# I'm not in favor of rat bikes!



## baronvoncatania

Sorry! I know i'm going to raise some hackels, But I have to ask, why would you want what was a beautiful piece of americana balloon tire bike and make it into something it never was? NO OFFENSIVE! but wouldn't it be better to return it to it's original glory? and preserve it's history?

I understand it take a LOT of money to do it right, but can't you just do the minimun to preserve it until you, or someone else can restore it properly?

jim c.


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## azhearseguy

Most Rat rodders take the bikes that are to far gone to be restored, or bicycles that have little to no collectors value.. plus if you hang on to everthing to preserve them, you will end up getting a visit from the producers of horders!..lol


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## Bicycle Belle

*In defense of ratrodders..*

I have to second the post that said that most ratrodders work with bikes no one else would even look twice at. Very few will cut up a true collectors item but yes I have seen one or two do it. The majority though do take bikes that would go to the scrap heap and give them new life again and I would much rather see an old bicycle being ridden and enjoyed (as it was meant to be) than scrapped. 
That being said, I find it just as sad to see a huge collection of bicycles become just that and nothing more. I understand about being a collector, though I see myself more of an enthusiast. When I see row upon row of bicycles stacked next to each other for me they lose their individual specialness and become just an aquisition. Bicycles for me are a functional form of art and I love speculating about the previous owners and all the adventures and joy they had in the years past on their beloved two-wheeled wonders.
This is not meant to offend anyone...it's just my opinion


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## Freqman1

Since I posted a rat I suppose I feel obligated to respond. First lets be clear that there is a difference between a 'rat' and a 'custom' although the lines can become blurred. My rat Phantom, for example, has not been customized in any way that alters any of the original parts i.e. cut, welded, bent, moulded, etc... . As a matter of fact if you read my post you will see that I intend to restore this bike as a red Phantom. I have all the parts except for the seat. This is a '51 so it takes the earlier (harder to find) seat. I'd be happy to jump right on this if you would please just send the seat! Seriously if you look at a lot of the rat bikes they are just missing some of the pricey parts and have not been ruined. I just wanted to have some fun with it in the mean time. BTW I rode it around town yesterday and everywhere I went people thought it was a cool bike. Relax and enjoy the hobby--that's why there's more than one flavor of ice cream--not everyone likes the same 'ol thing! v/r Shawn  







baronvoncatania said:


> Sorry! I know i'm going to raise some hackels, But I have to ask, why would you want what was a beautiful piece of americana balloon tire bike and make it into something it never was? NO OFFENSIVE! but wouldn't it be better to return it to it's original glory? and preserve it's history?
> 
> I understand it take a LOT of money to do it right, but can't you just do the minimun to preserve it until you, or someone else can restore it properly?
> 
> jim c.


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## baronvoncatania

*Thanks for the info*



Freqman1 said:


> Since I posted a rat I suppose I feel obligated to respond. First lets be clear that there is a difference between a 'rat' and a 'custom' although the lines can become blurred. My rat Phantom, for example, has not been customized in any way that alters any of the original parts i.e. cut, welded, bent, moulded, etc... . As a matter of fact if you read my post you will see that I intend to restore this bike as a red Phantom. I have all the parts except for the seat. This is a '51 so it takes the earlier (harder to find) seat. I'd be happy to jump right on this if you would please just send the seat! Seriously if you look at a lot of the rat bikes they are just missing some of the pricey parts and have not been ruined. I just wanted to have some fun with it in the mean time. BTW I rode it around town yesterday and everywhere I went people thought it was a cool bike. Relax and enjoy the hobby--that's why there's more than one flavor of ice cream--not everyone likes the same 'ol thing! v/r Shawn




Thanks for explaining it to me. Now I get it.  Like I said no offense.


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## dxmadman

*Rats," That Bike Looks Like Mine!"*

Truthfuly We was all ratbikers when we started into this hobby, Remember some of our first projects? Not so correct huh? We learned on our own, some of us just building, mixing parts, not realy caring if it was correct but we just wanted to ride it! Now we know about what is right and how to correctly restore a bike. "Thanks CABE!"  Some of us now perfecting our painting skills, and mechanical skills and are now up to a challenge. Now to have something no one else has, Your own kustom with your own reflection of your love and passion of this hobby. The price of that bike "Priceless"


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## bobcycles

*Rat bike*

Is the lazy way out of restoring a bike.   Personally I'm sick of them and the whole 'rat' mentality.  But as long as they're doing it to houspainted bike, or bikes that were partially complete or rust buckets to start with,  makes it a little easier to stomach.   Part of Americas new direction-- lowest common denomiinator thug culture of what the media tells the gullible is 'cool'.  The result?  Armies of mindless followers opting for the same Bling status symbol of mediocrity.  I will however say that I've seen some creative work in the rat realm, but the majority is the usual predictable vintage satin black frame with mixed make vintage parts and then the made in China bling 'add-on' ingredients to top it all off.  Some people will go the extra yards to do something exceptional. Any one see Dawalts shaftie?  Pretty remarkable. But that's a very small percentage of the rat custom scene... most are pretty >ick<  ghetto!


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## Freqman1

So I guess Bob doesn't care for my bike! Because I am going to restore this I didn't want to spend countless hours on metal work and glass smooth paint. Iam also a motorcycle guy (car guy too) and always loved the looks of the early board track racers such as the side-valve Harleys, Indians, and of course the Merkel! This is nothing but a diversion for me and the majority of my collection is original, unrestored bikes including four Phantoms. I'm something of an eclectic so I like to have a little diversity. If ya ain't having fun why do it? v/r Shawn


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## StevieZ

Well. I must say it is a shame to not restore some of the Vintage beauties. But if you did them all you would go broke. In my past experiences at swap meets and shows and even on the bike trail or just tooling around the town. I have had more people comment on my rat bike then any other bike. I have some pretty sweet rides to.


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## M.Martian

Both of my customs are just that because I got one of them as a frame only.  The other came as a frankenstein bike with random parts.  Neither of these bikes were in any way going to be restored due to cost.

My custom is just that.  It's actually built as a bike that some kid might have built it back in the 50's replacing parts as needed.  Same thing my dad did when he was a kid.  Just take random parts and build something that rolls.

Most of us custom guys do also have a love of vintage/original stuff.  Eventually I plan on having my Shelby complete with correct parts.  Just going to take a while since I'm broke.


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## bobcycles

*ratty*

mighta been a bit harsh on the rat lovers!  But I do think that trends where everyone jumps on the same band wagon get boring.  Remember those Chopper shows?  Jesse, then OC...then whatever next. BORING!  Look at what happened to JJ....burned out!  
This forum is Vintage bikes first and foremost....and Classic and Antique!   ...there is a ratrod site.
What else groundbreaking, 'cool' or different can be done with bikes?  How about living bikes?  Like chia pets!  Part of the new Greening movement!  Imagine watering your bike!!!
ok nevermind, heading out to get some satin black krylon and 120 spoke wheels, it's back to the rad rod idea, C'ya!


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## Bicycle Belle

*Actually this particular forum..*

Is about custom bikes and that's why the poster put his post here. He is entitled to his opinion as you are to yours. I would suggest maybe checking out the gallery on ratrodbikes and see what some of these guys are doing. I think you'll find a lot more than satin black paint and 144 spoke wheels. I think it would do some people good to remember that bicycles were created to be ridden, enjoyed and well used and not sit as part of some dusty collection of a person who sees only their monetary value. I'm not saying you're guilty of this or anyone else on this site is (I've met some wonderful people) 
I'm thinking that if our old bicycles could talk, they tell you of the wonderful times they've had...from the morning they were received by a happy child to the many adventures they shared. I'm also betting they'd tell you they love to do it all over again. So you go ratrodders! Rescue your bikes...ride them and love them!
(but leave me a few of the nice girls bikes I can restore  )


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## TheSaint

*Just Do It*

Building a Rat Rod is a great way to LEARN
what makes a bike appealing to others 
and to yourself. 

It is LESSON one can start to break down
the composition of elements on a bike,
such as shapes, color, positive, negative 
space and details you want the viewer
to be drawn to. Then the mechanics of
the bike, a stretched frame, a comfortable
ride, a harsh ride or a bit of both depending
on front suspension and tire choice. 

You WILL find a new level of competence
in crawling, walking then running in
progression of creativity and execution of your
own newfound ability of creating a Rat Rod. 
It is like a skill you develop with time,
like any medium whether drawing
with pen and paper or learning and
understanding what makes our bikes
so interesting. 

Some of the reputable restorers in the hobby
cannot build Rat Rods because it will
ruin their credibilty as Grade A perfect to the
absolutely correct o mundo part down to the
fastener to the exact o mundo pinstripe thickness
type restorer which we all want for
our letter perfect restorations. But can
these restorers have fun with building
a cool as heck, visually intelligent Rat Rod,
maybe, if they let their worries of what
their potential original type bike clients
may think go to heck......  

regards,
TheSaint


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## videoranger

*Yikes!*

Yeah, it's too bad those varmits on the left coast rated out 20" bikes with high rise handlebars and banana seats back in the early 60's. Now we are stuck with StingRays, Krates, Eliminators, Spyders, etc. Those kids should have left those little bikes as alone. Now we have "rat rodders", WHAT NEXT, ratted StingRays!!!! I'm goin' ta hide all my classics before they get CHOPPED!


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## dxmadman

*Rats "They Got One Too!"*

Videorangers right on the Sting Ray story,It was rats and customs that started the whole highrise revolution, Next to come the rat bike bike bandwagon coming to a store near you, flat black paint,red painted and mismatched color rims and tires, pinstripe graphics,the return of 24 inch cuisers, Damm its here already, Walmart and Target beat us to it! LOL


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## scarylarry

*Rat/Custom/Restore/Original*

This is a very interesting topic. In my opinion it boils down to personal individuality. Theres no wrong answer in what your doing to your own 
property, as long as your doing something. The shop that i worked with had a little bit of everything, from rat, to restored, to custom, and original.
Nobody was treated differently. Maybe things are different elsewhere, but the when swap & trade shows come around in the Fox Valley in Wi, as long as you two wheels, motor, or not, you're in the brotherhood...........
Thanks


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## yeshoney

*Many have seen...*

my bikes.  I prefer to call them Hot Rod Bikes, as they are usually made up of entirely vintage parts, with updated running gears, though i do have a handful of Skip tooth customs as well.  Here is one of my favorites as it certainly blurs all the stereotypical lines.  It is a 50's Spitfire, sans fenders riding on 24" S2 36 hole creme w/black pins wheels (try finding a set of those!) strung on a nexus IHG 7 speed and front roller brake.  Wides ape hangers and an early Messinger 'nanna seat.  Even has vintage Continental 24 x 2.125 tires.  Is it Rat? Is it Hot? Is it Custom? or is it a faithful recreation of something that started a revolution ~ in an adult friendly size   You decide!


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## how

I built this from parts laying around, it is my winter rider , I ride all winter and it is rough on good bikes


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## 1959firearrow

This is  a debate that will never end, just as it never will end in the car world.I'm just glad that the crap rod segment(a car haphazardly thrown together will little concern for safety, crappy welds, dangerous suspension and brake setups, and the one that bugs me  the  most, mesh or no floors) have stayed away from bikes. Rat rods and customs are interpretations of their owners needs or wants in a particular bike, vehicle etc. Lastly in my opinion bikes are meant to be done with however their owner chooses I like almost all of them. Judging  by all the accessories that were and are still sold bikes are meant to be customized if you want. A bike restored,ratted, or turned custom is just one more that doesn't go to the scrapper we should all be happy, the more of us there are the more history  we can save.


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## geech34-2nd

*Why be defensive about cutting up a bike?*

I was into hot rods for a long time & occasionally met up with someone who thought that it was a sin to alter anything. They were usually people who have no creative talent. Bikes are no different. There's nothing wrong with cutting something up & changing things. These things are meant to enjoy. I would hesitate cutting up something that is truly rare or in great original condition but there are many bikes out there that are easily replaced. No offense intended.


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## frankster41

Look out yard art people you will be the next group to get looked at in a negative way.


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## ratfink1962

I bought a rough X-53 from Geech34 here awhile back... too rough to restore, Rat thing is kinda played out in my mind, think Im gonna break out the chopsaw on it just to see what I can come up with 

might piss a few people off, but oh well... wouldnt be the first time!!


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## thegnu

as long as theres folks restoring them to perfect you will have others cutting them up , the way I see it . my first bike meant FREEDOM to explore an travel , an I express that with my builds be it a perfect resto or a clean preserved machine or a hacked to bits full blown custom , we should all respect one anothers interpretation of that freedom, we all experienced on our first ride or the pride of riding that perfect resto an also the pride of riding that rat because we as individuals built it an enjoy the fruits of our labors . each an every one of us can identify with that an that makes us all brothers , with differing opinions , but at the core still brothers.
Gary


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## Sulley

I picked up this 62 Higgins Spaceliner for almost nothing, the chrome was not to bad but i had done a complete resto on a 60 Higgins Flightliner a year ago, it was my first bike restore and i tell yea it was tuff to do, had to have chrome work done, nice paint, new nuts and bolts everyware, it came out great and i enjoyed doing it but when i picked up this bike i didnt want to go through a complete restore job. I like the Rat Bike look and i like the board trackers so i built a Rat Tracker of sort. I did take the time to do it wright but i dont feel i have to treat it with kit cloves, i don,t not have a lot of $ in it but i think i like it better than my correctly restored one, hey there all fun to ride and to look at, make it your own and hope others like it to.  Sulley

1962 Spaceliner








1960 Flightliner


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## 37fleetwood

at first, I wasn't going to add any text as the photo speaks for itself. not all rat rods are "not beautiful" in their own right. I took a bike that had been made into a tandem many years ago and then left broken in half in my uncles shed for years. the front half is an unknown year CWC of some sort, the rear is a ladies Colson again of an unknown year. by the op's definition these bikes would never have been ridden again. but, due to the modern technology of "Rat Rodding", both have been not only saved but made into something of grace and beauty, with a hint of rebelliousness.


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## vincev

If you dont like rat rods you will probably despise fixed gear bikes.I like rat rods but cringe when I see classic road bikes get their cable guides ground off,Campy components trashed ,brakes removed,etc.I saw an old Paramount completely trashed because the young rider wanted a "fixie".


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## partsguy

I don't mind Rats, but some guys are so crazy about rust, its sickening! Thats my only itch with some guys who do it. They want to keep all the rust and tear on a bike. Heck, just sand it and buy a $3 can of black spray paint at Wal-Mart. Even that would do. Rust is rust, its a form of decay.

I've seen some very nice, beautifully done Rats, but, I have also seen some ugly ducklings too.


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## partsguy

sulley said:


> i picked up this 62 higgins spaceliner for almost nothing, the chrome was not to bad but i had done a complete resto on a 60 higgins flightliner a year ago, it was my first bike restore and i tell yea it was tuff to do, had to have chrome work done, nice paint, new nuts and bolts everyware, it came out great and i enjoyed doing it but when i picked up this bike i didnt want to go through a complete restore job. I like the rat bike look and i like the board trackers so i built a rat tracker of sort. I did take the time to do it wright but i dont feel i have to treat it with kit cloves, i don,t not have a lot of $ in it but i think i like it better than my correctly restored one, hey there all fun to ride and to look at, make it your own and hope others like it to.  Sulley
> 
> 1962 spaceliner




this is what i mean by a nicely done rat^


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## PCHiggin

*Money.....*

or lack thereof is usually the factor. Some of us dont have the funds to make a classic nice again,so it gets put together rough.Some of us are just too cheap and cant stand the thought of tying up the cost of a used car in a bike.I have a friend that has nothing nice,all of his toys are "rats" .To each his own.


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## jd56

*To Rat or not???*

I think that if your want to rat a bike because it is too far gone then do what needs to be done to make the ride a head turner. Thats what rats are, head turners right. Everyone has visions of the perfect bike and then there are those visions of what if I did that..."dang that looks cool" is usually the final result.
We are all artists of some sort. Some are better at it than others.

I have a Western Flyer Sabre Flyer that I can't afford to strip and repaint to original. I too have plans to rat the bike, "why not", I say. 
It's your artistic impression being expressed.

Sulley and Scott, great looking bikes. I'd bet they would bring a pretty penny to the right person if they went on the market. 
I love the Flightliner and wouldn't think twice of adding that to my herd but, don't send me a PM to see if I want it. I want my own creation and will ride it proudly.

