# Mead Crusader



## ohdeebee (Oct 28, 2011)

Just got this today. I can't find any info on a Mead Crusader. The crank is dated '36, the frame looks like a '37 or '38 and the Morrow hub is a C2 sooo... 1933? I added the seat and bars which I know are incorrect but they'll do for now. Front fender has two holes, probably for a Torpedo light. Fork has hole for a lock, but no lock, at an angle. Anybody have any input?


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## hzqw2l (Oct 28, 2011)

*Nice*

Looks like a Schwinn boys standard Model C.   

Dummy tank without battery or electronics. 

Had a tank like that once.

Cool bike.


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## ohdeebee (Oct 28, 2011)

I figured it was based off of a C model. The tank has holes for a horn on the left side. Does anybody have any pics of an original?


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## Xcelsior (Oct 28, 2011)

*37 dx*

Looks like it could be a first year 37 dx model.  Now I know what you're alll thinking, dx models came out in 39... This is true for the double curved frame style we all know and refer to as dx.  But if you look in the catalog you will find that the first models were actually straight tube versions made in 37 more the December sales into 38 with this style frame and tank.  Very similar to a c model but with curved downtube.  Meads line of dx models were commonly badged as crusaders and challengers.  Or maybe not.


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## J.C. (Oct 28, 2011)

*BC*

*If she has the hole in the tank for a horn button, it is a BC Model.  Schwinn Built Mead badged.  Nice bike*


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## Xcelsior (Oct 29, 2011)

*I still say 37 dx model*

Bc mods had different style tank... More like a smooth tank(motorbike). This one here is c model tank.  Check your catalog an you will see the bike I am referring to.  there is even a corresponding letter from 1937 in the catalog explaining the dx models quality. 1937 d97x


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## J.C. (Oct 29, 2011)

*One Too Many*



Xcelsior said:


> Bc mods had different style tank... More like a smooth tank(motorbike). This one here is c model tank.  Check your catalog an you will see the bike I am referring to.  there is even a corresponding letter from 1937 in the catalog explaining the dx models quality. 1937 d97x




*I stand corrected.  Can't a man have a few.....cases of beer after a hard weeks work being Mr. Mom and then go playing on a bicycle forum with the big boys???*


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## ohdeebee (Oct 30, 2011)

*downtube*

The D97X models have a straight downtube. This bike has a curved downtube.


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## Xcelsior (Oct 30, 2011)

*Serial number will tell*

That is true, the 37 models did have a straight downtube.  But what about in 38 or 39?  My guess is that in 38 or 39, when mead cycle supply was buying up left over parts to produce their own models, as they were known to do which is why most of their models are dated one year later, they ended up with what you have there.  By that time the new Schwinn d97x models were in production and consisted of straight downtube double curved bar frames in 39.  I am only guessing this because this was the nature of frame progression.  If you look at motorbikes from 35/36 to 37/38, you will see the same thing.  If you look at bc models from 37/38 to 39/40 you will see the same thing.  So, by all this information, you can basically place your bike there.  What is the serial number?  Does it start with a B,C, or even D?


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## ohdeebee (Oct 31, 2011)

Serial number is B55235


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## bricycle (Oct 31, 2011)

Cool score! After reading RMS37's review, it does make sense that this is probably closer to 1940..... oh well-


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## RMS37 (Oct 31, 2011)

*Rarer than a Girl’s BPH?*

With all the talk about the rarity and potential value of the Girl’s Blue Phantom, a limited edition color and trim variant of a common frame, this bike is not getting its due!

This blend of “C” and “D” models does not appear in the collected catalogs, brochures, and factory letters of the Hurd book and without documentation, it is hard to know what designation Schwinn may have given it or the actual year of production.

I doubt this frame is as early as 1936 because although curved down tubes were offered beginning in 1936 on the top of the line Autocycle frames, they were something of a “trickle-down” feature, not reaching the DX line until 1940. 

