# 1936 Elgin Bluebird tear down



## rlhender

I am starting the restoration project on my BB after tearing down there were signs of blue paint so I guess I will go back with original color. I really like the blue better than the red. I did pick up the kickstand and a set of grips this week. I am still needing a rear rack, a few bands for the grips and a seat.
 I am looking for some help on what all is supposed to be chrome and what gets nickel. so if anyone has detailed pics it would be great. Or if you want to just list out what should be correct that would be good too.

Thanks


----------



## bike

*OUTSTANDING!!! and PIC OF SEISS HORN!*

YEEEAHHHAAWWw! 

Thank you!

That wasn't so hard.


----------



## catfish

Very Cool!!!! Keep use posted with photo updates.


----------



## THE STIG

it's easier to box now,, how much?


----------



## rlhender

THE STIG said:


> it's easier to box now,, how much?




I guess I would have to add about 10k for tear down labor plus shipping would make your grand total $NFS

But you know me stupid money buys anything..lol

Rick


----------



## THE STIG

???   $$$$$


----------



## rlhender

Anyone out there have info on the chrome parts for me? I would like to get parts out to this week


----------



## prewarbikes4sale

All chrome.


----------



## rlhender

prewarbikes4sale said:


> All chrome.




The speedo basket on rear wheel looks nickel, should it be chrome?


----------



## redline1968

Sweet... Bike. Crome the crank,rims, hubs, cups,bars,neck door knob. Cad the stand,drive gear(jealous), horn and possibly the bracket that holds the speedo.... Then stainless trim around the nose.


----------



## prewarbikes4sale

redline1968 said:


> Sweet... Bike. Crome the crank,rims, hubs, cups,bars,neck door knob. Cad the stand,drive gear(jealous), horn and possibly the bracket that holds the speedo.... Then stainless trim around the nose.




What he said


----------



## Dave K

You might want to see if you can get the red paint off and bring back the original finish.  Sometimes there is some really nice OG paint hiding under the rattle cap paint.


----------



## tailhole

super cool project!  Wow.


----------



## rlhender

Dave K said:


> You might want to see if you can get the red paint off and bring back the original finish.  Sometimes there is some really nice OG paint hiding under the rattle cap paint.




Looks like they stripped it down, paint has thick cracking down to bare metal, I saw signs of original paint behind headlight and under fenders

No chance to safe what's not there. 

Rick


----------



## Iverider

I'm sure you'll do it justice! Looks like a good core to start with! Nice meetin' ya this past weekend.


----------



## catfish

rlhender said:


> The speedo basket on rear wheel looks nickel, should it be chrome?




No. It should be Cad.


----------



## Iverider

Is there any Nickel on a bike this new?


----------



## redline1968

Krautwaggen said:


> Is there any Nickel on a bike this new?



Crome was the new nickel. Newest tech for that time.


----------



## ChicagoFlash

*36 Elgin*

Unique look i like it


----------



## rlhender

Does anyone know of anyone who can post some detailed pics of original paint bike? I would like to make sure I get all the paint details dialed in before I start.

Rick


----------



## Mikes bikes

*Mikes bikes*

That bluebird going look good !  Hello I'm mike . Enjoying your tear down, I'm wanting too get a bluebird going one day .i'm new on the cabe .I would like hear more about the bluebird ! Thanks,mike


----------



## HIGGINSFOREVER

If only I had a blue bird to send you pictures of the original paint.Good luck with your project


----------



## rlhender

*Base coat finished*

I got these parts back from paint today, next week the stripes will be on and everything is going to chrome shop tomorrow. Still looking for seat and rear rack. Also need a set of NOS 7/8" spoke nips, flat two sides if anyone has please let me know.

Thanks


----------



## Oldnut

*Nice*

Get them Rick a bike any a few of us will ever have,way out of my range phew


----------



## Djshakes

Did they paint the original fender rivets like that?


----------



## cyclingday

Djshakes said:


> Did they paint the original fender rivets like that?




