# Vicini 1970s (?)



## Jesper (Jul 22, 2022)

Something I've had for a few years; built up, but not happy with limited set-up due to "French" mount front derailleur which limits my front ring size (I often use 53-54T due to FW range). I thought this frame may have been repainted (it does show very minor touch-up paint in a couple spots) and modified for the FD mount, but paint and decals appear original (BB shell overspray match, no signs of other colors); and I have seen mamy more examples showing the same set-up. No sign of a previous clamp-on mounted FD (I believe the FD is OE; pre-'78/CSPC Record model, purchased with FD and Campy Record headset); paint unmolested and no paint fade outline. Down tube logo seems to be painted on (separate letters); very thick compared to decals of that era, no clearcoat.

  I found another similar bike that purports to be 1977 (https://www.speedbicycles.ch/velo/406/vicini_tour_de_france_1977.html) "Tour De France" model (has decals). Not sure if the '77 bike has original paint and decals (not specified), but headbadge decal is the newer version (not sure what year they started utilizing the triple stacked "V" logo, but I know it was in use circa '84-'85, possibly 2 badges/logos used concurrently during multiple years).
  Both frames have DT bottle mounts, under the BB shell cable routing, braze-on shifters, "French" mount FDs ('77 frame shows no sign of a previous clamp-on FD either), and DT logo; but different chain stay and brake bridge flange designs, BB shell and lug cut-outs, internal stay RD cable routing ('77- internal; my frame- external), TT cable routing ('77- braze-on; my frame- clamp-on), drop-outs ('77- Super Record short with portacatena mounting holes; my frame- long d-o's), seat tube "VICINI" logo ('77- in place; my frame- missing with no remnants or paint fade outline), and "1973" decals ('77-missing; my frame ST and TT).
  Not sure how '77 bike was dated other than Campy Pat. 77 RD installed (not specified as OE; FD post-'77 Nouvo Gran Sport model) so possible bike is '78 or later even if original equipment from factory or first owner. That would also better explain the portacatena d-o's since I believe they were first introduced in Campy's 1978 catalogue supplement (I highly doubt many if any small builders were using them prior to 1978 even if they were available in '77 (probably still using existing stock). Also, odd that the '77 frame shows a chain peg which would generally not be installed on a frame with the portacatena style d-o.
  Also, I had seen a couple examples that claimed to be 1973 year of manufacture (might due to "1973" decals if installed). One purported '73 frame had a similar set-up to my frame (under BB routing, bottle mounts, clamp-on TT guides, no pantos, long d-o's, no ST logo); but no chrome except fork crown and clamp-on FD.
  I would state with certainty that my frame is no earlier than 1974, but think it would be closer to '76-'78 given the FD model (if OE), bottle mounts, under BB cable routing, 126mm rear fork, long Campy drop-outs, and recessed nut brake mount. I believe it is at least 1 year older than the "1977" model (which I suspect to be '79 or later).
  Also, Vicini pantographs and custom lug cut-outs were much more prevalent on '80s and later frames. I know my fork isn't shown (I'll post it when I find it!), but like my frame it has no engravings.
  Only frame marks are on the front of the BB shell (50, 50.5). Frame size: seat tube 50cm c-c; top tube 50.5cm c-c.
Headtube/lugs, seat cluster/stay caps, and drop-outs chrome dipped; frame was not fully chromed under paint.
 I have not discovered who D'Alessandro is; but nothing is shown for a rider by that name as an Italian Champion in 1973 (Giro, National Championship).
  Sorry for being long-winded (as usual), but just wanted to provide my research comparisons from a couple years ago. I have not compared to Vicini examples on Steel-vintage.com, but I'll check out their frames for a match, although that site usually does not have  specific years for their bikes.
  I had not considered contacting Vicini due to the age of the frame, though I was aware they still exist. I may try to contact them just for a better idea as to what year/model the frame is.


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## bulldog1935 (Jul 22, 2022)

No question, that can't be a '73 frame with a decal that says "'73 Italian National Champion" - it's referring to a person who may have been on their frame.  
Someone has been unkind to the paint on the lugs.  

