# Prewar Cwc Tall Tank Questions



## mrg (Feb 8, 2016)

Got a couple of questions, anybody have any pics or info on CWC 1941 tall tank (Western Flyer or Roadmaster version) was always told (from Phil I think) WF had different rack & chain guard, like mine but the only pic I can find (Nostalga.net) (just got a phone call about this, sorry for the delay,now I can finish editing) (besides Bob Feller ad) that WF pic have Roadmaster parts so any other pics or ligature, I got the correct lite, bars, fenderbraces & seat not on yet, second question what year did CWC s notched plate screwed to springer switch to notches actually in back of springer


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## dogdart (Feb 9, 2016)

I believe this one is Nates



 
I'm almost done gathering parts for mine,  I had a nice dropstand,  but used it on my Hawthorne


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## dogdart (Feb 9, 2016)




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## dogdart (Feb 9, 2016)

here's another tall tank  
restored, looks like a Snyder  chainring


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## mrg (Feb 9, 2016)

These all seem to be WF badged, I have seen them with both style racks and always thought that different badged (Roadmaster/WF), had a particular rack, would like to see some literature, mine is a old restoration and don't know if they ever came with that chain guard, anyone seen one on these bikes, I have the correct fender braces for it but just noticed the front fender is not a springer version, hard to tell from pic of the yellow bike but looks like its not a springer fender also (with square dent for rubber), well I have seen the first pic before, but not the others so i've saw more here than in the 25 yrs I have owned it and just talked to someone that has a catalog with it in it. Thanks


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## dogdart (Feb 9, 2016)

I have the originalfront fender still. unfortunately it was missing the guard when found,  so I can't say for sure what it was born with


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## mrg (Feb 11, 2016)

Fellow caber Jaf/co sent me this from 41 Roadmaster and would like to compare to a 41 Western Flyer catalog pic if anyone has one. Is the first one (Nate's) original paint, rims looks like my repaint, WF?, this Roadmaster catalog says chrome?


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## dogdart (Feb 11, 2016)

mrg said:


> View attachment 284507




note the 1/2 inch  pitch chainring that was available in 1941 , but didn't reappear until well into the 1950's


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## dogdart (Feb 11, 2016)

I've seen  the pod style rack  used as early as 1940 on Snyder built bicycles  . CWC and Snyder often used parts from the other,  apparently to meet vendor contracts.  The rack with the reflectors in front seems to show up on later CWC bikes.  ???


the serial on mine  is high in the J prefix, probably built mid 1941 .
I've seen the other style rack on some CWCs , including the one in Evolution of the Bicycle  book claiming to be a 42 . 

   perhaps with war imminent , they used all. available parts ?


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## JAF/CO (Feb 11, 2016)

I have no info on this bike /not mine


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## mrg (Feb 11, 2016)

Dogdart you mentioned 1st bike was possibly Nate's, any more info ?, OG paint ?, as far as the racks, CWC and Snyder used the same parts when they were supplying the same distributed like Wards and both making the same model.


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## szathmarig (Feb 11, 2016)

dogdart said:


> note the 1/2 inch  pitch chainring that was available in 1941 , but didn't reappear until well into the 1950's



My tall tank Roadmaster has the non skip tooth 1/2 inch  pitch chainring.


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## cyclingday (Feb 11, 2016)

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## mrg (Feb 11, 2016)

Great pic Marty, you can really see the 1/2 pitch sprocket and the Royal masters, don't think I have ever seen the Western Flyer style in 1/2 and probably had Western Auto tires, still like to know correct WF chain guard, is there any WF literature or pics out there?, mine # is K9 so probably late 41.


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## dogdart (Feb 12, 2016)

mrg , your serial number is exactly what I expected,  based on other examples with that rack,  I believe it's likely original. 

A couple of theories I have are that stamping plants may have switched over to war production earlier and supplies ran out , so they used the pod rack , which would have been in house  for Hawthorne models , to supply bikes that were advertised to have twin lights  . The other possibilitie is that the pod rack  was to be the top rack for 1942 .


