# Explain Schwinn...



## danny7147 (Feb 23, 2012)

Okay, who will be kind enough to explain to a guy from England about Schwinn?

We don't get them over here, I think I've only ever seen one. From what I can understand, they're obviously a BIG make over there who have been going for years, but are they the 'classic' American bike make or something? They certainly seem to fetch big money on ebay!


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## 37fleetwood (Feb 23, 2012)

Oh this ought to be good!
Take whatever they say and cut it in half.

For many years Schwinn was the largest and most popular bicycle manufacturer in the U.S.A., they made tons of bikes, and are collected by many, though most Schwinn guys are a bit soft in the head, if you know what I mean.


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## PCHiggin (Feb 23, 2012)

*Pre 1983 Schwinn*

The Schwinn bikes that demand a lot of money were ballooners,Sting-Rays and middleweights made in their Chicago factory,up to the early 1980's.They didnt adapt to their customers demands for mountain bikes or bmx's fast enough and didnt modernize their factory or adjust the employee pay packages to compete with foreign competition.I dont think they ever could compete with the pay of Taiwan or China but thats another topic. The Chicago factory closed sometime in the early 80's,1983 I believe. They opened a new factory in Mississippi but it was too late,they were broke.They went bankrupt about 8 years later and the Schwinn family lost control of the company with all of its properties including trademarks.The second owners moved the HQ to Colorado and tried to get on top of the mountainbike market, bmx and trick bikes but got too far into debt. They tried to revive the classics with Phantom and Sting Ray replicas but those were too expensive and that company also failed.The current owners are a  larger corporation,they make  junk with a Schwinn badge for the big box stores and supposedly top quality bikes for speciality shops,the latter being way over priced in my opinion. I think the pre bankruptcy Schwinns demand a lot of money today much for the same reason they always did,they were simply made better and customers got much more for the money.This and the fact that Schwinn was the trend setter in engineering and styling put them ahead of the game at least since the 1930's.They patented the cantilever style frame and the knee action fork in the the late 1930's.These features were and still are copied by most others.No secret why so many still exist.


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## ducnut (Feb 23, 2012)

Wikipedia.....http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schwinn


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## snickle (Feb 23, 2012)

Schwinn can be compared to Ford & Chevy in that, all are classic American symbols of ingenuity and style, there are many around, and for the right price, you can have any one you want. Sure, there are many other bikes that also fall into this category, and even some far more valuable or sought after than anything Schwinn made. But none are as plentiful or parts as easily attainable as Schwinn. Not to mention, they were built like tanks. 

I am slowly looking at other vintage non Schwinn bikes that catch my interest but most of the ones Ive seen, they usually have at least 1 funky part that I don't dig. But then there's the ones who's design completely blows away anything the Schwinn designers ever came up with.


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## danny7147 (Feb 23, 2012)

Hmm... okay, thanks for explaining that! It certainly explains why they're collectable, I'd guess they're the same as Raleigh are here, where parts are simple. When you say they're a classic American icon, is it the sort of thing where a lot of adults would look back at some of the older frames and think "Hey, I had that one when I was a kid!"?

I'm trying to draw a comparison, as Raleigh came out with a lot of famous designs like the Chopper and Grifter where people see them and fill full of memories!


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## ratdaddy (Feb 23, 2012)

*Schwinn*

Yes raleigh is a great bike .i have had several and they do fetch top dollar for the parts.i think this goes way back with the schwinn.it is an icon just like a harley davidson or indian motorcycle.and thats what alot of the 20'-50's schwinn repersent to guys like us our dads had those old harleys with that flowing design you know like its moving even when its sitting still.we had to have something that was as cool as our dads.you know schwinn owned harley crocker motorcycle in the 30's and that had alot to do with the design of thier bicycles.heck i keep several of those 30's bicycle in my house so i feel like i going even when i sitting still.thinking bout puttting one on the bathroom wall .if you look back in our history books you will notice that american cars and trains and airplanes and motorcycle and bicycles and tricycles and toy cars and pedal cars have the look cause that what we like.


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## danny7147 (Feb 23, 2012)

Makes sense... they're a style icon as well then, like a Stingray or Corvette  Raleigh only did that a couple of times, but I get the idea now that you've compared it to those kind of things.

