# 1943 Schwinn Wartime New World - 23" large frame w/ lots of black out parts



## rennfaron

I just picked this NW up because of the wartime connection and have yet to have one in this time period with black out parts. Serial number is J07596, which I think is 1943 but have not looked too hard into that yet. I am hoping to start collecting some parts (I like to have all parts ready for the project before I start) and then tackle the break down, cleanup and reassembly. I basically just pulled this guy out of the box and gave it a once over to make sure Fedex didn't bang it up too bad... 

_Images shown are from seller. When I get more time I will upload more. I just wanted to throw this up there for sake of conversation (and to motivate me to tackle this one sooner than later... ) and because his photos were pretty darn good. _

*First impressions: *

Noted by the seller, the rear hub had been swapped out at some point for this large flange hub. I can only assume at this time it would have originally been a ND black out coaster hub.
Black out parts are: Levers, calipers, crank cones, wald pedals, seat clamp bolt, fender braces, seat post (hard to tell but the black coating looks to be there), front schwinn hub.
Parts not original to bike: large flange rear hub, chain ring, crank (maybe?), chain (maybe?).
Missing: miller kickstand (wonder if it would have been blacked out?)
Interesting observations:
It has a really cool persons tourist saddle on it from that time period. It makes me think that per supply issues, maybe Persons is what they could get (if original to the bike, which it looks to be). It could provide some more insight into supply chain issues at the time and who was making what.
You can tell it is from around that period by the lettering on the back which matches other persons saddles of the time.
I picked up a similar one but I assume not as old

It has the painted white rims which I have seen on some wartime NWs.
@GTs58 had noted to me that it is one of a couple/few he has seen with the rear caliper mounted on the inside of the stays

Still has the original "WAR TIRE" tires on there.
Also - Looking for swap blackout parts if you got them.


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## Oilit

That  rear hub may not be original, but it looks like it's been on there a long time. Interesting bike, thanks for posting!


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## rennfaron

Oilit said:


> That  rear hub may not be original, but it looks like it's been on there a long time. Interesting bike, thanks for posting!



For sure. The seller said he thought the change happened in the 50s, but I assumed that was a guess since he didn’t have the bike long. He could be right.


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## Oilit

It may have been changed in the '60's, but I'd guess that hub is older. I wonder what years were those hubs produced? (Edit: '60's? I mis-read the year).


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## prewarmachine

Don't quote me, far from an expert, but that looks like a Schwinn high flange free wheel rear hub. I know they were an option for my 41' so should be an option for yours too.


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## rennfaron

prewarmachine said:


> Don't quote me, far from an expert, but that looks like a Schwinn high flange free wheel rear hub. I know they were an option for my 41' so should be an option for yours too.



That's a good question. I am fairly sure there are different versions of the high flange hub that are associated with different points in time. Those type hubs are beyond me and it is the first one I have owned. Maybe someone that knows these well and the types/timelines can chime in on what they think. I added two more pics that show the hub a bit better. It has stamped "Schwinn" in script and "PAT. PENDING". Someone could have not wanted the coaster but did want to put parts that were of the age of the bike and put that on there, so not original, but period correct. Hard to know.

Per the age of the overall rust of the bike versus the rust on the chain ring, rear hub and crank it does seem like those parts are not original. Per @Oilit those parts were still on there a long time though.


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## 1motime

Why can't the rear hub be original?  No reason for a coaster with caliper brakes.  This is a platform bike so anything in the catalog was available?
Great bike.  Probably not a lot of use.  Looks like the atmosphere and time made the patina.  Even with that the Persons seat has held up better than most Mesingers.


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## rennfaron

1motime said:


> Why can't the rear hub be original?  No reason for a coaster with caliper brakes.  This is a platform bike so anything in the catalog was available?
> Great bike.  Probably not a lot of use.  Looks like the atmosphere and time made the patina.  Even than that the Persons seat has held up better than most Mesingers.



I agree, but don't know much about those hub types. I most likely would have thought that the rear hub was original if the seller had not said it was updated in his listing info and followed up and said the same again after I reached out. I reached back out to the seller just now and he said he got it around 10 years ago (I thought he flipped it quick) and the person he bought it from had it in the family for a long time. I can only assume that was information somewhat passed on to him from the previous long time owner or else he would not have brought it up and made such a point about it. The patina is from an outdoors life right off the coast of SoCal.