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## dogdart (Feb 12, 2016)

Here are some pics ofmy original paint 1942 A2 serial Roadmaster .

note the enclosed chainguard was still in use . Also  note the painted wheels and truss rods,  as materials for chrome plate where unavailable.  
Also I believe the  Hawthorne chainring to be original equipment,  as supplies dwindled and whatever was on hand was used to  crank out bikes


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## mrg (Feb 12, 2016)

I was always told the pod rack was just on the WF version (WF chainring also) and Roadmaster had the longer rack (any pics of a RM with pod rack) still trying to document if both used enclosed guard, sense my front fender is not the springer version who know what was changed years ago or different parts (chainguard) used in wartime shortage, if the bike you thought might Nate's is og maybe WF version was exactly the same except badging, chainring and tires (who knows about wartime shortages) and the racks changed because of yr (41/42) or shortage.


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## dogdart (Feb 12, 2016)

I am fairly certain that all the parts that that were on mine.other than wheels , seat , and chainring,  were original to the bike . the layersof paint  are consistent down to the original maroon.  my bikewas probably built 4 months  before yours


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## dogdart (Feb 12, 2016)

http://ratrodbikes.com/forum/index.php?threads/1941-western-flyer.26888/

original thread on RRB site for Nate's bike

also found this on Dave's site 
not enough resolution


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## dogdart (Feb 12, 2016)

more info 

http://thecabe.com/forum/threads/pre-war-western-flyer.2338/


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## dogdart (Feb 12, 2016)




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## dogdart (Feb 12, 2016)




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## mrg (Feb 13, 2016)

Thanks dogdart, that and other threads (Phil) is where I got some of my info years ago and talked to Phil on the phone about it also and even he was not sure about my chain guard, as far as that ad, the last bike is hard to tell if its a tall tank but blowing it up the chain guard looks possibly like mine (curved stripes)and rack (curves up to seat clamp) like Roadmaster?


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## dogdart (Feb 14, 2016)

one that  Nick had for sale 
Western Flyer badged 
WF chainring


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## dogdart (Feb 14, 2016)

here's a girls 41 Western Flyer from bicyclebills page . 
air foil rack , painted wheels. 
no other info


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## dogdart (Feb 14, 2016)

another 41 girls WF
http://thecabe.com/forum/threads/pre-war-1941-ladies-western-flyer-new-find.14806/


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## mrg (Feb 14, 2016)

Looks like the first WF girls has the same chain guard as mine & painted wheels but a Roadmaster chainring, the second one has the longer version of that chain guard, maybe just before the war the used a mix of parts, well mine could be correct except front fender & braces.


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## juanitasmith13 (Feb 14, 2016)

FYI for your info: this guard is on e-bay... 4 more days; appears to be the 'shorter' version.    http://www.ebay.com/itm/western-fly...597289?hash=item3d11ada369:g:qKMAAOSwPc9Wv8Bm


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## mrg (Feb 14, 2016)

Post war version, Thanks anyway, think I have a pre war one but still don't know if mine didn't come with whats on it.


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## THEGOLDENGREEK (Feb 16, 2016)

Here are the only 2 pics I got of this model might help you out looks all original!


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## nateyboy (Apr 17, 2016)

Adding my newly acquired Western Flyer to the mix. Original and complete minus the dropstand and headlight lens. Dirty and crusty, but solid with no rot. Serial number forthcoming.


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## mrg (Apr 18, 2016)

Cool crusty rider (with a little work) can tell from pics, does the lite have the W and wing on it


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## bikeyard (May 7, 2016)

WF


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## ram.1950 (May 7, 2016)

Hey DogDart - this is the 1941 Huffman Built Western Flyer in your Western Auto Sale Flyer. Ironically it has a Shockmaster Fork and also the little rubber bumper fastened to the front springer that sits in an indentation in the front fender. I didn't like that set up - as the Shockmaster would absorb bumps the fender would move. By the time you stopped it could be a couple inches of travel away from the bumper. I eventually sold it intact and the new owner was elated.








