# Need Help Here !       Chicago Cycle Supply Co,  Serial number.



## CURTIS L LINDGREN (Feb 1, 2018)

Hello to all here.      I'm new to the Cabe, but have messed with pre war bikes on and off for a while now.     I just got a 1934 ?    26"  Motorbike style  Bicycle   Made By  Chicago Cycle Supply Co.        It has a " Spartan"   badge         The Serial # is 550637      I haven't found a list of numbers for this bike yet.     Maybe someone here can help me figure out what I have ?       It seems to be a 16" X 20"  Frame.   Seems small.  Is this an adult bike or child's bike ?    Please help with date range or model number if this can be determined.   Thanks in advance .       Curt


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## barneyguey (Feb 1, 2018)

CURTIS L LINDGREN said:


> Hello to all here.      I'm new to the Cabe, but have messed with pre war bikes on and off for a while now.     I just got a 1934 ?    26"  Motorbike style  Bicycle   Made By  Chicago Cycle Supply Co.        It has a " Spartan"   badge         The Serial # is 550637      I haven't found a list of numbers for this bike yet.     Maybe someone here can help me figure out what I have ?       It seems to be a 16" X 20"  Frame.   Seems small.  Is this an adult bike or child's bike ?    Please help with date range or model number if this can be determined.   Thanks in advance .       Curt
> 
> View attachment 747062



Chicago Cycle Supply did not manufacture bikes, they distributed them with many different names on them including Spartan.

Sent from my SM-G530T using Tapatalk


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## barneyguey (Feb 1, 2018)

Since it has that style of fork and the head badge is held on with screws rather than rivets, it's probably a Schwinn. Barry


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## barneyguey (Feb 1, 2018)

Schwinn had several different frame sizes to pick from before WWII that had 26" tires.


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## island schwinn (Feb 1, 2018)

More pics of the whole bike and serial number will help.


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## CURTIS L LINDGREN (Feb 2, 2018)

The bike is disassembled at the moment.    I'll post more pics shortly.   It has drop center wheels    a Torrington art deco handlebar stem  and an older ?  seat .   frame is 16" top of downtube to center of crank..............and.......20" from center of crank to axle of rear wheel. It Has a Morrow Rear hub that is stamped D 1 ,  serial # has no letter in it...............only  550637    Is this an adult bike ?   or a Boys bike ?


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## island schwinn (Feb 2, 2018)

The Morrow hub is 1934.


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## tripple3 (Feb 2, 2018)

Every frame feature says "Schwinn" built.
Serial # dates frame to earlier than delivered; '34 sounds fine to me.
Hippie Mike rides a couple 16" frames.
It's cool and could be made ridable with a little effort, time, and tubes, tires and lube.


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## WES PINCHOT (Feb 2, 2018)

AGREE ON 1934 SCHWINN SERIAL NUMBER.


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## barneyguey (Feb 2, 2018)

WES PINCHOT said:


> AGREE ON 1934 SCHWINN SERIAL NUMBER.



Howdy Wes! Were you the one that posted the serial number list that I was able to copy a long time ago. It had gaps in it and the fellow said he was working on it. I gave him some photos of serial numbers and the bikes to add to the list. I was wondering if it was ever made more complete? Thanks! Barry


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## Autocycleplane (Feb 2, 2018)

barnyguey said:


> Howdy Wes! Were you the one that posted the serial number list that I was able to copy a long time ago. It had gaps in it and the fellow said he was working on it. I gave him some photos of serial numbers and the bikes to add to the list. I was wondering if it was ever made more complete? Thanks! Barry




That list is completely bogus.


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## barneyguey (Feb 2, 2018)

Autocycleplane said:


> That list is completely bogus.



Did anyone have another one started that was more accurate?


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## Autocycleplane (Feb 2, 2018)




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## Autocycleplane (Feb 2, 2018)

barnyguey said:


> Did anyone have another one started that was more accurate?




Tim’s old list was much better. It’s been posted somewhere in the Schwinn Serial sticky when he took his own site down


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## WES PINCHOT (Feb 2, 2018)

barnyguey said:


> Howdy Wes! Were you the one that posted the serial number list that I was able to copy a long time ago. It had gaps in it and the fellow said he was working on it. I gave him some photos of serial numbers and the bikes to add to the list. I was wondering if it was ever made more complete? Thanks! Barry




HI BARRY,
NO I DID NOT POST A SERIAL NUMBER LIST.
I HAVE A LIST THAT WAS COMPILED BY KNOWLEDGEABLE GURU COLLECTORS
ABOUT 10-12 YEARS AGO.  IT WAS UNDER STOOD THAT IT SHOULD NOT BE PUBLISHED.
THERE WERE SOME CABERS THAT DID POST THEM ON THE CABE.
I SUGGEST YOU DO A SEARCH FOR PREWAR SCHWINN SERIAL NUMBERS TO FIND THE POSTING, .
THERE IS ONE GUY ON THE CABE THAT IS NOT A BELIEVER.   SO BE IT, ONE IN EVERY CROWD.