My original guess was that this was a Schwinn frame variant designed to use up an overstock of C-model tanks after that standard frame had been generally discontinued (1936 and 1937 with the tank, depicted through 1939 without the tank.) The C model tank also appears on the earliest DX frames of late 37 (and assumedly early 1938) but this frame is a dinosaur with straight seat stays (hints of Moto-Balloon B-9/10 about it.)

Using the “lets get rid of old stock” explanation and placing the build in late 1939/1940/1941 would explain the anachronism of the early tank on what is essentially a 1940 style DX frame with a straight rather than curved lower top tube. The Mead name on the bike would cause me to place it later rather than earlier in this time line because Mead was generally known as Schwinn’s closet cleaner.

Based on all of that, my inclination was to date the bike to approximately 1940 or maybe 1941.

The serial number is the best source for narrowing things down against pure deduction and speculation of course those numbers are not truly available in factory purity so it still gives up to some speculation. 

By the table I have found, the serial number B55235 could be for either 1937 or 1939 depending on the font size of the stamping, earlier bikes using a small font and later bikes using what was essentially the same size as postwar units.

If I am correct in my date assumption for this frame then the saddle may be fairly appropriate for the bike and if you are searching for a Mead style tubular rack for this bike I believe the frame is too late to use one.


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## ohdeebee (Oct 31, 2011)

Thanks Phil! That is a lot of info the think about. I must apologize, I misheard when the serial number was read to me. Here is a photo of the actual number. It looks like the same font size as post war models, which, according to what you said would make it later. I am having an absolute bear of a time trying to figure out what exactly this bike is, not to mention what parts should be on it. Something else odd about this bike is that it has factory rivets where the drop stand holes would have been. I can tell from the paint wear that the there was a chainguard and rack on this bike at one time. Which rack should I be looking for? Which guard should I be looking for?

My '39 DX is numbered C09603 for comparison.


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## Xcelsior (Oct 31, 2011)

*mead cycle supply*



ohdeebee said:


> Serial number is B55235




That plces it as a 39 frame.  If your looking for it and a sales model in a catalog, try a mead cycle supply from 1939-1940.  That is if you can find one.  Based off of all the other similarities with the dx line( the name crusader, fenders, seat, being a base model blah blan blah) you might find it under that type of model.  I think your frame could very well be a tall frame as well... which would explain the size and measurements of the rear stays and seat tube.  good luck.


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## RMS37 (Oct 31, 2011)

Back to my reference chart, “D” moves the bike up to 1940. I hope that someone with access to Mead catalogs for that period will take note and post on this one. As the bike is likely one of a batch put together to clean house, I would be inclined to build it out with similar equipment to a basic 39 DX if you can’t find a clear reference picture for this specific model.


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## ohdeebee (Oct 31, 2011)

I guess I'm still confused about this bike. So its a C-Model frame built with leftover parts as a DX by Mead in 1940? I have a nice red/creme '39 guard (correct for the DX) I can put on it. Possibly a 9 hole rack?


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## Xcelsior (Oct 31, 2011)

*Parts*

D is late 39 to early 40 so let's not confuse build date to sales/catalog date. They are different. But being a mead it most likely was sold in 1940.  I've had 39 dx's with D and other 40 bikes with D so you should be close there.  Mead cycle supply did use  9 hole racks as well on basic models.  Even some of the lesser model rangers had 9 hole racks.  So staying with the "build close to 39-40 dx" idea would work.  The dx style hockey stick guard was used by mead also.  So that too would work.  But again, it's your bike!


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## RMS37 (Oct 31, 2011)

This bike is not really a C-model or a DX, but shares similarities with both. Schwinn model naming conventions make the best sense if they tell you what they called the model and you can say “oh yes, I can see the logic in that.” Going in the other direction it impossible to know for certain what a model designation is through plain deduction and without literature.  

This frame has characteristics of a 1940 DX combined with the tank aperture of an earlier “C” frame. As there were B/C models, I would sensibly call this one a C/D but If Schwinn did name it they may have come at it from a completely different angle. 

