# Need help with a date on a Raleigh built Hercules Royal Prince



## 1959firearrow (Feb 14, 2012)

*Need help with a date on a Raleigh built? Hercules Royal Prince*

Alright I'm trying to date this Raleigh built Hercules Royal Prince it was the first bike my grandfather ever bought brand new and the only bike he owned up until a couple of months ago. He says he can't ride anymore and wanted me to have this and my grandmothers first bike. The hard part is he couldn't remember the year he bought it, all he said was sometime in the 50s. Well this may be just about the nicest quality bike I have ever ridden and I would like to put date on it. It has a Sturmy Archer 3 speed hub and shifter the only number I found on the was 5. Its got a miller headlight and generator setup also. Any help would be appreciated. The precision built quality of these bikes is awesome!


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## Andrew Gorman (Feb 14, 2012)

What model is the SA hub? According to the intertubes Raleigh bought Hercules in 1960.  Here's more info from this very board:
http://thecabe.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?5141-Hercules-Raleigh-Roadster.  That search button is a handy gadget!


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## 1959firearrow (Feb 14, 2012)

I'm not sure what that it is Raleigh built I was just told that it was by someone, could be a Hercules built bike but I don't know what to look for.


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## ducnut (Feb 14, 2012)

That's definitely a Hercules-built bike. The dropouts and lugs are not RI stuff.

You can find more info on dating the hub here.


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## sailorbenjamin (Feb 14, 2012)

Naw, that's a Herculese Herculese.  Compare the fuller chainguard, different fender contours, and lugs with little ornamental eyes to this Raleigh. Also, there is the chainring and the different handlebars.







Raleigh and Herculese joined hands in about '59 so I'm guessing that this is a pre '59 bike and it's not from Nottingham.  I'd say late 50s but what do I know?


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## sailorbenjamin (Feb 14, 2012)

BTW, is that Findlay, Ohio?


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## 1959firearrow (Feb 14, 2012)

Yes it is findlay ohio(im from pandora my grandfather has lived his whole life in findlay) There are two tags on it from 75, a normal state issued tag and a round tag my grandfather made that mounts between the fork and wheel with the license number and findlay ohio on it. Do you live around here? I do see alot of differance between the raleigh and the hercules now.


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## sailorbenjamin (Feb 15, 2012)

I'm in NY these days but my best college buddy moved out to Findlay about 10 or 12 years ago.  I make it out to visit maybe every 5 years.  I'll have to look you up next time.  He's into older VWs.  Maybe you've seen his silver bug around town.
Here's a link for us old 3 speed fans.  They'd love to see this bike;
http://www.bikeforums.net/showthread.php/623699-For-the-love-of-English-3-speeds...


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## 1959firearrow (Feb 15, 2012)

You should look me up! By the way guys I made the mistake of thinking the Sturmey Archer shifter meant it had a Sturmy 3 speed, Instead it has a Hercules B type 5. Somewhere I red that Hercules used Sturmey hubs and shifters until they started making their own. So I'm gonna guess this is between the years they switched over which would be????? Called my Grandpa to ask if he ever changed  the shifter he said "no I only changed the rear tire and tube once" so that led me to believe the switchover theory?


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## sailorbenjamin (Feb 16, 2012)

I've heard that, too but I don't know any specifics.


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## usarnie1 (Jun 9, 2019)

Your grandfathers bike is a 1955.


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## Oilit (Jun 22, 2019)

I agree with the others, your bike was built by Hercules in Birmingham around 1955. My understanding is that Hercules hubs were introduced after WWII, with the "A Type" in the late "40's up until about 1952, then the "B Type" until 1956 or '57. I expect these hubs were built by Sturmey-Archer for Hercules, in part because Hercules used Sturmey hubs pre-war, partly because it would have been impractical to produce hubs so similar to what was already available and partly because I have a "Hercules SW" dated 1958 that looks exactly like the Sturmey-Archer SW except for the name. The A Type and B Type seem to have been based on older Sturmey designs, but the Hercules SW seems to have been built just before Sturmey-Archer halted production of the SW; after several attempts to fix the problems they gave up and went back to the AW design. Supposedly the "Schwinn Approved - Made in Austria" hubs were used in 1959 because Sturmey-Archer was having delays restarting production of the AW. And then Sturmey-Archer's parent company, Raleigh Industries, was bought by Tubing Investments in 1960 and merged with the British Bicycle Company, parent company of Hercules. So there was a lot going on and I could have some of the details wrong, but I think it's correct for  the most part.
There aren't as many of the older Birmingham-built Hercules around as the later Raleigh-built-in-Nottingham version, and your granddad's looks to be in good condition. If the differences aren't obvious at first, find someone with one of the Raleigh-built bikes and compare them side by side.They're like a Ford and a Chevy, two completely independent executions of a basically similar design.


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