_The listing said this, "The bike is original except that the original coaster-brake rear wheel was at some point swapped for a Schwinn single-speed freewheel, with a nice very high-flange hub. The change also required the change of the chainring to 1/2" pitch, from the original 1" pitch. Given these upgrade parts are also quite vintage, I suspect the change was made in the 1950s." _​


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## SirMike1983

Is it a tall frame? That would be an impressive score indeed, if it were.


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## rennfaron

SirMike1983 said:


> Is it a tall frame? That would be an impressive score indeed, if it were.



You know what Mike... your question just now (cause I know you know these NWs well and wouldn't ask if you didn't question something) prompted me to reevaluate my eyeballing last night and take a tape out there and get some real measurements. I generally have these frame sizes locked in per a quick glance, but I unpacked this last night, basically in the dark with a head lamp on, and put it away today and was just leaning on my recollection of first impressions during the unboxing.

So when I initially saw the bike in the listing (first image), I was about 99% sure it was a large frame. I even took the image and overlaid it over other large frames I have on file. The geometry and sizing matched up. I was then 100% sure and pulled the trigger and had a large frame coming my way. When I pulled it out of the box last night, I eyeballed the gap on the head tube and then was 100% sure I had screwed up the frame size, got my wires crossed on the image and I bought a 21" frame... UNTIL you just asked that question. I ran outside and luckily have another NW up in the stand right now and it is a 21" frame. I took both measurements and waddya know, you're right and my initial instincts were right and it is a large frame. I am sure I would have realized my mistake at some point, but glad it happened now! On left is the other NW I have and measurement from center of crank top of seat post and on right is this bike. 

_...started a new job two weeks ago...need more sleep...haha_


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## 1motime

SirMike1983 said:


> Is it a tall frame? That would be an impressive score indeed, if it were.



Good eye!  Makes a special bike that much more.  I like it!


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## 1motime

rennfaron said:


> I agree, but don't know much about those hub types. I most likely would have thought that the rear hub was original if the seller had not said it was updated in his listing info and followed up and said the same again after I reached out. I reached back out to the seller just now and he said he got it around 10 years ago (I thought he flipped it quick) and the person he bought it from had it in the family for a long time. I can only assume that was information somewhat passed on to him from the previous long time owner or else he would not have brought it up and made such a point about it. The patina is from an outdoors life right off the coast of SoCal.
> 
> _The listing said this, "The bike is original except that the original coaster-brake rear wheel was at some point swapped for a Schwinn single-speed freewheel, with a nice very high-flange hub. The change also required the change of the chainring to 1/2" pitch, from the original 1" pitch. Given these upgrade parts are also quite vintage, I suspect the change was made in the 1950s." _​



Anything is possible.  No reason to change the hub.  It makes perfect sense with the rest of the bike


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## Oilit

1motime said:


> Why can't the rear hub be original?  No reason for a coaster with caliper brakes.  This is a platform bike so anything in the catalog was available?
> Great bike.  Probably not a lot of use.  Looks like the atmosphere and time made the patina.  Even with that the Persons seat has held up better than most Mesingers.



Good point! If you have a rear coaster brake, you're not going to have a rear caliper, and I don't see wear on the chain stay from a torque arm either. There's one rusty spot, but it doesn't look big enough. I'm not convinced that bike ever had a coaster brake. If it's still got the original tires, I'd think those are the original wheels. The only thing that really looks out of place is the chain ring.


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## GTs58

While you have your tape measure out, check out your crank. My 43 black out dog legged crank is a 7 incher. It's said the New Worlds used a 6 1/2" crank, but with a 23" frame they may have used a 7 incher.


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## rennfaron

GTs58 said:


> While you have your tape measure out, check out your crank. My 43 black out dog legged crank is a 7 incher. It's said the New Worlds used a 6 1/2" crank, but with a 23" frame they may have used a 7 incher.



6 1/2"


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## rennfaron

A new development in the answers to the questions on the original setup... The coaster brake note, per the seller, checks out. And not just that, it was a ND 2 speed setup. Also, I need to soak the rear rim, but I am pretty sure the entire wheel was replaced. The front wheel is original and is painted white with black pin stripes. The rear rim looks to be a superior rim of the time and is rusted good. I do not see any white paint. I have a couple other of these superior rims and they were badly rusted just like this and same type rust (those superior rims rust really bad in the right environment).