 Nope!
 Major faux pas!


----------



## rlhender

Djshakes said:


> Did they paint the original fender rivets like that?




Not sure, maybe you should go outside and see if yours was painted like that or better yet lets call Sears and ask them. I decided to do it that way because I didn't want to damage a $2000 paint job installing "Reproduction" rivets in it.

Rick


----------



## Duchess

It's a beautiful color. Is that metallic? I'm a former car guy and not so knowledgeable about bikes, but I didn't think metallic paints were used much back then (or you don't care to be exactly correct, which is cool, I'm just curious).


----------



## 37fleetwood

Duchess said:


> It's a beautiful color. Is that metallic? I'm a former car guy and not so knowledgeable about bikes, but I didn't think metallic paints were used much back then (or you don't care to be exactly correct, which is cool, I'm just curious).




the bluebirds were available in metalic blue starting in 1937 as far as I know.


----------



## Tin machine

*simply beautifull*

wow !!! and wow love it bro !!! I am jealous great job


----------



## rlhender

Yes, it is a metallic paint, There were three options and we went with the one that showed the finest flakes, The pictures do not do this bike justice the paint looks great in person.

Thanks for the compliments and thanks to all the haters...lol


----------



## rlhender

Duchess said:


> It's a beautiful color. Is that metallic? I'm a former car guy and not so knowledgeable about bikes, but I didn't think metallic paints were used much back then (or you don't care to be exactly correct, which is cool, I'm just curious).





 copied from another post

The Color Option in 35 was French Blue with Red trim or Red with Ivory Trim. some with 36 but in the winter of 36-37 the blue changed from French blue to Opalescent Blue. then in Summer of 37 your color option was Blue with Red trim or Gunmetal with Black trim.


----------



## 37fleetwood

sorry I only have this one catalog showing the Bluebird. maybe someone else has the others. I wasn't bashing, it's a beautiful job you're doing!


----------



## rlhender

37fleetwood said:


> sorry I only have this one catalog showing the Bluebird. maybe someone else has the others. I wasn't bashing, it's a beautiful job you're doing!




Thanks for the info, I see it had a 1-1/2 volt dry cell Battery, where do I find one of those?

Rick


----------



## Iverider

Shipping weight 90 pounds??? Holy hell!! (Per the catalog)

Lookin' good. Hope to see it in person at the Hoosier swap this summer if you decide to bring it!


----------



## scrubbinrims

*Damned if you do, damned if you don't*

Personally, I would have removed the rivets as the end product would mimic the original look better.
That said, either way it isn't correct technically, but these decisions are yours.

I recently removed the rivets from a Blackhawk I am restoring (and ready for sale by the swaps) and I did so as the fenders were easier to polish without and I had a nicer set of stays to use.
In my opinion, better to have MLC rivet screws to gain nicer stays.
You gotta make tough calls like this and the critics later don't know all the circumstances.

Chris


----------



## mike j

Love that blue on your bird. Beautiful job. Looks like there is some red in the pigment, or it could be from the flash, either way great choice. Can't wait to see it all together.


----------



## Djshakes

rlhender said:


> Not sure, maybe you should go outside and see if yours was painted like that or better yet lets call Sears and ask them. I decided to do it that way because I didn't want to damage a $2000 paint job installing "Reproduction" rivets in it.
> 
> Rick




LOL

Rivets are rivets. Don't get sand in your vag over it, I was just asking out of curiosity. I maybe restoring one for a guy soon.

In fact, send me your fender and pay shipping both ways and I will install the proper rivets, as long as there isn't a skim coat of bondo under the fender that will crack.