Just saying
JD


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## Terry66

I guess I don't get the big deal. I have seen some amazing all original bikes. I have seen some amazing restorations. I have seen some amazing "rust" bikes and I have seen some amazing rats. I can appreciate them all. I especially like the creativity of rat bikes. As Lance said in his book. It really is all about the bike.

For me, it really depends on the bike. If I have a bike that is fair condition or better, I try to keep it in its original state. I appreciate the history of the bike and want to preserve that. If I have a truly mint bike, I can even force myself to NOT ride it. I get the collecting/original thing. However if I have a bike that is in poor condition, then I will look at either restoring, customizing or building a rat. That said, I will not destroy something so that it can't be brought back at a later date. No cutting, welding, etc for me.

Personally I am ok with the rat crowd....what I can't understand is the guy who collect bikes but doesn't ride bikes. I mean I get having a pristine bike and not riding it, but a bike seems like an odd thing for a non-cyclist to collect. Why not collect stamps or Avon bottles? They take up a lot less room! 

Hey, we are all into bikes for different reasons and that's what makes it so cool and fun.


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## TheFizzer

I'm Mark & I started a vintage bicycle club 5 years ago & we are the Rat Riders.  Doesn't mean that we chop up nice bikes & make them ratty.  In my mind it just means to customize a bike & make it look cool & have fun with it!!!!  We have our vintage bicycle event once a year & had over 100 people show up with all types of bikes from choppers to originals to rat bikes to muscle bikes, as long as you ride them & have fun then that's all that matters to me.  We donated all the money to muscular dystrophy that we raised.  I do have to say though, I would never cut up a bike that is a nice original bike.  Here's a pic of my Monark Super Deluxe & then one of my Western Flyer X-53 that is just a little custom.  Also my red Schwinn, looks like an original bike but really it's custom because the frame is a 1977 with a mix of old & new parts.


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## dfa242

I love that X-53 and it reminded me of my one mild custom - It's a prewar Western Flyer I'm putting together as a rider, so I thought I'd add it to this thread.  Fortunately, Joe did a nice job of stripping off the blue housepaint before offering it for sale here on the CABE.  I kinda' liked the look so I'm gonna' just preserve the bare metal. 

My question is this - Can someone tell me what type of headlight(s) would have been on this model?  Obviously I'm not too concerned with complete originality for this bike, and I do have a great old car spotlight with matching patina that I could retrofit for it, but thought I'd see if the correct light(s) would be a good look too.

Thanks for your thoughts,
Dean


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## vontrike

Really like the rear fender on the X. I was doing something like it on my bike, but wanted to hinge it, to change the tire. Have not came up with the right hinge idea as of yet. Any thoughts.


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## ozzmonaut

I like ratbikes, but I love original vintage steel. In my mind though, unless you do a nut and bolt, 100% correct rest on a bike, anything you do to it is ratting it. My 55 panther fools some people into thinking it is a repro. It looks almost new. But it is not 100% original and is not a proper resto, so I would classify it as a rat. The frame is emerald green, the tank and fenders are cream. It is a nice looking bike. Plenty of chrome bits and awesome ride. Would I rather the bike be original vintage? YES. However, when I got the rusty frame it was basically junk. The parts were laying around and mostly junk as well. My choices were to either let the bike rot and go to the earth, or turn it into an enjoyable ride and give it life and the ability to please riders in the future. It is one of my favorite bikes, but I won't own it forever, and someday, someone else will own it and ride it and wonder how something from 1955 came to exist in this state during their life. They will likely ride it about and get as many questions if not more as I do about it. They might repaint it or modify it somehow and make it their own. That will be just fine. There are two hands on the scale. On one side , they are vintage bikes, and that is amazing in its own right. The fact that we choose to preserve history and sometimes create beautiful things from piles of rust. On the other side, they are only bikes. They are tools or machines and they have served their purpose. I can't see becoming angry about their existence one way or the other. I have 20+ bikes, so I obviously enjoy this, but I appreciate all kinds of bikes. I have OG vintage stuff, and some of the craziest, wildest stuff in my stable. I can't see splitting hairs among ourselves as the group who has chosen to continue the lives of these machines.


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## TheFizzer

​


vontrike said:


> Really like the rear fender on the X. I was doing something like it on my bike, but wanted to hinge it, to change the tire. Have not came up with the right hinge idea as of yet. Any thoughts.




The second half of the X-53 fender is just bolted together behind the rear reflector so it removes easily to change the tire.


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## vontrike

I pulled a couple fenders down out of the rafters and started chopping away to build one like on your x. The reflector hid yours well. I have a couple ideas about taillights also. Mine is 2 inches short of being 8 feet long, so this will put it past that. Thanks for the info.


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## Backpedaler

i don't like bmx bikes!    :eek:


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## partsguy

ozzmonaut said:


> I like ratbikes, but I love original vintage steel. In my mind though, unless you do a nut and bolt, 100% correct rest on a bike, anything you do to it is ratting it. My 55 panther fools some people into thinking it is a repro. It looks almost new. But it is not 100% original and is not a proper resto, so I would classify it as a rat. The frame is emerald green, the tank and fenders are cream. It is a nice looking bike. Plenty of chrome bits and awesome ride. Would I rather the bike be original vintage? YES. However, when I got the rusty frame it was basically junk. The parts were laying around and mostly junk as well. My choices were to either let the bike rot and go to the earth, or turn it into an enjoyable ride and give it life and the ability to please riders in the future. It is one of my favorite bikes, but I won't own it forever, and someday, someone else will own it and ride it and wonder how something from 1955 came to exist in this state during their life. They will likely ride it about and get as many questions if not more as I do about it. They might repaint it or modify it somehow and make it their own. That will be just fine. There are two hands on the scale. On one side , they are vintage bikes, and that is amazing in its own right. The fact that we choose to preserve history and sometimes create beautiful things from piles of rust. On the other side, they are only bikes. They are tools or machines and they have served their purpose. I can't see becoming angry about their existence one way or the other. I have 20+ bikes, so I obviously enjoy this, but I appreciate all kinds of bikes. I have OG vintage stuff, and some of the craziest, wildest stuff in my stable. I can't see splitting hairs among ourselves as the group who has chosen to continue the lives of these machines.




This bike sounds really nice! Got any pics?


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## titus

*don't call me a rat!*



bobcycles said:


> Is the lazy way out of restoring a bike.   Personally I'm sick of them and the whole 'rat' mentality.  But as long as they're doing it to houspainted bike, or bikes that were partially complete or rust buckets to start with,  makes it a little easier to stomach.   Part of Americas new direction-- lowest common denomiinator thug culture of what the media tells the gullible is 'cool'.  The result?  Armies of mindless followers opting for the same Bling status symbol of mediocrity.  I will however say that I've seen some creative work in the rat realm, but the majority is the usual predictable vintage satin black frame with mixed make vintage parts and then the made in China bling 'add-on' ingredients to top it all off.  Some people will go the extra yards to do something exceptional. Any one see Dawalts shaftie?  Pretty remarkable. But that's a very small percentage of the rat custom scene... most are pretty >ick<  ghetto!




the whole term (and basis for such term) "rat rod" is horribly mis understood and is a terrible overencumpasing term.  it down talks the rebelious trend to ride it the way you have it till you can fix it.  calling  someones unfinished bike ratty or messy or even lazy is just rude.  some people have put tremendous hours into manipulating the frame and shape of the metal on their bikes and want others to know about it so they "show" it.  from personal experiance if you make something to nice and clean you will get comments like "he bought it like that".  personally if I see a bike that is "perfect" I think instantly how nice of them to have something that everyone could have if they had enough money.  I don't care if you have the latest walmart special and go and buy gold "china" fenders and whitewall tires, great job, not my taste but you did it your self and that's what you wanted.  

if something is yours, you need to know why and how it is.  if your ride is perfectly original then it is only as good as the maker stamped it out.  I've done restorations and you can only go so far and then it's done.  the idea behind "hot rodding" (you call "rat" rodding) is to constantly be in a state of improving (according to your taste) your ride.  if you like to minimalise then strip it down if you like erra correct "bling" then dig through the piles and put it together.

if you're gonna have to use the term "ratrod"  then own it! comment on your own stuff leave others less fortunate then yourself alone respect that someone is passionate about something.  some times these "ghetto" kids only have that bike you just put down, cool to them is just having something to call thier own and the only thing they can do to make it thier own (because no one has taken the time to teach skills and they don't have the coin for it) is to put cheap trinkets on it and call it bling.  so what if the rust shows, so what if the wheels don't match.  so what if they had to use parts off of a huffy mountain bike to get it rolling... hey at least they got something to roll with now.


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## 1959firearrow

Hey just saying my bike money fund is pretty thin most of the time so I make do with what I have and I have never had anything more than trash find bikes or the most exspensive bike i ever purchased was $60 1/4 of my check at the time. I enjoy my vintage rides and know when to leave the good ones alone. I gladly make my riders out the house painted parts bikes I can get ahold of in my area. I still get the same thrill riding them as anybody does on a bike. I like nicely restored bikes just as much but havent come across a bike worth restoring besides one that I have and is my username and I'm slowing gethering parts for that one. Don't knock it till you try it! It's a great chance to be creative and it gives me something to call mine as I like vintage cars too but those are out of my reach most of the time cause the cheapies really arn't ever worth the hassle.


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## ramito

*Nice topic*

10 0f 10....war time...lol


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## mazdaflyer

*Custom or Rat???*

I reading through the posts in this thread, I'm now confused.  When is a custom a custom and not a rat bike.  When is a rat bike a rat bike and not a custom. How do I categorize these... 

*Custom or Rat??? *





*Custom or Rat??? *


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## scrubbinrims

I am a poor judge in these categories, but I would say custom x 2 as neither looks pulled from a dumpster nor has any Halloween decor on them.
Chris


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## mazdaflyer

dfa242 said:


> I love that X-53 and it reminded me of my one mild custom - It's a prewar Western Flyer I'm putting together as a rider, so I thought I'd add it to this thread.  Fortunately, Joe did a nice job of stripping off the blue housepaint before offering it for sale here on the CABE.  I kinda' liked the look so I'm gonna' just preserve the bare metal.
> 
> My question is this - Can someone tell me what type of headlight(s) would have been on this model?  Obviously I'm not too concerned with complete originality for this bike, and I do have a great old car spotlight with matching patina that I could retrofit for it, but thought I'd see if the correct light(s) would be a good look too.




Roadmaster used a fork light bracket similar to yours, here is a Roadmaster light that is on ebay now, not mine by the way.


----------



## HAMP

*1933 chicago schwinn liberty will send pictures if interested.  Call hamp 918-333-332*




















Freqman1 said:


> So I guess Bob doesn't care for my bike! Because I am going to restore this I didn't want to spend countless hours on metal work and glass smooth paint. Iam also a motorcycle guy (car guy too) and always loved the looks of the early board track racers such as the side-valve Harleys, Indians, and of course the Merkel! This is nothing but a diversion for me and the majority of my collection is original, unrestored bikes including four Phantoms. I'm something of an eclectic so I like to have a little diversity. If ya ain't having fun why do it? v/r Shawn


----------



## SJ_BIKER

*rATS AND LoWrideRS*

I got in to the hobby by building a rat rod/lowrider cruiser ....a 26 inch 1970s schwinn middleweight frame that no one wanted.  95% of it was repro parts but i was happy as a carribean clam in those early years.  It is far cheaper and more liberating to build a cool custom i must admit.  Then I saw the evolution of the bicycle books and my curiosity and the money in my wallet went for a wild ride.  When i think about putting 900-1300 into a schwinn phantom project...deep in the back of my mind i think about how i could just as easily have a cool cruiser for less than a quarter of that.  Around here there was a trend to build mountain bike klunkers(stripped down balloon schwinns mostly 1930s to 1950s bikes) and sell off the fenders plus other accessories or keep them for another project.  It is better to keep them on the road no matter what results than to see any bike in a land fill.  A moment of silence for those bikes that are now in bike heaven.


----------



## tailhole

*Disagree*



bobcycles said:


> Is the lazy way out of restoring a bike.   Personally I'm sick of them and the whole 'rat' mentality.  But as long as they're doing it to houspainted bike, or bikes that were partially complete or rust buckets to start with,  makes it a little easier to stomach.   Part of Americas new direction-- lowest common denomiinator thug culture of what the media tells the gullible is 'cool'.  The result?  Armies of mindless followers opting for the same Bling status symbol of mediocrity.  I will however say that I've seen some creative work in the rat realm, but the majority is the usual predictable vintage satin black frame with mixed make vintage parts and then the made in China bling 'add-on' ingredients to top it all off.  Some people will go the extra yards to do something exceptional. Any one see Dawalts shaftie?  Pretty remarkable. But that's a very small percentage of the rat custom scene... most are pretty >ick<  ghetto!




I think it's lazy to look at a prefectly restored bike hanging on a wall.  I ride my bikes.  Really ride them, everyday - even in the Colorado winter.  I spend several weeks riding and fine tuning the seat height, handlebar angles, etc to make a comfortable and fast ride.  Each bike gets a total rebuild at LEAST 3 times a year out of necessity.  I never remove or damage original paint, I only repaint bikes that have been previously house painted.  I don't cut the bikes or chop them into barely ridable pieces of 'art' either, don't understand that mentality at all, but if you own it, do as you will.
Last summer my friends & I rode an unrestored '40 Schwinn DX in a cruiser relay race downtown and won the race by a lap and a half.  We beat skinny kids on skinny tire bikes with shaved legs and drilled out hubs, we beat teams with 5 speeds on their bikes.  We won not only the race, we won oldest bike and oldest team.  We won because we ride our bikes, not by sitting on our 'lazy' asses and spending thousands on a bike that is too valuable to ride.
I truly appreciate the restorers out there, don't get me wrong, but to call 'rat' bike riders lazy is just ignorant.  When is the last time you went on a 40 mile fat tire bike ride?  We did last weekend and will do it again all summer long.
My bikes are loved and upgraded as needed, but all with vintage american parts.  It's like the old motorcycle saying, 'it's not what you ride, it's that you ride'  So, I'd suggest putting together a bike that you can ride, take a fall on, maybe get a scratch or two and go outside and put in some pedal time.


----------



## SJ_BIKER

*Besides..*

One never knows when the next aerocycle or bluebird might be born with all the creative ideas out there that will define the generation of a time and people...right?


----------



## Boris

I just kind of like to think of it as a rolling parts storage area....with a Bob U seat.


----------



## Saving Tempest

*It's great if you want to do a complete restoration!*

I did not. I have no clue as to the exact model Tempest, my Rollfast is and it came in about six or seven coats of primer over a red frame. I didn't get much out of carefully removing the primer. The headbadge was almost flattened and of course all color was gone. When I decided to paint I went with light and dark blue, white-apple green and white-dark blue fenders and the same green for the fork.

In all honesty, the Columbia repro tank must have been telepathic because although I had never seen a 1941 Columbia the design of the tank graphics and maybe the chainguard came out looking like a Columbia!I really like the split red reflectors a bunch as well and they go on all the bikes I've rode or sent out since.

The motorcycle panniers I used first were not very good, kept popping open while riding so now I am going to adapt the custom welded rack/pannier carrier for Saddleman saddlebags and also a late seventies Honda fairing.

IS is RAT? Seriously, In 37 years (late starter) I really don't know what a "RAT" is.

It will look even better than THIS-Where it was 43 years ago.

BTW I had to have some bracing do to the BB or it wouldn't even be here.

I wanted a 'motorcycle' bike with the Rollfast (who is Tempest), an old fashioned big fendered tank bike with custom striping and a Zephyr light for Germaine ('95 Schwinn Custom Cruiser) and I ended up with a horizontal Western Flyer tank and a small Delta torpedo-like light to mount under the basket unless I can find a longer chrome fender...I am trying to keep this one simple though and ALL have head, tail and signal lights.


----------



## rustyspoke66

Boy that,s a long read. I would just like to get back to the original post. First and foremost these bikes are 100% Americana. Another thing is the classification of rat rod or custom. I think any bike that has been taken from it's original manufactured state or condition should be considered "Custom". So even the guys restoring bikes are building custom bikes to some extent and they may be correctly restored but they usually are not. Most restorations I see have had the chrome redone in show quality triple plate and really nice shinny clear coats on the paint. Don't get me wrong I think they look great but wouldn't they still be considered custom? As far as the rat bike thing goes if a guy want's to build a bike that would be consider'd a rat bike, do some research on what makes a car a rat rod and go that direction. Otherwise you are building a custom bike. That's it, just custom and as long as you are having fun, go with it.