Mead purchased frames manufactured by Schwinn (and others) and they were painted and finished specifically by or for Mead but typically the base frames were no different from those offered in-house by Schwinn and to other distributors. Mead did still have a fair (but dwindling) market share when this bike was produced so the frame may be part of a unique batch order produced by Schwinn solely for Mead consumption but it is reasonably likely that the same frame was produced and will turn up in branded and in the livery of Schwinn or that of other Schwinn distributors.


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## ohdeebee (Oct 31, 2011)

I would like to build as close to original as possible. If originals were equipped with different parts depending on what was available, I guess I have quite a bit of leeway as far as that goes. I'll probably put the '39 feather guard on it. At least for now and probably go with a Mead rack since they seem much more readily available than a prewar 9 hole. For now, I look at these parts simply as place takers until I can determine how exactly this bike should be equipped. It is a tall frame so it rides really nice and actually fits an adult which is a nice change of pace.


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## RMS37 (Oct 31, 2011)

Xcelsior said:


> D is late 39 to early 40 so let's not confuse build date to sales/catalog date. They are different.




Serial-number-wise you must be referencing a different chart than the one I have (which is based on someone else’s work and or observations and not my own.) The chart I have been using lists serial numbers A-C10999 as 1939 production numbers and C11000-E53499 as 1940.


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## GenuineRides (Oct 31, 2011)

*numbers shmumbers*

Without a definitive list from Schwinn that states C10999 was built on 12/31/1939 we are all guessing.  Looking at the characteristics and parts used and I think the date range of late '39 to early '40 is fairly accurate and appropriate.  And is it really important one year or the other?  Was there really a definitive split?  Car companies did and still do the same thing, they overlap model years, have transition styles, use up older parts etc. and have inaccuracies in their catalogs.  How many '68 Krates have you seen with the drum brake that is shown in the catalog??? ..check the picture closely sometime.  Again this has been discussed before too, in a manufacturing world the day the frame is stamped (when still raw) isn't the day it leaves the warehouse, nor is it necessarily even the week or month it's built, boxed and invoiced or even close to the day it is shipped.  With the case of Mead, the frame could have been produced in November, even missed the x-mas season bikes which were typically being produced in August/September for pre-orders, and may have not hit the dealer or streets until February.  And especially since Mead was the occasional "clean-up crew" for many of Schwinn's inventory. To put this into perspective, this frame could have been welded early with many others, sat in a parts room for months, then pulled as part of a package deal and slapped together with parts from any of the numerous bins available.  Remember, this was the late 30's and Schwinn was selling bikes fast and furious, and probably making money fast and furious too at $35 a bike.  Sure they were putting them out quick, but inventory control wasn't as lean as it may be today, and I'm sure some areas were rather crude, unorganized, and haphazard.  They were just trying to get what they could get out as fast as possible.  Frames could be stuck in a warehouse for weeks or months while a more "current" and desirable model was getting more attention and receiving more orders, so they were pushed to the front of the producton schedule.

I even go back to a frined of mine who owned a Schwinn store in the 70's.  He wanted a parade bike to advertise his store so he called Schwinn and ordered a Mini-Twinn frame in the early 70's when he first bought the store...but they were only made in 1968...he got his frame (they had inventory) with a 1968 serial number and in red!  They never made one in red, but he ordered it that way, showed up decaled correctly with '70's seats too and no fenders.  I think I still have pics of it with the orange flocked fenders he put on it later.  Probably the rarest mini-Twinn you will ever encounter!  Is it a '68 or is it a '71?  Goes to show that serial numbers are a great guide to narrow the range, but not perfect.

GenuineRides


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## ohdeebee (Oct 31, 2011)

I agree it is not the most important thing to narrow it down to the exact date of production or even year in some cases. I am curious with this bike because it is seemingly such an oddity. I would also assume that since Meads were primarily mail order bikes, that they could be ordered however the customer wanted, with whichever parts they wanted. Hell, if they wanted a girls seat on a boys bike, I'm sure it could be done. I think it would be interesting to see an original ad or picture of an original bike like this one for comparative purposes. I'm going to build it up with the parts I have available to me until someone says otherwise. I have somewhat of an idea of what this bike should look like when its done but who knows what I will come up with in the meantime.


