# Hornet?



## mrg (Apr 18, 2021)

So not sure about this one, was a real mix of parts/years when I got it, looks like it may have had a tank at one time!, #'s say 56 and was looking my S2 pile for rims to make it a rider before I sell realized it's a middleweight!, didn't think Hornet was a MW in 56. Spitfire was a 1 year only straight bar in 56 so is this a Spitfire with a patina matching Hornet guard?, guess I have to dig in the S7 pile or just put some Klunker wheels to get it rolling down the road. not to good of pics!


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## GTs58 (Apr 18, 2021)

There were two Hornet models for 1956. The Deluxe Hornet D-19 was a balloon and the F-15 equipped was a middleweight. Both were middleweights in 1957.
That one would have a tank, rear carrier and a torpedo light. And truss rods.


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## mrg (Apr 18, 2021)

So equipped meaning it probably had a tank?


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## GTs58 (Apr 18, 2021)

mrg said:


> So equipped meaning it probably had a tank?



Yes, basically the same as the Deluxe but truss rods instead of a springer, blackwall verses whitewall and light wasn't the Rocket Ray.


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## RustyHornet (Apr 19, 2021)

Very cool. Have always thought these transition years were neat. Have almost the same bike. Been calling mine a Spitfire, chain guard is non original but matches decent. This one is dated 1956 as well, built on my birthday too. The more I look at it, it looks like it may have had a tank too, and the signs of truss rods, the headset “washer” is missing, so someone prolly nabbed the truss rod bracket!


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## Jeff54 (Apr 19, 2021)

Yeah, that did have a tank. The real question is whether the deluxe and standard Hornet frames are identical so to fit balloon tires properly. The deluxe fenders are slightly wider than middleweight, but that's the next question: Did the standard have the same as deluxe too? And were all the fenders and frames the same size  in the transition until the full change into S7's?
I measured my deluxe years ago in a post here, somewhere, but forget the exact numbers. Otherwise, just go with the bible thumpers: "The catalog is the holey gospel and if it's not in it, Schwinn never did it." So, those  are fake tank scratches and chips. If a bike was accessorized when new  then, it is condemned to become a parts bike, stripped and rot in hell's rust pile.


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## mrg (Apr 19, 2021)

I forgot to mention this also has a bolt on kickstand like the Spitfire, you would think a semi-equipped with a tank would have a welded on stand?


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## RustyHornet (Apr 19, 2021)

mrg said:


> I forgot to mention this also has a bolt on kickstand like the Spitfire, you would think a semi-equipped with a tank would have a welded on stand?



Mine has the same bolt on stand. It is strange. Perhaps they were gearing up for the change to middleweights and used some lower end frames that didn’t come with bolt ons. It does seem odd. The catalog picture shows them having the big Phantom sprocket, but mines got a clover.


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## mrg (Apr 19, 2021)

Spitfires were the lower end frames Heavy & middleweight all with bolt on stands but didn't know if any Hornets ever had them.


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## RustyHornet (Apr 19, 2021)

mrg said:


> Spitfires were the lower end frames Heavy & middleweight all with bolt on stands but didn't know if any Hornets ever had them.



Hard telling what they had going on with the transition years, also this was the last year for the straight bar hornet. Maybe they just used whatever frames they had to finish out the Hornets with the straight bar before gearing up for the canti Hornets?


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## GTs58 (Apr 19, 2021)

mrg said:


> I forgot to mention this also has a bolt on kickstand like the Spitfire, you would think a semi-equipped with a tank would have a welded on stand?




The earlier Hornets did have a built in stand and forged stem. Around 1953 Schwinn changed a lot of the models and the Spit and Hornet both had bolt on stands and rolled stems. In 54 the B6 changed to a cantilever Hornet equipped Streamliner. Lots of changes going on during these years prior to the the middleweights and the Balloon extinction.


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## Rivnut (Apr 20, 2021)

On the 1956 Fair Price Guide, the Hornet has an F prefix before the model number and the Deluxe Hornet has a D prefix.  All balloon bike, except the Phantom, have the D prefix, and all othe middleweights have the F prefix.  Is that prefix an indicator of the frame used in building the bike?