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## barneyguey (Feb 2, 2018)

I have that catalog and used it to date my three prewar Schwinn's. I was wondering because I see people discuss the year in relation to the serial number all the time here on the Cabe. I guess the age by the frame styles and the fenders, angle of the braces on the fenders, tank styles, lights, horns etc. on the bike.


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## barneyguey (Feb 2, 2018)




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## barneyguey (Feb 2, 2018)

WES PINCHOT said:


> HI BARRY,
> NO I DID NOT POST A SERIAL NUMBER LIST.
> I HAVE A LIST THAT WAS COMPILED BY KNOWLEDGEABLE GURU COLLECTORS
> ABOUT 10-12 YEARS AGO.  IT WAS UNDER STOOD THAT IT SHOULD NOT BE PUBLISHED.
> ...



Thanks Wes! Barry


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## GTs58 (Feb 2, 2018)

Autocycleplane said:


> Tim’s old list was much better. It’s been posted somewhere in the Schwinn Serial sticky when he took his own site down




I believe his list begins with the 1935 numbers which start with letters.


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## Autocycleplane (Feb 2, 2018)

WES PINCHOT said:


> HI BARRY,
> NO I DID NOT POST A SERIAL NUMBER LIST.
> I HAVE A LIST THAT WAS COMPILED BY KNOWLEDGEABLE GURU COLLECTORS
> ABOUT 10-12 YEARS AGO.  IT WAS UNDER STOOD THAT IT SHOULD NOT BE PUBLISHED.
> ...




More than one guy Wes. That list is a joke. You are almost always wrong when you blindly trust it, despite all the obvious clues to the contrary. You add a lot of confusion and tend to buck the consensus - so who is the one guy here?


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## barneyguey (Feb 2, 2018)

GTs58 said:


> I believe his list begins with the 1935 numbers which start with letters.



Thanks! Barry


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## CURTIS L LINDGREN (Feb 3, 2018)

Thanks for the info and feedback.    looking at the chainrings,  is it possible someone has put the sweetheart in place of the original ?     I see the sweetheart on other models, but not with this frame.    I read an article stating '33 bikes had 5 # serial numbers, and 1934 had 6# serial Numbers.............do we know this to be fact ?     I have a tank coming in for this today ( Let's hope she fits ! )    also a rack , so it's gonna be pieced together with non original parts.   I've always liked this style of bike.................but have yet to own one , till now.    I'm very impressed with the  knowledge you bike guys have .    The posts are very informative and interesting.        More pic's to come as this progresses .    Thanks again for the help.


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

You see the sweetheart sprocket on all different models. 
Also, lot's of people change the sprocket depending on where they live. A lot of the bikes that come out of Seattle have small (ladies sprockets) to make it easier to ride up the hills. If they live where it's pretty flat, they use bigger sprockets. Barry


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## CURTIS L LINDGREN (Feb 3, 2018)

barnyguey said:


> You see the sweetheart sprocket on all different models.
> Also, lot's of people change the sprocket depending on where they live. A lot of the bikes that come out of Seattle have small (ladies sprockets) to make it easier to ride up the hills. If they live where it's pretty flat, they use bigger sprockets. Barry



The crank measures 9"  diameter     it has  26 teeth on it.      Thanks for your comments, and insight !


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

You bet! Have a great day! Barry


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## GTs58 (Feb 3, 2018)

Here is the SN list that has been talked about here. It's posted in the Schwinn Serial Number thread at the top of the page in the section All Things Schwinn.


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

GTs58 said:


> Here is the SN list that has been talked about here. It's posted in the Schwinn Serial Number thread at the top of the page in the section All Things Schwinn.
> 
> View attachment 747721



Thanks man! That's very kind of you to find it and post it! Barry


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## CURTIS L LINDGREN (Feb 3, 2018)

GTs58 said:


> Here is the SN list that has been talked about here. It's posted in the Schwinn Serial Number thread at the top of the page in the section All Things Schwinn.
> 
> View attachment 747721



BINGO !      THANK YOU !