Think Corvette, Harley, Coca Cola, Flying Fortress, McDonalds (not the best example, but still American...), and Schwinn's up there as an icon of the States the 'way it used to/should be! Our bikes were well built, but the problem was that they symbolised Britain the way it was... dull, grey, straight, boring, but very practical  Sure, built well, but without looking pretty closely they all follow the same design. Just from some of the forums I've been flicking through though, it sounds like Schwinn had pretty unique designs, ones that people can tell the model at a glance the same way you'd be able to tell a Dodge Charger from a Trans Am? Or would you have to be 'into' Schwinn to know the difference?


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## OldRider (Feb 23, 2012)

Schwinn might have got all the glory but please don't forget there were other manufacturers with very comparable bikes in looks, style and reliability.


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## ratdaddy (Feb 23, 2012)

*Schwinn*

Acually i think it was excesilor motorcycle schwinn bought.anyway,look at one of those motorcycles and then look at a schwinn of the same time period.same designers.we love our airflow look.


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## ratdaddy (Feb 23, 2012)

*Schwinn*

Yea look at the elgin line of bike.twin bars blue birds and so on.and shelbys wow.


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## PCHiggin (Feb 23, 2012)

ratdaddy said:


> Acually i think it was excesilor motorcycle schwinn bought.anyway,look at one of those motorcycles and then look at a schwinn of the same time period.same designers.we love our airflow look.




Yeah,They owned Excelsior and Henderson Motorcycles.Those names were Schwinn Trademarks or properties until their bankruptcy.


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## julzgiles901 (Feb 25, 2012)

OldRider said:


> Schwinn might have got all the glory but please don't forget there were other manufacturers with very comparable bikes in looks, style and reliability.




well said.


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## PCHiggin (Feb 25, 2012)

OldRider said:


> Schwinn might have got all the glory but please don't forget there were other manufacturers with very comparable bikes in looks, style and reliability.




I agree untill about 1955 or '56. Monark was bought by Huffy and their bikes turned into Huffys,decent stuff but not good as Monark.Columbia seems to have been the closest second to Schwinn around then but got el cheapo too with their components a few years later.I have a 1949 girls 26'er and its rock solid compared to a 60's middleweight I used to own.


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## 37fleetwood (Feb 25, 2012)

Huffy made good stuff until around 1956-57 after that it's all rubbish.


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## danny7147 (Feb 25, 2012)

I read the Wiki article about Schwinn, it's an amazing story... it kind of sums up the whole 20th century really, boom and bust etc! What was a surprise was seeing the Stingray though, it's almost an identical version of a Raleigh Chopper, and I'm quite curious which came first!










Now it's fair to say that the Stingray has a far curvier frame, the Chopper is very straight, but you have to admit that the look of it is pretty similar! I'm not sure about the Schwinn, but the Chopper in the picture obviously has the saddle raised to the very highest level as it's normally a lot lower down than that!


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## Larmo63 (Feb 25, 2012)

The Arnold, Schwinn bicycle is well known to have always been the best bicycle in America.

They always were, everybody knows, that they will always be the pinnacle of style, innovation, 

and high quality!! Many try to postulate that they are just another brand, but they are merely 

shooting spitwads at a battleship.


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## ratdaddy (Feb 26, 2012)

*Baseball apple pie and schwinn bikes rock*

I have alot of schwinns,and i love to just look at them.and sometimes ride but mostly look.but i bought a nice original jc higgins colorflow at a swapmeet yesterday and i think i will be looking at it for a day or two.i might even bring it into the house in my cave for awhile just to get the feel for it.then iam going to take it out in front of my house on this big ol hill and see how fast it will go.with my wife in pursuit of course with the pickup truck so she can haul me and the bike back home.


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## PCHiggin (Feb 26, 2012)

danny7147 said:


> I read the Wiki article about Schwinn, it's an amazing story... it kind of sums up the whole 20th century really, boom and bust etc! What was a surprise was seeing the Stingray though, it's almost an identical version of a Raleigh Chopper, and I'm quite curious which came first!
> 
> View attachment 43532
> 
> ...