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## Jeff54 (Apr 20, 2021)

Yeah but no, the deluxe straight bar has a bolt on kick stand too. Unlike others maybe the deluxe hornet has a deluxe stand that doesn't work the frame into crap and wiggle loose too.

Also, there's more Deluxe Hornets that do not have large sprocket than those that do. It seems more like, if somebody restores one, they'll op to change the sprocket too 52tooth and get a larger chain to fit. That way, the bible thumpers "If it's not in a catalog it aint holey" are happy.  I mean, surely it could not possibly be that Schwinn factory turned out anything other than  the exact same thing in a catalog 100% of the time? Schwinn note to dealer's ordering form: 'Oh no, it's my way or the highway! Ordering bulk or a single unit, Mix and matching is not allowed. ' 'Schwinn, Oh, so sorry CharlRe, we're out of that seat on that model of the bike in the photos, in catalog, an we ain't gonna supply any other option either, come back next year, Okey dokey?'


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## GTs58 (Apr 20, 2021)

Rivnut said:


> On the 1956 Fair Price Guide, the Hornet has an F prefix before the model number and the Deluxe Hornet has a D prefix.  All balloon bike, except the Phantom, have the D prefix, and all othe middleweights have the F prefix.  Is that prefix an indicator of the frame used in building the bike?




The F in the model number denotes a Middleweight. The D and B are balloon models. And to make it fun, they changed things years later and some middleweights had a B number.


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## Rivnut (Apr 21, 2021)

Is there anything in a model that will let you know how to distinguish the cantilever frames from the straight bar frames.


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## Jeff54 (Apr 21, 2021)

I think that I need to get my calipers out and get rusty, while he's on this topic and compare some figs. I mean, there's just something about the deluxe that, it looks, get the feeling they are no different than standard Flat bar Hornets in this time frame.   
I mean, ya no,, I'd prefer deluxe is special, yet, it no looky likes it be so.


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## GTs58 (Apr 21, 2021)

Jeff54 said:


> I think that I need to get my calipers out and get rusty, while he's on this topic and compare some figs. I mean, there's just something about the deluxe that, it looks, get the feeling they are no different than standard Flat bar Hornets in this time frame.
> I mean, ya no,, I'd prefer deluxe is special, yet, it no looky likes it be so.




Only diff between the Deluxe and regular Hornet was the two tone paint color choices, whitewalls, Springer verses truss rods and Rocket Ray verses the torpedo light. The cost difference was $10 in 1956. That's a lot for adding whitewalls and a swapping a fork for a springer.  Add 10 bucks to the cost of a Deluxe Hornet and you could have a Phantom.


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## Uncle P (Apr 24, 2021)

I have a ‘56 Hornet in this same color and configuration. It was my dad’s and seemed to be complete and unmolested when I got it, other than the missing tank. Currently on upgraded running gear because it sees a lot of miles per year. The original S7 wheels, drivetrain and seat/post are safely stored away.


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## Rivnut (Apr 24, 2021)

@Uncle P Do you have the tank for it as well? Cool color combinations.


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## Uncle P (Apr 24, 2021)

Rivnut said:


> @Uncle P Do you have the tank for it as well? Cool color combinations.



I do not. No one in the family knows what ever happened to the tank. I’d like to pick one up, but it will be difficult to find one in the same state of patina so that it looks consistent with the rest of the bike.


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## RustyHornet (Apr 24, 2021)

Uncle P said:


> I have a ‘56 Hornet in this same color and configuration. It was my dad’s and seemed to be complete and unmolested when I got it, other than the missing tank. Currently on upgraded running gear because it sees a lot of miles per year. The original S7 wheels, drivetrain and seat/post are safely stored away.
> 
> View attachment 1397499



That bike looks really good! Like the black wheels on it.


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## Uncle P (Apr 24, 2021)

RustyHornet said:


> That bike looks really good! Like the black wheels on it.



Thank you! Going to the ISO 559 size hoops obviously opened up a Pandora’s box of tire choices, which was the goal. The seatpost and cranks are carbon, and I really like the contrast of the fresh black parts on the classic frame. It was built to be ridden regularly and it rides gloriously. I put 2000 miles on her last year.


