# Recovering Vintage Saddles?



## SirMike1983

My Columbia project currently has a nice reproduction saddle. Though it's a decent saddle, I was wondering if it's possible to get a vintage saddle that has basically shot as to its leather and then to recover the saddle with new leather, leaving the original hardware. It would basically look authentic but have new leather on top for riding. 

Is this possible? If so do anyone have a tutorial on it?


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## 53Phantom

I juts recovered the Messingger seat with black leather on one of my vintage Schwinns. It was pretty easy and I think it turned out good. I couldnt find a tutorial online but, here is how I did it. I went to an automtive upholstery supply and bought a scrape piece of black leather and new piecxe of 1/2" dense foam padding. Ask them for a can of thier best spray adhesive too. After cleaning the seat pan thoughly, I soaked the piece of leather in water for a few minutes until it was very soft and pliable and stretched it across the seat pan, working it around the edges and curves. I then let it dry overnight. Next, I sprayed the top of the seat pan and installed the foam padding. Trimmed it to fit after it dried and then sprayed the top of the foam with the adhisive and installed the leather cover. I started in the middle and worked my way toward the edge to make sure there were no wrinkles. Trim the leather cover to where there is about 2" of extra material around the edge. Turn the pan over adn spray the underside of the covering and about 1" of the pan with the adhesive and carefully fold the edge under making sure there are no wrinckles. Trim thr excess material and you are done. Make sure that you give the adhesive a few minutes to get tacky before you stick anything together. Alos, make sure that the foam that you use is not too soft or too thick. You may be able to use your old pad. Anyway, I am sure there are mnay ways to do it but, this worked for me. I shoudl say that I have done allot of furniture upholstery in the past . The main thing it to make sure you pull the cover ttight around the edge so that there are no wrinckles or bunching. Also, in tight curves like the front edge of the seat, you will need to make some small cuts in the cover to remove some of the bulk of the material in order to fold it under the pan. Good luck!


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## SirMike1983

53Phantom said:


> I juts recovered the Messingger seat with black leather on one of my vintage Schwinns. It was pretty easy and I think it turned out good. I couldnt find a tutorial online but, here is how I did it. I went to an automtive upholstery supply and bought a scrape piece of black leather and new piecxe of 1/2" dense foam padding. Ask them for a can of thier best spray adhesive too. After cleaning the seat pan thoughly, I soaked the piece of leather in water for a few minutes until it was very soft and pliable and stretched it across the seat pan, working it around the edges and curves. I then let it dry overnight. Next, I sprayed the top of the seat pan and installed the foam padding. Trimmed it to fit after it dried and then sprayed the top of the foam with the adhisive and installed the leather cover. I started in the middle and worked my way toward the edge to make sure there were no wrinkles. Trim the leather cover to where there is about 2" of extra material around the edge. Turn the pan over adn spray the underside of the covering and about 1" of the pan with the adhesive and carefully fold the edge under making sure there are no wrinckles. Trim thr excess material and you are done. Make sure that you give the adhesive a few minutes to get tacky before you stick anything together. Alos, make sure that the foam that you use is not too soft or too thick. You may be able to use your old pad. Anyway, I am sure there are mnay ways to do it but, this worked for me. I shoudl say that I have done allot of furniture upholstery in the past . The main thing it to make sure you pull the cover ttight around the edge so that there are no wrinckles or bunching. Also, in tight curves like the front edge of the seat, you will need to make some small cuts in the cover to remove some of the bulk of the material in order to fold it under the pan. Good luck!




That sounds a lot like what "bunch o' bikes" had as his method on his website. How has it held up to riding in terms of durability? Has the leather cover and glue held up?


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## 53Phantom

I have not ridden it but for a few minutes but, my experience with this glue is that it will hold up very well. I use it all the time for covering door panels, headliners, etc. on cars.


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## SirMike1983

Well the saddle is here and in somewhat crusty shape. I was thinking of taking as much of it as I could and dipping it in Evaporust to get the rust off. There may be some parts I can't do that with (there's a cloth mattress that's hemmed in on the upper seat pan still and I'm wondering whether to try to save it). But I was thinking Evaporust as much as possible, then spray gloss black what I can (use gloss black with detail brush for the small spots where the spray might not reach) then recover using leather and adhesive and reassemble. Sound about right?


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## 53Phantom

Sounds good to me. let us know how it turns out.


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## SirMike1983

Well it came apart alright. The only thing that broke was one of those weird rectangular "clips" that fastens down to the bottom pan where the main bolts are. I might be able to get another at the hardware store (I think I've seen something like this there at least). This actually might be a good Troxel saddle. I thought at first it was a run of the mill Messinger, but the mattress portion has a big circular indentation similar to the stamp on the Troxel on my Henderson. So actually this saddle might have been a bit better than I thought. 

The springs themselves are in decent shape.

I'm hoping this project is a success. It seems like the leather saddles are among the first things to go on these bikes. There are tons of saddles out there that could be good, but need new covering. This one is among, I think. We'll see I guess.


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## sam

Check out how I recovered a seat at:
http://www.ratrodbikes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=26280


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## SirMike1983

sam said:


> Check out how I recovered a seat at:
> http://www.ratrodbikes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=26280




So you pulled the old padding off completely and then glued new padding to the pan? What kind of glue did you use for that?


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## 53Phantom

Great job Sam ! I like the carpet pad idea. The foam I used is a little soft for my taste. I see allot of the old seats originally used cotton batting on top of the pan. I might try that next time. The uphoulstry shops sell foam with  Dacron  already attached to. Dacron really helps the leather keep its shape and adds comfort. Here is another tip. For trimming and shaping the foam aftre is is glued to the seat pan, use an electric fish fillet knife. You can really carve and sculpt the foam to the contour that you want easily.