----------



## Freqman1

rlhender said:


> Not sure, maybe you should go outside and see if yours was painted like that or better yet lets call Sears and ask them. I decided to do it that way because I didn't want to damage a $2000 paint job installing "Reproduction" rivets in it.
> 
> Rick




Damn Rick did you really pay $2k for a paint job? I remember back in the day only getting about $1k and maybe some car parts in trade for a decent paint job on a whole car. Looking sweet I can't wait to see it together. Are you going to bring it to MLC? V/r Shawn


----------



## redline1968

French blue was only color used late 35 then with red added in 36. Also the early French blue was a slightly different in color for the 1936 year. That's my understanding. Wow 2k ..1.5 k over my budget.


----------



## Larmo63

"Sand in your vag....."     Good one, Tim!

I give you props for:

a) restoring such an iconic bike
b) bringing the project before the bike sharks here

Good luck with it!!!!!

(I would drill out the rivets too)


----------



## cyclingday

Freqman1 said:


> Damn Rick did you really pay $2k for a paint job?
> 
> Yeah, and it's not even close to the right color. The Opalescent colors weren't introduced until the the Spring Summer catalog of 1937, and they didn't have any metallic flake in them at all.
> They were more like abalone shell in appearance.
> 
> I know this all sounds bad, and if it was a Luxury Liner nobody would care, but it doesn't get much better than an Elgin Bluebird, so with the price of the bike, and a two thousand dollar paint job on top of that, it just seems like a little research is in order, to get it as close to correctly restored as possible.
> 
> Now, if a full blown custom is what the goal is, then that is going to be an absolutely spectacular custom bicycle. No doubt about it!


----------



## rlhender

Freqman1 said:


> Damn Rick did you really pay $2k for a paint job? I remember back in the day only getting about $1k and maybe some car parts in trade for a decent paint job on a whole car. Looking sweet I can't wait to see it together. Are you going to bring it to MLC? V/r Shawn




Yes I did, The shop had 32 hrs in labor, they do all repairs the old way with a big hammer and no bondo build up.


----------



## rlhender

Djshakes said:


> LOL
> 
> Rivets are rivets. Don't get sand in your vag over it, I was just asking out of curiosity. I maybe restoring one for a guy soon.
> 
> In fact, send me your fender and pay shipping both ways and I will install the proper rivets, as long as there isn't a skim coat of bondo under the fender that will crack.




Vag....Really?  Make sure you introduce yourself to me at ML.....

Rick


----------



## tbone

I'm not knowledgeable enough to know rivets from nail heads, but the bike looks great.

"Sand in vag" shld be up for quote of the year....


----------



## rlhender

cyclingday said:


> Freqman1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Damn Rick did you really pay $2k for a paint job?
> 
> Yeah, and it's not even close to the right color. The Opalescent colors weren't introduced until the the Spring Summer catalog of 1937, and they didn't have any metallic flake in them at all.
> They were more like abalone shell in appearance.
> 
> I know this all sounds bad, and if it was a Luxury Liner nobody would care, but it doesn't get much better than an Elgin Bluebird, so with the price of the bike, and a two thousand dollar paint job on top of that, it just seems like a little research is in order, to get it as close to correctly restored as possible.
> 
> Now, if a full blown custom is what the goal is, then that is going to be an absolutely spectacular custom bicycle. No doubt about it!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Not even close? Maybe it was the lighting and flash in the picture that is throwing your judgment off? I did do research and the paint code was from someone who has painted many of the BB's and they have turned out just fine... It is what it is and that is Mine (Paid in Full)...Lets see more pics of 36 BB's so we can compare..
Click to expand...


----------



## THE STIG

i wouldn't take the rivets out now.........


----------



## rlhender

Larmo63 said:


> "Sand in your vag....."     Good one, Tim!
> 
> I give you props for:
> 
> a) restoring such an iconic bike
> b) bringing the project before the bike sharks here
> 
> Good luck with it!!!!!
> 
> (I would drill out the rivets too)




I want to make sure I am introduced to Sandy at ML
A) Thanks
B) Sharks or retired Sears employee's

I can always drill and paint the fenders as most of the cost was labor for repairs... It's only money and if I don't spend it my wife and son will ..lol

Rick


----------



## Djshakes

Wow, you really take stuff personal.  