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## Rivnut (Apr 24, 2021)

I’ve got a slew of restored middleweights but I’ve found that my favorite bike for pure riding pleasure is a stripped 63 Schwinn Traveler with a set of middleweight alloy wheels and the 1.75 x 26 tires.  Light in weight and easy to pedal.  Ain’t the fastest but I’m in no hurry.


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## Uncle P (Apr 24, 2021)

Rivnut said:


> I’ve got a slew of restored middleweights but I’ve found that my favorite bike for pure riding pleasure is a stripped 63 Schwinn Traveler with a set of middleweight alloy wheels and the 1.75 x 26 tires.  Light in weight and easy to pedal.  Ain’t the fastest but I’m in no hurry.



That travelled sounds like fun. I agree that it’s a whole different experience riding the old stuff. I too find it to be really relaxing and the fun factor seems higher compared to my modern bikes. Plus everyone seems to like seeing classics out being ridden.

I’ve been getting the bug to build up another one. I’ll have to be patient but I think I want to find a 40’s Schwinn Superior next. There was an amazing green one on here a while back, but price plus shipping was not in the cards.


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## mrg (Apr 24, 2021)

Finished up this 56 Hornet project and took it for a test ride down the tracks before putting it in the for sale section, have a set of all black rims & tires but descided on the red with gums also have some og S7's if someone would rather have those.


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## hm. (Apr 24, 2021)

Hey Mark looks nice and the sidewall on those new 40 psi gumwalls look to be a better shade. Dig the tan color. Not yellow like the common duros.


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## Uncle P (Apr 24, 2021)

mrg said:


> Finished up this 56 Hornet project and took it for a test ride down the tracks before putting it in the for sale section, have a set of all black rims & tires but descided on the red with gums also have some og S7's if someone would rather have those.




That’s got great patina!


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## Jeff54 (Apr 25, 2021)

Caliper results: Surprisingly Top bar lower and seat post bars, On, all my Schwinn are just about the same, from 47, my oldest and even 56 racer ,, 63 middle weight. include 55 Phantom and 95 phantom. 81 24" cruiser too. Level up to at least 2002 cruisers. same, same, go figure?  Checked my 50 CWC and, it's about 1/8th " thinner (didn't look at actual measurement CWC but marginally thinner whereas, my 41 CWC is about same as schwinn. . so, moreover,  post war or at least by 1950, CWC is more middleweight than Schwinn is.

Now, where it should show differences in the Hornet straight bar, deluxe VS. standard is the width of the fender bridge, bracket yet, that seems to be even smaller than 60's middleweight, and at 1-1/4" is freakin small compared to 60's at 2-1/4".  This  is a completely different bracket than others Schwinns, except. IDK my 56 racer might have this small bracket too. The 54 cantilever middleweight, has the new bracket for rear brakes and or multi-speed models. just about or is the same on the 1980 Cruisers.

So, my 1955 Deluxe Hornet's  Adjusted to were localized area is; in-between  uppers stays, space to fit rear fender properly, and is 2-7/8" +/-. Fender width seems to average a tad under 3" about 2-15/16 and potentially may be 2-7/8". Mine aint new or even close. " It's like, at least on my Hornet deluxe straight bar, there are 1/4"+ that is, less than standard Balloon fender and frame.

That means, at least on Deluxe the lower stays, if there's any difference then,  are bent wider. Kind like differences in sting-ray and their compatibles. tornado, and Jr's, or those issued with S7 verses S2 rear rims, there're just bent out, Lower stays are curved wider just after the bracket/bridge. I.E. If there is a difference between Straight bar deluxe Hornet and and standard, it may be there.

U kind-a have to guess where to measure the stays, on straight bar hornets to check, unless their fenders are the same size too. Maybe later, about 1958, other straight bar frames got narrower? And maybe, if so then, it, like stink-ray and their 20"  Jr verities, it's just a matter on how the rear lower stays are bent/curved. I mean, I had to bend 20" Juniors to get S2's to fit, but, could not bend out enough to get rear fenders in right without squeezing, bend fender a little. And if U tried to bend a 20" out to fit fenders for S2 wheeled bike fenders, U can break the fender bracket/bridge weld.


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