I looked on the inside of the stay and bingo, there is a wear area in the right spot. This is different than surrounding patina and the paint is worn and has a definite bite into the paint.








I also see where the guard was attached. I wonder if it was a hockey or one of these types? I don't know if they have the same spacing on where the bracket sits on the stay...





ND 2 speed shifter location - hard to tell in the photos but there are definite impressions/bites into the paint where a shifter was clamped on and the wear does not wrap or extend to the bottom of the tube which definitely confirms it was that setup (they clamped on to the top and sides but the bottom was open). I originally wasn't looking that far back on the top tube, but once the 2 speed setup clicked I looked and there were the clamp marks.


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## 1motime

Pretty good detective work!  Changes were made.  The wear marks tell all.  So if it was a coaster than the caliper brakes were added later.  Wonder the reasoning why the rear is mounted backward.


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## rennfaron

1motime said:


> Pretty good detective work!  Changes were made.  The wear marks tell all.  So if it was a coaster than the caliper brakes were added later.  Wonder the reasoning why the rear is mounted backward.



Thanks! I am glad the clues came together because I was stumped last night. Some daylight and fresh eyes put 2 & 2 together. I had also forgotten about the 2 speed ND setup and was just thinking about the typical ND coaster.

If those brakes were added later, it must have been a few days later haha, because they look very original to the bike. Plus they are blackout levers and calipers. That would be very impossible to add later because sourcing blackout would be very hard and they would not have been blackout if put on later. I RARELY see those blackout parts (I would have to look back at my archive to see if I have any NWs archived with blackout brake setups).


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## 1motime

Sounds like it might have been a bike shop / dealer update.


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## SirMike1983

Looks like you can see finishing filing done around the frame joints through the paint around the head tube joint.


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## rennfaron

1motime said:


> Pretty good detective work!  Changes were made.  The wear marks tell all.  So if it was a coaster than the caliper brakes were added later.  Wonder the reasoning why the rear is mounted backward.



@GTs58 said he has seen the rear caliper mounted on the inside of the stays a couple times before and still no idea why. It would be my first time seeing it.


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## 1motime

War time.  Labor time was of the essence.  Every hour counted  Minimum of time spent filing


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## Oilit

I figured the black-out "Schwinn-Built" calipers had to be original, but I can't fault your reasoning, the mis-matched rims put it beyond question. With a Superior rim (pre-war?), a black-out caliper and war tires, now I'm wondering if maybe this was somebody's transportation during the war and that's when the work was done. Are you going to set it back up as a two speed?


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## rennfaron

It is fun to try and put the pieces back together, but sometimes impossible to fully know the story. I would really like to put it back to 2 speed condition, but we will see. It would be a pretty killer setup. Tracking down that in blackout and a white rim will take a bit.


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## SirMike1983

If it isn't original as it is, then you are a little more free to build it up the way that would best suit you. Maybe consider building your own wheelset for rider purposes and just set aside and preserve what you already have. A set of Superior rims laced to a pre-war Sturmey AW and a Schwinn script front hub would really bring it to life.

If you live in a flat area, the large-flange single speed freewheel is a great choice. They're very smooth and efficient-running hubs.

I love ND hubs, but the 2-speed and 3-speed ND set ups are over-priced for what they do for you as a riding machine. It doesn't help that they're high-cachet ballooner parts. They're really for when you have to have a more "original" machine, and you'll certainly pay good money for them. I just think the AW set up gives more bang for the buck, especially if you already have hand brakes.


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## Miq

Nice wartime New World @rennfaron!  I love the War tires and all the blackout parts!


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## rennfaron

More thoughts to unravel...