And just what would you do if you met me? Kick my ass?  Yeah, that'll teach anyone not to mess with you on the internets!!! Relax a bit, you make yourself sound like a meat head. 

If you can't take criticism or expect people to fall all over themselves with praise on this site you are mistaken.  Hell, I even offered to rivet your fenders for free.


----------



## THE STIG




----------



## rlhender

Djshakes said:


> Wow, you really take stuff personal.
> 
> And just what would you do if you met me? Kick my ass?  Yeah, that'll teach anyone not to mess with you on the internets!!! Relax a bit, you make yourself sound like a meat head.
> 
> If you can't take criticism or expect people to fall all over themselves with praise on this site you are mistaken.  Hell, I even offered to rivet your fenders for free.[/
> 
> No meat head here, just like to meet people that I talk with here on the Cabe and try and gain as much knowledge as I can, only been messing with bikes for a few years and I like to meet people who have knowledge or at least think they do, after a personal meeting I can usually make a sound judgment weather I want to take their advise in the future or not.
> Sorry if I came across as being hasty, the Vag statement was a little wrong! Just my opinion.
> I will continue this thread with updated pics for those that are interested, Cad parts are on their way today and the Chrome parts should be done in about a month.
> Rick


----------



## Oldnut

*Phew*



Djshakes said:


> Wow, you really take stuff personal.
> 
> And just what would you do if you met me? Kick my ass?  Yeah, that'll teach anyone not to mess with you on the internets!!! Relax a bit, you make yourself sound like a meat head.
> 
> If you can't take criticism or expect people to fall all over themselves with praise on this site you are mistaken.  Hell, I even offered to rivet your fenders for free.




Time for the (keyboard Muhammad Ali's) to take a break it's a privilege to watch somebody to restore a mega dollar bike.other than a 100% original bike you can pick a restoration apart stripes wrong angle,wrong color,stem is wrong------this is all about fun,I've worked on cars that have won at pebble beach,so what---


----------



## Djshakes

Sorry for misunderstanding.

Look, you have a top flight bike here that you put a lot of money, time, effort and pride into.  Like Marty said, this isn't some common bike.  Sitting here picking apart what nut or bolt should be chromed or cad is a little much, however, I feel the fender rivets being painted is a major distraction and an easy fix.  Most amateur paint jobs done in a garage have rivets painted over because the restorer didn't have the resources or will to do it the right way.  THIS CLEARLY IS NOT ONE OF THOSE BIKES.  

Is drilling out the rivets risky, sure, if you don't take your time.  The only concern would be that they painted the fender attached to the fender, so the inside top of the brace wouldn't be paint, so you would have to get it to line up exactly before riveting or repaint the top.  

Coincidentally, I just repainted a section of a bluebird fender in that exact color.  On the underside of the front flair there was some bondo cracking and the owner wanted it perfect.  A car place painted it and often they use bondo as they don't have fender rollers.  Base coat/clear coat is very easy to work with and I painted and blended the section quite easily. So this could be done on your brace if need be.  

The paint job on your bike looks flawless.  Don't stop at 99% and have a glaring 1% staring you in the eye.  If you have a riveter I can even send you a couple rivets free of charge.


----------



## rlhender

Can someone post some stripe pics on a BB, would like to see original and restored.. What ya got? Mine goes Tuesday and would like to have some good examples to use.

Thanks


----------



## scrubbinrims

For the alleged amount of bluebirds in collections and being out of the "rare" classification, I cannot think of many in the bluebird club on this site (I think it is about 6).
Chris


----------



## redline1968

scrubbinrims said:


> For the alleged amount of bluebirds in collections and being out of the "rare" classification, I cannot think of many in the bluebird club on this site (I think it is about 6).
> Chris
> View attachment 139756




?????????? Bfd club?


----------



## redline1968

Here are a couple pics off the web not mine. They are claimed as originals.


----------



## Obi-Wan Schwinnobi

redline1968 said:


> Here are a couple pics off the web not mine. They are claimed as originals.