Noteworthy, you don't see crimped chainstays on  higher-grade frames, which usually take climbing advantage from sweet oval chainstays.


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## Jesper (Jul 22, 2022)

@bulldog1935  yes, lug c-o's were the area that definitely got touched up, but easy enough to do a better job. The chrome was also "cleaned up" with improper methods (fine sandpaper?) causing scratching. I only use bronze wool to clean up chrome which is too soft to scratch it.
Any idea as to the headbadge design change year?

I did a quick search and it seems that there are a bunch of "1973" Vicinis out there. Rather odd that they are all from the same year, but no 1973 decals on them. They were on some auction (Catawiki) site I've never heard of (I'm not an online kind of guy!); and all seemed to be sold by the same seller as "restored" (into single speeds). Cheaper models with "clunky" looking lugs, plate style brake bridge, large stamped out pump peg braze-ons.
Just found one that appears to be an exact match on that same site (differences: black in lug c-o's, missing TT decal. Seller called it a 1974; it has a Pat. 74 NR derailleur (OE?).

More photos:


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## bulldog1935 (Jul 22, 2022)

Here's a different head badge from the 80s








						Vicini Classic Road Frame Set 1980s
					

Lugged frame. Oria tubes.




					globalvintagemedia.com
				



There's a red and chrome '82 on facebook with the same headbadge as just above - the same red/chrome shows up on Velobase.
Odds are, your headbadge dates to the 70s.

I don't think your frame has any chrome.  I think he took a grinder to bare steel to make it look like it was chrome.

Adding a ps - when Steve went searching for a project bike frame, he ended up with this craigslist World Sport.
The guy had stripped the paint from the head lugs and fork, though he did a better job than above.
Steve polished the steel very nicely.



Steve's urban upright was built around a Dyad wheelset with SRAM 2-speed auto hub and Shimano dyno hub, Bush-Mueller lamps.
The crank, chainguard and brakes are Velo Orange.


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## bikerbluz (Jul 22, 2022)

Cool frame Jesper


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## Jesper (Jul 22, 2022)

bulldog1935 said:


> Here's a different head badge from the 80s
> 
> 
> 
> ...



  You may be right about the chrome lugs/caps; definitely chrome at drop-outs and fork crown on my frame as far as I can tell. I never really looked at it that way, just assumed someone had torn it up. I may have assumed chrome having seen another similar example which appeared chrome in the photos. I have polished steel to a "mirror" finish using super fine grit sand paper and then crocus cloth/compound for the final phase. I did that on a pepperbox black powder gun's barrel I built. It came out great, kept oiled to prevent humidity corrosion.
  The stacked "V" logo was the one I was originally familiar with because I had a late 60s-early 70s frame that someone had put that style decal on even though it was obviously not a Vicini frame; decal is now on my refrigerator.

Forgot to mention that the seat post diameter is 27.2mm.

Edit: here is the link to the bike I think is the same: https://www.catawiki.com/en/l/13210835-vicini-restored-eroica-1974


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## bulldog1935 (Jul 22, 2022)

on the bike you linked, the fork crown is chrome, but the dropouts are not.
These are chrome dropouts on the left, were bare steel when they were brazed on the frame - they had to be - and they were chromed when the socks were chromed on the rear triangles.

 



Next to it are the same steel Campy dropouts, never chromed, and painted.

One would have a helluva time marking chrome with a grinder - chrome plate is Hard (70 HRC) - harder than steel can be hardened (50 HRC).

@Jesper - borrowing your photo



This is Not chrome-plated.  There is no diamond or any other material in a wheel skewer, axle nut or RD bolt washer hard enough to mark chrome plate like that.
That has to be bare steel, except for where it's painted.
TX PE No. 75665
I'm a metallurgist with a professional engineering license.