@GTs58 made an interesting observation *(and corrected me below - per edits)*. Enamel rims aren't really the best for a caliper setup and are generally found on bikes with a drum setup or coaster brake setup. With a caliper setup they clamp and wear into the paint pretty good and also deposit the brake pad color in a nice ring on the sides. I was looking back at my archived NWs and I have about 11 NWs that have white enameled rims. During Wartime the rim options were "Schwinn Superior or Ivory Finish (white enamel)." *(Edit - I read that as superior OR ivory finish - only option at this time was Ivory finish on a superior rim (no plating option))*. So the white enameled rims were out there at this time, and I can only assume specific to only this time period as I have not found this spec (yet) in years before or after wartime. I assume it was a customer preference on which one they went with, but during wartime maybe supply limited even those options. So out of those 11 NWs I have on file 9 of those are wartime '42-'43 (from what I found) and the other two: one most likely is wartime because it has blackout parts (no stated date) and the other could be wartime but no stated date. So potentially 100% of those 11 are wartime. So again it appears that Ivory Finish (white enamel) was specifically a wartime option *(Edit - confirmed it was)*. Of the 11 with white enamel, 3 had a caliper setup (generally just on the front). And we know that calipers on enamel weren't great, but per the supply issue, maybe that is just what had to go on there. Or maybe the customer is always right and they wanted painted rims and a caliper setup and the dealer just went with what they wanted. So on this bike, the blackout hub plus white rim appear to be original (blackout Finish + Ivory Enamel = wartime). The back rim definitely looks swapped. This would be quite the not-so-great setup out of the gates to have front/rear calipers on enameled rims. But if that option set was contingent on the restricted supply at that time, then that is what they had to go with. *(Edit - pretty interesting that they had to go with a pretty bad setup because they weren't plating at that time.)* 

Thoughts?


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## C M Gerlach

rennfaron said:


> More thoughts to unravel...
> 
> @GTs58 made an interesting observation. Enamel rims aren't really the best for a caliper setup and general found on bikes with a drum setup or coaster brake setup. With a caliper setup they clamp and wear into the paint pretty good and also deposit the brake pad color in a nice ring on the sides. I was looking back at my archived NWs and I have about 11 NWs that have white enameled rims. During Wartime the rim options were "Schwinn Superior or Ivory Finish (white enamel)." So the white enameled rims were out there at this time, and I can only assume specific to only this time period as I have not found this spec (yet) in years before or after wartime. I assume it was a customer preference on which one they went with, but during wartime maybe supply limited even those options. So out of those 11 NWs I have on file 9 of those are wartime '42-'43 (from what I found) and the other two: one most likely is wartime because it has blackout parts (no stated date) and the other could be wartime but no stated date. So potentially 100% of those 11 are wartime. So again it appears that Ivory Finish (white enamel) was specifically a wartime option. Of the 11 with white enamel, 3 had a caliper setup (generally just on the front). And we know that calipers on enamel weren't great, but per the supply, maybe that is just what had to go on there. Or maybe the customer is always right and they wanted painted rims and a caliper setup and the dealer just went with what they wanted. So on this bike, the blackout hub plus white rim appear to be original (blackout Finish + Ivory Enamel = wartime). The back rim definitely looks swapped. This would be quite the not-so-great setup out of the gates to have front/rear calipers on enameled rims. But if that option set was contingent on the restricted supply at that time, then that is what they had to go with.
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> View attachment 1349641View attachment 1349642


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## C M Gerlach

Great bike,
I have some blackout hubs, rims from a wartime british thing...would be perfect match for your project..pm if you care


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## GTs58

SirMike1983 said:


> Looks like you can see finishing filing done around the frame joints through the paint around the head tube joint.




I noticed that too! All the war time J series serials that had the electro-forged head tubes and tube joints I've noted happened to be on the 21" frames. I think this is the first 23" war time J serial #'d piece so far. New tooling would be needed to stamp out the larger 23" frame head tube pieces and it appears they weren't that far ahead yet. The seat tube is EF to the BB though. 

As far as the war time rim option on that spec sheet, I'm seeing just the Superior that was painted Ivory, no other option. There is a freewheel hub option, caliper brake option but no plated rim option. That definitely seems like a catch-22 situation.


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## rennfaron

GTs58 said:


> As far as the war time rim option on that spec sheet, I'm seeing just the Superior that was painted Ivory, no other option. There is a freewheel hub option, caliper brake option but no plated rim option. That definitely seems like a catch-22 situation.



That makes more sense. I was reading that as superior OR ivory finish, not superior w/ ivory finish. And that explains why so many with ivory rims during wartime!


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## Miq

If you can't use chrome because of the War, what other choices did you have?


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## rennfaron

Miq said:


> If you can't use chrome because of the War, what other choices did you have?



I learned earlier, you didn’t! I don't know much about these wartime bikes and had thought they may have extra stock of parts leading into this time period, as I have seen some wartime bikes with a mix match of plated parts and blackout parts. For example, I have seen some with blackout bars, but a plated stem. Or plated calipers/levers but blackout hubs. So I assumed kind of the same for the rims. But it seems pretty strict on that part that wartime = enamel finish.


