# How much would you pay?



## oskisan (Mar 25, 2015)

For those of you that are working on building out an airflo, the following questions were raised in a prior post:

JAF/CO currently sells fiber glass tanks, complete ready to hang on the bike with steel inserts for $999 shipped (steel inserts are $275 alone by themselves).
Even at that great price (by the way these are awesome tanks), there are still some of us stubborn folks after an all metal tank...

So a couple questions came up:

1) What would you pay for a nice real original tank (speedline, and arrow) 
2) How many people would be interested in buying an all metal non-fiberglass tank if someone were to remake them
3) What would you pay for a steel tank if someone were to remake them (speedline, and arrow)

Thanks,
Ken


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## THE STIG (Mar 25, 2015)

Complete O.E. steel tank $2k-3k , bare glass tanks sold awhile ago for $1200+....  if your going to ride it, glass is fine
$1k for a loaded glass one is cheap


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## THE STIG (Mar 25, 2015)

or you can buy this and be done
http://thecabe.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?71245-Big-Tank-Shelby-Bicycle-FOR-SALE


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## redline1968 (Mar 25, 2015)

I did mine and the cost of acquiring the bike  with steel orig tank and  full resto with Crome  missing parts search and paint supplies costs totaled to 5K +\-. Seems like a bargain now. I'd sell mine if they made steel repops I hate repops.


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## Freqman1 (Mar 25, 2015)

The steel tanks have been reproduced. I believe I was told 10 were made and I don't remember exactly but thought they said around $1500 was what they sold for. Slick I think has one on his bike so he may be able to shed more light on the subject. Like I said before a couple of years ago I saw an original Speedline tank sell for about $1700 but think in today's world you could get $3000-3500 if you tried. I already have an original paint Speedline so I wouldn't be a player for a repo steel tank but think $2k wouldn't be out of line.  V/r Shawn


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## slick (Mar 25, 2015)

This is my repop steel tank. Im not sure what they sold for originally, who made them, or how many were produced??? I have asked around for the history on my bike with no luck? I also would LOVE to know who made the tanks.....

All i can say is....it isnt that great of a copy. It needs lots of work to be up to par. Do i care its a repop steel tank instead of original? No. Usually the critics that wanna cry foul are the ones who don't own one to begin with. To me, my bike gets ridden all the time. So if its a repop steel, or fiberglass, doesn't matter. Hell, even if i had an original, id still ride it. Its a bike, not a piece of furniture.


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## Freqman1 (Mar 25, 2015)

The only other thing I remember is that supposedly the guy that made them was in Kentucky. Maybe one of the seasoned collectors out there can tell us more. BTW I ride my bike regularly. Chris is right they were made to be ridden! V/r Shawn


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## slick (Mar 25, 2015)

As far as pricing goes....

Jims repop glass tanks for ANY bike are top notch, sturdy in construction, both halves meet together as they should, and they fit the frame very well. All of his tanks were molded from a real steel tank. it doesn't get any better honestly. 

So you have to think....do you wait 5 to 10 years for an original to pop up in non swiss cheese shape, pay dearly for it because you are in competition with the other 2 dozen guts who have been looking, or do you buy a glass  one now, paint it, and enjoy the bike now instead of it sitting there like Charlie Brown waiting for the great pumpkin to appear.....

An original tank in great shape on my eyes is a good 3k +. But the odds of one popping up without the bike attached.......hahaha have fun with that needle in a haystack. 

And for a repop steel tank. The price will be steep and it should be. Its hand made, not stamped out by a machine Like they were. As the saying goes...time is money l and you need the talent and attention to detail to get it right to make it look the part.


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## JAF/CO (Mar 26, 2015)

They only cost about $40 bucks ( as In green money ) for a deluxe air flow in 1938


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## oskisan (Mar 26, 2015)

So Jim,

I did this as an experiment to identify how many people would indeed be interested in buying a tank new, repoped or whatever. I am rather disappointed (and wonder if it is the subject of this thread not having airflo in it) that more people have not chimed in that they want a tank.
I find this extremely interesting as I also see people making them themselves.

At this point I may have to throw in the towel and state that in my quest to try and bring together a group of airflo enthusiasts to have several tanks made, I have determined that there are really few of us... (some people without tanks are actually poo pooing a repop - - WOW)!

Having said this, I would be in for 2 speedlines and would be willing to pay $2k ea (hopefully would get a cut on the 2nd). At this rate though, I do not believe there is enough profit in it for any craftsman to move forward and create them.

Disappointed-
Ken



JAF/CO said:


> They only cost about $40 bucks ( as In green money ) for a deluxe air flow in 1938
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## slick (Mar 26, 2015)

Ken, 

The first thing you have to realize is that these bikes are one of two things in peoples eyes. Ugly or beautiful. Most guys think they are ugly. Fine with me, i think the same about the 75 plus year old schwinn cantilever frame design. Their literally are millions of them. The other factor is that these bikes and their parts are rarer than most other bikes. How many pop up per year for sale? How many Airflow guards pop up for sale? 