Isn't the grey one from copake?.. Supposed to be og but in fact is a resto...


----------



## redline1968

No idea. Just grabbed them of the web as references. Sweet looking for a not so rare bike.


----------



## cyclingday

rlhender said:


> Can someone post some stripe pics on a BB, would like to see original and restored.. What ya got? Mine goes Tuesday and would like to have some good examples to use.
> 
> Thanks




 My bike is Nates old barn find, and the trim detail is pretty obliterated. It's a fairly simple scheme though, so it shouldn't be too hard to duplicate. The picture of Chris's Redbird is a great example. 
I did notice that on his bike, the trim color does not fill out the embossed rib on the tank all the way, and on my bike it just about fills the entire rib area.
 The picture of the Greybird shows a thin pin stripe surrounding the painted rib. If that is in fact a resto, then I would discount that detail. It's hard to tell on my bike, but it doesn't look like it ever had a pin stripe around the rib.The fender stripe is about 3/16"ths wide or just shy of 1/4"  It runs 1/2" from the edge and follows the embossed spear on the tip of the front fender, But it does not run against its edge. The stripe is about 3/8"ths away from the stamped edge, and comes to a point 3 1/2" from the tip.


----------



## redline1968

Looking at a few more pics believe the small outlining pin stripe is correct. Seems this detail keeps showing up. The door on the red one is odd so I'm not sure if it's a orig paint.


----------



## rlhender

Thanks guy, this helps

Rick


----------



## cyclingday

The biggest mistake that you can make when restoring a bike, is by looking at other restored bikes.
That's how erroneous information keeps getting perpetuated.
Recently, some guys out here reproduced the 37/39 Schwinn brake lever, and the used a restored one as their example. The sample lever had been ground and polished down during the re chroming process, and the thickness guage was way thinner than the originals. Every flaw that the restored lever had, showed up in the reproductions.

Look at as many original paint bikes as you can, and don't even look at restored bikes, because you can just about guarantee that 99% of them are wrong.
Remember the game in Kindergarten where the teacher whispers in one kids ear, and by the time it gets around the room, it's completely changed?

Creative license is Human ature, and everybody wants to change it, to make it just a little better than it was before. Now, whether or not the tank rib pin stripe is og or not, I have no idea. It may be a production year thing. My bike is a 37, and it's still all original, and as near as I can tell, it never had the pin stripe around the tank rib. I could be wrong on this, and in fact I'm sure that I am. That is why you need to look at as many original paint bikes as you can so that you can get a concensus what what is truly correct.

I'm sure, there were minor differences between 35,36 & 37 So take that into consideration as well.


----------



## scrubbinrims

My original "BFD" redbird has not a trace of pinstripe around the rib...anywhere.

This can lead to 3 different conclusions...

#1 It was present in all bluebirds and at some time was cleaned off along the entire circumference and on both sides.
Keep in mind, I cleaned it conservatively and it was well preserved as you can see.

#2 Is as Marty suggested in that is was present during a particular season/edition.
Mine has both a '35 (produced) and '36 (released) serial number.

#3 Never had it ever and appears only in clones.

Personally, I would not add it...can be added later if you like much easier than being removed down the road.
Chris


----------



## rockabillyjay

I have a bunch of pictures of this one if you need them..all original.


----------



## fordmike65

rockabillyjay said:


> I have a bunch of pictures of this one if you need them..all original.
> 
> View attachment 139881




Damn that's a Beaut!


----------



## redline1968

Wow  great bikes red ,blue, gray whatever color... Now that gets me juiced up..restored or not they are f----k'n awesome   So you add 2 k to a original who cares... they are just the best work of art on the planet  bar none in my opinion.  Just that Im not into cliques hate them and always will.


