america 
4. Hawthorne zep/ladies RMS
5. 37 Colson Vogue

I like the 39-41 girls mercury and the 40-41 colson cushioner and  Firestone bullnose.  Some would include the girls monark wingbar


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## bike (Oct 2, 2020)

5. 37 Colson Vogue much rarer (with the battery pak) than the above
I like the MS America best...


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## bikesnbuses (Oct 2, 2020)

Original decal on the guard


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## Pedals Past (Oct 2, 2020)

bike said:


> 5. 37 Colson Vogue much rarer (with the battery pak) than the above
> I like the MS America best...



maybe the rarest only about five known i had Bicycle Bills it brought big $$$ for a girls bike


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## Demzie (Oct 2, 2020)

@mynameislegion


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