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

GTs58 said:


> Here is the SN list that has been talked about here. It's posted in the Schwinn Serial Number thread at the top of the page in the section All Things Schwinn.
> 
> View attachment 747721



I have a Motorbike with flat braces. The front hub is New Departure, not Schwinn. This serial no. list says it's a 1938? O11889


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## GTs58 (Feb 3, 2018)

barnyguey said:


> I have a Motorbike with flat braces. The front hub is New Departure, not Schwinn. This serial no. list says it's a 1938? O11889
> QUOTE]
> 
> .




Tim's list does not mention the O numbers. Just my observation on all the SN lists on the internet, each list has some errors, if you want to call it that. Including the main post war list originally posted on Angelfire!


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

GTs58 said:


> Tim's list does not mention the O numbers. Just my observation on all the SN lists on the internet, each list has some errors, if you want to call it that. Including the main post war list originally posted on Angelfire!



Ok, I think my bike is earlier than 38 because of photos in a prewar catalog I have?


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

GTs58 said:


> Tim's list does not mention the O numbers. Just my observation on all the SN lists on the internet, each list has some errors, if you want to call it that. Including the main post war list originally posted on Angelfire!



I've been searching my files and just found the list I re-typed, and it's different than the list you posted. Here it is:



*Prewar Schwinn Serial Numbers:*


*Below is a list of prewar Schwinn serial numbers.  The numbers were obtained from original bicycles that could be identified by components.  Obviously there are gaps between years. If you have an identifiable Schwinn and can help close the gap, please email us.  This is not an exact science and there are exceptions which I have listed as well.  *

*A1858-J1**** (hand stamped)                  1935*

*K                                                              ?*

*L2825-T10018 (hand stamped)                 1936*

*R5****-W08983                                         1937*

*W60510-B19181                                       1938*

*B22207-D37747                                        1939*

*D28843-F89521                                         1940*

*G32427-H93415                                        1941*



*Oddities:*


*S50874 - BC model with SPRINGER! Machine stamped*

*Y16867 - Motorbike with straight down tube, 37 style fenders, a six hole rack and a Hockey stick style chainguard.*

*Z05868 - Machine stamped, straight down tube, blue frame, motorbike frame and tank. *

*Z08930 - machine stamped, 1936 styleguard, 1936 style paint scheme, motorbike, non dated crank, footed badge*

*11187 - Early Aerocycle, welded tabs on fenders*


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## GTs58 (Feb 3, 2018)

barnyguey said:


> Ok, I think my bike is earlier than 38 because of photos in a prewar catalog I have?




Keep in mind that the serial numbers do not "always" indicate a year of manufacture. When Schwinn started machine stamping the serial numbers the numbers were stamped on the bikes component before the frame was built. The new year model's production almost always started in the previous year. Catalog pictures are a good reference but they are many times incorrect with the detailing.


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

GTs58 said:


> Keep in mind that the serial numbers do not "always" indicate a year of manufacture. When Schwinn started machine stamping the serial numbers the numbers were stamped on the bikes component before the frame was built. The new year model's production almost always started in the previous year. Catalog pictures are a good reference but they are many times incorrect with the detailing.[/QUOTE I did know that, they had to build up a Stock before they could sell them, just like the Car Companies do. What year would you say mine was? Barry


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## GTs58 (Feb 3, 2018)

Barry, did your bike have a casting date on the crank? Did you have both fenders or just the rear?

Since the O serial numbers on that list starts with O02000 the previous numbers may or not have been stamped in 1937. Flat braces for 37 but who can say or who knows when your bike was actually built. If it was a model year transition bike then it could have been a 1938 model equipped with flat fender braces. As been noted on many Schwinns, the last year model's parts have shown up on a few of the new years models that had a component change. One good example off the top of my head is the 1959 + S seats starting with the three rivets and then all the way to the 1963 S seats with no rivets. The three rivet seat was used on the 59-61 models but there have been many 1962 models that came with this seat when the vast majority of 62 models came with the one year only 2 rivet seat. And if you look at catalog many of these models all the way into 1963, the catalog illustrates some 1963 models with the 3 rivet seats when in fact the 63 models were equipped with the no rivet Mesinger. Same deal with the seats and front carriers in the catalog images of the very early middleweights.