----------



## brownster69

*rat bikes*

jeff, you said it  i see restored bikes and they are over restored and too shinny i own a lot of vintage gas pumps and it is hard to make them look original like when they were new so i hate them compared to my original un restored pumps in my collection. same with rat rod cars i have a vintage era correct chopped/channeled model a and i built it to 50's era correct and it is not painted yet and i get the stigma nice rat rod .. and it pisses me off because it is a 50's era traditional custom hotrod. so the second  bike i am building a so called rat bike but it is not i call them hot rod custom bikes i use junky rusted house painted parts and powder coat and paint them so atleast the parts do not go to the scrap yard but on the flip side i have a lot of original un restored bikes from 1912 to 1953 that i love to death and i ride the tires off them every month so yes most of these bikes i think are customs not rat bikes.


----------



## rustyspoke66

Boy, I didn't think this post would keep guys from posting their bikes. I hope no one is taking this to heart, after all the things being said are just opinion and personal preference. Just to hopefully help clear some stuff up this section of the Cabe is called "Custom Bikes" which is just that and I hope it doesn't die from a few comments. So lets see some custom or rat bikes. Here are some examples of cars that this all came from.
RAT ROD.



Custom Crazy.



Custom with taste.



So lets get some bikes in this section and once again the pictures above are just my opinion. Not set in stone.


----------



## Saving Tempest

rustyspoke66 said:


> Boy, I didn't think this post would keep guys from posting their bikes. I hope no one is taking this to heart, after all the things being said are just opinion and personal preference. Just to hopefully help clear some stuff up this section of the Cabe is called "Custom Bikes" which is just that and I hope it doesn't die from a few comments. So lets see some custom or rat bikes. Here are some examples of cars that this all came from.
> RAT ROD.
> So lets get some bikes in this section and once again the pictures above are just my opinion. Not set in stone.




I've got one less bike to work on since my Flyer was stolen over 2 weeks ago.

Tempest has been on hold for almost a year. It's not that hard perhaps but life owns me too much. Dad had lung cancer, we held his last reunion in July and he died December 10. I never gave the style a name, it's my bike. I've never been a full resto type anyway. The bike is for me and I'm a klutz.

I like seeing them as much as any saved from the swamp in an old barn Columbia. DO post.


----------



## 70mustangmatt

*i dont know what this is*

i saved this 1954 schwinn from the scrap heap when i was ten and its been sitting around doing nothing for the longest time until a couple weeks ago when i dug it out of the back yard i intend to put a tailfin on the fender thats why the coke cardboard is there early prefab im also looking for a cheap repop of the phantom or hornet style tanks if someone could help that'd be very nice


----------



## videoranger

I call this build a "street rod". Started with a bent and dented frame and put together a great riding seven speed cruiser. 26 mile rides are my usual Friday afternoon relaxation and this bike is very comfortable for me. I sold off quite a few complete in need of restoration bikes and held back my best complete originals for my collection. A custom or rat build can be a great way to put together a bike that suits your individual riding and styling tastes. The fun thing about a custom is that you can put together some very cool combinations of parts to make a great ride. Using what you've found is much cheaper than searching for the correct part you need. The Dyno Moto Glide is one I found on Craig's a couple weeks ago for $200 in mint condition. It's a 1999 pre- pacific cyce GT factory custom that's done very nice. I'm more into spending $200 for a super nice complete rare bike than putting big bucks into a resto.


----------



## yeshoney

*Ooozing Cool!*

My Roadmaster....


----------



## danny7147

*Define it!*

How would you define a rat bike? One modified from its original form? A non authentic bike? Or both? My bikes have won best in show at numerous events, yet not a single one is original. Authentic, maybe. The fact is, change a brake pad, it's no longer original. Grease the bearings. No longer original. And take it a step further, say that brake pad is a modern copy by some Chinese manufacturer, it could be identical, but it's not authentic. Unless you want to leave rust as rust and leave a bike sitting in a cocoon from the day it was made then we're all guilty of ratting/modding, even those with a beautiful 1895 boneshaker... Polished it? Then it's not original.


----------



## danny7147

*Poll!*

Here are two of my bikes which will prove my point... which would you say you prefer out of the two, as in, go to a show, which catches your eye first?










This one, is a 1905 Sunbeam. Totally authentic in every way, but missing a few cables. It's completely rusted out, but has the potential to be restored with sound metal underneath the rust. Always a head turner because it's 'original', but without a serious amount of restoration it will continue deteriorating and in a few more years time will end up in a little pile of rust on the workshop floor.










This is my 1950 Norman Light Roaster. The first photo is of the day I got it. Everything you see was wrong, the mudguards, brakes, even the handlebars. After a HUGE amount of money and searching, it ended up as the bike you see today. Completely unoriginal other than the frame, but LOOKS authentic. There's not a single part on it that came from another Norman Light Roadster. So does that make it modded?

As I said, change one part and it's no longer original... but if you're a restorer/collector then I can guarantee you're as guilty of destroying history and heritage as the guy who goes one step further and takes out a welding torch to one.


----------



## ozzmonaut

classicfan1 said:


> This bike sounds really nice! Got any pics?



yep. Technically a rat. 


View attachment 51900 But so is this http://s1176.photobucket.com/albums/x325/ozzmonaut/Bike%20stuff/?action=view&current=SANY0411Small.jpg


----------



## ozzmonaut

But I also see what people mean by stating the difference between custom and rat. I guess both bikes above could fit into either category. The schwinn was built from whatever I could afford, and built to ride. But with the decent paint job and chrome it could be called custom. The other bike took a ton of time and effort to build. It  was cheap but is more show than go. But a smaller front sprocket helps offset the weight of the bike. I wouldn't want to ride it more than a few miles though. While it looks ratty, it is probably more of a custom. Can we start a new category just called "Deathtraps"?


----------



## Craiggo

Im glad I found this thread!

This is my first time visiting this site in about 8 months. I became a member over at RatRodBikes.com last July and I left this site in the dust which I kinda feel bad about . I really like the community over there and it is fun to see everyone's different styles and design.  This site I realized would break my bank. My Buildoff bike features a DX frame that was very far gone. many of you, i'm sure would have just tossed it in the scrap. 

I have much more to say, but im sure it has already been said on the last 6 1/2 pages. we ratrodders dont destroy history, we simply regenerate it with our own personality. personally, all my bikes were headed to the metal pile. dont go attacking US for ruining history.


----------



## fordsnake

*Radical Rat Rod*

For the past month I’ve been working on a build over on the Rat-Rod site. And I must say, the participation there has given me a new understanding and perspective of the Rat Rod community and their camaraderie.

Unlike the CABE forum which is entrenched in the preservation and the restoration of classic bicycles. The Rat Rod forum is dedicated to builders and creative minded folks that thrive in a world of imagination; modification, and crafting. These guys are the embodiment of experimentation and the “what if” school of thinking…what if I try this” or “what if I do this?” Their mantra is “ I’ve got nothing to lose! ” Plus they're extremely supportive of each other’s vision, no matter how big or small the idea…all negativity is checked at the door.

Their community reminds me much of the 1800’s Impressionist artists, whose works were viewed as unacceptable, and radical for violating the rules of academic painting by the pretentious and conservative Académie des Beaux-Arts Salon. These early Impressionists and their adherents argued there was a different way of seeing things, and they sought out new styles and techniques that was outside of traditions!

“Outside of the box thinking” was the inspiration for my build…If you'd like you can follow my progress at: http://www.ratrodbikes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=67&t=57039

Parts that were used:
Frame & Tank: 1940’s CWC Hawthorne
Front suspension fork: 1960’s Sears Spaceliner
Crank arm: 1930’s Monark Dogleg
Sprocket: 1900’s Pierce
Headlight: 1930’s Delta Car Spotlight
Handlebars: 1900’s Race Bars
Stem: 1930’s Iver Johnson
Pedals: 1900's Torrington Rat Trap
Seat: 1930’s Troxel pan
Rims: 1960’s Murrays with New Departure hubs & brake
Tires: Carlisle Darts


----------



## yeshoney

Rollin' Art Baby!

Love the vision and execution.  The three kidney bean sprocket looks right at home on this build!

Little of this and a little of that!

VOILA!


----------



## dfa242

fordsnake said:


> For the past month I’ve been working on a build over on the Rat-Rod site. And I must say, the participation there has given me a new understanding and perspective of the Rat Rod community and their camaraderie.
> 
> Unlike the CABE forum which is entrenched in the preservation and the restoration of classic bicycles. The Rat Rod forum is dedicated to builders and creative minded folks that thrive in a world of imagination; modification, and crafting. These guys are the embodiment of experimentation and the “what if” school of thinking…what if I try this” or “what if I do this?” Their mantra is “ I’ve got nothing to lose! ” Plus they're extremely supportive of each other’s vision, no matter how big or small the idea…all negativity is checked at the door.
> 
> Their community reminds me much of the 1800’s Impressionist artists, whose works were viewed as unacceptable, and radical for violating the rules of academic painting by the pretentious and conservative Académie des Beaux-Arts Salon. These early Impressionists and their adherents argued there was a different way of seeing things, and they sought out new styles and techniques that was outside of traditions!
> 
> “Outside of the box thinking” was the inspiration for my build…If you'd like you can follow my progress at: http://www.ratrodbikes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=67&t=57039




Really cool job, Man - I especially like the tribal paint and your willingness to share details of your technique.


----------



## fordsnake

yeshoney said:


> Rollin' Art Baby!
> 
> Love the vision and execution.  The three kidney bean sprocket looks right at home on this build!
> 
> Little of this and a little of that!
> 
> VOILA!





dfa242 said:


> Really cool job, Man - I especially like the tribal paint and your willingness to share details of your technique.



Thanks guys, I’m humbled by your appreciation…it was a fun project! I purchased the bare frame sans the tank a few months ago from a member here on the CABE. I initially thought I would restore it, but then changed my mind and felt it was a perfect candidate for the RRB build-off. Besides I can always convert it to it’s original appearance if I’d want to


----------



## Carbon

From my experience, having as many of the old bikes now as I do, many of them original parts can't be found. I personally prefer to customize my bikes keeping them mostly era correct, not so much rat them. I've never been one that likes anything stock or original though all the same, being an oldschool hotrodder, the same applies to bikes for me. Why wouldn't you want to take something that looks like this,...




And make it look like this,...








Urethane base coat clear coat, 100 times better quality then the old enamel paint that came on these bikes. The original wheels and fenders were rusted beyond use. If you can't put the bike back all original with the original parts that came on that specific bike, why bother.


----------



## Terry66

I have original bikes, restored bikes, custom bikes and have built rat bikes. I evaluate every bike I get my hands on and make a decision based on the bike's condition, worth before/after restoration, etc. Some I decide to not bother with and just sell. It just depends on the bike. I guess I don't get the big deal either way. 

As far as posting rat bikes, here is a before/after of a '51 Higgins I found with house paint and wheels that were shot.


----------



## mnick2112

*Rat, Custom, Restored or Original???*

Hello CABE members,

I consider myself more of a rat rodder, but also equal parts restorer and custom bike builder. I totally agree with all sides here and it is sometimes a shame to take a balloon classic and do some of the stuff that is done to them. It is also a shame to let sit, bikes that need to be saved (rat or restored). End of the day, I try to do both. Some bikes are meant to stay original like my 1952 Cycle Truck with original paint:





Or this 1927 Mead Ranger I am happy with just the way it is, but still looking for the original trusses, kickstand, light and grips:





Or this 1941 Colson redo because I bought it with paint brush paint:





Or a full blown custom JC Higgins that I did not weld or modify, but still have a total custom look and feel without damaging the original bike in any way. To me, my Higgins is a total Rat Rod and I love it:





I think at the end of the day, it is variety that makes all of us simply love bikes. Rat Rod, Classic or weekend warrior, bikes keep the world going around. That and the railroad system, LOL.


----------



## Sulley

This is my latest RAT BIKE. 1958 Columbia built GoodYear Hiway Patrol. Sat out side for 20 some years, recovered the seat with an old green tshirt, put on a new set of all green tires and grips and its a rider, total price $45  cant bet that with a stick. LOL   Sulley


----------



## axsepul

azhearseguy said:


> Most Rat rodders take the bikes that are to far gone to be restored, or bicycles that have little to no collectors value.. plus if you hang on to everthing to preserve them, you will end up getting a visit from the producers of horders!..lol




I agree, plus you will make a one of a kind bike that no body else has.


----------



## uncle stretch

Its kinda always been there was here and then there was over there. Two totally different 
views on old bikes. I always thought we both had our place in the bike world. We do with what 
we have and yall wait for that one ...you hardly never find one of those parts...and restore a bike
back to its former original glory. Sometime in my early bike hacking career I decided if we kept
hacking up old stuff that we were doing a disservice to history. I decided I could take tubing and 
build my own frames and reap the benefits of custom builds without damaging history. So I do.


----------



## ricky123

For me classic bicycles are those about which I can trace their history aand get to know the characteristics that make them unique, after which I take initiative in purchase


----------



## cyclonecoaster.com

*Boardtrack racer -- my Rat Rod Bike*

*Had this frame for a while -- just the frame & fork since the rest of the bicycle was rusted to well beyond - wrong fork - wrong fenders - correct 24" wheels - but rusted though & the rest was what you see in the top photo - the rest of the pics are what it tuned into - A RIDER* - I built it up recently so I could ride it - nothing was altered to achieve this look -* so if someone who doesn't like the Rat Rod look wants to give me all the original missing parts - I will gladly bring it back to an original bicycle* - but seeing how impossible it is to locate the parts for these 1935 Silverking window framed bicycles - I don't think I will get the parts anytime soon - *Some day I will have all the correct parts - until then or in the meanwhile I will enjoy my Copperking conversion whenever I can* -- RIDE VINTAGE -- Frank


----------



## jackomeano

*Rat rod Girardengo*

Thats right im gonna rat out my 1950 Girardengo 3 speed !  And MAYBE MY LAZZARETTI...


----------



## Saving Tempest

*Well, if this is rat, it's decent rat...*

and it's at the LBS getting a new headset after about 60 years.

[video=youtube;qQZzTrTRe9s]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQZzTrTRe9s[/video]


----------



## jwm

If an old bike is mostly toast, then rat away! I love custom anything! What Frank did is a textbook example. If it's close enough to original, and clean enough to ride as-is, then ride as-is. If it needs a restore, and you're willing to go the distance on the project then restore. I for one, love seeing the better-than-original restorations with professional paint jobs, new chrome, reupholstered saddle and the works.

The only thing in this hobby that burns me up is seeing a beautiful survivor, a bike in good shape that's got all the original parts, get parted out for profit. To me, that displays a craven, crass, and mercenary lack of values.  It destroys a piece of Americana for the sake of a few bucks in someone's pocket. There is an example or two in the sales section right now. And, just so I'm clear- I have no objection to parting out some frankenbike, or a bike that's mostly stripped to begin with, or one that is missing so much stuff that it's not worth a restoration.

JWM


----------



## Saving Tempest

Tempest has plenty of scratches and dings! She sat in my shed for about four years because I'm slow and methodical and overloaded with stuff and my dad was dying from lung cancer the whole time. I almost died of renal failure July 18th from 'lithium sickness' and the heat! But my birthday was June 26th and that was my goal to get on the road, which I did.

Along the way I collected all of the things I wanted to put on the bike...the Honda fairing, custom welded rack, trim rings from the previous 'saddlebags' and real Saddleman saddlebags I found on eBay some time ago.

Here is that rack and saddlebags, ready to mount.


----------



## michelleclark

Rat rodders take the bikes that are to far gone to be restored, or bicycles that have little to no collectors value.Majority though do take bikes that would go to the scrap heap and give them new life again and I would much rather see an old bicycle being ridden and enjoyed  than scrapped.


http://www.welovekohsamui.com/things-to-do-on-kohsamui/activities/bars/


----------



## jd56

*Wow...now this is sweet  rat and I too am not a fav for rats*

Not being a Rat guy, I was surfing this evening on the bay scene and found this beautifully built stainless(?) bike. Damn this is a cool looking bike. 







here is the listing for more pics.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/vintage-bic...122?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3f1f620cb2


----------



## dougfisk

Baronvoncatonia hasn't visited the site since April 2012, yet his thread has lasted 14 months so far, with 81 posts.  _I'm in favor of _his immortalization!