This has nothing to do with the subject but it is a 1941 CWC Western Flyer. A little strange - Phil told me they must have run out of regular production sprockets for this bike because the chain ring that is often associated with the Roadmaster Cycle truck is what they put on this girls bike.


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## whizzer kid (May 13, 2017)

Good information here fellows , I have been looking for prewar Western flyer information. This has helped but still would like to know about the correct rear reflector for my bike would have been?  As seen in 1st picture my bike, with obviously the wrong rear reflector. Other pictures are the glass one I wanted and thought looked correct???

 Please let me know any book that might be out there on these WF/CWC,


mrg said:


> These all seem to be WF badged, I have seen them with both style racks and always thought that different badged (Roadmaster/WF), had a particular rack, would like to see some literature, mine is a old restoration and don't know if they ever came with that chain guard, anyone seen one on these bikes, I have the correct fender braces for it but just noticed the front fender is not a springer version, hard to tell from pic of the yellow bike but looks like its not a springer fender also (with square dent for rubber), well I have seen the first pic before, but not the others so i've saw more here than in the 25 yrs I have owned it and just talked to someone that has a catalog with it in it. Thanks



bikes too. Definitely not as much info out there as shwinn and other makes .


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## whizzer kid (May 13, 2017)

Bummer, people must be busy enjoying the nice weather


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## dogdart (Apr 16, 2018)

Another girls WF has showed up on the Bookface


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## ZE52414 (Jun 26, 2018)

Trying to find info on the one I have coming to me as well. It may be one that was pictures earlier in this thread. Not 100% sure. Kinda excited about this non Schwinn.


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## juanitasmith13 (Jun 27, 2018)

ZE52414 said:


> View attachment 829857 View attachment 829858 View attachment 829859 View attachment 829860 View attachment 829861 Trying to find info on the one I have coming to me as well. It may be one that was pictures earlier in this thread. Not 100% sure. Kinda excited about this non Schwinn.




NICE!!!     CWC


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## fordmike65 (Jun 27, 2018)

ZE52414 said:


> View attachment 829857 View attachment 829858 View attachment 829859 View attachment 829860 View attachment 829861 Trying to find info on the one I have coming to me as well. It may be one that was pictures earlier in this thread. Not 100% sure. Kinda excited about this non Schwinn.



I believe these were offered only one year, 1941. I'm sure @mrg can add more info.


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## JAF/CO (Jun 27, 2018)

1941


James Frazier (209) 481-9464
jfkiller53@aol.com


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## Kickstand3 (Jun 28, 2018)

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## ZE52414 (Jun 28, 2018)

Mine showed up today and having one hell of a time with the seat post. Not good! Other than that its pretty killer


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## Wes Holbrook (Aug 26, 2018)

dogdart said:


> View attachment 285497 one that  Nick had for sale
> Western Flyer badged
> WF chainring



What happened to this frame and tank?!??!!


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## dogdart (Jan 9, 2020)

Yet another has surfaced


Any more?


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## fordmike65 (Jan 9, 2020)

dogdart said:


> Yet another has surfacedView attachment 1121699
> Any more?



@THEGOLDENGREEK came across one recently.


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## Balloonoob (Jan 9, 2020)

dogdart said:


> Yet another has surfacedView attachment 1121699
> Any more?



Did you ever get the yellow paint off your bike?


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## THEGOLDENGREEK (Jan 10, 2020)

Nice find and yes Mike I did find one as well!


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## dogdart (Jan 10, 2020)

Balloonoob said:


> Did you ever get the yellow paint off your bike?



 Am nearly finished, have to lace front wheel still


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## Balloonoob (Jan 10, 2020)

dogdart said:


> Am nearly finished, have to lace front wheel stillView attachment 1121942



Oh wow. Was that awesome reverse paint job hiding under all that yellow? Looks awesome!