From what I have noted studying Schwinns is their model year change over began with the November of the previous years serial numbers. In some cases when Schwinn introduced a new model the serial numbers were dated as far back as September. So theoretically an early 38 SN bike could have a 37 component or a 37 SN bike could have a new 1938 component. I still believe there were no actual 1949 model year Phantoms!     

The 1963 Corvette catalog image with the 59-61 three rivet Mesinger.


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

Thanks for the information!  Yes,it had both fenders, but for some reason I didn't end up with a photo with the front fender on the bike before I re-did it. I don't think there is a date on the crank? The front fender had the mark from a Silver Ray being mounted on it and it has the hole and the clip for the wiring. All the parts are original except the Light, the wheels( the originals were really rusty), the pedals and the battery tube I made out of a Mini Mag 3 d-cell battery flashlight. LOL     I recovered the seat, it turned out ok. I left the handle bars with all the holes drilled in them? I painted it all myself,but it has no pin striping because I shake to much!

So you think it may be a 1937? Barry


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

Here's a photo of the seat and serial number. The letter and the numbers are big and uneven?


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## CURTIS L LINDGREN (Feb 3, 2018)

Tank came in today ...................seems to fit just fine !      I was very pleased to have been given the opportunity to buy this.    I think it will help me achieve my goal for the look I'm after.       Thank You RR !


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

Looks great Man!


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

tripple3 said:


> Every frame feature says "Schwinn" built.
> Serial # dates frame to earlier than delivered; '34 sounds fine to me.
> Hippie Mike rides a couple 16" frames.
> It's cool and could be made ridable with a little effort, time, and tubes, tires and lube.



Howdy! I noticed the Sweet Heart sprocket looks a little different than what I'm used to. Am I seeing things?


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## CURTIS L LINDGREN (Feb 3, 2018)

Different   in what respect ?       I have a Colson that has a sweetheart crank on it ,   I could compare...............


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

CURTIS L LINDGREN said:


> Different   in what respect ?       I have a Colson that has a sweetheart crank on it ,   I could compare...............



Here's a photo. Check it out! Barry


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

The one on your bike has round spots in between the hearts. Is this something they did on earlier Schwinn bikes?


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

CURTIS L LINDGREN said:


> Different   in what respect ?       I have a Colson that has a sweetheart crank on it ,   I could compare...............



I believe their are several sweetheart sprockets that were on different brand of bikes, each being just a little different in design.


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## WES PINCHOT (Feb 3, 2018)

GTs58 said:


> Here is the SN list that has been talked about here. It's posted in the Schwinn Serial Number thread at the top of the page in the section All Things Schwinn.
> 
> View attachment 747721



THIS IS THE SERIAL NUMBER LIST I REFERRED TO.


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## tripple3 (Feb 3, 2018)

tripple3 said:


> Every frame feature says "Schwinn" built.
> Serial # dates frame to earlier than delivered; '34 sounds fine to me.
> Hippie Mike rides a couple 16" frames.
> It's cool and could be made ridable with a little effort, time, and tubes, tires and lube.






barnyguey said:


> Howdy! I noticed the Sweet Heart sprocket looks a little different than what I'm used to. Am I seeing things?



Barry, that's not a *frame* feature and could have been changed over the years. I know you you knew that
I have seen both types on Schwinn built bikes and multiple non-Schwinn Sweetheart "type" chainrings that look similar.


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

tripple3 said:


> Barry, that's not a *frame* feature and could have been changed over the years. I know you you knew that
> I have seen both types on Schwinn built bikes and multiple non-Schwinn Sweetheart "type" chainrings that look similar.



I though maybe it was another brand sprocket.


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## tripple3 (Feb 3, 2018)

barnyguey said:


> I though maybe it was another brand sprocket.



I think both round hole and the more common are Schwinn from what I remember seeing.
The other Mfgrs look a little different.


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## Autocycleplane (Feb 3, 2018)

GTs58 said:


> Barry, did your bike have a casting date on the crank? Did you have both fenders or just the rear?
> 
> Since the O serial numbers on that list starts with O02000 the previous numbers may or not have been stamped in 1937. Flat braces for 37 but who can say or who knows when your bike was actually built.
> View attachment 747836




Many/most 37s don’t have flat braces despite the catalog pictures.


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## Autocycleplane (Feb 3, 2018)

barnyguey said:


> Howdy! I noticed the Sweet Heart sprocket looks a little different than what I'm used to. Am I seeing things?




That’s a common sprocket on other Schwinns in ‘35


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

tripple3 said:


> I think both round hole and the more common are Schwinn from what I remember seeing.
> The other Mfgrs look a little different.