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## grey3speedfrmeuro

Although I like the Texan's sugestions, I would say if youre near a horse saddle shop and the bike saddle is realy old 1900-1930's ish why not take it to them and pay the extra. Some of the early Troxel saddles pre 1920's had lots of stiching and raised hip pads they used natural materials to cushon the cushons and a horse saddle maker could exactly re create it for you as they copy and modify patterns and restore saddles all the time.    Just a thought.....


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## grey3speedfrmeuro

If a bicycle saddle had rust you could buy a small sandblaster and use walnut hull grains purchased at an automotive paint shop instead of actual sand that would harm the old metal. You could clean it then take it to an bicycle, motorcycle or automotive repainter to have repainted.  I should probably post this in the restoration section, yup, Im a newbie....


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## 53Phantom

grey3speedfrmeuro said:


> If a bicycle saddle had rust you could buy a small sandblaster and use walnut hull grains purchased at an automotive paint shop instead of actual sand that would harm the old metal. You could clean it then take it to an bicycle, motorcycle or automotive repainter to have repainted.  I should probably post this in the restoration section, yup, Im a newbie....




You wouldnt have the joy of doing it yourself : )  I actually took a Messinger sewn edge seat to a saddle maker who quoted me a minumum of $400.00 to recover it. I said no thanks.........Those guys dont like to mess with them.


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## SirMike1983

It's not 1900s-1930s. It's probably 1940s-50s era, which would be correct for the bike. I'm not interested in paying for a restoration professionally on this thing as it's more user grade than anything else. 

The Dacron is an interesting idea. I'd never thought of that. I may give that a shot and I'll have to see where I can get some of it. I will admit what worries me some is the prospect of the leather coming loose either from the padding below it, or from the saddle in general and then becoming a mess. 

The pad on this is some kind of cloth sack type material. It's actually in very nice shape, though I may have to remove it to get underneath it and de-rust. Perhaps I can reuse it by applying spray adhesive.


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## grey3speedfrmeuro

Okay, I jsut didnt read the post that carefuly, thanks for setting me streight on the price...If I had an industrial sewing machine and equipment to do it what is a fair price? There is somone on the internet that does bicycle and motorcyle saddles.


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## grey3speedfrmeuro

For some out there that want to get an idea what others charge to repair early bicycle seats when do it yourself isnt an option:

www.saddles.amintech.com/ (early bicycle saddles) Brooks Ltd. still makes most modles of early seats with some variation.

motorcycleseatrepair.com/ (shows before and after shots of elaborate repairs of vynil and late 20th centrury seat technology.


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## SirMike1983

The early ones like the sewn Troxels are indeed best left to the pros if it's anything more than minor repair. They're pretty valuable in decent shape and often rely less on just being bolted together pans and more on careful leather fitting and sewing.


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## SirMike1983

Ok I decided to do a total tear down and I've found:

the original pad was very much like a "rug pad" sort of cushion-- it's rather thin and has only some give.

The pad was contained in a "pouch" of canvas. It appears the pad was glued to the upper pan and the canvas was glued to the pad. I was able to extract the pouch and pad semi-intact. But given the apparent amount of rust it attracted, I think I'll get a rug pad and some fresh canvas and spray glue it on. The metal parts are in an oxalic acid bath right now.

Some questions:

-where did you get your upholstery leather? It's real leather and not pleather, right?
-where did you get the rug pad?

I went to a hobby/crafts/fabric store today and only found the canvas for the new pouch.


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## yewhi

sam said:


> Check out how I recovered a seat at:
> http://www.ratrodbikes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=26280




Great bike BTW. This was one of my top three when I voted.

Nice job all around.

Tim


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## SirMike1983

I've got a piece of upholstery leather on the way, though I'm still searching for carpet pad scrap. Home Depot had pad but only sold it in larger quantities than what I need.


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## SirMike1983

Any one have a source for carpet pad scraps?

I actually have everything BUT that now... go figure.


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## Mawthorne

I would think just about anyplace that sold carpet (if they install what they sell) might help you out but if not you might try calling a few installers. You might also check hobby stores as I have seen all kinds of foam there, although it costs more. Final thought, if you have one nearby, maybe the Habitat Re-Store? Good luck, and please let us know where you find it in case we decide to takle that project!


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## SirMike1983

I've taken a pass on the carpet pad and am trying something else-- a neoprene non-slip floor cushion mat. I found one at Home Depot for $10. I traced the pattern and cut it out. It's similar in thickness (1/8 inch) to the original rubber pad, but a bit firmer and "stickier". It also seems more tear resistant and durable than the original. After I'm done with this there will be enough mat left to even out the ends on the mat and actually use it on the kitchen floor. 

I'm using 3m 777 spray stick (the toughest stuff I could find). It REALLY is sticky stuff and seems to have bonded strongly. 

I'll be covering the neoprene 1/8 pad with canvas (seems to be the same stuff as the original lining) and then covering the canvas with the leather. I'm a bit unsure of whether to use the canvas or not, as the neoprene is very, very sticky (even without the glue) and would likely grip the leather nicely. But then the canvas may smooth out the shape of the pad and make a better looking seat. 

Any thoughts on whether to go with the canvas liner or go straight leather to pad?


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## sam

I'd skip the liner.


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## ib6ub9

*jacket seat covers*

I just thought I'd mention using leather jackets that you get at pawn shops or we have Frenchies stores up here(second hand clothing).  A friends wife recovers his Motorbike seats with them all the time.  You can sometimes even pick one up to match the old patina if that's what your looking for.  I'm sure other have used this but I thought I would throw it in with this seat repair thread.....Pretty good by the way.


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## SirMike1983

Recently recovered the leather saddle. It came out alright-- a couple creases in the front, but ride well and looks nice generally.


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