# TOC tandem ID help please



## New Mexico Brant (Feb 24, 2019)

Seeking help to identify this TOC tandem; please note the offset head badge rivets.  Let me know if any more images are needed.  Kindly, Brant


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Feb 24, 2019)

Nice tandem!


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## New Mexico Brant (Feb 26, 2019)

It seems this tandem has Pierce characteristics; any thoughts @dfa242 ?  Many thanks, Brant


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## Rambler (Feb 26, 2019)

I would agree, Pierce is a likely candidate.


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## dfa242 (Feb 26, 2019)

Yes, I agree it looks like a Pierce.


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## dnc1 (Feb 26, 2019)

Is that 'stoker' handlebar mounting on the frame top tube peculiar to "Pierce"? I've never seen one like that before.
Nice machine! 
What year approximately do people think?


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Feb 26, 2019)

Badges and more...,


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## New Mexico Brant (Feb 26, 2019)

dnc1 said:


> Is that 'stoker' handlebar mounting on the frame top tube peculiar to "Pierce"? I've never seen one like that before.




What made me first think Pierce was the fork; I had another fork (off of a Pierce) sitting on my bench next to the tandem that is identical.  Here are some images of an 1899 Pierce courting tandem that has some very similar features.  Also note the badge rivet positions on both.
I would love to hear thoughts on age as well.


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## Rambler (Feb 26, 2019)

Here is another Pierce tandem so I would say that unusual rear handlebar mounting is a Pierce identifier.


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## oldspoke (Feb 26, 2019)

New Mexico Brant said:


> Seeking help to identify this TOC tandem; please note the offset head badge rivets.  Let me know if any more images are needed.  Kindly, Brant
> 
> View attachment 954551View attachment 954552
> View attachment 954553
> ...



A nice machine !

This is a dual steering tandem ?


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Feb 26, 2019)

New Mexico Brant said:


> What made me first think Pierce was the fork; I had another fork (off of a Pierce) sitting on my bench next to the tandem that is identical.  Here are some images of an 1899 Pierce courting tandem that has some very similar features.  Also note the badge rivet positions on both.
> I would love to hear thoughts on age as well.
> View attachment 955345
> 
> ...



Cool bell!


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## New Mexico Brant (Feb 26, 2019)

oldspoke said:


> A nice machine !
> 
> This is a dual steering tandem ?




Yes, it is dual steering.  Thank you for your kind words.


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## New Mexico Brant (Feb 26, 2019)

I wish Will @filmonger was still around to comment.  Here is an 1897 image he posted in the Pierce serial number thread.  Although the image is not entirely clear, it appears one tandem has dual steering and the other two may not.


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## New Mexico Brant (Feb 26, 2019)

I found the serial number on the rear seat mast: 49580.





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## Blue Streak (Feb 27, 2019)

I have scans from the Wheelmen Library of Pierce catalogs for years 1897, 1899, 1900, 1901 and 1902. For these years, Tandems are only shown in the 1899 catalog. The Regular Double Diamond Tandem Models 162 & 164 were single steering but double steering was available as an option. They also offered _Track Use _and _Road Use _models.


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## Kenny Middendorf (Feb 27, 2019)

cool tandem !!!


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## New Mexico Brant (Feb 28, 2019)

Tandems show up in the 1898 Pierce Catalog; it is interesting because it mentions to state (Texas & New York) champions (amateur racers) were won in 1897 on Pierce tandems.  It is curious they did not appear in their 1897 catalog, maybe there was a separate catalog?


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## SKPC (Feb 28, 2019)

NMB...can you provide a couple good pics of the rear axle carrier fittings?


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## stezell (Mar 1, 2019)

Very cool piece of history Brant!


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## New Mexico Brant (Mar 6, 2019)

SKPC said:


> NMB...can you provide a couple good pics of the rear axle carrier fittings?
















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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Mar 6, 2019)

New Mexico Brant said:


> What made me first think Pierce was the fork; I had another fork (off of a Pierce) sitting on my bench next to the tandem that is identical.  Here are some images of an 1899 Pierce courting tandem that has some very similar features.  Also note the badge rivet positions on both.
> I would love to hear thoughts on age as well.
> View attachment 955345
> 
> ...



I’m looking for this type of bell.


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## dnc1 (Mar 7, 2019)

GiovanniLiCalsi said:


> I’m looking for this type of bell.
> 
> View attachment 959956



Wasn't one of these up for discussion on here last year? I think it was thought to be a 'lap' bell at first, you may want to search for it as that.
Also, I'm looking for this type of saddle too.


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## fordmike65 (Mar 7, 2019)

https://thecabe.com/forum/threads/what’s-up-with-this-huge-bell-on-a-recent-1899-iver-johnson-roadster-find.131199/


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## GiovanniLiCalsi (Mar 7, 2019)

dnc1 said:


> Wasn't one of these up for discussion on here last year? I think it was thought to be a 'lap' bell at first, you may want to search for it as that.
> Also, I'm looking for this type of saddle too.



Yes, it was.


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