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## Oilit

The last line of the catalog you posted above is hard to read, but it looks like "Parking stands, chain guards and chrome finish on all parts except cranks and handlebar stems, have been eliminated by War Production Board." I didn't think about the problem of using calipers on painted rims, but it sure looks like that's what they did.


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## Miq

Those VW1M Ads from @HUFFMANBILL are still adding info to the story.  Good stuff.


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## GTs58

Oilit beat me to it.


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## Miq

The single rear mudguard wire brace instead of two rear wire braces is also an odd wartime thing.  Post war (end of war?), in the middle of the K serials, they flipped to the slat style braces.


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## SirMike1983

Hand brakes and painted rims were not uncommon before WWII. I've seen ivory colored rims that had hand brakes from the WWII era, black painted rims from 1910s - 30s English bikes with rod brakes that had stirrups and pads rubbing on them. It's a cheaper alternative to plating, or an alternative that does not require as much in the way of strategic materials if in war time. The pads eventually rub the paint off, and then you're down to bare metal. If you ride the bike regularly, it won't rust because the brake pads just wipe away the starting surface corrosion. When it goes bad is if the bike sits, then you later want to ride it again. At that point you may have a pitted rim. But eventually the same happens to plating - it wears off and you're down to bare metal. It just takes longer.


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## rennfaron

Miq said:


> The single rear mudguard wire brace instead of two rear wire braces is also an odd wartime thing.  Post war (end of war?), in the middle of the K serials, they flipped to the slat style braces.



All those little pieces of info are great. If you were putting together a wartime NW and you snag some off ebay, I guess better make sure you get the right ones for that time period!


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## Miq

Finding a wartime single wire rear mudguard for a New World victory bike doesn't sound easy.


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## rennfaron

Oilit said:


> The last line of the catalog you posted above is hard to read, but it looks like "Parking stands, chain guards and chrome finish on all parts except cranks and handlebar stems, have been eliminated by War Production Board." I didn't think about the problem of using calipers on painted rims, but it sure looks like that's what they did.



@Oilit just checked to see if it ever had a stand and nope. No paint loss or indention on the top or bottom between the stays. It is crazy to think the bike never had a stand... It also makes me think to recheck where I thought was paint loss in the right spot for the guard to attach and check that again and also where the other end would connect to see if it ever had a guard. Per that ad, it may not have...


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## Oilit

rennfaron said:


> @Oilit just checked to see if it ever had a stand and nope. No paint loss or indention on the top or bottom between the stays. It is crazy to think the bike never had a stand... It also makes me think to recheck where I thought was paint loss in the right spot for the guard to attach and check that again and also where the other end would connect to see if it ever had a guard. Per that ad, it may not have...



It's possible that someone added an aftermarket chain guard at some point, although if they did, you would think it would still be there. Somebody put a kickstand on my 1942 CWC, but it doesn't look like there's ever been a chain guard.


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## SirMike1983

I've seen a number of WWII-era lightweights with no chain guards. These were mostly Westfields, Elgins, Cleveland Welding, Huffman bikes. They made heavy use of black out parts. Most had stands, and some had black-out stands. The farther you go into the war period, the more likely you are to see these sorts of things. Some of these bikes also made use of wooden pedal blocks and wooden handlebar grips, though most of the ones I've seen still had rubber blocks and rubber grips. If you see no signs of any chain guard at any point, then it's possible your bike never had a chain guard as it was purchased and delivered. Same is true for the stand. It's possible the person just did not want or need (or want to pay for) a stand. Cost and material cutting measures ran deep by 1943. I say build it up however would be most useful to you, depending on where and how you prefer to ride, and go with it. Set aside anything you don't need so you can put it back later if need be.


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## 1motime

Pant cuff clip was cheaper that a chain guard.  The bike could have been someone's primary transportation.  Heavy gas rationing in 1943.  Middle of the war.  
Everyone sacrificed for the greater good


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## HUFFMANBILL

Hey Guys,

From April, 1942 until Sept., 1944 U.S. government bicycle regulations ( Limitation Order L-52 ) did not permit new bicycles to be sold to the public with chain guards or stands, which of course was due to wartime metal rationing.  So during this period any chain guards and stands used were from pre April 1942 production not from the factory new bikes ( Say, Mr. Smith obtained a new Columbia lightweight through the rationing program to use in getting to his war production job that bike would have been received by him without chain guard or stand.  However, he may attach and old chain guard and/or stand that was laying around ). As of Sept., 1944 the regulations were changed to allow new bikes to be sold with chain guards and stands as long as the addition of these components did not have a negative impact on war production contracts.  Also, in regards to chain guards and stands the restrictions only pertained to civilian use bicycles.  U.S. Military use bicycles were allowed to be produced and delivered with chain guards and stands.

