# Major Taylor Bike



## pelletman (May 2, 2017)

The Worcester Historical Society claims this bike is attributed to Major Taylor.  Anyone have any idea what it is?


----------



## pelletman (May 2, 2017)

https://www.facebook.com/worcesterhistory/?hc_ref=PAGES_TIMELINE&fref=nf


----------



## redline1968 (May 2, 2017)

Looks like a pierce fork


----------



## corbettclassics (May 3, 2017)

Looks like the last 4 letters are "ronn"

Might be an "L" two letters before the "R"

Need to study this one a little more when I have some time. ( French bike?? )


----------



## filmonger (May 3, 2017)

Not sure what it is.

Possibly the Worchester Telegram might have something in the newspaper archives - most likely in their daily. weekly bicycling column 1890's.


----------



## filmonger (May 4, 2017)

Do you think the remnant is Johnson?


----------



## corbettclassics (May 4, 2017)

filmonger said:


> Do you think the remnant is Johnson?
> View attachment 461110 View attachment 461109




No


----------



## filmonger (May 4, 2017)

LOL... I know you guys have been through this aspect. Just sayin that .... the the letter before what looks loke the fist ( n ) - just might be an ( s ) and what looks like the second ( n ) might be an ( o ) the last letter being the n and a big paint chip after. Still leaves the issue of no underline graphic though. Maybe not the best theory. Still......


----------



## 66TigerCat (May 5, 2017)

Several bicycles have surfaced that have been attributed to Taylor but all lack proof beyond the current owners word. It would be hard to prove. I'm not suggesting that the Worcester Historical Society is making false claims but I wonder if there is documentation with that bike. If it did belong to Taylor it would be very valuable, IMO.


----------



## dnc1 (May 5, 2017)

Does any period account of his racing mention the marque(s) he used?


----------



## corbettclassics (May 5, 2017)

dnc1 said:


> Does any period account of his racing mention the marque(s) he used?




I don't think there is anything like that.  Basically you have to see what year the picture is of him on a bike and figure out what bike he's on.
I have put together my own timeline of his racing bikes periodically but not easy. He raced in Europe on several different bikes and here
he was famous on the Iver Johnson.  But, he rode so many bikes that I'm still waiting for someone to put together the timeline of bikes like 
I have done with Eddie Bald.  I can pretty well tell you every bike Bald rode year to year from 1893 to 1903. Waiting on a Taylor aficionado !!


----------



## pelletman (May 5, 2017)

We know he rode Iver Johnson and Orient


----------



## corbettclassics (May 5, 2017)

pelletman said:


> We know he rode Iver Johnson and Orient




and off the top of my head an Alcyon, Labor, I think a Peugeot and a Comet. Taylor raced on lots of bikes. I'm not sure if he rode a Munger when he was being trained by Munger himself. Need to go over this stuff and refresh my memory.


----------



## dnc1 (May 5, 2017)

Thanks @corbettclassics.
I knew he came to Europe for races.
One imagines all of the French manufacturers falling over themselves to get him to endorse their machines.


----------



## redline1968 (May 5, 2017)

close?


----------



## dfa242 (May 5, 2017)

According to Ritchie's book, _Major Taylor_, he won a 75-mile race in 1895 on a Munger


----------



## 66TigerCat (May 6, 2017)

In no particular order - Munger, Orient, Comet, Iver Johnson, Stearns, Peugeot, Labor, Alcyon, Massey-Harris. There are probably others but I haven't found any any info on other marques yet...


----------



## 66TigerCat (May 6, 2017)

Speaking of Major Taylor's bikes, take a look at this one. It was owned by an ex-racer in Australia who owned a bike shop. He passed away in 2010 so who knows where it is now. Checkout the crank. There is an additional chainwheel in front of the crank. I can't think of what it could be other than some sort of tensioner. The previous owner called it a 6 Day outrigger !(?).

Here's the pic.


 
I'm trying to find the patent info on it. No luck so far. Here's the link to the story about the previous owner from 2004. Incidentally, I think he's being paced by an Orient pacing machine.

http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2004/09/02/1093939072042.html


----------



## dnc1 (May 6, 2017)

US patent no. 684,882 A, filed Dec. 9, 1900.
A full description of  how this works is available online.


----------



## 66TigerCat (May 6, 2017)

dnc1 you are the man ! Thanks for digging that up.


----------



## dnc1 (May 6, 2017)

filmonger said:


> Do you think the remnant is Johnson?
> View attachment 461110 View attachment 461109



Looks very similar to me.


----------



## corbettclassics (May 6, 2017)

That's one of the pics I was going to post as I wan't sure what bike he was on.

Here's the other shot of it with his head down instead of looking at you.

I think it's actually the same photo but with photoshop on his head.


----------



## dnc1 (May 6, 2017)

66TigerCat said:


> dnc1 you are the man ! Thanks for digging that up.



You're welcome.


----------



## dnc1 (May 6, 2017)

corbettclassics said:


> That's one of the pics I was going to post as I wan't sure what bike he was on.
> 
> Here's the other shot of it with his head down instead of looking at you.
> 
> ...