The Sting-Ray was available in the summer of 1963. The pic. you posted is of a 1968 Sting-Ray "Orange Krate",they were available Christmas 1967 or very shortly thereafter until 1972 or '73. The Chopper is cool,not very common where I grew up.


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## danny7147 (Feb 26, 2012)

I've got a feeling that the Stingray would actually predate the Chopper by about 5 years then! A lot of people call the Chopper the bike that saved Raleigh as they were losing money every year, and it was only when they released the Chopper that they made a comeback. There really is a big similarity there though!

So, when someone asks "What would you call the 'classic American 50's car", the answer would usually be Corvette... what would you say is the 'classic' Schwinn? The most collectable, best, the one you'd love to find in a barn etc?


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## Balloontyre (Feb 26, 2012)

danny7147 said:


> So, when someone asks "What would you call the 'classic American 50's car", the answer would usually be Corvette... what would you say is the 'classic' Schwinn? The most collectable, best, the one you'd love to find in a barn etc?




This may not be the "classic schwinn" but to find a Westfield Built Mead Ace.... Now that would be a barn find for me.


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## PCHiggin (Feb 26, 2012)

*Classic Most Collectible?..*



danny7147 said:


> I've got a feeling that the Stingray would actually predate the Chopper by about 5 years then! A lot of people call the Chopper the bike that saved Raleigh as they were losing money every year, and it was only when they released the Chopper that they made a comeback. There really is a big similarity there though!
> 
> So, when someone asks "What would you call the 'classic American 50's car", the answer would usually be Corvette... what would you say is the 'classic' Schwinn? The most collectable, best, the one you'd love to find in a barn etc?




Thats a tough one,I have a couple of early 50's ballooners with different style frames and really enjoy riding both of them. I also have a few middleweights and Sting-Rays that arent ridden as much but I wont part them.  I'd say based on prices any of the mid to late 30's ballooners are the most sought after by true collectors,they're the most scarce.The post war to late 50's ballooners are most collectible to the novices born prior to WWII and post war baby boomers.The Sting-Rays are most collectible to late boomers,born in the late 50's or early 60's. So many different models are collectible its impossible to nail down one,but the Phantom has been a major collectible ballooner for at leat 35 years that I can remember....BTW,I love Vettes but my fav 50's cars are and have always been 1955-'56 Chevs and '32 Fords from that era.I'm going  to the Autorama in Downtown Detroit today and hope to see a bunch.


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## rustyspoke66 (Feb 26, 2012)

This is only a opinion but Schwinn is like an a##hole. Everybody has one. But to be fair I do agree that Schwinn did hang on to quality construction longer than any other name that had been around since the late 1800's, therefore making them one of the most common collected vintage bikes out there. However as far as being trend setter in engineering and styling they stayed on the safe side and never really got away from the same old thing for a really long time, like the canti frame and the straightbar frame those things are still used today and offer nothing in the advancement of design or engineering. Plus when Schwinn did their big reproduction thing it devalued almost every post war bike they built. Now a guy in some cases can't tell if a bike has repop parts on his phantom or stingray without looking very close and even then some of the parts were built so good that you cant tell at all. Of course with all that being said I still have a few Schwinn's on the wall and there are a few prewar Schwinn's I wouldn't mind having in my collection. Happy collecting!!!!!!!!!


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## PCHiggin (Feb 26, 2012)

rustyspoke66 said:


> This is only a opinion but Schwinn is like an a##hole. Everybody has one. But to be fair I do agree that Schwinn did hang on to quality construction longer than any other name that had been around since the late 1800's, therefore making them one of the most common collected vintage bikes out there. However as far as being trend setter in engineering and styling they stayed on the safe side and never really got away from the same old thing for a really long time, like the canti frame and the straightbar frame those things are still used today and offer nothing in the advancement of design or engineering. Plus when Schwinn did their big reproduction thing it devalued almost every post war bike they built. Now a guy in some cases can't tell if a bike has repop parts on his phantom or stingray without looking very close and even then some of the parts were built so good that you cant tell at all. Of course with all that being said I still have a few Schwinn's on the wall and there are a few prewar Schwinn's I wouldn't mind having in my collection. Happy collecting!!!!!!!!!




The repops actually made the gennies worth more not less,the bad economy took care of everything else.