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## markivpedalpusher (Nov 3, 2011)

Another cool original crusader popped up on ebay

Item number:350503957321


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## Xcelsior (Nov 3, 2011)

*Right on the money not!*

Too bad BBC pricing is and has been a little askew! Most of the ballooners hanging around there are tagged with a price tag of at least 2000 to 10000 dollars for average prewar and postwar bikes you would normally see on the market for 300 to 1000 dollars.  But, it's their choice and right to affix value.  Saw the crusader dx model in person some time ago and I believe it had a 3000 pricetag then.  Which is why it has been sitting there for years. They do have some nice collectable bikes there though.  Just at insane retail prices.  Good luck bidders on that one.


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## Dave K (Nov 3, 2011)

Is this bike a good reference?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Pre...321?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item519ba9f349

opps just looked closer the ebay bike is a DX.  The guy is dreaming on the price.  But it is a cool bike


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## bobcycles (Nov 3, 2011)

*C Model Ranger!*

Could have been sold as late as 1940 ...Mead was a catalog outfit that sold Schwinn bikes for more money than Schwinn got for their own badged bikes!   Interesting to see a C model frame with a curved downtube.  Super unusual frame that one as it will not fit a Motorbike tank or straightbar, yet has the curved down tube of 1937 and up bicycles.  Very odd beast!  But a great find in that condition! Value?  I'd say 4-500 range... plane janer with a pretty tank!


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## ohdeebee (Nov 9, 2011)

*Updated*

Added a chainguard, grips, Torrington 10's and a ribbed Delta light. Would like to find a set of tank straps if anyone has any they would give up. Also a narrower set of bars, with or without the crossbrace would be nice


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## Larmo63 (Nov 9, 2011)

Now, after all of that, go crusading!!!!


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## x8notes (Nov 9, 2011)

Scwhinn was really a great company with great products. I got Schwinn since my teen years...


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## ohdeebee (Dec 3, 2011)

*Update*

When with narrow crossbrace bars (Thanks 55tbird!) and switched over to G3 blackwall tires. I think the red was just too much. More goodies on the way to dress this oddball up a bit.


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## ohdeebee (Dec 12, 2011)

Just missing the rack. Upgraded the wheels with better rims and added the truss rods today.


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## ohdeebee (Jan 24, 2012)

Front drum brake and proper original headlight added. Just need a rack.


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## Balloontyre (Jan 25, 2012)

*Beauty*

That bike is really coming together, looks Soooooooo much better in person. Nice!


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## alroad (Jan 25, 2012)

Looks like a 37 I traded to a CABE member about last year.  
At the time I had 4 ( C )  cycles 3 36's & this 37.
 Not # 1 on the list of most SCHWINN Collectors. I like them as they are more RARE
 than the common Motor Bike & are a lot lighter.  If the 37 you have the  Tank has more pitting on the Horn Button side & the bottom, other key point would be it's a Tall Frame. I have the Tall Frame truss rods & the original Chain Guard.
If you have a need to complete the Bike  with these items  let me know. { Great Ridin C mod.}  To me this Mead Crusader is a 9 in the paint Department. A Keeper ! !
 Alroad atbbkb@yahoo.com


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## ohdeebee (Jan 25, 2012)

Sent you an email.


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## ohdeebee (Feb 9, 2012)

*Done*

Thanks to Alex (alroad), I was able to get some of the long lost original parts. I took off the repainted guard and replaced it with the one that came on the bike. I was also able to take it out on this sunny day for a couple of pics and a short ride. I'm calling it done.


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## Dave K (Feb 9, 2012)

Looks great.  Such a cool bike


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## BIKE AT THE MOON! (Feb 10, 2012)

*great.*

Yeah that bike is great!


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