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## Jesper (Jul 23, 2022)

I cannot properly discern if the drop-outs on the  2nd linked example bike are chromed or not (could be my eyes, device, and/or a combination of both), & I do not disagree with the assessment; but given the similarities (aside from badge design) between my frame and the online example I will assume that the photo does not properly reflect (literally or figuratively) enough resolution to actually determine its real design. Considering the frames in my inventory, which is substantial (approx. 80 frames), all frames with chromed rear drop-outs (stay socks or not) are either painted (excepting the machined f_w_lat clamping surface), or are chromed completely including whatever "sock" length the builder decided upon aside from some specific details.
I have taken a VERY CLOSE LOOK at my frame and the drop-outs and seat cluster are chromed. I can't account for how the present condition of the seat stay caps occurred, but it does not eliminate the fact that my frame's d-o's, stays, head lugs, and fork crown are indeed chromed.
I cannot account for the resolution of the linked bike's images so I was merely using it as a near example of my frame aside from decal discrepancies (different head badge design, and missing top tube "d'allesandro" decals). Unfortunately, no image of the linked bike's BB shell to provide further clarification.
Regardless, this frame will be just fine for me when, or if, I install a clamp-on FD to allow for better personalized set-up. No plans to do anything other than to ride and keep in my personal rider stable once I customize the build. 
I appreciate the insight regarding my frame and the attempt to identify it (year and model) on multiple levels.
  I will entertain anything further identificationof its year and model.


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## Jesper (Aug 10, 2022)

bulldog1935 said:


> on the bike you linked, the fork crown is chrome, but the dropouts are not.
> These are chrome dropouts on the left, were bare steel when they were brazed on the frame - they had to be - and they were chromed when the socks were chromed on the rear triangles.
> 
> View attachment 1667448 View attachment 1667449
> ...



Actually, it is chrome plated. It is not bare or polished steel. Verified by another who does plating and other services.

Another metallurgist told me that silica and certain oxides can cause scratches to chrome plating.


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## bulldog1935 (Aug 11, 2022)

horse hockey


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## juvela (Nov 15, 2022)

-----

changed upon this example in the course of the day's peregrinatory

it is dated as "late 1970's"








			vicini – TROPPE BICI
		



-----


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## Jesper (Nov 20, 2022)

Thanks for the example; definitely a newer model.

I just picked up a panto'd stem, already have a Vicini Campy SR post. I have been slightly sidelined the past month so no real progress other than the gathering of parts. End of year petsonal projects stacking up: Gloria Garabaldini, Gandolfi, Fondriest X Status, et al. Thankfully those bikes are essentially complete and just need some servicing before putting on the road. Not too worried since selling season down in FLA is months away; I do not deal with Xmas sales insanity. Plus helping someone restore a Crescent 320 for their son-in-law as a holiday gift.


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## Jesper (Nov 23, 2022)

Stem I recently got. Excellent deep pantograph which should make polishing easier. I think it is a "Criterium" model, 100mm.
 Slotted top.


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## Jesper (Nov 27, 2022)

Here is my "Vicini" post; mid-late 80s Campy Super Record single bolt in a very sad condition. Corrosion has deteriorated the shaft where it sat at the seat lug (I wonder what the frame looked like!). Damage is quite deep having eradicated part of the pantograph. I have never had corrosion damage that deep on any part in the past. When mounted on the frame it will certainly be exposed. 

I have no real experience in trying to restore a component with that degree of damage. I can only think of soldering the area, but I have no idea as to what solder type/ratio to use for tinning and/or filling. 

Any recommendations would be appreciated.

Specs: Bolt (steel) and spacer (steel) are chrome plated. Bolt: 13mm head (closer to 12.5mm), 40mm length, and pitch 1mm(?). Post length before taper is 175mm, with taper 185mm, length to center of clamp (with clamp perpendicular to post shaft) 215mm. Clamp rail width 43mm (c-c). Flutes (8) approx. 56mm long starting 2mm below taper. Markings: "LIMIT" (60mm from bottom); limit indicator marks (55mm from bottom); "BREV. INTER." above "CAMPAGNOLO" both on front of tapered shoulder; "27.2" on rear of tapered shoulder.


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