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## dogdart (Jan 10, 2020)

Balloonoob said:


> Oh wow. Was that awesome reverse paint job hiding under all that yellow? Looks awesome!



Unfortunately, no. 
No paint could be saved. 
A donor ladies 41 "A" and some magic provide the illusion


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## dogdart (Jan 20, 2020)




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## dogdart (Apr 15, 2020)

Current progress of mine , and a couple an Instagram friend sharred with me


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## mrg (Apr 15, 2020)

Looks great, seems like all the OG ones are Maroon/cream ( opalescent or opaque ) any other og paint colors out there, any color under that rust @nateyboy, I still have that repaint I stated this thread with, I'd like to try a different color but OG.


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## dogdart (Apr 15, 2020)

mrg said:


> Looks great, seems like all the OG ones are Maroon/cream ( opalescent or opaque ) any other og paint colors out there, any color under that rust @nateyboy, I still have that repaint I stated this thread with, I'd like to try a different color but OG.



The one I'm working on now, was also maroon , unfortunately it had two repaints and no OG paint left


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## mrg (Oct 10, 2020)

Just wondering how many of these Tall Tanks have a horn, seems like most don't but found this old ad here?https://thecabe.com/forum/threads/prewar-roadmaster.34787/


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## dogdart (Oct 20, 2020)

Also of note,  the bike is not equipped with the Shockmaster fork .
 The catalog lists they came with horn in tank , but both my WFs do not have a horn


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## Sharke (Oct 7, 2021)

The last picture originally with no-cleaning/ rust removed.I believe this is the same bike in his forum other than mine has a few oddities.Like first the color second mine has a horn(not working yet).I am missing springs, the front forks, and the front head light.I have the front rim and fender it is on it now but this is older picture. Also another oddity is the badge says Packard and not western flyer.And as far as my knowledge on it goes, everything is original.


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## mrg (Oct 7, 2021)

@Sharke, I have only seen Tall Tanks with WF or Roadmaster badge, any sign of a name on either side of the tank, on the white between the lines?


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## Sharke (Oct 8, 2021)

No name or anything to signify what it called on tank that I can see.I also looked inside no letter or marking to tell me what it called.


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## mrg (Oct 8, 2021)

Surprised there is not even a faint outline on the tank, if it were sold as a Packard maybe they didn't have a Packard decal.


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## TieDye (Oct 9, 2021)

dogdart said:


> I believe this one is Nates
> 
> View attachment 284063
> I'm almost done gathering parts for mine,  I had a nice dropstand,  but used it on my Hawthorne
> View attachment 284066



Those are Roadmaster chainguards.


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## mrg (Oct 9, 2021)

Seems like the earlier WF versions came with the ribbed guard ( 3 versions short, long & chrome ) and the bobbed rack but later the enclosed style guards also came on WF versions as did the longer rack, I think wartime shortages were kicking in and the just used what they had.


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## dogdart (Jan 25, 2022)

I didn't get the serial number on the maroon one , but some things of note on it are the Standard paint scheme and the tank is equipped with a horn 



It is Roadmaster badged


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## mrg (Jan 25, 2022)

dogdart said:


> View attachment 284966



The only other one I've seen with a standard paint scheme you posted here 6 yrs ago, both have 1 color tanks!, wonder if it had a horn to?, the first bike you posted has a all chrome headlight & standard fork also.


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## mrg (Jan 25, 2022)

Don't know why sometimes when when you "Quote" it shows the pic and sometimes just the link to the Pic?


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## tobytyler (Jan 26, 2022)

1941 prewar roadmaster


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## mrg (Jan 26, 2022)

Nice but not a Tall tank that this thread is about!


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## dogdart (May 1, 2022)

A couple more surfaced at ML


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## dogdart (May 5, 2022)

Another maroon and cream WF.
Interesting that the tank has provisions for a horn but appears the button hole was factory deleted. 





Seial  K97508 , puts it pretty late in production before war shut down


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## dogdart (May 24, 2022)

A couple more surfaced on Facebook without tanks


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