----------



## PeterScherer

I saw that bike on eBay, $1,200 isn't that bad of a price actually; especially considering that custom metal work involved. Sweet bike!
Cheers,
Peter


----------



## Boris

jd56 said:


> Not being a Rat guy, I was surfing this evening on the bay scene and found this beautifully built stanless(?) bike. Damn this is a cool looking bike.




I saw that too JD. No question about this bike being slicker than s_ _t, but I do think the seat might do some serious butt pinching.


----------



## vincev

Butt pinching? something you would enjoy Marko.


----------



## Boris

Not to ignore you Vince, but I took a better look at those springs, and see that there's some sort of protective covering on them. No wait! I AM ignoring you Vince.


----------



## vincev

Sorry JD,Dave has to ruin every thread that I try to be serious on.


----------



## jd56

I figured you 2 would get in on this thread. The headlight was my draw to the bike.

But, the seat does look painfull


----------



## axsepul

Plus





Equals


----------



## hotrod62

i have seen a lot of old stock bicycles that simply just don't look good. kinda drap  rat them out and their awesome looking in the ratrod auto world you turn more heads and have way more fun with a ratrod car or truck then a stock one that most people wont drive they haul them around in fear of scratching the paint. ratrod bikes & autos are the way to go in a lot of cases that don't mean  that theirs not a place for original stock  lots of people love them my self i like the best of both worlds.............


----------



## kenspaceliners

I've always liked the look of a modified bike, you don't have to worry about seeing another bike just like yours.
All my bikes were bought as a bare frame and built up, except for the Flightliner it had the tank and springer when I bought it. I am gathering original parts for my bikes, maybe one day they will be stock again.
Kenny


----------



## jackomeano

If you can put together a bicycle that looks great and rides better, than so be it ...
Rat rod Frankin bike custom or go back to org.  Some can and some cannt not . And I can tell the difference . 2 



each thier oun.
I love to look at a well built bicycle and that is all...


----------



## Iverider

vincev said:


> If you dont like rat rods you will probably despise fixed gear bikes.I like rat rods but cringe when I see classic road bikes get their cable guides ground off,Campy components trashed ,brakes removed,etc.I saw an old Paramount completely trashed because the young rider wanted a "fixie".





That's a shame. Everyone knows that's what Varsities are for!


----------



## Saving Tempest

jd56 said:


> Not being a Rat guy, I was surfing this evening on the bay scene and found this beautifully built stainless(?) bike. Damn this is a cool looking bike.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> here is the listing for more pics.
> 
> http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5335809022&icep_item=271109459122




Looks like a theme for this seller, except this one is almost all painted but for the headlight (sorta painted


----------



## geech34-2nd

Incorrect forum for my rant, sorry


----------



## bricycle

...here I thought this thread was finally dead.


----------



## Iverider

bricycle said:


> ...here I thought this thread was finally dead.




It is. Just nerves. Nothing to worry about.


----------



## patr1ck

*What is the big arguement about?*

The real issue here is the persons individual freedoms. Yes, people died for us in order that we have free choices and expression. A bike is just a clump of metal that a person purchases. Once that purchase is made, they have the choice to make a door stop out of it, hang it in the garage with intentions of losing a few pounds with it, restore it with anal precision, or leave it as is. We all are here because we enjoy the biking hobby. We need to appreciate and respect the freedoms that we have to enjoy the hobby which ever way we want. Some people watch Donna Reed and others like Dobi Gillis. They both have merrits with respect to vintage tv shows. I prefer Dobi Gillis and Rat Fink, you can do what you want. It is your time and your dime and I respect you for it.

At a car show, I pass up all the restored 57 Chevys and zero in on the dude that made a gas tank out of a beer keg, a overflow bottle out of a Jim Beam bottle, and an air cleaner out of a beer tap. It is my choice. I love black suede paint and rust is like gold. It conforms to my life style. I am not a polished person nor do I like a polished bike or car. Way too stiff for me, but hey if you like it, go get it. yuppers






classicfan1 said:


> I don't mind Rats, but some guys are so crazy about rust, its sickening! Thats my only itch with some guys who do it. They want to keep all the rust and tear on a bike. Heck, just sand it and buy a $3 can of black spray paint at Wal-Mart. Even that would do. Rust is rust, its a form of decay.
> 
> I've seen some very nice, beautifully done Rats, but, I have also seen some ugly ducklings too.


----------



## rollfaster

*im not in favor of rat bikes....*

well, i am!this bike was missing a lot of parts and been poorly spray bombed many times.i was hoping i could find the original paint underneath but no such luck.so over a rrb in seen a zep ratted and i loved the lines of the frame so much i decided to do the same to this one.as i stripped all of the old paint off i liked the look of the bare metal so i cleared over it.if this bike was complete and original it would have been put back together that way.but it is what it is and im still not done with it.


----------



## Spence36

If it wasn't for ratting we wouldn't have mountain bikes .. Back in the late 70's a guy named Gary Fisher and his bros took old Schwinn prewar straight bar frames because of the strength and craftmanship and turned them into mountain bikes it's true look
It up!  same with the stingrays became BMX bikes !! So rat rod = progress and personality I'm a bike collector and a purist I don't restore I only buy and find original  parts for my projects prewar Schwinn  mainly !!!  but there's nothing wrong with progression and expression that's why we have bikes to begin with !!! Just please don't take a nice original paint barn find or what ever and rat it out if it's beyond saving go ahead do what ya want or sell
What ya don't like so guys like me pay too much money for rusty gold otherwise keep on peddling !!!! More power to ya !!!! 


Cruising my Prewar Schwinn


----------



## 37fleetwood

Spence36 said:


> If it wasn't for ratting we wouldn't have mountain bikes .. Back in the late 70's a guy named Gary Fisher and his bros took old Schwinn prewar straight bar frames because of the strength and craftmanship and turned them into mountain bikes it's true look
> It up!  same with the stingrays became BMX bikes !! So rat rod = progress and personality I'm a bike collector and a purist I don't restore I only buy and find original  parts for my projects prewar Schwinn  mainly !!!  but there's nothing wrong with progression and expression that's why we have bikes to begin with !!! Just please don't take a nice original paint barn find or what ever and rat it out if it's beyond saving go ahead do what ya want or sell
> What ya don't like so guys like me pay too much money for rusty gold otherwise keep on peddling !!!! More power to ya !!!!
> 
> 
> Cruising my Prewar Schwinn




I think you'll find it was as much about cheap and plentiful as it was about strength and craftsmanship... more accurate would be "Back in the late 70's a guy named Gary Fisher and his bros took old  Schwinn prewar straight bar frames because they were cheap and plentiful and they were strong enough to take the beatings given them." other frames were used on the early clunkers, the Schwinn Straight bar was so commonly used because they were everywhere.


----------



## Smoopy's

yeah, who would want a rusty piece of trash like this anyway..I guess it was because it was fun to build and a change from the norm..this is mine:


----------



## Murph68

Perfect.....the barbed wire bat sealed it for me!....sweet build......gotta figure out how to mount one of those on my dogma 65.1 for road riding this year!...haha......do they make carbon mounts for somethin like that?

Jamie


----------



## Mungthetard

*Figured I better post my princess ratrod b4 and after pics*

From sheik to  I don't even wanna tell you about what I had to cut chop add and paint to make this little princess in to what was a complete over haul but I'm happy with her


----------



## oquinn

*Remember the ultimate rat builders!!*

They were call the "Wright Brothers"


----------



## Smoopy's

Murph68 said:


> Perfect.....the barbed wire bat sealed it for me!....sweet build......gotta figure out how to mount one of those on my dogma 65.1 for road riding this year!...haha......do they make carbon mounts for somethin like that?
> 
> Jamie




LOL..thanks bud..we are working on perfecting a newer version of the old Adirondack bat holder..won't be in carbon though..


----------



## rollfaster

*Very tastefully done*



Smoopy's said:


> yeah, who would want a rusty piece of trash like this anyway..I guess it was because it was fun to build and a change from the norm..this is mine:




Great work on this bike. A perfect rat in my opinion.


----------



## scrubbinrims

oquinn said:


> They were call the "Wright Brothers"




Yeah wright...


----------



## HIGGINSFOREVER

Custom,Rat Rod,i don't know if that is what I start out to build.I just look at all these parts laying around,Frames,fenders, bars,wheels some rattle can paint and just like that I have a bike.


----------



## Tin machine

*well my 2 cents on rats*

what I Have noticed on the west coast is !! that most bikes you would consider buying are bikes that are missing fenders racks chain guards and alot for some reason are missing head badges , I said that to say this ?  anytime I Can preserve a bike to original riding patinaed state do that !! original is always more valuable and tells the history and story of that bike !! but if life gives you lemons make lemonade some times all you can do is build a Rat rod bike ...and in some ereas its a Roman thing to do ...2 cents not worth much !!!


----------



## DJ Bill

Tin machine said:


> what I Have noticed on the west coast is !! that most bikes you would consider buying are bikes that are missing fenders racks chain guards and alot for some reason are missing head badges !




That's where all those eBay goodies come from! If someone wasn't parting out bikes there wouldn't be stripped frames lying around to make rats from.. (My Roadmaster project, while hopefully prettier than an average rat bike, started out life with me that way. )

I look at the guys on eBay with rows of chainguards and wonder... what happened to the rest of those bikes..??You can't tell me the bike shops sold the owners of those bikes new chainguards and just tossed the old ones in a pile for someone to discover twenty years down the road.....I'm thinking more like they took the junkers in on slow days and stripped the saleable and easliy removed parts off them before tossing the rest...

And the fender lights or horns.........always disappear. It amazes me to see them still on a barn find. They never worked for long anyhow.   Heck the first thing I did when I got a new bike that had wheel reflectors in the 70's was take them off and hang them on the wall in the garage...( I thought I was saving weight on my Schwinn...) 

It is inevitable that somewhere, after all the goodies have been stripped off and sold, there is a stripped frame awaiting its fate as a rat.


----------



## bikewhorder

Krautwaggen said:


> It is. Just nerves. Nothing to worry about.




LOL. Kind of reminds me of this story. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mike_the_Headless_Chicken


----------



## ThegoodThebad&Therusty

I've been thinking about this bike that Smoopy's posted up thread ~ 





How did the DNA for a build like _that_ end up in Tennessee ? It oozes Miami, Cuba or even Chula Vista So. Cal. Total Cuban/Dominican/TJ influences going on there.

Well at any rate, I dig it and I think it rates it's own theme song, like to hear it ? - here it goes ~

[video=youtube;YjAvQ22_05I]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YjAvQ22_05I[/video]



pap


----------



## rustjunkie

I like bikes


----------



## mazdaflyer

As previously stated bikes in original condition may be best left as is or at most cleaned. Complete restorations are nice if you have the talent and means to do one. For some the rat or custom path satisfies the need to be creative. To me doing a rat rod provides an avenue to repurpose objects not necessarily bike related.


----------



## Saving Tempest

Smoopy's said:


> yeah, who would want a rusty piece of trash like this anyway..I guess it was because it was fun to build and a change from the norm..this is mine:




Well, yeah, that's pretty swell, but wouldn't that just attract girls, and girls are funny (Wally)?


----------



## Smoopy's

ThegoodThebad&Therusty said:


> I've been thinking about this bike that Smoopy's posted up thread ~
> 
> How did the DNA for a build like _that_ end up in Tennessee ? It oozes Miami, Cuba or even Chula Vista So. Cal. Total Cuban/Dominican/TJ influences going on there.
> 
> Well at any rate, I dig it and I think it rates it's own theme song, like to hear it ? - here it goes ~
> 
> 
> 
> pap




thanks for the comps bud and Tuco likes his new theme song..


----------



## Smoopy's

Saving Tempest said:


> Well, yeah, that's pretty swell, but wouldn't that just attract girls, and girls are funny (Wally)?




girls ARE funny but THEY sure are swell..


----------



## tailhole

37fleetwood said:


> I think you'll find it was as much about cheap and plentiful as it was about strength and craftsmanship... more accurate would be "Back in the late 70's a guy named Gary Fisher and his bros took old  Schwinn prewar straight bar frames because they were cheap and plentiful and they were strong enough to take the beatings given them." other frames were used on the early clunkers, the Schwinn Straight bar was so commonly used because they were everywhere.




Totally agree with your tweak of wording, but also about the ratting led to mtn bikes.  Same thing with race cars and just about anything else, take a stock product, strip and modify to suit the task you assign it.


----------



## fordsnake

Ok all of you hibernating rat rod members who’ve been asleep for the last 4 months! The Rat Rod Build Off 9 has finished and it’s time to reengage and cast your vote. This year the talent pool was amazing; check ‘em out, http://www.ratrodbikes.com/forum/in...ial-rrb-build-off-9-finished-bike-list.85067/ *Take a minute and Vote if you haven’t already*.


----------



## cyclingday

I just finished looking through all 38 pages of the Drag King Raceliner thread over at the Rat Rod Build off #9.
If you haven't seen it yet, do yourself a huge favor and check it out.
Most of these tend to be total rats or total customs, with not much room in between.
This one really captures the essence of what the bike was, and what the bike has become, from its original theme concept through its evolution.
Absolutely, outstanding!


----------



## bike

*A link is always most helpful!*



cyclingday said:


> i just finished looking through all 38 pages of the drag king raceliner thread over at the rat rod build off #9...!






thanks!!!!!!


----------



## kingfish254

*Rat Rod Build Off #9*

You are so right about RMan's Drag King build. It was obvious to me that his was going to be the top build early on in the Build Off. His execution and detail work are superb.

There are some incredible builds this year. You can see a finished gallery of them here - http://www.ratrodbikes.com/forum/in...ial-rrb-build-off-9-finished-bike-list.85067/


----------



## hoofhearted

fordsnake said:


> Ok all of you hibernating rat rod members who’ve been asleep for the last 4 months! The Rat Rod Build Off 9 has finished and it’s time to reengage and cast your vote. This year the talent pool was amazing; check ‘em out, http://www.ratrodbikes.com/forum/in...ial-rrb-build-off-9-finished-bike-list.85067/ *Take a minute and Vote if you haven’t already*.






*Wow-Wee-Wow-Wow .... an amazing selection of machines built 
thru creativity and craftsmanship - all.

Enigma ... #28 is my choice.  

In a design-league of it's own, while displaying attention to detail, not only 
in the manner of fabrication ... but also being very respectful to a classic frame - 
everything about the machine is built to 'bolt-on' ... and 'bolt-off' ... should 
the bicycle ever want to revert to it's original, mid-30's identity.

Very, Very NICE, Carlton (fordsnake) !!!!!!!!!!*


..........................  patric cafaro


post script ... I spent some time on that RatRod site tryin' to figure how to 
place a vote, and even became a member.  

Looked everywhere but in the correct area.  If I figure out how to vote .. I will.

If anyone here knows how to cast a vote at that RatRod site ... let us know, please.  THANKS !!!!


*The following are a few of the fotos posted at that RatRod site for Entry #28 ... Enigma*




 



 



 







 










=====================
=====================


----------



## oldwhizzer

*custom*

I agree with Pat the best bike there!Nice Job!!


----------



## Freqman1

Outstanding photography as well! Beautiful bike Carlton. V/r Shawn


----------



## hillbilly_handshake

What is considered a "rat" bike? The reason I ask is this. I'm working on motorizing a 1956 Roadmaster boys' frame. Now, I'm building from a completely care frame, no original parts I know of, save possibly the French seat post and headset bearing cups, though not sure at all. I'm using parts that I want to use, including building my own wheels. I am painting the frame black, not because everyone else does, but because it's my favorite color. The gas tank and the cable sheaths will be orange. But when I think of a rat, I think of a bike that is purposefully made to look crappy. And that's not an insult to rat bikes or those who build them, I mean that in the most artistic way possible. There is a lot of artistic media that is "purposefully crappy". All I'm saying is, I'm building my bike to look nice, it might even be a show piece. I'm not restoring the bike to any sort of original condition, but I'm trying to make it as nice as possible and with this being a motorized vehicle, my focus is primarily on functionality. So where does everyone draw the line?