----------



## rlhender

rockabillyjay said:


> I have a bunch of pictures of this one if you need them..all original.
> 
> View attachment 139881




Yes please as many detailed pics as you can offer would be great. Add here or my email is rick.henderson@bluelinxco.com

Thanks


----------



## bikecrazy

Great bike! Did they ever come with chainguards? Were they built for Sears by Murray? Just curious because Murrays were built in my hometown of Cleveland.


----------



## scrubbinrims

bikecrazy said:


> Great bike! Did they ever come with chainguards? Were they built for Sears by Murray? Just curious because Murrays were built in my hometown of Cleveland.




First of all, real men don't eat quiche (I hope this cliche' doesn't upset redline) or need chainguards, secondly, no...made by Westfield exclusively.
Chris


----------



## redline1968

scrubbinrims said:


> First of all, real men don't eat quiche (I hope this cliche' doesn't upset redline) or need chainguards, secondly, no...made by Westfield exclusively.
> Chris




Only if I have to eat it.  :0


----------



## rlhender

Here are a few updated pics for the Sharks....

Rick


----------



## DonChristie

Wow! Thats lookin really good! What else have you got to do?


----------



## Oldnut

*Bluebird*

Looking great nice to see it coming along


----------



## rlhender

schwinndoggy said:


> Wow! Thats lookin really good! What else have you got to do?




All chrome will be done middle of next month, spoke the wheels and put it together. Still looking for seat and rear rack for it.

Thanks


----------



## Lawrence Ruskin

Man, that' going to be a beautiful bike...


----------



## DonChristie

So I was thinking to myself, Self, why not post my Elgin Bluebird shirts for sale thread here. Everyone who reads this thread likes Bluebirds, right? Just to keep it legit, every shirt sold from this post on, I will contribute a dollar to rlhender's Elgin build. This way you can show support and own a shirt!
http://thecabe.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?55435-Elgin-Bluebird-shirts


----------



## cyclingday

It's looking super good, Rick.
The lighting in this set of pictures is much better.
I still don't think that the opalescent color was available until the Spring of 37, so if your bike is a 36, it should have been the opaque French Blue.
But what you have there, is definitely fantastic!
Thanks for braving the shark infested waters, and sharing the progress of your spectacular 1936 Elgin Bluebird. 
It truly doesn't get much better than that!


----------



## rlhender

schwinndoggy said:


> So I was thinking to myself, Self, why not post my Elgin Bluebird shirts for sale thread here. Everyone who reads this thread likes Bluebirds, right? Just to keep it legit, every shirt sold from this post on, I will contribute a dollar to rlhender's Elgin build. This way you can show support and own a shirt!
> http://thecabe.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?55435-Elgin-Bluebird-shirts





Thanks but better yet, lets just say if someone wants a shirt, just say you saw the post on Rlhender's BB post and you keep the funds to design more shirts or maybe add HENDERSON to the back of mine..

Thanks Rick


----------



## vincev

I was by Rick and saw the bike.WOW! Top of the line paint job!


----------



## rlhender

Cad parts are done, chrome should be done on the 15th.. Still looking for seat, rear rack and 7/8" flat 2 sided nips

Rick


----------



## prewarbikes4sale

rlhender said:


> Cad parts are done, chrome should be done on the 15th.. Still looking for seat, rear rack and 7/8" flat 2 sided nips
> 
> Rick




Cool pic! You can send those to me they would look great on my shelf!


----------



## rlhender

prewarbikes4sale said:


> Cool pic! You can send those to me they would look great on my shelf!




Ha Ha right next to a couple leafspring seats and a rear rack knowing you......lol


----------



## rlhender

a few updated pics of the BB... Still looking for seat and rear rack


----------



## vincev

Its stunning Rick!


----------



## rlhender

vincev said:


> Its stunning Rick!




Thanks...How is Tank doing?


----------



## mike j

Holy Cannoli ! Now that's a bicycle.


----------



## cyclingday

Super, Aledocious!


----------



## vincev

Hey Rick.I have taken a break from the rescue for the summer  after Tank.Last I heard he was with a trainer and there was an interested couple.


----------