Thanks man! I wondered about that. Barry


Autocycleplane said:


> That’s a common sprocket on other Schwinns in ‘35



Thank you! Barry


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## barneyguey (Feb 3, 2018)

Autocycleplane said:


> Many/most 37s don’t have flat braces despite the catalog pictures.



That's cool! I started out thinking it was a 1936, then a 1938 first thing this morning, then a 1937 this afternoon and now I'm back to 1936. LOL


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## Autocycleplane (Feb 4, 2018)

barnyguey said:


> That's cool! I started out thinking it was a 1936, then a 1938 first thing this morning, then a 1937 this afternoon and now I'm back to 1936. LOL




My point exactly about the bogus "copyrighted" list - it's patently wrong and causes unnecessary confusion. You mention your bike has an "O" serial, but you don't mention if it has the large hand stamped serial or the small machine stamped serial. 

Rough rules to go by for prewar balloon Schwinns, but it always helps to have enough parts on the bike to corroborate:

Large, unaligned hand-stamped letter/numbers appears to have ended in the 36/37 transition. 

Small, aligned machine-stamped letter/numbers up into the lower Ws are usually 37 model years

Small, aligned machine-stamped letter/numbers W and up (into A and B with small font) are usually 38 model years

Large, aligned machine-stamped letter/numbers seem to start with 39 models (A,B,C, maybe some Ds) and continue with 40 (D, E, some F) and 41 (F, G, H) models
Notice the use of the term model years, I feel this is a more accurate term to use when dating these bikes. Also I feel these general guidelines come from collectively looking at more of the higher-end equipped bikes than the base level entry level models (the nice ones just garner more interest), so I do think there is plenty of room to grow our understanding. 

I have been contemplating setting up a Prewar Schwinn Registry, where photos of bikes with reasonable provenance can be submitted to build on some of the work Tim had started.


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## barneyguey (Feb 4, 2018)

Autocycleplane said:


> My point exactly about the bogus "copyrighted" list - it's patently wrong and causes unnecessary confusion. You mention your bike has an "O" serial, but you don't mention if it has the large hand stamped serial or the small machine stamped serial.
> 
> Rough rules to go by for prewar balloon Schwinns, but it always helps to have enough parts on the bike to corroborate:
> 
> ...



Howdy! Good morning!  It has the large hand stamped serial number. This along with the flat braces etc. is why I thought it was a 1936. Barry


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## GTs58 (Feb 4, 2018)

barnyguey said:


> Howdy! Good morning!  It has the large hand stamped serial number. This along with the flat braces etc. is why I thought it was a 1936. Barry QUOTE]




I'm thinking you might be right. Ain't this fun? !!!!


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## barneyguey (Feb 4, 2018)

GTs58 said:


> I'm thinking you might be right. Ain't this fun? !!!!



Yes it is!!  The funny thing about it is, what difference does is matter if it's a 1936 or a 1937. I love it and will never get rid of it. Barry

It had the marks on the frame where a tank hung, I wish I had a tank and rack for it.


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## CURTIS L LINDGREN (Mar 2, 2018)

Hi Guys ,   Ok  so I've been gathering parts from all over.     I know some of you are against doing this....................but, I gotta save this frame !     I Have had several different types of bikes , but never a motorbike style frame.     At 1st I thought it might be too small................but no way.   I'm 5'11"   and  this feels very comfortable .    I kinda did a "Hodge Podge Build" ,    But I really like it.    Still not sure of the ultimate end result, but you gotta start somewhere.


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## colonialbrass (Oct 19, 2021)

Restoring an old Schwinn and the serial says it a 1950's Starlet,
but the frame and chain guard do not match the 50s Starlet








Any ideas as to what is going on with the serials saying it a 1950's Schwinn Starlet,
but the frame and chain guard do not match the 50's Starlet.
It matches the 1930's Cadillac Chicago Bicycle Supply Co. Goes with the story
behind the bike being purchased in the 30's and restored in the 80's.


1930's Cadillac Chicago Bicycle Supply Co


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## Freqman1 (Oct 19, 2021)

colonialbrass said:


> Restoring an old Schwinn and the serial says it a 1950's Starlet,
> but the frame and chain guard do not match the 50s Starlet
> 
> View attachment 1498615View attachment 1498613
> ...



The serial does not tell you the model or how it was badged. Could have been anything from a base model to a full boogie Hollywood. Could have had any of several hundred different badges on it. All that is lost to time now. V/r Shawn


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