----------



## bike

*To me*



hillbilly_handshake said:


> What is considered a "rat" bike? ... But when I think of a rat, I think of a bike that is purposefully made to look crappy. And that's not an insult to rat bikes or those who build them, I mean that in the most artistic way possible. There is a lot of artistic media that is "purposefully crappy". All I'm saying is, I'm building my bike to look nice, it might even be a show piece. I'm not restoring the bike to any sort of original condition, but I'm trying to make it as nice as possible and with this being a motorized vehicle, my focus is primarily on functionality. So where does everyone draw the line?




Your bike would be full on custom. Ratrods and bikes are anything  but started as making it look like the way a person of limited means 
would have done it back in the day or mimicing a boardtrack racer- they were rough and ready- street rods were super expesive chrome paint etc and not at all how it was done 

crappy is in the eye of the beholder- homebuilt and used can be a beautiful thing. That said a lot of crappy things are built to take advantage of the rat market.


----------



## williamlee111

Boy!  I'm new to this site, and I thought everyone here liked bikes.  I mean all kinds of bikes like I do. Maybe not.  If I knew this was going to be a Concourse d Elegance bike website, I might not have joined. If I go to a swap meet, and see a bare frame without a fork laying in the dirt for 40 bucks, I'm buying it and building what ever I want.  I mean I have a rescued Chicago Schwinn date of Thursday, May 26th, 1960, built between 10:00 and 10:15 Am.  It has Collegiate green paint that an automotive paint shop matched up for me, but it doesn't have fenders.  It has a Chinese crank, and bars, and eBay decals.  A buddy told me once, "You rescued a Chicago Schwinn frame and fork from the scrappers.  Well done." Well, sheesh, maybe not if you read some of the posts here. I thought I was doing a good thing.









Bicycle Belle said:


> Is about custom bikes and that's why the poster put his post here. He is entitled to his opinion as you are to yours. I would suggest maybe checking out the gallery on ratrodbikes and see what some of these guys are doing. I think you'll find a lot more than satin black paint and 144 spoke wheels. I think it would do some people good to remember that bicycles were created to be ridden, enjoyed and well used and not sit as part of some dusty collection of a person who sees only their monetary value. I'm not saying you're guilty of this or anyone else on this site is (I've met some wonderful people)
> I'm thinking that if our old bicycles could talk, they tell you of the wonderful times they've had...from the morning they were received by a happy child to the many adventures they shared. I'm also betting they'd tell you they love to do it all over again. So you go ratrodders! Rescue your bikes...ride them and love them!
> (but leave me a few of the nice girls bikes I can restore  )


----------



## Obi-Wan Schwinnobi

williamlee111 said:


> Boy!  I'm new to this site, and I thought everyone here liked bikes.  I mean all kinds of bikes like I do. Maybe not.  If I knew this was going to be a Concourse d Elegance bike website, I might not have joined. If I go to a swap meet, and see a bare frame without a fork laying in the dirt for 40 bucks, I'm buying it and building what ever I want.  I mean I have a rescued Chicago Schwinn date of Thursday, May 26th, 1960, built between 10:00 and 10:15 Am.  It has Collegiate green paint that an automotive paint shop matched up for me, but it doesn't have fenders.  It has a Chinese crank, and bars, and eBay decals.  A buddy told me once, "You rescued a Chicago Schwinn frame and fork from the scrappers.  Well done." Well, sheesh, maybe not if you read some of the posts here. I thought I was doing a good thing.



No that's cool...you saved a frame!... I think what some of the guys are talking about is the fact some ratrod guys take really nice complete bikes and destroy them by turning them into some pile of primer black crap...


----------



## Smoopy's

hey guys, just thought I would share this. My build-off bike from last year A.K.A. "Tuco" has a full feature in the upcoming issue of Ol' Skool Rodz magazine. I believe it goes on sale Oct. 4th or 7th..just watch your local newsstand..hell, if you send me your copy, I'll even autograph it for you..LOL..anyway, to me it's a big deal since this puts bicycles in the limelight right along with the custom car/ hot rod culture..I just hope it leads to many more bikes being featured along with the talented builders who build them..here's the issue:


----------



## videoranger

Very cool magazine feature article, CONGRATS! Ride Low and Ride Slow.


----------



## mick5cents

Smoopy,That is my favorite rat bike ever.Congrats


----------



## partsguy

SJ_BIKER said:


> One never knows when the next aerocycle or bluebird might be born with all the creative ideas out there that will define the generation of a time and people...right?




I wish you were right, but the only creative ideas I see from my 20-something generation is...iPhone updates. They're convenient to have but they don't "wow" me in anyway. On Thanksgiving and the Friday after, I stay home with my family and chat with friends. Those gadgets sure aren't winning me over enough to trample children and fight other adults...poo on all that commercialism


----------



## partsguy

Smoopy's said:


> hey guys, just thought I would share this. My RRB build-off bike from last year A.K.A. "Tuco" has a full feature in the upcoming issue of Old Skool Rodz magazine. I believe it goes on sale Oct. 4th or 7th..just watch your local newsstand..To me it's a big deal since this puts bicycles in the limelight right along with the custom car/ hot rod culture..I just hope it leads to many more bikes being featured along with the talented builders who build them..here's a sneek peek spy photo of the issue (special thanks to Alan a.k.a. Decotriumph for the great write-up and opportunity :




Nice job, bro!

Cute girl on the cover too!


----------



## Mike G

*RE: I'm not in favor of rat bikes...*

This is just my two cents on the whole "Rat Bike" scenario... Just my opinion, don't start shooting!

I am kind of in the feeling that the term "Rat" gets used a bit loosely, being used to describe rides that don't get any sort of restoration effort. When actually the whole "Rat" thing is a kind'a sub culture, sort of an American based Rocker theme, without the café racer bikes. An amalgamation of vintage, retro rockabilly, nostalgic cool, Von Dutchified... all without the price tag of glitz and shiny chrome. It's obviously a genre that's widely accepted in automotive circles, just go to any hotrod, VW, or vintage car show, "Rat" rides are usually there in growing numbers. So it's only natural that the genre would translate into the motorcycle and as the OP brought up with the original post, ultimately bicycles. When I say the term gets used a bit "loosely" and example of that was one post that said if it wasn't for "Rats" there wouldn't be any MTB's. Well to me that really wasn't any kind of "Rat" effort, that was all done out of necessity to meet demands with what was available. Yes, kind'a the same theory as "Rat" but the aesthetic wasn't their prime objective. On the flip side of that coin, a rust covered barn find may be "Ratty" but in the original context of the term, without the utilization of what's on hand and again a specific targeted aesthetic it's not necessarily "Rat", just old and rusty... it's a fine line though between "Ratty" and "Rat".

Love it, hate it, it's a culture with an art form all it's own.

BTW "Smoopy's", awesome example of "RAT" ified! and congrats on getting it published!

Again this is all just one guy's opinion


----------



## TRM

cyclingday said:


> I just finished looking through all 38 pages of the Drag King Raceliner thread over at the Rat Rod Build off #9.
> If you haven't seen it yet, do yourself a huge favor and check it out.
> Most of these tend to be total rats or total customs, with not much room in between.
> This one really captures the essence of what the bike was, and what the bike has become, from its original theme concept through its evolution.
> Absolutely, outstanding!




Thank you cyclingday! 

I'm still new here, so it came as a great surprise to stumble onto this comment! It's very rewarding to find such a nice compliment that was completely _unsolicited_. I know that some people campaign for recognition and subsequent votes in these build-offs, but because I was not a member here during that time, it is especially gratifying to read yours and the other compliments posted here for my build!

Thanks again to you and everyone else for the kind words!

Here's a current picture of 'DRAG KING'.


----------



## phantom

Love the Rat Phantom........here is my attempt at a custom like I had has a kid.


----------



## bricycle

TRM said:


> Thank you cyclingday!
> 
> I'm still new here, so it came as a great surprise to stumble onto this comment! It's very rewarding to find such a nice compliment that was completely _unsolicited_. I know that some people campaign for recognition and subsequent votes in these build-offs, but because I was not a member here during that time, it is especially gratifying to read yours and the other compliments posted here for my build!
> 
> Thanks again to you and everyone else for the kind words!
> 
> Here's a current picture of 'DRAG KING'.




I'm not big on customs... but Drag King is Reeeeeaalllyyyy KOOL!!!!!


----------



## TRM

bricycle said:


> I'm not big on customs... but Drag King is Reeeeeaalllyyyy KOOL!!!!!




Thanks! I really appreciate the complement coming from someone that's 'not big on customs'.


----------



## mazdaflyer

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## the tinker

Really Nice!!   Nice pipes.  :o


----------



## the tinker

*another one saved*











I had a poorly repaired Hawthorne frame.  really bad weld job where frame broke and was repaired by way too much brazing rod piled on.  I considered throwing this frame out it looked so bad.  I saw this tank setting under a table at a swap meet. every one had passed it by.  the guy wanted 10 bucks for it!  wasnt rusted, I didnt know what it fit, but for 10 bucks I bought it.   
 Of course the only frame it fit was the ratty hawthorne.
Lots of grinding later I got the bad welds looking excellent.  striped off two coats of house and paint lots of rust.  Added 1950 Huffy fenders, a 49 Buick hood ornament, the hocky stick guard 
and a coke bottle opener I found nosing thru the trash.    
The only way this bike got saved was because of the tank.  I put it together Christmas week, and just brought it out today. too icey to ride though.    Another old bike saved!


----------



## Saving Tempest

BRAVO!!!


----------



## COB

Nice save for the tinker!


----------



## Jaypem

Great old thread !
I'm sure that many of the opinions stated here remain unchanged, but I suspect that there are 
quite a few who have had their eyes opened to some degree by the sheer awesomeness that
a well executed Rat bike can deliver!

This years build off winner, TRM's Decoluxe !
( Go to ratrodbikes.com and check out the whole build start to finish !)




Maybe here at the Cabe, that subtle line between OG and Rat would be appreciated most...
Here's a bit of both!


----------



## Mark Allard

Interesting topic.....the reality of the matter is most of us doing "Rat Rods" rarely alter a bike to the point that they could not be returned to original condition. Also we are widely responsible for many of the restorers being able to find their restorations. All those parts you sell to fund your restorations are the parts we buy to build our Rats. Likewise most of the parts we buy are the parts that are far too gone for a restorer to use or too common to be of interest. Also while building these Rats our interest and knowledge of the originals grows and most of us will do a restoration at some point. Here is a pic of my JC Higgins Flightliner I have named the "Flatliner" all the parts used were salvaged.


----------



## StoneWoods

mazdaflyer said:


> *Custom or Rat???*
> 
> I reading through the posts in this thread, I'm now confused.  When is a custom a custom and not a rat bike.  When is a rat bike a rat bike and not a custom. How do I categorize these...
> 
> *Custom or Rat??? *
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *Custom or Rat??? *



 I say traditional custom on both


----------



## Mark Allard

A RAT has more to do with the method of build rather than appearance of the finished product. A RAT uses existing parts to achieve a cohesive finished product. A custom uses more scratch built fabrication. Many say mine are not RATS because they have too polished of an appearance. This is just my opinion its not written in stone anywhere. In reality its probably just a matter of how much of a bike snob one is.


----------



## spoker

one custom,one rat


----------



## Jaypem

Mark Allard....very very excellent builds!
Are they all yours? The moto-bike is killer !!


----------



## phantom

The only "semi - rat' more of a custom that I did. Just like one I had in the day. Late 50's


----------



## King Louie

I think to change the appearance of a bike other than its original state is a form of expressing ones self weather it be a custom or rat rod or even s Klunker build , I too love a complete original bike as much as customizing a bike to my personal liking . I could live with myself either way ! Lol


----------



## bicycle larry

the tinker said:


> *another one saved*
> 
> View attachment 192367View attachment 192368View attachment 192369View attachment 192370
> 
> I had a poorly repaired Hawthorne frame.  really bad weld job where frame broke and was repaired by way too much brazing rod piled on.  I considered throwing this frame out it looked so bad.  I saw this tank setting under a table at a swap meet. every one had passed it by.  the guy wanted 10 bucks for it!  wasnt rusted, I didnt know what it fit, but for 10 bucks I bought it.
> Of course the only frame it fit was the ratty hawthorne.
> Lots of grinding later I got the bad welds looking excellent.  striped off two coats of house and paint lots of rust.  Added 1950 Huffy fenders, a 49 Buick hood ornament, the hocky stick guard
> and a coke bottle opener I found nosing thru the trash.
> The only way this bike got saved was because of the tank.  I put it together Christmas week, and just brought it out today. too icey to ride though.    Another old bike saved!
> 
> View attachment 192367
> 
> View attachment 192368
> 
> View attachment 192369
> 
> View attachment 192370



not an


the tinker said:


> *another one saved*
> 
> View attachment 192367View attachment 192368View attachment 192369View attachment 192370
> 
> I had a poorly repaired Hawthorne frame.  really bad weld job where frame broke and was repaired by way too much brazing rod piled on.  I considered throwing this frame out it looked so bad.  I saw this tank setting under a table at a swap meet. every one had passed it by.  the guy wanted 10 bucks for it!  wasnt rusted, I didnt know what it fit, but for 10 bucks I bought it.
> Of course the only frame it fit was the ratty hawthorne.
> Lots of grinding later I got the bad welds looking excellent.  striped off two coats of house and paint lots of rust.  Added 1950 Huffy fenders, a 49 Buick hood ornament, the hocky stick guard
> and a coke bottle opener I found nosing thru the trash.
> The only way this bike got saved was because of the tank.  I put it together Christmas week, and just brought it out today. too icey to ride though.    Another old bike saved!
> 
> View attachment 192367
> 
> View attachment 192368
> 
> View attachment 192369
> 
> View attachment 192370



not another one tinker dave , its super nice I like it , good talking to you to day tinker dave keep them comeing ,I no you got more surprisess!!! for us cabers!!!!!  from bicycle larry


----------



## Saving Tempest

Dudes, he had quite a few things I liked and would want on Beryl, like the rack and tank. Even if it's black I saw the Troxel seat I want on eBay. Troxels are my official favorite seats.


----------



## Barto

View attachment 440762 Like my Hot Rod, I build my Bicycles and Motorcycles for me with my money, and my sweat.  It's none of anyone's business what or how I do it.  I build these things to make me happy.  I used to show my 1958 FLH Harey Davidson but got tired of everyone telling me what they would do if it was theirs.  I Build both Stock and Rats and enjoy both.


----------



## BLWNMNY

I like them all too, I have my fair share.


----------



## Pauliemon

Wow! And the debate rages on for 6 years. I like bikes! Custom, motorized, restored, rat, just bikes. I lean towards the custom, rat, motorized. I do not restore bikes. But I will be happy to come over and oggle at your restored bike. Now I'm gonna go weld some big ugly brackets on my 41 Autocycle frame. Just kidding.


----------



## Pauliemon

I think my attraction (read: addiction) to crusty rusties is because that's what we had as kids. No one in my neighborhood had a fancy Schwinn. If we were lucky enough to get a new bike it was a basic model. If you had a bike you'd start saving for some ape hanger, shorty fenders, lay back seatpost, etc. We weren't poor, just working class families.


----------



## RJWess

Me like Rat Bikes.


----------



## Boris

Cleveland Welding and Colson Light Custom Rats Before, After and In-between.


----------



## the tinker

Nice job Dave. These "patina'd" bikes are great. Pick up a bare bones frame or rusty bucket and build a rider out of it.don't have to worry about it falling over. What we should do is go to Indiana , stop by Vince's place and steal his primo bikes and make "rats" out of them
That Colson is my favorite.


----------



## the tinker

Hey, Are those the fender braces that were hanging in my garage?


----------



## Boris

the tinker said:


> Hey, Are those the fender braces that were hanging in my garage?



They most certainly are. Did I do OK? Funny thing about that Colson. When I picked it up, I told the seller that I'd send him photos when I completed the bike. Well, after about two years the bike finally got completed. I called him and asked if he'd still like to see some photos. He did, so I sent them. I never did hear a word back. I don't think these were quite the results he was expecting to see.