They're almost identical, but if you look at the people in the background, particularly the head of the man behind the guy on the rear of the motor-pacer, you can see they were taken from slightly different angles.


----------



## filmonger (May 7, 2017)

Here is some interesting tidbits about Taylor when he first started. This was from the wheel Aug 1898 in an article about the Indianapolis Meet. Being the hometown of Taylor there was some background given to the reporters about how Taylor started. Here it states he used to ride a Hecla juvenal wheel of the old high wheel type as a messenger for Tom Hay. It states that it had backbone made of solid Iron. It also mention's that Taylor was able to break this backbone. It then say's he was a steward of the bachelor quarters presided over by "Birdie" Munger when Munger was the superintendent of the bicycle works in Indianapolis.





Just a little background on Hay....


----------



## dnc1 (May 7, 2017)

filmonger said:


> Here is some interesting tidbits about Taylor when he first started. This was from the wheel Aug 1898 in an article about the Indianapolis Meet. Being the hometown of Taylor there was some background given to the reporters about how Taylor started. Here it states he used to ride a Hecla juvenal wheel of the old high wheel type as a messenger for Tom Hay. It states that it had backbone made of solid Iron. It also mention's that Taylor was able to break this backbone. It then say's he was a steward of the bachelor quarters presided over by "Birdie" Munger when Munger was the superintendent of the bicycle works in Indianapolis.
> 
> View attachment 462845
> 
> ...



Some pumpkins indeed!


----------



## Underground Bicycle Shop (May 7, 2017)

I saw an old photo of him on a bike extremely similar to that just recently. Definitely rings a bell


----------



## pelletman (May 8, 2017)

Underground Bicycle Shop said:


> I saw an old photo of him on a bike extremely similar to that just recently. Definitely rings a bell




It would be good if you could post it here if you can remember where it was


----------



## Handyman (May 15, 2017)

The director of the Fitchburg Historical Society has been emailing the Worcester Historical Museum about the Major Taylor bike they have and got this response in an email:  *"the biographer who wrote about him (Andrew Richie) says that it was a German Durkopp bike: he said that whenever Major Taylor went to Europe, he brought back a European bike. They estimate that the bike dates from between 1900 and 1925". *
Pete in Fitchburg


----------



## filmonger (May 16, 2017)




----------



## 2jakes (Aug 3, 2017)

corbettclassics said:


> and off the top of my head an Alcyon, Labor, I think a Peugeot and a Comet. Taylor raced on lots of bikes. I'm not sure if he rode a Munger when he was being trained by Munger himself. Need to go over this stuff and refresh my memory.




I have a first edition “Major Taylor” by Ritchie (1988).




On page 240, there is mention that Taylor consulted with Louis Munger about writing a book.
I don’t have a copy so I went online:








Major Taylor pays homage to Louis D. “Birdie” Munger:




Here are excerpts where Taylor makes mention of a bicycle built by Munger.


----------



## corbettclassics (Aug 3, 2017)

Here's a few ads of Munger's bikes if you have an interest :->  ( I haven't found one yet ..!!! )

==============================================


----------



## Freqman1 (Jan 18, 2018)

I'm currently reading "Major Taylor: The Inspiring Story of a Black Cyclist and the Men who Helped Him" (Kerber & Kerber). I believe they drew heavily on Taylor's autobiography ("The Fastest Bicycle Rider in the World") but certainly are able to add a perspective that Taylor couldn't (or wouldn't). Interestingly it does mention quite a few of the bikes he rode including some he borrowed for races due to his machine being delayed or lost. It does say he rode a Munger "Birdie Special" when he was with Munger. Of real interest though was the reference to the IJ bikes and that some of these were sold with Major Taylor on the head tube. I would assume this was something akin to a Pierce Frank Kramer Special. The pics of him on an IJ show the typical IJ badge. Has anyone ever seen an IJ Major Taylor bicycle? On a side note because he did spend a lot of time in Europe and Australia it seems it might be worthwhile searching the French, German, and Australian Ebay sites for Taylor memorabilia. V/r Shawn


----------



## corbettclassics (Jan 18, 2018)

I've been searching those sites overseas for yrs with no luck.  I would love to find a Munger for the collection though which I have never seen.  There are so many TOC racers that I'm looking for but they seem to have all disappeared as they weren't around very long as not many were made.

I think Tigercat is a Major Taylor collector and maybe he has some photos in his collection of a Taylor IJ that you're talking about.


----------



## Handyman (Jan 18, 2018)

I did not know that Freqman1, 
This has got to be, without a doubt, the "Holy Grail", to any Iver Johnson collector.  An Iver Johnson racing bike with Major Taylor on the headtube......................,You've got to be kidding me !  Pete in Fitchburg


----------



## dnc1 (Jan 18, 2018)

So, forgive me for asking @66TigerCat, does such evidence for this mythical 'IJ' machine exist?
Also, forgive my own ignorance fellow Cabers, just when approximately, did the eponymous handlebar stem get its' name? 
Was is it advertised as such while he raced?
Was he remunerated for it?
Just curious to know.