There is no way to get a repop tank steel tank made and sold for the $2k range, unless its a very poor repop and would need massive amounts of bodywork and more fab work to make it fit properly and look correct. So without the high demand for tanks, the price will stay high on them. Schwinn parts will always be repopped. Everybody wants a Schwinn. High demand, high production, low price.


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## cyclingday (Mar 26, 2015)

At last years San Francisco ride, one of the Rolling Relics crew had an absolutely stunning Hiawatha Arrow. The fit and finish of that bike was the best I've ever seen.
When I asked the owner about the bike and its restoration, he informed me that the tank was one of Jims fiberglass models. I thought I had some pictures of the bike, but I can't seem to find them.
After looking at that bike, I realized that if you're going to do a full tilt resto, then starting out with the crispest parts you can find is the way to go. (This is why John in San Diego remakes his parts for chrome even though he has an original.)You will not find a better tank for your Speedline Airflo or Hiawatha Arrow than one of Jims.
Obviously, a newly stamped steel tank would be the next best thing, but the cost of tooling for that would probably never be recouped. It would end up being a labor of love. But, the guys who cherish their Genuine Antiques would probably hate you for doing it.


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## Freqman1 (Mar 26, 2015)

Everything that has been said about Jim's tanks is a testament to their quality. I have one of his Five Bar tanks and it fits better than the factory tank. Unlike a lot of fiberglass parts I've dealt with for cars that required hours of fit and finish Jim's tanks are ready to paint and once done, just looking, you would never know the difference. I say all of that to say this; if you only need the tank to complete your bike get one of his, put it on the bike, and ride it until you run across an original if that's what it takes to make you happy. A repo is a repo whether its glass or steel and will never be the real thing. I've seen pictures of that Arrow and it is a stunning bike. V/r Shawn


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## frampton (Mar 26, 2015)

I would keep on searching until you find the real thing. You will never regret it.


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## oskisan (Mar 26, 2015)

Ok, well so much for the $2k dream! I am amazed there are not more people wanting a tank... I thought for sure there would be more interest than all of us that already have airflos! 

I feel like I am one of the flying Walendos on a tightrope out there by myself on this one...

Ken


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## JAF/CO (Mar 26, 2015)

*thanks*

thanks guys for all the positive post about my parts tanks and all the other stuff
I like to please every one how gets my parts but first they have to please me.  right now I am doing 
Shelby steel racks and lobdell seats with john a. help they are coming out nice,  chain guard is next maybe both in steel and aluminum 
I already do steel lighting bolts for the Shelby and side panels for the arrow may try some in aluminum on these 
I also make a lot of parts for other bike not just Shelby
so if any one need help with some parts give me a call I won't tell any one lol

I have some real stuff also and there is still more out there keep looking

if you like your bike with a bunch of missing parts that's your business


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## JAF/CO (Mar 26, 2015)

one other thing , I do make some Schwinn parts  but I like shelby ,cwc and dayton/Huffman better  lol !!!


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## cyclonecoaster.com (Mar 27, 2015)

I like original paint bicycles personally - 

I am not a restored bike guy though ... but if I were to restore one & was missing the key item - the big tank well then I would have to go fiberglass & Jim is the way I'd go ... great quality / fit & finish .. but for now I will just ride my original paint riders ..


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## scrubbinrims (Mar 27, 2015)

It sounds as though the craftsmanship and time it would take to make a steel tank would push the price northwards of what a real one would cost, although a real one is not likely viable and then there are the odds of YOU getting it.
As said, whether glass or steel... they are both reproduction and if you want the look, I would recommend moving forward at the least cost when its said and done.
I am proud to be the owner of an original paint speedline airlflow and what contributes to that is not only the design I covet, it's the rarity of it.
Some bikes are just meant to be special and not everybody can have them.
There are a lot of significant bikes I don't have...an aerocycle, monark 5-bar, elgin robin, 37-38 RMS, etc... but I'd rather not have them vs. owning a close approximation... and keep them special.
Chris


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## slick (Mar 27, 2015)

How about i pay this much..... just for my Shelby lovers out there.. 

I have a few more parts but didn't want to seem greedy. Oh and NONE of these are for sale. The tank is a Restoration project for a customer.