----------



## kwoodyh

Love that bike RJ, but I don't see a "Rat" I see a 1st gen MTB style, when I think "Rat" I see in my minds eye something that is basically unridable with just silly things affixed to it?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## vincev

the tinker said:


> Nice job Dave. These "patina'd" bikes are great. Pick up a bare bones frame or rusty bucket and build a rider out of it.don't have to worry about it falling over. What we should do is go to Indiana , stop by Vince's place and steal his primo bikes and make "rats" out of them
> That Colson is my favorite.



You are always welcome but the Portland Pinhead......well maybe not so much.


----------



## Bob Yearick

Rat bike is not a lazy custom build. I see it as preservation of patina. They are only new once. Like us they age over time. To see the checked paint. The fading of finish and tarnishing of metal is a badge of honer. Anyone with money can restore a bike to new. But it takes true time and use to make a Rat. I love both the restored and the preserved bike.


----------



## vincev

Dave Marko said:


> They most certainly are. Did I do OK? Funny thing about that Colson. When I picked it up, I told the seller that I'd send him photos when I completed the bike. Well, after about two years the bike finally got completed. I called him and asked if he'd still like to see some photos. He did, so I sent them. I never did hear a word back. I don't think these were quite the results he was expecting to see.



Which bike did you polish and wax the spokes on ?


----------



## the tinker

Another project started today.... Picked up this frame on Sat. at a swap for 40 bucks. Nice &straight, but rusty , old straight-bar frame.



Looked like an old Ranger.Took some "Goof-Off and removed the frame darts that had been painted over original darts.


There was a faint outlione of a round Ranger badge and some original "Ranger brown" paint still left.

Removed the paint and 90 years of rust.& Found a 36 Ranger chrome fork in the basement.....

 

Shot a coat of red primer on it. This will be the start of a nice "Bomber."....no fenders,no restoration, just a rider.


----------



## kwoodyh

Another one under two wheels, that's what I like to see! You staying ruddy brown or something else in satin?


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----------



## the tinker

kwoodyh said:


> Another one under two wheels, that's what I like to see! You staying ruddy brown or something else in satin?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



I don't know, decisions,decisions...... I'm thinking right now of dark maroon with ivory "One Shot" original type frame darts.
Flat bottom spring saddle, some drop center rims and vintage balloon tires. A bobbed rear fender would look nice too.
I just got an  early 50's Buick hood ornament, also have the top rear chrome fender bezel off a 53 Olds 88 . Would like to work one of those into a bike somehow.  Whatever, it will be fun


----------



## vincev

the tinker said:


> I don't know, decisions,decisions...... I'm thinking right now of dark maroon with ivory "One Shot" original type frame darts.
> Flat bottom spring saddle, some drop center rims and vintage balloon tires. A bobbed rear fender would look nice too.
> I just got an  early 50's Buick hood ornament, also have the top rear chrome fender bezel off a 53 Olds 88 . Would like to work one of those into a bike somehow.  Whatever, it will be fun



no lake pipes ??


----------



## the tinker

You mean these?


vincev said:


> no lake pipes ??






 I don't have this bike anymore. The new owner didn't like the pipes.......but I still have them.....hmmmmm, that gives me a idea.  Thanks for reminding me about these pipes Vince


----------



## Pauliemon

Dave Marko said:


> They most certainly are. Did I do OK? Funny thing about that Colson. When I picked it up, I told the seller that I'd send him photos when I completed the bike. Well, after about two years the bike finally got completed. I called him and asked if he'd still like to see some photos. He did, so I sent them. I never did hear a word back. I don't think these were quite the results he was expecting to see.



LOL! These are not the droids you're looking for,...


----------



## kingfish254

Rat Bikes Are Fun


----------



## rick whitehurst

How's about a girls CWC with the dress cut off and replaced with a pair of pants. And a beehive springer. And a cheap seat.   Still a work in progress.


----------



## removed

baronvoncatania said:


> Sorry! I know i'm going to raise some hackels, But I have to ask, why would you want what was a beautiful piece of americana balloon tire bike and make it into something it never was? NO OFFENSIVE! but wouldn't it be better to return it to it's original glory? and preserve it's history?
> 
> I understand it take a LOT of money to do it right, but can't you just do the minimun to preserve it until you, or someone else can restore it properly?
> 
> jim c.



Right on!!!  Rat rodding wastes antiques!


----------



## BLWNMNY

CRIPPLE said:


> Right on!!!  Rat rodding wastes antiques!



To each his own.


----------



## RLS

I read through this.... all 9 pages
I gotta be honest, I have seen a lot of negative and ignorantly biased opinions that would have been best never aired out.
_*As the saying goes opinions are like....... everyone has one*_, But I gotta be honest and complete that old phrase and in doing so say,
_*Some are completely full of crap and suffer from profuse and perpetual diarrhea *_
  I have also seen Many (more) that are well placed.
  As for the 56 Tiger Ratrotter I am project manager/mechanic of on behalf of a friend.... He initially did think about doing a custom semi restoration.
  The thing is, he picked the bike up for $15 from a Craigslist ad......there was no pictures, just a temping one liner "1950s Schwinn Cruiser"
Upon viewing the parted out bike with him, we established that it was in fact a 50's but it was during the stripping I was able to uncover the burried truth. With so many layers of paint, years of neglect and abuse it just didn't feel right to do a full resto to Me.
  The bike in total was mostly complete, Ashtabula forks with some out of center bending to both (placed the front rim about 1 1/2 off center and rubbing)
 the rear fender missing, front fender rusted chrome and layered paints just generally shot to hell, the rims by all sourced info are not likely even Schwinn (could be idk), a Schwinn racing type saddle that my best guess is from a 70' collegiate or suburban based on the rubber formed cover and riveted in Schwinn Approved rear plate and also having Saddle bag eyelts under it, and the bars were OE type Tiger replica/repops.
  I sent him WIP pics of the stripped frame and asked what color he was doing since the original color was definitely and early version of translucent red over silver, commenting that it looked kinda baddass the way it sat. Keeping in mind for the strip down I had knocked out all four of the frame bearing cups.
 (the steertube ones actually fell out with the fork, I had to gently re hammer and roll the head tube in to hold them properly during rough fit mockup)

  To my surprise, he loved it " Oh F**K yeah dude! Do it! You're the boss.....make her mean!"
So in short to my surprise it really does fit the bike in the nature it was found. It is on its way to looking tough as nails, and war torn as if it was a Vietnam napalm survivor.
  The rear rim was salvageable after torching the nipples red hot and giving them a careful tweak and a quick oil quench after freeing up.... there was no truing the rim between the paint and rust not allowing them to budge prior. For the record no part of this bike has been forcibly modified in any way....just a few things swapped out such as 70' Shcwinn trike handlebars, the 50's Shcwinn DX truss assembly and solid cast steel steer stem from that John Deere themed POS that no one seems to be able to definitely identify or support there claims with info I can look at and validate.
(Yeah BTW that ugly cat came back, it sits in my basement while I cook up a dose of crazy to toss at it)

However following suit with alot of the negative nellies around here being jerks about rat bikes or rat rods in general...... I am to a degree on your side. However it is specificaly to you whom are being jerks about it that I say this: " function over form" 
  A bike is worthless if it ends in a scrap pile to be crushed or melted down, so have the sensability to enjoy the fact it is at least still being loved!

Always worry about function before giving on rusted rats arse towards what it looks like! I won't deny having seen alot of disgusting half baked BS given the label rat, custom, or chopper that I would sooner laugh hysterically and mock the builder as I wonder how drunk they were while building it> JS!
  I am a traditional semi-purist if it cost to much to restore outright but is at least worth the vision to save a little history, then take the desire and save its function.

Chopper is in no way indicative of excess rake and forks longer than the frame.... I blame trendy dipsticks for raping classic terms.
It is postwar in origin from when the troops came back from war and kept their Harleys and Indians, seeing how them bikes were pushed hard where roads may not have existed and rattled themselves stupid on pavement.... most military add-ons were welded on. Seeing all was welded on and the idea of "WON'T USE IT-- LOSE IT" everything had to be CHOPPED OFF, and as a civilian these things No longer served any purpose other than dead weight to slow the bike down The true American Chopper was born.

Same said for a ratter, a rat build is a No budget build, or any money put towards it is minimal and mandatory mostly for function. The term is based on scavenging like a rat, or digging through scrap piles or a packrat parts bin to pillage usable stuffs....doesnt matter what or where from only that it will work modifications needed or not.
TBH I am highly offended by the lame builds with nonsensical crap pinned onto them for no reason and misuse of the terms chopper and rat. 
A fine example of a typical  rat repair would be a piece of coffee can tin to patch a horribly rotted out section of tank, fender, or chaingaurd not solder filled as it would cost you time using a torch flux and solder.....this is an ultra low/no budget build we are talking about here!


----------



## RLS

kingfish254 said:


> Rat Bikes Are Fun
> 
> View attachment 490437



Sorry FISH...That ain't No rat.
That is a custom built frame with old parts bolted to it. I ain't blind, I see the fresh welder burns, and know enough to know what I am looking at.
  She is a nice one though!


----------



## kingfish254

RLS said:


> Sorry FISH...That ain't No rat.
> That is a custom built frame with old parts bolted to it. I ain't blind, I see the fresh welder burns, and know enough to know what I am looking at.
> She is a nice one though!




Who ever said that a Rat has to be an old frame?


----------



## RLS

kingfish254 said:


> Who ever said that a Rat has to be an old frame?
> 
> View attachment 819167



Lmmfao, pretty much anyone into the Street Rod and American Muscle Classics Scene or at least has a functional understanding of what Makes a RAT exactly that

Silly trendies tend to get on my nerves...... nothing personal.
 As Badass nice as it is....Your bike is just a one off custom no closer to being a RAT bike than a rusty washer is to being a quarter JMHO


----------



## bikewhorder

RLS said:


> Lmmfao, pretty much anyone into the Street Rod and American Muscle Classics Scene or at least has a functional understanding of what Makes a RAT exactly that
> 
> Silly trendies tend to get on my nerves...... nothing personal.
> As Badass nice as it is....Your bike is just a one off custom no closer to being a RAT bike than a rusty washer is to being a quarter JMHO




I'm not even quite sure what you're saying, but I'm vaguely offended and beginning to understand why discussing the definition of a Rat Rod Bike, is not allowed.on the RRB forum.


----------



## kingfish254

RLS said:


> Lmmfao, pretty much anyone into the Street Rod and American Muscle Classics Scene or at least has a functional understanding of what Makes a RAT exactly that
> 
> Silly trendies tend to get on my nerves...... nothing personal.
> As Badass nice as it is....Your bike is just a one off custom no closer to being a RAT bike than a rusty washer is to being a quarter JMHO




Funny man, no sweat off of my back. I've been enjoying bikes on ratrodbikes for almost 8 years, so I don't think I fall under the category of a "silly trendy". I don't even necessarily try to make a bike ratty or otherwise. I just have fun building cool bikes. That is actually the main point of building bikes out of old or unusual parts over there. Just to have fun and not to worry about how any "experts" judge the applicability of any label to your build.
 My one and only take away is one of your earlier quotes "*As the saying goes opinions are like....... everyone has one"  :eek:*


----------



## the tinker

RLS said:


> Lmmfao, pretty much anyone into the Street Rod and American Muscle Classics Scene or at least has a functional understanding of what Makes a RAT exactly that
> 
> Silly trendies tend to get on my nerves...... nothing personal.
> As Badass nice as it is....Your bike is just a one off custom no closer to being a RAT bike than a rusty washer is to being a quarter JMHO




Am I missing something here?  Where's some photos of your  "many" creations? I don't see too many posted here.  What does Kingfish have to do to make his bike right in your eyes, paint it all flat black? Or maybe take all the paint off, and leave it bare?
So you give a compliment, then in the next line bash his creation....sad.

My friend, Mike Alexander....Custom King


----------



## RLS

the tinker said:


> Am I missing something here?  Where's some photos of your  "many" creations? I don't see too many posted here.  What does Kingfish have to do to make his bike right in your eyes, paint it all flat black? Or maybe take all the paint off, and leave it bare?
> So you give a compliment, then in the next line bash his creation....sad.




Tssk tssk, not bashing at all.
I don't much care for labels, but if one must label at least do so accurately.  FYI, Flat or Bare finish hardly makes a Rat.
  I am quite impressed by the bike in general.
Cleaely there is much thought, time, skills, and effort into such a unique frame that carries the grace of an old cantilever style in its curves, but the brashness and brutality of being able to run FAT Tires .... It is a custom not a Rat.
NUFF Said


----------



## Sven

_Is this a  Rat Bike?_


----------



## removed

Ridiculous


----------



## kingfish254

No worries at all RLS. We are simply talking about a difference of OPINIONS. Anyone that builds a RAT bike or a CUSTOM or a CUSTOM RAT or any other flavor of fun bike, doesn't do so for approval or validation based on your "definition" i.e. "OPINION" of those terms. 
Ride On!
Rat On!
NUFF SAID


----------



## Sven




----------



## removed

kingfish254 said:


> No worries at all RLS. We are simply talking about a difference of OPINIONS. Anyone that builds a RAT bike or a CUSTOM or a CUSTOM RAT or any other flavor of fun bike, doesn't do so for approval or validation based on your "definition" i.e. "OPINION" of those terms.
> Ride On!
> Rat On!
> NUFF SAID



Ok mr nuff  said.   What a goof


----------



## Kickstand3

Sven said:


> View attachment 819258
> _Is this a  Rat Bike?_




KOOL


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


----------



## kingfish254

CRIPPLE said:


> Ok mr nuff  said.   What a goof



Ridiculous


----------



## vincev

"Dave Marko said: ↑
They most certainly are. Did I do OK? Funny thing about that Colson. When I picked it up, I told the seller that I'd send him photos when I completed the bike. Well, after about two years the bike finally got completed. I called him and asked if he'd still like to see some photos. He did, so I sent them. I never did hear a word back. I don't think these were quite the results he was expecting to see."




What ever happened to that idiot Dave Marko ?? He sure was a stupid kind of guy.I guess to much hanging around coffee shops sniffing bike seats to see if a male or female owned the bike.


----------



## Drzdave58

Here's some definitions of a rat bike...not surprising to me we don' see many true hardcore rat bikes...i would suspect a very small percentage of people actually have one.. have seen pics of them...cant say I like them that much..they look like rolling trash...just my 2 cents worth..


----------



## Saving Tempest

kingfish254 said:


> No worries at all RLS. We are simply talking about a difference of OPINIONS. Anyone that builds a RAT bike or a CUSTOM or a CUSTOM RAT or any other flavor of fun bike, doesn't do so for approval or validation based on your "definition" i.e. "OPINION" of those terms.
> Ride On!
> Rat On!
> NUFF SAID




So by the previously offered definitions and statements I am anything from the equivalent of putting 'street mags' on a base model 1968 Chevelle Deluxe four-door with an inline six to look badass to a mile shy of Chuck Barris.


----------



## mazdaflyer

Here’s my rat bike interpretation...

 

 

 


It’s rusty and crusty with some mismatched parts. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Drzdave58

mazdaflyer said:


> Here’s my rat bike interpretation...View attachment 820101 View attachment 820102 View attachment 820103
> It’s rusty and crusty with some mismatched parts.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



We’re allowed our own interpretation of a rat bike..?..I thought it could only be one way..


----------



## mazdaflyer

Another one, it started with frame, fork and guard with lichens.


----------



## Sven




----------



## Saving Tempest

Drzdave58 said:


> We’re allowed our own interpretation of a rat bike..?..I thought it could only be one way..




The thing is that mazdaflyer has actually influenced more than one bike around HERE, they inspired my Rollfast Rosa, and are an innovative designer. Oldfart36 is another influence to me, there are quite a few of you I look to for some cues.

Your idea of RAT is someone else's teacher.


----------



## mazdaflyer

Saving Tempest said:


> The thing is that mazdaflyer has actually influenced more than one bike around HERE, they inspired my Rollfast Rosa, and are an innovative designer. Oldfart36 is another influence to me, there are quite a few of you I look to for some cues.
> 
> Your idea of RAT is someone else's teacher.



I appreciate the props...here’s another one.



 The frame came from Oldfart.


----------



## Sven

mazdaflyer said:


> I appreciate the props...here’s another one.
> View attachment 820181 The frame came from Oldfart.



If you were to take the chainguard off  the blue frame / yellow wheeled bike. Would that now be considered a Klunker?