Regards,
Bill


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## rennfaron

HUFFMANBILL said:


> Hey Guys,
> 
> From April, 1942 until Sept., 1944 U.S. government bicycle regulations ( Limitation Order L-52 ) did not permit new bicycles to be sold to the public with chain guards or stands, which of course was due to wartime metal rationing.  So during this period any chain guards and stands used were from pre April 1942 production not from the factory new bikes ( Say, Mr. Smith obtained a new Columbia lightweight through the rationing program to use in getting to his war production job that bike would have been received by him without chain guard or stand.  However, he may attach and old chain guard and/or stand that was laying around ). As of Sept., 1944 the regulations were changed to allow new bikes to be sold with chain guards and stands as long as the addition of these components did not have a negative impact on war production contracts.  Also, in regards to chain guards and stands the restrictions only pertained to civilian use bicycles.  U.S. Military use bicycles were allowed to be produced and delivered with chain guards and stands.
> 
> Regards,
> Bill



Great info. Thanks Bill.


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## Oilit

HUFFMANBILL said:


> Hey Guys,
> 
> From April, 1942 until Sept., 1944 U.S. government bicycle regulations ( Limitation Order L-52 ) did not permit new bicycles to be sold to the public with chain guards or stands, which of course was due to wartime metal rationing.  So during this period any chain guards and stands used were from pre April 1942 production not from the factory new bikes ( Say, Mr. Smith obtained a new Columbia lightweight through the rationing program to use in getting to his war production job that bike would have been received by him without chain guard or stand.  However, he may attach and old chain guard and/or stand that was laying around ). As of Sept., 1944 the regulations were changed to allow new bikes to be sold with chain guards and stands as long as the addition of these components did not have a negative impact on war production contracts.  Also, in regards to chain guards and stands the restrictions only pertained to civilian use bicycles.  U.S. Military use bicycles were allowed to be produced and delivered with chain guards and stands.
> 
> Regards,
> Bill



I didn't realize the military bikes still had guards and stands. Thank you!


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## jimbo53

Here is a catalog page of the New World (does not specify year) but does list a high flange rear hub with freewheel and caliper brakes.


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## rennfaron

Update: It looks like it did have a guard at one point.


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## HUFFMANBILL

Oilit said:


> I didn't realize the military bikes still had guards and stands. Thank you!



Yes,  the contracted Columbia and Huffman standard G519 US Military models of 1941 - 1944 and the Columbia US Military Compax models F92-L and F92-H Folding ( collapsible ) bicycles between 1942 - 1945 were originally equipped with both chain guards and stands from the factory.

Regards,
Bill


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## HARPO

As far as the Large Flange Hub, here's the catalog page from 1941...


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## 1motime

I would think the Large Flange front is more common.  Would be a nice touch with both of the large ones.  Get to keep the calipers that way


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## rennfaron

I am curious about the line in the wartime ad, "Also Delta Roadliter Lamp availabe mounted on handlebar stem -- at additional cost." I looked up these lights and it looks like there are different versions. Some look like they mount to fenders. This one would be mounted to the bars. Anyone know the exact one discussed for the time period?


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## 1motime

rennfaron said:


> I am curious about the line in the wartime ad, "Also Delta Roadliter Lamp availabe mounted on handlebar stem -- at additional cost." I looked up these lights and it looks like there are different versions. Some look like they mount to fenders. This one would be mounted to the bars. Anyone know the exact one discussed for the time period?



I have never seen them mounted on fender.  Fender is not the strongest and the fin is in the way.  Usually on a bracket mounted to the handlebar pinch bolt on the neck


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## rennfaron

I was researching these and found some that are said to be "roadliter" and are mounted to the fender. Assumed to be around wartime (pre/post).








