# What year is my elgin oriole



## kstarkusa (Nov 30, 2011)

well I was doing some research on my elgin oriole and I found out that the first letter indicates the year, for example 1934=M 1935=N. But the bigining of my serial number is J ****. can anyone help me on this


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## RMS37 (Nov 30, 2011)

The Oriole name was used over time on several different Elgin branded bicycles, some were made by Westfield and others were not. If you post a picture of the bike and the serial number, what you have and the date can probably be sorted out.


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## kstarkusa (Nov 30, 2011)

Alright ill try to get some pics of the bike later today

thanks for your help


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## kstarkusa (Nov 30, 2011)

here are the pic of the bike and the serial number.. Im almost done taking of the crappy house paint that some put on there long time ago all that is left is the fenders. I have the original step up rims for the bike just need to change them over onto the bike

I hope the serial number will help.


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## jpromo (Nov 30, 2011)

That J looks like a lightly stamped D  Phil will know.


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## kstarkusa (Nov 30, 2011)

that is a distinct possibilty it can be a D a faint stamp.that is what my dad.  I really wonder what year it


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## kstarkusa (Dec 1, 2011)

can anyone help me on the year???


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## elginkid (Dec 1, 2011)

Based on the parts, I'd guess 1935 or 1936.  The rims look to be incorrect though.  I'd predict that they were originally Lobdell double drop centers, or slightly less likely a regular drop center.  If that dating code is correct, perhaps it's an "O" and a 1936?  If the handlebars are original, I'd tend to guess more towards '36 anyway.  Less motorbikey, and more streamlinesque.


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## kstarkusa (Dec 1, 2011)

thank you very i do have the original rims and they are the step up rims that look like the fenders, and yes the handle bars are the original

thank you for the info


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## RMS37 (Dec 2, 2011)

I’m inclined to agree that the serial number is a partially stamped “D”.  The “M” and “N” serial numbers you mentioned are for Westfield built bicycles and were followed in 1936 by a return to the letter “A” so neither “D” or “J” work for dating this bike as a Westfield built unit and essentially preclude it from being built by Westfield. I’m inclined to think this bike may be an H.P. Snyder sourced Elgin rather than the more common Westfield built bike which explains the serial number not matching the Westfield pattern. Unfortunately Snyder serial numbers are idiosyncratic to that firm and have not been decoded for the early balloon models yet.

The two key items that do help date this bike are the paint pattern and the fork crown. In the Fall 1936/Winter 1937 Sears catalog the paint pattern used on the Oriole Moto-Balloon was changed from darts like on your bike to the later pattern with three paint stripes trailing back from just behind the head tube. This dates your bike as earlier; from the introduction of balloon tires in 1934 through the Spring or Summer of 1935 when these bikes still featured a paint pattern with darts.

The Quadriplate fork crown is also the same as the fork depicted in the Spring/Summer 1935 Sears catalog and considering that, and the style of the frame of the companion girl’s model in the same catalog, it is likely that for a short time these bikes were supplied to Sears by H.P. Snyder instead of Westfield.

Most of the other features on this bike have a Snyder look about them (including the integral rear fender stay/fender brace combo) but the frame differences themselves between Westfield and Snyder Moto-Balloon frames are subtle. A typical Snyder frame will have short lug like protrusions on the crank hanger that the seat and down tube fit into (which I can’t see in your photograph.) I would look for those; if they are present then the manufacturer is a given, if not then further study of the frame will be necessary to be certain who made it for Sears.


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## kstarkusa (Dec 3, 2011)

thank you Phil for the great information I really appritiate it. At lease now I have a good idea what the year this bike really is.

thanks again


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