----------



## Drzdave58

I was checking out the Harley Davidson forum where they are having the same discussion about ratbikes...they claim you cannot build a rat bike...they ‘evolve’ over time..


----------



## mazdaflyer

Sven said:


> If you were to take the chainguard off  the blue frame / yellow wheeled bike. Would that now be considered a Klunker?



I suppose you could call it that...all in the eyes of the beholder. Survivor bikes, restored bikes, retro mods, rat bikes, customs, klunkers, even some of the new stuff, they’re all cool.


----------



## the tinker

Drzdave58 said:


> I was checking out the Harley Davidson forum where they are having the same discussion about ratbikes...they claim you cannot build a rat bike...they ‘evolve’ over time..




These rats are evolving in my basement:

 

 

 

 

  Both of the below bikes will be something?  They sure won't be anything close to original. They are on the stand right now, I just need the time to get to them.

 

  This green Ranger sports Hawthorne graphics and will have a bobbed rear fender. 
The Colson below started off when I seen a pair of badly dented green fenders at a swap. I knew right then and there, before I had even purchased them , that I was going to build a custom around those original green fenders.  


A house was being re-piped and had a pile of galvanized pipe out on the curb. I seen an old valve wheel on a water valve and said to myself,"Gee that would make a swell base for a reflector for the green bike, so I took it and now it's on the back of bike.



Dig that "Jiffy"  motor-bike kickstand!

I was at a flea market and seen this hood ornament.....knew where I would put it before I bought it.


Folks can argue until the sun comes up tomorrow, but I don't care, to me it's all about having fun.....and it's good fun.


----------



## Saving Tempest

Tinker, a few of those rats could use handlebar transplants


----------



## 49autocycledeluxe

if you want to have some fun, sign up for the Jalopy Journal "traditional Hot Rod" site, name yourself Rat Rod Joe or some other rat rod name and start a post about your cool rat rod just like all the other ones you see on the Jalopy Journal. saying RAT ROD on the jalopy Journal is the equivalent of someone calling your mom the C word. they can't seem to define it, but will flip out when you say it..

I used to be a regular over there. now I am irregular over here.


----------



## Sven

49autocycledeluxe said:


> if you want to have some fun, sign up for the Jalopy Journal "traditional Hot Rod" site, name yourself Rat Rod Joe or some other rat rod name and start a post about your cool rat rod just like all the other ones you see on the Jalopy Journal. saying RAT ROD on the jalopy Journal is the equivalent of someone calling your mom the C word. they can't seem to define it, but will flip out when you say it..






When did the *"R"* word become so offensive?

_*BTW...I have a a question , just curious. Is this the longest running thread on the CABE ?   Today marks 6 years, 8 monthes and 18 days  ( 2452 total days )*_


----------



## SKPC

*Rats are cool*.  Rodent-like. Very evolved.  Adaptable.  Determined.   Disheveled.  Mangy.   Sneaky.  Survivors. Come in different looks and sizes.   Nuthun wrong with Rats. They have their place in this world.


----------



## 49autocycledeluxe

SKPC said:


> *Rats are cool*.  Rodent-like. Very evolved.  Adaptable.  Determined.   Disheveled.  Mangy.   Sneaky.  Survivors. Come in different looks and sizes.   Nuthun wrong with Rats. They have their place in this world.




They have their place in this world... but when they come to my place I kill them.

https://www.cdc.gov/rodents/diseases/direct.html


----------



## SKPC

I've rubbed out a few in the past with a 22cal birdshot-ammo rifle that were problematic.


----------



## sue12

i have them all from original paint bikes too old repaints too frankenbikes, I buy franken bikes because you get a really good parts pile going for restores at a cheap price. I rescue all kinds of bikes from dumps and barns and fields but they have too have been a quality bike too start with.  Lately it was an early fisher mtn from Dunsmuir ca dump and a Lotus Prestige road bike from san rafeal dump.  I purchased a Shelby shock ease frame and fork from a friend that already had been stripped and primered. Does this mean these orphans do not have value? Certainly not! It is fine if you only want too do TOC to thirties beauties.  They are not the only ones with value or quality and that leaves the rest of the harder too obtain gold too find for the rest of us.  It takes skill time and money too take the longer trail BUT that is when every bike you have has a story too go with it!!  The rule for rats is it can look like heck but has too work!! good luck!


----------



## Sven

*2,483 days*


----------



## the tinker

2,483 days, that's about 7 years .
i love rat bikes or whatever you wish to call them. These bike frames hanging up are all future rats.




 I have everything to put them together.   Most will have springer forks on them.  Hanging up is a 30's Schwinn, 30's Colson,and two 50's J.C. Higgins and a Columbia. I have three more future rats in the basement. Another Colson and a Roadmaster


The Evans-Colson will become a Rat too. 




 Something to look forward to on those cold winter days.


----------



## Sven

Do you remember Eric Von Zipper's Ratz?

I like "Rat" Bikes as well. ( I have my ideas of what a rat-bike is, just like everyone else)


----------



## A.S.BOLTNUT

Saving Tempest said:


> The thing is that mazdaflyer has actually influenced more than one bike around HERE, they inspired my Rollfast Rosa, and are an innovative designer. Oldfart36 is another influence to me, there are quite a few of you I look to for some cues.
> 
> Your idea of RAT is someone else's teacher.





They I'm sure probably got ther influence from RatRodbikes.com , I can remember when they joined the forum , you should check it out !


----------



## Smoopy's

A.S.BOLTNUT said:


> They I'm sure probably got ther influence from RatRodbikes.com , I can remember when they joined the forum , you should check it out !


----------



## mazdaflyer

A.S.BOLTNUT said:


> They I'm sure probably got ther influence from RatRodbikes.com , I can remember when they joined the forum , you should check it out !



My influence actually came first from the ICT Coasters Bicycle Club Art of the Bicycle Show and Midwest Bike Fest, then the CABE and RatRodBikes.Com.
A wealth of information at both web forums.


----------



## Sven

A.S.BOLTNUT said:


> They I'm sure probably got ther influence from RatRodbikes.com , I can remember when they joined the forum , you should check it out !



*Just checked out Ratrodbikes.com.  A lot of way out custom built to  "rat" bikes as well. Very cool site. *
_*2491 days - 6 years / 9 months / 26 days*_


----------



## Boris

Don't really much care what someone wants to call their crusty ol' bike. I've always felt comfortable calling mine "beaters".


----------



## vincev

I can appreciate  a rat bike.Most of the time they are just stripped down without fenders and chain guards and high rise bars.Those are not impressive.RRB has some wild customs though .


----------



## Sven

vincev said:


> I can appreciate  a rat bike.Most of the time they are just stripped down without fenders and chain guards and high rise bars.Those are not impressive.RRB has some wild customs though .




I'll say RRB has some wild customs




This is one wild custom




.....was built from this Schwinn Traveler.
This reminds me.......I wonder if there has been any progress on _49Autocycledeluxe'_s  Custom Varsity???


----------



## OldSkipTooth

If you feel artistic then a customized bike is an expression of who you are and how you see life. We live our lives through our senses and our physical world. I enjoy the curve of a raw curved bike frame or fender like I enjoy a cold brew or a hand on a sweet round hip of another! Peace out ✌️


----------



## dunkmon

well said mi amigo.


----------



## Sven

dunkmon said:


> well said mi amigo.



I second the motion


----------



## Smoopy's




----------



## scooter_trasher

Lets just see , this one was $20 and an hours drive, all the original parts are in my garage, why ride stock?


----------



## scooter_trasher

how said:


> I built this from parts laying around, it is my winter rider , I ride all winter and it is rough on good bikes
> 
> View attachment 27836
> 
> View attachment 27837



I just picked up a three speed that had the same painter


----------



## John Gailey

Whatever is in your garage or work space makes you happy... Go with it!
I also liked the comment about having a beer in one hand and having something curvy in the other.


----------



## modelcarjedi

scooter_trasher said:


> Lets just see , this one was $20 and an hours drive, all the original parts are in my garage, why ride stock?
> 
> View attachment 848151
> 
> View attachment 848152
> 
> View attachment 848153
> 
> View attachment 848154




Nice ride !! You could always put it back to boring  







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## scooter_trasher

modelcarjedi said:


> Nice ride !! You could always put it back to boring
> 
> View attachment 859749
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk



Nice Bike, there's something truly special about 26" Fastbacks, best riding 5 speed I've ever had , didn't think the bananna seat would be comfortable, (got me shopping for a 20" stingray) ,if schwinn would have made them, they would have likely out sold the Varsity, riding with drop bars is bad for the  testicles Just ask Lance , or is it the spandex 
never,ever,ever,never,ever..............................................ever



styling 

nice quick release seatpost 
clamp,with or without pumps


----------



## barneyguey

How many guys did like me and made choppers by extending the forks with another set of forks. I'd loved my chopper! Of course I was 8 years old. I cut off one set of forks and pounded them on the other set with a hammer. LOL    I wrecked several times because they fell off while I was doing a wheelie.  Kids!


----------



## modelcarjedi

scooter_trasher said:


> Nice Bike, there's something truly special about 26" Fastbacks, best riding 5 speed I've ever had , didn't think the bananna seat would be comfortable, (got me shopping for a 20" stingray) ,if schwinn would have made them, they would have likely out sold the Varsity, riding with drop bars is bad for the testicles Just ask Lance , or is it the spandex
> never,ever,ever,never,ever..............................................ever
> View attachment 859756
> styling View attachment 859757nice quick release seatpost
> clamp,with or without pumps




My bike is only a 24” and I like how it rides. Plus sized rider on tiny bike = wheelies [emoji41]


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## 5760rj

geech34-2nd said:


> *Why be defensive about cutting up a bike?*
> 
> I was into hot rods for a long time & occasionally met up with someone who thought that it was a sin to alter anything. They were usually people who have no creative talent. Bikes are no different. There's nothing wrong with cutting something up & changing things. These things are meant to enjoy. I would hesitate cutting up something that is truly rare or in great original condition but there are many bikes out there that are easily replaced. No offense intended.



wow, after reading all of the responsives  which I fall into as well im hesitant to share or boost about anything I do with others now with the feeling im an idiot for doing so


----------



## OldSkipTooth

I hate rat bikes too, and I hate rusty bikes...but then I hate haters too. So out of hate let’s create!


----------



## A.S.BOLTNUT

Ni


OldSkipTooth said:


> I hate rat bikes too, and I hate rusty bikes...but then I hate haters too. So out of hate let’s create!View attachment 887184





Nice looking rider  !


----------



## SKPC

Edit:  Dead rat deleted, and "Rat Bike" also deleted...


----------



## Sven

2611 days, 
7  years / 1 month / 25 days


----------



## GTs58

Sven said:


> 2611 days,
> 7  years / 1 month / 25 days




Yep, 13 days after my 58th BD.


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## mazdaflyer

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Mr. Monkeyarms

Finding complete original bikes in good shape is always nice!  But I love building something cool out of a pile of parts that should or should not work together.  Satisfies my creative side and usually end up being some of my favorite riders.


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## Allrounderco

I've got to say, the more I read this thread, the more I realize I _am _in favor of rat bikes, however they are defined.


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## Sven

Mr. Monkeyarms said:


> Finding complete original bikes in good shape is always nice!  But I love building something cool out of a pile of parts that should or should not work together.  Satisfies my creative side and usually end up being some of my favorite riders.
> 
> View attachment 906870
> 
> View attachment 906871
> 
> View attachment 906872



Love that trike. Can you take a picture of the other side. I'd like to see how you have the shifter set up


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## Mr. Monkeyarms

A pic of the other side may not be helpful. The 5 speed shifter is mounted inside the floating tank. Don't have a good pic but will get an overhead later today.


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## piercer_99

heck, probably half my bikes could fall into this designation.   I mean, I don't think they are rats, however, someone could.


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## anders1

It’s funny that this thread turned into a place to show your rat bikes. I don’t think that was the original intent. Kind of ironic, and funny. I like looking at the Rat bikes, some of your designs are very creative...


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## MarkKBike

Whether or not they are liked by everyone, I think they are a good thing for this hobby in general.

Most the bikes that are turned into rat type of rides do not get purchased in collector quality. They at least get some basic maintenance and get pieced back together often with mis-matched parts and end up getting preserved for the next owner to do with what they want. It just gives these bikes and the parts that are used another chance at avoiding the junk yard.

I think almost everyone here also enjoys seeing vintage bikes in mint condition, but these collectable mint bikes are often out of individual budgets. I do like seeing a vintage bike in mint condition, but also appreciate the rat rides as well.

I would never tear down a mint bike and turn into a rat ride, but have also purchased bikes that would be to costly for me to restore. When that happens I make the best out of the situation and try to piece together some parts I have handy. It can be fun just trying to get a old bike back on the road. (like the one in my avatar). This bike has received more complements than any other I have had the chance to ride, and little on it is original or matches. Every part on it has been picked up in Chicago area flea markets / estate sales in less than desirable condition. Except for the tires which were purchased new, and cost me more than the frame.

In the process if I collect any parts of value that I think other people can use, they often end up on the auction site to help others with what ever type of restore / refurbish they are trying to accomplish.

I'm not really in the same market as many of the higher end collectors who post here, but enjoy seeing all the photos and the few parts I can offer up usually end up finding other buyers in need rather quickly.


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## piercer_99

they can't all be original.


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## Drwizzletooth

Built this last week out of parts laying around, my daughter has since adopted it.


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## Sevenhills1952

Imho this happens with everything, bikes, cars, furniture, everything. It's disgraceful to take anything old, nice, restorable and destroy it when a collector could enjoy it as is or restore it properly.
Case in point. I have a friend in the moving business. He gets a call from a woman, twentysomething who inherited her grandparents home. It was filled with family treasures that she did not want. My friend backs his large box truck around to the basement door and hears boom-boom-boom! This @%$÷#@ is throwing stuff down the basement steps!!!! Gorgeous furniture, etc., smashed to bits.
My friend shows me the stuff...whats left of a 200 year old grandfather clock, stuff you can't imagine. He was headed to the dump. One thing he gave me I salvaged, repaired was a Chippendale chest of drawers. Inlaid wood...its in one of our bedrooms, it's gorgeous.
As I told him...if she had called me, I would have gladly paid her $5-$10,000 for all that stuff.
Bottom line, people should think before modifying an antique car, bike, anything. It's probably worth more as is and with that money buy something in bad shape, missing parts, etc. Then it doesn't matter and TWO people are happy in the end![emoji3]

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## Henryford2

Late 40's early 50's Monark that was well beyond restoration. Reborn as a Whizzer bike.


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## Duchess

I found this ~1830 Sheridan dresser on the side of the road over 10 years ago. Knobs appear to be ~1930s, but it's otherwise in pretty good shape. It doesn't fit with anything I have, so I'm trying to sell it (most old furniture is just not in much demand, which is crazy to me considering what people pay for disposable trash from Ikea or, frankly, even most of the better places nowadays). I appreciate that the people who didn't want it at least left it out carefully rather than just destroying it. My own bedroom set is Midcentury furniture I got for free that was pretty beat up, but was well-built and made of actual wood, so I rebuilt and refinished it (even in mint condition, it's still worth less than lower quality new furniture that's not complete junk). When I moved, I refinished it again to go better with the new place and a beat up old radio cabinet I also got for free and fixed up. All those pieces would have ended up in a landfill and, though it would be a shame, it would be better IMO if someone had painted and modified the Sheridan dresser than it had gone to the trash. For under $200 (mostly hardware), a couple cheap tools, and some decent amateur woodworking skills, I turned a beat old bedroom set into custom pieces I would have had to pay over ten times that to find something comparable that was new. Solid wood can be rebuilt and modified heavily with little effort and skill, yet people would rather pay more for cheap new trash that falls apart after one move and can't be repaired or changed up. It's a lot like old vs. new bikes at the lower end of the market.


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## the tinker

The only thing  man-made that virtually lasts forever are arrowheads. Politically correct types try to discourage and even outlaw picking them up from the ground...for whatever reasons they have.
I don't agree with all these folks that feel they have to preserve everything in it's original place, state, or condition. If you find, or buy something, it's your to do what you wish with it, no matter how rare or valuable others think it is.. Let them buy it from you, if they think it's so valuable.