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## poolboy1 (Mar 20, 2016)

Freqman1 said:


> The steel tanks have been reproduced. I believe I was told 10 were made and I don't remember exactly but thought they said around $1500 was what they sold for. Slick I think has one on his bike so he may be able to shed more light on the subject. Like I said before a couple of years ago I saw an original Speedline tank sell for about $1700 but think in today's world you could get $3000-3500 if you tried. I already have an original paint Speedline so I wouldn't be a player for a repo steel tank but think $2k wouldn't be out of line.  V/r Shawn




I sold Slick his bike with tank on it. Originally 10 where made and where sold for $3000.00 each and from my understanding they where all sold before they where done.
$1700.00 for a original tank alone is a gift for a original tank.
If they need it they will pay...If they have the $ great if they don't great... Find one... Good luck.


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## Nickinator (Mar 21, 2016)

We know where the original mold is for those steel tanks, not sure it's worth anything today or not...
Darcie


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## slick (Mar 21, 2016)

Since you know who has the mold, how many of the tanks were made? If the owner of the mold decided to sell, id be interested. Mine is the only confirmed tank to exist besides the ones on restored bikes that we will never know without visual inspection.


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## fordmike65 (Mar 21, 2016)

Nickinator said:


> We know where the original mold is for those steel tanks, not sure it's worth anything today or not...
> Darcie




Get that mold & start pumping them out!


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## Joe Buffardi (Mar 21, 2016)

Well if its a correct punch press mold it probably weighs about 400 lbs. with a positive and a negative and would take a punch press bigger than most machine shops have for that caliber and size of sheetmetal.


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## Joe Buffardi (Mar 21, 2016)

Were talking industrial factory automotive punch press pre WWII giants to do the job clean and crisp.


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## 2jakes (Mar 21, 2016)

Freqman1 said:


> The only other thing I remember is that supposedly the guy that made them was in Kentucky. Maybe one of the seasoned collectors out there can tell us more. BTW I ride my bike regularly. Chris is right they were made to be ridden! V/r Shawn




Ron Lewis in Lilly, Kentucky. He did steel fabrications for the 1934 Aerocycle.


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## Nickinator (Mar 21, 2016)

2jakes said:


> Ron Lewis in Lilly, Kentucky. He did steel fabrications for the 1934 Aerocycle.



He is not the one that currently has the molds. 
Darcie


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## PREWAR ELGIN (Mar 21, 2016)

Start pumping those arrow tanks and take my money please!


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## JAF/CO (Mar 21, 2016)

those molds are realy caled dies and like joe said big machines and a lot of hand detail work afterwords
not as easy as it sounds  if it was easy there would be more tanks ot their

added : also  you need someone to invest the big dollars


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## Joe Buffardi (Mar 21, 2016)

I know of only one place that can do the stamping and its in Los Angeles. Old machine shop that has been there since 1937. I could get it done if you can get the dies. We just have to make a fixture to hold the dies so it will work on his punch press.


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## Joe Buffardi (Mar 21, 2016)

So if the dies are available you should have 4 pieces total and they should be extremely heavy. One positive left and negative left, one positive right and negative right. If you have pictures that would be cool to see. But it is a ton of work and its mostly a labor of love. You wont make much money. Dies can cost around $5,000-$10,000.


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## JAF/CO (Mar 21, 2016)

TANK WITH STEEL INSERTS , RACK , GUARD , BARS , NECK , EGE LIGHT , FENDER BRACES , SEAT AND POST
I ALSO MAKE THE ARROW TANK AND THE NO NOSE ALL OF MY TANKS HAVE STEEL OR ALUMINUM INSERTS


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## slick (Mar 21, 2016)

Ok guys. My steel repop tank definitely needs tuning,and then FINE TUNING... So as far as clean tanks being popped out.....not guna happen. But if i could buy the dies, i would. Just to have to go with my tank. 

Now, as far as the best alternative there is to a steel tank...Mr. Jim Frazier is your Huckleberry. He makes the best alternative to a real tank you will find ANYWHERE on  the market. Hands down. I have searched for the last 7 years for a complete original Airflow tank by itself....its just not guna happen. The tank will be connected to the bike. Trust me. So either step up and buy a complete bike, or buy a Jim tank and add it to your bike. Nobody will know until they knock on your tank. My Hiawatha Arrow had a Jim tank. Nobody ever knew. And if they do knock on your tank....they need to be knocked out. Don't touch something that isn't yours. Plain and simple.


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## Joe Buffardi (Mar 21, 2016)

JAF/CO is the way to GO!


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## CWCMAN (Mar 22, 2016)

X2 Jim's fabrication and attention to detail is unmatched.


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## cyclingday (Mar 22, 2016)

Yeah,
What they said!


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## Freqman1 (Mar 22, 2016)

x 4 His Five Bar tank fits better and is easier to install than the originals! V/r Shawn


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## MrAustralia (Mar 26, 2016)

HA!!!

What are the chances!!! Timing is impeccable! 

It's off to a flying start though! Bidding frenzy!!

http://m.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-1930s...er-Tank-Balloon-Tire-/272187263783?nav=SEARCH


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