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## Ozark Flyer (Feb 26, 2012)

Larmo63 said:


> The Arnold, Schwinn bicycle is well known to have always been the best bicycle in America.
> 
> They always were, everybody knows, that they will always be the pinnacle of style, innovation,
> 
> ...




Great products will dominate despite the spitwads.  Schwinns long lived dominance of the bicycle market, large number of vintage machines still in circulation, and other attributes Larmo listed are precisely the reason so many are still around today.  If you look at many of the long passed vintage brands out there, you will see a lot of clumsy attempts to find a style or design feature that could compete with Schwinn.  Fate and the free market delt with those competitors appropriately and the positive result was a lot of unique (and expensive) bicycle oddities for present day collectors.  "Everybody has one" because everybody wants one.


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## rustyspoke66 (Feb 26, 2012)

I would also believe that market saturation had something to do with everyone having one. They were the dominant force kinda like Walmart is now. Doesn't Walmart sell Schwinn now.


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## RMS37 (Feb 26, 2012)

Ozark Flyer said:


> Fate and the free market delt with those competitors appropriately




I imagine this also sums up the general sentiment held for the Schwinn company by Taiwanese, Korean, and Chinese bicycle manufacturers today.


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## rustyspoke66 (Feb 26, 2012)

Just a note, I have three Schwinn's hanging in the shop right now and Schwinn is what I started with in collecting bikes simply because you could find parts. Now a whole new world has opened up with the internet, Ebay and places like the Cabe. Now we can collect the bikes that were really cool, hard to find and built in much lower numbers than Schwinn. So let me say there is nothing wrong with Schwinn at all except that everybody has had one at some time and they seem like the norm and far from exceptional.


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## 1959firearrow (Feb 27, 2012)

The Schwinn is the 1932 ford of the car world everything that can be done has been and anybody and their brother has had/has one. I have one its a 1967 Typhoon Deluxe in really sad shape but I keep it around because I like the Schwinn company story especially the early days. The one thing that I really respect Schwinn for was they really did build bikes for about every purpose,price, and person successfully for quite a long time compared to most other manufacturers and they did it with amazing quality. Towards middle of the 50s I can see where Schwinn would become a "superior" bike to most brands but before that and especially pre-war stuff I have yet to see much of a difference.


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## snickle (Feb 27, 2012)

I would say 1957 Chevy Bel Air & 1949 Schwinn Black Phantom sitting in your garage would about sum it up for 2 of the many American classics.

But I guarantee if you put a 1938 Elgin Bluebird next to those 2, which do you think would catch a little more interest.


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## Larmo63 (Feb 27, 2012)

CyclingDay said it best in another thread about Schwinn; "If no one had ever seen a '49 B-6 and one showed up, people would be freaking out."

If Bluebirds were as common as Schwinn cantilevers, and b-6's were as rare as Bluebirds, the Schwinn would get as much or more attention in that garage.


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## GenuineRides (Feb 27, 2012)

*Iconic Schwinn*

We seem to forget too that Schwinns were some of the highest priced bikes of their day...and people still bought them in droves.  Do you think all those buyers were wrong?  No, they saw the value in a well built machine with general appeal to the masses, what many people call the 80/20 rule.  To succeed you need to appeal to 80% of the population and Schwinn did just that.  A $60 B-6 from 1947 would be $610 today, when the ave. yearly wage was $2850 and gas .15/gallon.  True, many of their concepts were not cutting edge or on the front edge of design, but they remained an iconic brand for years despite that, kind of like Coca Cola, not crazy mixed up ideas trying to start the next trend, but tried and true classic.

GenuineRides
www.genuinerides.com


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## cyclingday (Feb 27, 2012)

To answer the question, as to which Schwinn model bike would be the most coveted barn find;

I think most people would agree, that it would have to be the 1934/35 Streamline Aerocycle.

That model was significant because it is the bike that started the styling trend that seperated one manufacturer from the rest, and it was the bike that son Frank built to pay homage to his retiring father.

The last motorcycle that was built under Ignaz Schwinns direction was the 1929/31 Streamline Henderson model KJ. It was a ground breaking design in that it was the first motorcycle ever built using cast aluminium gas tanks that wrapped around the frame rather than hanging in between the frame.