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## Henryford2

A little off topic, but living in Northern Ohio Indian artifacts are somewhat easy to find. Unfortunately farmers tilling often break them but at a minimum bring them up to the surface for the picking. The change to no-till farming is making it a little more difficult. Best place now is farm auctions. Enjoy


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## Kato

Henryford2 said:


> A little off topic, but living in Northern Ohio Indian artifacts are somewhat easy to find. Unfortunately farmers tilling often break them but at a minimum bring them up to the surface for the picking. The change to no-till farming is making it a little more difficult. Best place now is farm auctions. Enjoy
> 
> View attachment 923651





Waaaaaaayyyyyyyyy kool !!!
I grew up just outside Toledo / area known as The Black Swamp and found tons of these when I'd go hunting as a kid.
I'd trade them to buddies for football cards but still have a few of the better ones still today.


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## vincev

Some rat bikes are really cool.I dont mean just trashing the fenders and spray bombing a bike. I hate seeing a nice original get destroyed though. Short story: Years ago my friend bought a 1946 Ford.It was a perfect original and had the trophies to prove it.Within a week he started butchering the car and turned it into a street rod. Needless to say this  guy was scorned at all the car shows. I know it was his car but I hated to see it trashed. I guess I feel the same with bikes.


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## Sevenhills1952

vincev said:


> Some rat bikes are really cool.I dont mean just trashing the fenders and spray bombing a bike. I hate seeing a nice original get destroyed though. Short story: Years ago my friend bought a 1946 Ford.It was a perfect original and had the trophies to prove it.Within a week he started butchering the car and turned it into a street rod. Needless to say this guy was scorned at all the car shows. I know it was his car but I hated to see it trashed. I guess I feel the same with bikes.



I agree 100%. It's horrible to see anything nice and original butchered like that.
On the other hand, if an old bike in bad shape is saved from the dumpster, or rusty, or previously modified at least it saves it from the crusher.
I like and collect Rambler cars. Ones with a Chevy motor the owner may like but aficionados and club members don't.

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## bikecrazy

No matter what you do, some people will love it and others will hate it. It takes a strong soul to stay true to themself and do what they love. If you think it’s cool, it is cool.


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## Scout Evans

Any bike less than 100 years old needs to be ridden as a first priority. A restored or original classic just sitting for display is wrong. Same goes for a rat that is just for a conversion piece as it hangs in the garage. Whether it's a rat or restored takes a backseat to riding the thing.


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## Eisele1

baronvoncatania said:


> Sorry! I know i'm going to raise some hackels, But I have to ask, why would you want what was a beautiful piece of americana balloon tire bike and make it into something it never was? NO OFFENSIVE! but wouldn't it be better to return it to it's original glory? and preserve it's history?
> 
> I understand it take a LOT of money to do it right, but can't you just do the minimun to preserve it until you, or someone else can restore it properly?
> 
> jim c.



My dad is in a de tomaso Pantera car club, at every big event being that they are classic,rare, and also sports/race cars, the club splits in half. Half go to the race track and the other to the "show n shine", both sides never quite under standing the other. Haha I laugh every time, but you know if we all thought and felt the exact same way about everything, Life would be pretty boring I think. HAPPY 2019!


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## Scout Evans

Any old bike that is saved from scrap that isn't anywhere near original but can be fixed up to ride is fine. I don't ever endorse cutting up a good original, but many classic bare frames can easily be made into a decent rat. Most of the old stuff I got is free, so it's pretty bad off, seldomly with original paint worth saving. My 53 Schwinn, the bike I first ratted out in 1978 was so badly pitted from rust on the chain stay that I filled it in with bondo, still has many miles in it, but not as a restored Meteor. Not worth a complete restoration, but still beats anything made in China. It's had different versions over the years and the frame waits in a shed for another rebuild back in Florida.


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## Saving Tempest

All of my bikes are my cars. Why settle for vanilla if chocolate or lime jello is to be had?


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## willswares1220

Give new life to a plain jane~~~~~


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## spoker

Scout Evans said:


> Any old bike that is saved from scrap that isn't anywhere near original but can be fixed up to ride is fine. I don't ever endorse cutting up a good original, but many classic bare frames can easily be made into a decent rat. Most of the old stuff I got is free, so it's pretty bad off, seldomly with original paint worth saving. My 53 Schwinn, the bike I first ratted out in 1978 was so badly pitted from rust on the chain stay that I filled it in with bondo, still has many miles in it, but not as a restored Meteor. Not worth a complete restoration, but still beats anything made in China. It's had different versions over the years and the frame waits in a shed for another rebuild back in Florida.
> View attachment 929164
> 
> View attachment 929165
> 
> View attachment 929166
> 
> View attachment 929167



now theres abike where things worked,nice bike!!


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## Balloonoob

This thread really makes me think.  I had always labeled my 2 builds as rat bikes but thinking it over they simply are not trashy enough or have any parts that were never designed to be used on a bicycle. They both include some level of paint. When you think of a rat rod car or truck in your head these builds above certainly do not come to mind and neither do the bikes i built. Sure they are custom but certainly not the version of rat rod that many would shoot for in a car build. Don't take my word for it just Google rat rod. There is a common theme in most of the results.  No paint at all or tons of rust. Forget flat black. This almost makes me want to build a true bare metal beer and salt rusted then clear coated bike with even more garbage tack welded to the frame.  Seriously i just might do this.  Right after i build a vintage straight bar balloon tire bike.   We live in a world where everything is labeled. That is the way it is.  I'm ok with that. Label me what you want and I will label you right back. I don't really care and you should not either.


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## Balloonoob

Those look great to me


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## Balloonoob

'' Theres no wrong answer in what your doing to your own property, as long as your doing something. ''  the only 2 bikes i have built in the past 2 years were (modern) customs and in the 2 weeks or so i have been on the cabe i have learned that there is a wrong answer.  Rats or customs on vintage bikes are really only to be done under certain conditions and if any restoration possibilities remain customization should be avoided, minimal, or easily reversed. Preserving history worth preserving is important.  That's why anyone who has worked to remove house paint from a vintage bike took the time knowing that what they were doing was important. Not just to them. I salute them and their persistence. And those who applied said house paint (or flat black spray paint for that matter) should be tarred and feathered.


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## Balloonoob

Also surprised this thread is 14 pages long..... Everyone has an opinion on this.


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## mazdaflyer

Rescued bike in progress, call it what you want, Rat Rod , junk, custom, aberration, you name it. 


 

 




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## Mr. Monkeyarms

mazdaflyer said:


> Rescued bike in progress, call it what you want, Rat Rod , junk, custom, aberration, you name it.
> View attachment 943261View attachment 943262View attachment 943263
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk





Looks like a nice, comfortable rider to me! Well done!


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## A.S.BOLTNUT

Here's a few of mine


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## Balloonoob

mazdaflyer said:


> Rescued bike in progress, call it what you want, Rat Rod , junk, custom, aberration, you name it.
> View attachment 943261 View attachment 943262 View attachment 943263
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk



Is that a siren above the light? Very cool.


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## mazdaflyer

Balloonoob said:


> Is that a siren above the light? Very cool.




Thanks, it’s an old 6V pancake style horn. Best found at swap meets or flea markets. Pricey on EBay. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## Sven

_*RAT  FINKS*_


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## A.S.BOLTNUT

A few more I built and sold ....


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## Smoopy's

What a good day to ride a “rat bike”..I tend to favor this one


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## Sven

_*2692 days - 7 years , 4 months  & 13 days


*
*NiiiiiCe!!!!*_


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## Mr. Monkeyarms

Smoopy's said:


> View attachment 946425
> View attachment 946426
> 
> View attachment 946427
> 
> 
> 
> What a good day to ride a “rat bike”..I tend to favor this one




I tend to favor that bike as well Smoopy!  You are a gifted craftsman and have built some amazing bikes but this is my personal favorite of yours. Perfect in evey way!


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## A.S.BOLTNUT

" Bat Rasterd " Dx Stretch


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## Smoopy's

Mr. Monkeyarms said:


> I tend to favor that bike as well Smoopy!  You are a gifted craftsman and have built some amazing bikes but this is my personal favorite of yours. Perfect in evey way!



Thanks bud..it’s one of my best riding bikes in my stable..super smooth


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## A.S.BOLTNUT




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## A.S.BOLTNUT

Smoopy's said:


> View attachment 946425
> View attachment 946426
> 
> View attachment 946427
> 
> 
> 
> What a good day to ride a “rat bike”..I tend to favor this one


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## spoker

Scout Evans said:


> Any old bike that is saved from scrap that isn't anywhere near original but can be fixed up to ride is fine. I don't ever endorse cutting up a good original, but many classic bare frames can easily be made into a decent rat. Most of the old stuff I got is free, so it's pretty bad off, seldomly with original paint worth saving. My 53 Schwinn, the bike I first ratted out in 1978 was so badly pitted from rust on the chain stay that I filled it in with bondo, still has many miles in it, but not as a restored Meteor. Not worth a complete restoration, but still beats anything made in China. It's had different versions over the years and the frame waits in a shed for another rebuild back in Florida.
> View attachment 929164
> 
> View attachment 929165
> 
> View attachment 929166
> 
> View attachment 929167



i like the look the reversed fork tube,incase anyone missed it


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## BLWNMNY

Here’s one of mine.View attachment 948038


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## A.S.BOLTNUT

BLWNMNY said:


> Here’s one of mine.View attachment 948038




Glad too see you joining in !


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## redclayhd

My thoughts on the "broad" rat movement is - Most of the rat bicycles I've seen are pretty cool. I'm not a fan of destroying or changing a nice original bicycle/motorcycle/car/truck just for the sake of making it look rusty and weather beaten. I think bicycles escape some of the negative accessorizing because they are human powered. Rat fans will attach all sorts of unnecessary crap to motorized vehicles because they're not concerned with extra weight. "Hey, I found this rusty 18 inch pipe wrench laying in the road. I'm gonna weld it somewhere on the bumper of my rad rod. It won't serve any purpose or look good, but they ARE both rusty."  Some artistically inclined builders can get away with it and it be tasteful. 90% of the rest of us cannot. From what I've seen, I have liked about 85% of the rat bicycles, probably 50% of the ratrod cars/trucks and about 20% or less of rat bike motorcycles. Now, I'd much rather see an old bicycle frame put together with mismatched parts and someone enjoy it, than to see it forgotten in the corner of a storage building forever. If the old bicycle is mostly complete, it would be nice to see it put back original. A lot of times finances (and patience) prevents original restoration. To me, rats should be built for practical reasons or as a step toward original restoration OR a restomod, depending on your preference. BTW If what I've said doesn't come across clearly, just know it made perfect sense in my brain as I was typing! LOL


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## redclayhd

redclayhd said:


> My thoughts on the "broad" rat movement is - Most of the rat bicycles I've seen are pretty cool. I'm not a fan of destroying or changing a nice original bicycle/motorcycle/car/truck just for the sake of making it look rusty and weather beaten. I think bicycles escape some of the negative accessorizing because they are human powered. Rat fans will attach all sorts of unnecessary crap to motorized vehicles because they're not concerned with extra weight. "Hey, I found this rusty 18 inch pipe wrench laying in the road. I'm gonna weld it somewhere on the bumper of my rad rod. It won't serve any purpose or look good, but they ARE both rusty."  Some artistically inclined builders can get away with it and it be tasteful. 90% of the rest of us cannot. From what I've seen, I have liked about 85% of the rat bicycles, probably 50% of the ratrod cars/trucks and about 20% or less of rat bike motorcycles. Now, I'd much rather see an old bicycle frame put together with mismatched parts and someone enjoy it, than to see it forgotten in the corner of a storage building forever. If the old bicycle is mostly complete, it would be nice to see it put back original. A lot of times finances (and patience) prevents original restoration. To me, rats should be built for practical reasons or as a step toward original restoration OR a restomod, depending on your preference. BTW If what I've said doesn't come across clearly, just know it made perfect sense in my brain as I was typing! LOL



To drive my point home a little better when it comes to ridiculous things some people do with rat rods, I'll expound a little on the "pipe wrench" thought.  "Hey, I found this rusty 18 inch pipe wrench laying in the road. I'm gonna weld it somewhere on the bumper of my rad rod. It won't serve any purpose or look good, but they ARE both rusty. I'll probably put it next to that worn out lawn mower blade I welded on there yesterday".


----------



## the tinker

Pipe wrench. . . nice idea. I'll work on it. Your dream will come true!


----------



## Speed King




----------



## Boris

the tinker said:


> Pipe wrench. . . nice idea. I'll work on it. Your dream will come true!




Might work as some sort of mounting bracket for your faucet handle reflector.


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## Mr. Monkeyarms

Maybe 2 pipe wrenches made into a fork... Then it would be purposeful & ratty!


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## vincev

I dont mind rat bikes.I dont agree with welding useless things just because they are rusty.Just added weight.If something has a purpose and looks kind of "steam punk" I like.


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## Mr. Monkeyarms

That's kinda the whole thing with rats. Using what you have laying around to make something work. May need to be modified a bit to function but that, to me is true rat rodding at it's purest form. Save the decoration for sake of decoration for the trailer queens!


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## OldSkipTooth




----------



## mazdaflyer

1955 Wards Hawthorne + 50’s Sears David Bradley Hood and a few other pieces.


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## TwoSchwinns

From this...




to this.



I call it a clunker.
*Oh, and it's a SHINY black frame.*

And I do agree with [B]bobcycles[/B]* about preserving when possible, and with the others who rightfully mention the cost of restoring. But, the real idea is to ride them, and having a bike sitting around waiting for a restoration that might never happen is a waste unless it's a very special model. Most customized bikes can *ultimately* be restored anyway since most have bolted on parts which can be unbolted just as easily.

Don't like to see *sporterized vintage firearms either, but in those cases the possibly nicely marked stocks are ruined forever.


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## kingfish254

I started with a 1930s Elgin Twin Bar frame and ended up with a SteamRoller this year for the RRB BO15


----------



## Bike from the Dead

They say there's a buyer for anything, and it turned out I was the buyer of this mangled 1950 Snyder-built Montgomery Ward/Hawthorne frame. I've had multiple people tell me I bought a piece of junk, but that just made me determined to resurrect this bike and make it rideable again using a variety of equally mangled parts. 











I managed to finish it just in time for the 15th annual Rat Rod Bikes.com Build Off. Not bad for a "dumpster bike."


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## Retro Flutter

I built a rat bike over the summer/fall this year. Used up a Murray frame I had sitting in the basement and a bunch of other parts I had laying about. Rear end is Canadian made CCM Galaxie, main frame is American made Murray Buzz bike and fork is Japanese made Cobra.  Everything else is kinda whatever I had.  Named it Misfit.

I rather enjoy Rat bikes as no 2 are the same...each one is uniquely different.


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## OZ1972

kingfish254 said:


> I started with a 1930s Elgin Twin Bar frame and ended up with a SteamRoller this year for the RRB BO15
> 
> View attachment 1261342
> 
> View attachment 1261341
> 
> View attachment 1261340
> 
> View attachment 1261344



Man that is awesome !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## Cooper S.

You know, the more I look at bikes on Facebook, the more I’m starting to agree. That being said, there’s just as many butchered restorations


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## Hukah

kingfish254 said:


> I started with a 1930s Elgin Twin Bar frame and ended up with a SteamRoller this year for the RRB BO15
> 
> View attachment 1261342
> 
> View attachment 1261341
> 
> View attachment 1261340
> 
> View attachment 1261344



Holy surprise party Batman, that thing is WHACK!!
Nice handleit bars, BTW


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## Hukah

Bike from the Dead said:


> They say there's a buyer for anything, and it turned out I was the buyer of this mangled 1950 Snyder-built Montgomery Ward/Hawthorne frame. I've had multiple people tell me I bought a piece of junk, but that just made me determined to resurrect this bike and make it rideable again using a variety of equally mangled parts. View attachment 1287464
> 
> View attachment 1287463
> 
> View attachment 1287462
> 
> I managed to finish it just in time for the 15th annual Rat Rod Bikes.com Build Off. Not bad for a "dumpster bike."
> View attachment 1287465
> 
> View attachment 1287466
> 
> View attachment 1287467View attachment 1287468



I have a similar condition "rescue" I'm working on. Being a girls model, it's only "redeeming" value was/were the gothic fenders that were in only okay shape.
I've got an idea for her but I'm in idle mode until spring when I can paint again.
Oh yeah, Nice job BFTD


----------