----------



## bricycle (Jan 18, 2018)

corbettclassics said:


> That's one of the pics I was going to post as I wan't sure what bike he was on.
> 
> Here's the other shot of it with his head down instead of looking at you.
> 
> ...




Not the same photo, but close. driver's head is in front of spectator in first photo, not in second.


----------



## 66TigerCat (Jan 18, 2018)

dnc1 said:


> So, forgive me for asking @66TigerCat, does such evidence for this mythical 'IJ' machine exist?
> Also, forgive my own ignorance fellow Cabers, just when approximately, did the eponymous handlebar stem get its' name?
> Was is it advertised as such while he raced?
> Was he remunerated for it?
> Just curious to know.



Interesting. I read the Kerber book and don't recall reading about the special MT model Iver. That doesn't mean much, I can't remember what I had for breakfast . I believe he only raced for them for a short time so if there were any it was probably a short run. Hens teeth, for sure. 

The "Major Taylor" stem became popular around the turn of the century. I don't believe it was Taylor's design but he certainly popularized it's use. I think his name was used more as a description for that syle of stem sort of the way we call facial tissue Kleenex, or bandage a Band-Aid. I tried to find a patent for it but was unsuccessful.


----------



## Freqman1 (Jan 18, 2018)

66TigerCat said:


> Interesting. I read the Kerber book and don't recall reading about the special MT model Iver. That doesn't mean much, I can't remember what I had for breakfast . I believe he only raced for them for a short time so if there were any it was probably a short run. Hens teeth, for sure.
> 
> The "Major Taylor" stem became popular around the turn of the century. I don't believe it was Taylor's design but he certainly popularized it's use. I think his name was used more as a description for that syle of stem sort of the way we call facial tissue Kleenex, or bandage a Band-Aid. I tried to find a patent for it but was unsuccessful.




In the Kerber book look at pgs 36 (3rd para), 59 (2nd para), 60 (2nd para), 66 (1st para), and 69 (3rd para) for reference to the Munger "Birdie Special". It looks like this bike was likely only built in 1895-6 and according to pg 36 had a "silver emblem featuring an owl on the front".  P254 (3rd full para) for Major Taylor IJ (1902). V/r Shawn


----------



## filmonger (Feb 15, 2018)

Taylor rides Stearns 1899... From the Referee


----------



## filmonger (Feb 15, 2018)

1899 - Mjr Taylor races...




 


 


 



 


 


 


____________________



 

_______________


----------



## corbettclassics (Feb 15, 2018)

Here's a couple of original photographs of Major Taylor never really seen out there that I have saved in my archives ..


----------



## corbettclassics (Feb 15, 2018)

And another one :->


----------



## corbettclassics (Feb 15, 2018)




----------



## 66TigerCat (Feb 15, 2018)

View attachment 754873[/QUOTE]
Any info on this pic Bill ? Where/when is it from ?


----------



## Jon Olson (Feb 15, 2018)

Hay and Willits “Outing” badge from the 1890’s. The bicycle Co. was Marshall Walter Tayler’s $6 a wk. stunt   
riding job at age 13. He wore a military uniform that earned him his nick name “Major”.


----------



## corbettclassics (Feb 15, 2018)

66TigerCat said:


> View attachment 754873



Any info on this pic Bill ? Where/when is it from ?[/QUOTE]
From France - looks like he’s on a Peugeot.  What year did he ride this? I need to double check. I’ve got another one like this but he’s looking down. I liked this one because he’s looking at you.

Bill


----------



## 66TigerCat (Feb 16, 2018)

corbettclassics said:


> Any info on this pic Bill ? Where/when is it from ?



From France - looks like he’s on a Peugeot.  What year did he ride this? I need to double check. I’ve got another one like this but he’s looking down. I liked this one because he’s looking at you.


It looks like it might be from the same photo session as the one above it. He is definitely riding a Peugeot in the pic.


----------



## filmonger (Feb 19, 2018)

Had to ride the same race again.... curious.


----------



## 2jakes (Feb 19, 2018)

corbettclassics said:


> Here's a couple of original photographs of Major Taylor never really seen out there that I have saved in my archives ..
> 
> View attachment 754872




I was looking for information regarding a movie preview (2010) about Major Taylor without much luck.
I did find these images .






Avenue Kleber, Paris.


----------



## filmonger (Feb 26, 2018)

Aug 1899 - The Wheel.... Munger talks about plans and the money that is likely to be made for Taylor - about 15000 USD a year.






Sept 1899 - The Wheel ... Mile a minute discussion with Taylor


----------



## filmonger (Mar 10, 2018)

Taylor is reinstated by the racing union after the lifetime suspension - fine imposed.

From Cycle Age... May 1900


----------



## filmonger (Mar 10, 2018)

Use of Steam Tandems for records in France.... Would they equip Taylors in the same way. Nov 1899 cycling Age











_______________


----------



## GiovanniLiCalsi (Mar 10, 2018)

filmonger said:


> Taylor rides Stearns 1899... From the Referee
> 
> View attachment 754745


----------