						COLSON FRONT CUSHIONER GRILL TANK PRE/POST WAR BICYCLE RESTORED TO PERFECTION | #1798166062
					

THIS AUCTION IS FOR A STUNNING PRE/POST WAR 26  BOYS COLSON FRONT CUSHIONER GRILL TANK BICYCLE. IT HAS BEEN COMPLETELY RESTORED TO ABSOLUTE SHOW QUALITY AS A 1941 COLSON IMPERIAL.THE BIKE IS A 1950 CO




					www.worthpoint.com
				











						prewar bicycle Colson Bullnose Super Cruiser antique | #45212597
					

original boys 26  balloon Colson Firestone SuperCruiser 1941 bicycle -older repaint very straight condition good rider has cushion fork- tiller handlebars w Torrington Script- correct stem-orig grips-




					www.worthpoint.com
				




I saw these on ebay and the flat bottom made me think it mounts to the fender. This is the same style as above, but better images. Again, assumed to be 40s and not 50s like the style below.
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-...0001&campid=5335809022&icep_item=363259768314
https://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-...0001&campid=5335809022&icep_item=363235379053

It could be that these are from a different time period but still a ROADLITER.
I did see this one that looks completely different but still called a roadliter and would attach to the stem. However, this one looks more from the 50s.








						Delta Roadliter Headlight As-Is Vintage Bicycle Light schwinn corvette jaguar | #1861396696
					

Vintage Delta headlight with some issues. Missing lens, missing bulb. The mounting bracket is missing one of the legs, as pictured. Small amount of chrome peeling on top of bezel. Light has not been t




					www.worthpoint.com
				



https://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-...0001&campid=5335809022&icep_item=303803235349


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## 1motime

Those Firestones are 1941.  Balloon wide fender.  I have one and don't think it will mount on the fender.  I have a New World and held it up.  Fin is in the way.  Maybe the stem mount is an old design that was used for decades


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## 1motime

My 1940 New World was completely original. It had a Deltaflex tail light. No headlight.  Maybe this is correct?  Generator powered.

https://thecabe.com/forum/threads/few-parts.117928/


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## Oilit

Considering the Traveler always had lights it stands to reason that Schwinn would have offered something for the New World. Somebody out there must have one, but I don't recall seeing one.


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## rennfaron

Oilit said:


> Considering the Traveler always had lights it stands to reason that Schwinn would have offered something for the New World. Somebody out there must have one, but I don't recall seeing one.



You would think. I have about 60 unique NW examples archived and I just looked through them and none have a light. That is why I was wondering about the Delta light that was said to be an add-on. You would think at least one example would turn up with an original light.

@Pedalsnostalgia said this on that other forum, "Delta manufactured two different RoadLiters: The original RoadLiter during the 1940's & 1950's (a white, teardrop shaped) and then a "new" RoadLiter (chromed,ball light) starting in the early 1960's." So that chrome ball one is too young for the NWs.


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## cyclingday




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## cyclingday

It’s interesting that there appears to be a distinct transitional Defense model between the prewar fully optioned New World and the fully rationed Victory/War model.
The Defense model only seems to have been built during the 1st quarter of 1942.
All of the prewar options were still available except for the items imported from England.
The most notable difference on the Defense model from the prewar model is the use of the Standard Schwinn headset, instead of the newer precision 1940 type.
I don’t see why this change would’ve been made unless the supply ran out.
The only blackout parts used during this period was the bottom bracket cup/hardware and the wire fender braces.
Otherwise it was full chrome as usual.
It seems like sometime in April or May, that the decisions were made to ration the materials, or enough time to run out the existing supply of prewar production materials, had been made, that the limitations and rationing began to occur.




Probably an early/pre blackout 1942 catalog entry.


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## Oilit

cyclingday said:


> It’s interesting that there appears to be a distinct transitional defense model between the prewar fully optioned New World and the Spartan fully rationed Victory model.
> The defense model only seems to have been built during the 1st quarter of 1942.
> All of the prewar options were still available except for the items imported from England.
> The most notable difference on the Defense model from the prewar model is the use of the Standard Schwinn headset, instead of the newer precision 1940 type.
> I don’t see why this change would’ve been made unless the supply ran out.
> The only blackout parts used during this period was the bottom bracket cup/hardware and the wire fender braces.
> Otherwise it was full chrome as usual.
> It seems like sometime in April or May, that the decisions were made to ration the materials, or enough time to run out the existing supply of prewar production materials, had been made, that the limitations and rationing began to occur.
> View attachment 1461880
> Probably an early/pre blackout 1942 catalog entry.



That is interesting! I can see how ball bearings could be restricted early. The 8th Air Force raids on Schweinfurt were to attempting to knock out German ball bearing plants, and the bomber crews paid a high price for those attempts.


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