Every motorcycle built after that model had streamline saddle tanks to this day.

If you look at the Streamline Aerocycle in comparison to the Streamline Henderson, the resemblance is very apparent.

The tank on that bike was so forward thinking, that it set off a styling war that gave birth the very hobby that we are all so enamoured with.

In fact, on that count alone, I would say that from a historical standpoint, the Streamline Aerocycle would be the most coveted barn find of them all. Now I know that statement will set off a firestorm of its own, but it is the bike that started it all.


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## GenuineRides (Feb 27, 2012)

Please realize too that Schwinn patented the cantilever frame design that continues to this day in some derivation from almost every manufacturer, along with establishing the straight bar frame design as an standard seen on many other classics and current repops.  The Autocycle and Motorbike copies flourished by 1938 so Schwinn had to come up with something else...canti!  Heck even the lowriders copy the original Schwinn design springer.  Their overall durability kept them in the game for all these years, and still keeps Schwinn at the forefront of classsic collectors.  Have you ever tried to twist an S-2 hoop without spokes, can't do it, even cut it in half, and it will not bend (part of their sales display, see attached)...nuf said

GenuineRides
www.genuinerides.com


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## 2jakes (Mar 14, 2012)

*1934/35 Aerocycle*

For years I had been searching for the elusive & expensive Aerocycle. In the meantime I had acquired several Phantoms along the way.
Finally I was able to own the Aerocycle & although what you say is true about this landmark bicycle , for me I found out that
riding it was not as comfortable as my "Phantoms".  I sold the Aerocycle . Do I regret it…..sometimes ! But I've come to the conclusion
that the fun was in the search & all that went into "getting & fixing it up". My next quest is the "Bluebird". My wife thinks I'm "nuts".
Which I guess I am.!














cyclingday said:


> To answer the question, as to which Schwinn model bike would be the most coveted barn find;
> 
> I think most people would agree, that it would have to be the 1934/35 Streamline Aerocycle.
> 
> ...


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## cyclingday (Mar 14, 2012)

I had always heard the rumors about how bad the ride was, on an Aerocycle. So, I was pleasantly surprised to find out, how good the ride is on an Aerocycle.

Now maybe I just got lucky and found the only Aerocycle built that has a decent ride. But, I kind of doubt that. It's all about fit and finish, and a proper set up.

The Bluebird will always be high on my list of the most beautiful bikes ever made.  I would love the chance to experience one of those someday. But, I have also heard the same rumors, about how cheap and tinny they are, and that they are prone to breaking just in front of the seat tube.

I have also heard that the fit is awful and that the ride quality is terrible.

I would really like to find out for myself just how horrible an Elgin Bluebird is. Because, I suspect that with a little luck in finding a good survivor. And some proper fit, set up, and finish. That a Bluebird can ride as smooth as glass.

With looks that are second to none, how can it not?


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## 2jakes (Mar 14, 2012)

*Aerocycle*

I probably didn't express myself right. There was never a question of fit or finish with the Aerocycle.  It rode as well as it could but I started
riding the Phantoms first for a long time & I got used to the spring action coils which made for a very comfortable cushion ride that the
Aerocycle with the lack of coil made for a stiffer ride. Also the long cross-braced handlebars were a little too close to maneuver for me. But
I still think it's one of the most beautiful bikes. My mistake was comparing it to the Phantom for comfort. I own a 1939 Ford Panel & a 1946
Chevrolet pickup….no A/C or power steering & the ride can be rough especially with the primitive shocks but I love them & when I climb
on…I adjust to it & looking out thru the small windows everything turns black & white like an old time movie enjoying the backroads , never
on the freeway ( don't think my trucks can keep up with the speed limits) I don't want to hotrod these trucks to modern standards just enjoy
them as they were originally built. I should've done that with the Aerocycle….oh well, if I should ever get lucky enough & find the Bluebird
I'll keep it no matter how it rides. Good Luck to you !


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## cyclingday (Mar 15, 2012)

Thanks, I'll need all the luck I can get.

 The Bluebird is a tough one to find. Very expensive when they do show up, with a lot of competition.

 That is the one bike that seems to be universally loved by everyone.


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