Pre-War Hercules?

[Oilit]

1953 or 54, based on the hub. The hub is 1953, so the bike would be right around then. Sometimes they're dated the previous year and the bike is completed the following year. It's a Birimingham Hercules (a true "Hercules", not a Raleigh-made Hercules). Bike looks to have been over-painted with orange paint, based on the overspray on the top of the headbadge and the lower head tube race. Braces look painted too. But then it's also not missing a whole lot, so it's a good project. Hercules had hubs and shifter branded their own. The innards are very similar to the Sturmey AW, but some of the parts are a bit heavier-duty (e.g., the clutch). It's possible Brampton made the hubs for Hercules.

The hub may not be original, the first year for the B series hubs was 1952, but I believe the last year for the round head badge was 1949, then they went to the shield style. But my knowledge of Hercules is limited, so there may be variations I don't know about. Maybe the rod-brake bikes carried the older style badge a year or two longer.

 

[SirMike1983]

It's possible. Though the shifter is 1950s style as well, and the hardware looks to be fully chrome rather than any black-out (many of the earlier bikes) or nickel (also earlier bikes). They used several types of chainrings over the years, but in terms of commonality, the "H" chainring most often turns up on the post-war bikes.

There are a number of possibilities - replaced parts on an older bike, an older badge getting used up from existing stock on a newer bike, bike frame was assembled and sat but was assembled with newer parts at the factory, etc.

I do think it's a post-war bike, based on all those parts, but it's hard to pin down if the hub isn't original. Any transfers have been lost to the overpaint unfortunately.

I guess it's worth checking the frame serial number - can't hurt. They often not helpful, but maybe you get lucky and it's close to another person's bike number of a known year.

 

[Oilit]

@dnc1 has a friend who was planning to try to put together a list of Hercules serial numbers, but I don't know if that ever got off the ground. You would think if you had enough known examples there would have to be some kind of pattern, or maybe there's some old papers lying in a drawer somewhere in Birmingham....

 

[HPL]

1953 or 54, based on the hub. The hub is 1953, so the bike would be right around then. Sometimes they're dated the previous year and the bike is completed the following year. It's a Birimingham Hercules (a true "Hercules", not a Raleigh-made Hercules). Bike looks to have been over-painted with orange paint, based on the overspray on the top of the headbadge and the lower head tube race. Braces look painted too. But then it's also not missing a whole lot, so it's a good project. Hercules had hubs and shifter branded their own. The innards are very similar to the Sturmey AW, but some of the parts are a bit heavier-duty (e.g., the clutch). It's possible Brampton made the hubs for Hercules.

Thanks SirMike,
I was thinking early '50s, but was confused by the headbadge which apparently was used for various years. I tried to date it from other examples showing different headbadges, but of course relying on the fact that the dates for those examples may not have been correct. I've seen the green "shield" style shown on as early as a '48 (based on the owners dating), but it would seem that some headbadge use may have been concurrent for the same year (?). I'm surprised that they were still using bolt-on stays in the '50s. I've assumed the paint to be a respray, but was done well excepting some of the masking. I guess I need to find some period decals to finish it off since I'm not changing the paint. Also, looking for a Dynohub front for my lighting gear.

 

[HPL]

@dnc1 has a friend who was planning to try to put together a list of Hercules serial numbers, but I don't know if that ever got off the ground. You would think if you had enough known examples there would have to be some kind of pattern, or maybe there's some old papers lying in a drawer somewhere in Birmingham....

I had seen a site with some Herc serials when I was researching my '30s-'40s Raleigh, but I don't remember where. I didn't have the bike at that time so I wasn't paying any attention to the non-Raleigh data. I'll sit down again and seen if I can find out where it was posted, I'm not too patient when it comes to online work; usually very frustrating for me. I haven't even looked to see where the number is located; shouldn't be a problem unless the paint is obscuring it.

 

[SirMike1983]

Was it here: https://oldbike.eu/frame-number-bicycle-dating-guide/ ?

The headbadges and chainrings can be tough for dating these because there seemed to be a fair amount of mixing back and forth, using up old stock, etc. You'll see a bike with an "H" chainring that's earlier than one with the "HERCULES" full lettering sometimes, for example. The HERCULES is the older pattern, but they were still using them well into the 1950s.

Given the re-paint was done with a fair amount of care another possibility is an earlier frame was overhauled at a shop with newer parts and sent back out.

People from those times would probably be surprised we're so interested in learning about and collecting bikes like this today. To them, these were utilitarian transportation items.

You have the most important aspect - that the bike basically has all (or enough parts) to be made whole. At this point, I would think you're looking for the last few bits. With these projects there are certain parts that are very, very difficult to find if the project is missing those things.

 

[fat tire trader]

I have 2 prewar Hercules bikes and a bunch of catalogs. When I have time later, I will read through this thread and comment.

and click here to see my BV Deluxe http://www.fattiretrading.com/42herc.html

 

[dnc1]

@dnc1 has a friend who was planning to try to put together a list of Hercules serial numbers, but I don't know if that ever got off the ground. You would think if you had enough known examples there would have to be some kind of pattern, or maybe there's some old papers lying in a drawer somewhere in Birmingham....

Thanks SirMike,
I was thinking early '50s, but was confused by the headbadge which apparently was used for various years. I tried to date it from other examples showing different headbadges, but of course relying on the fact that the dates for those examples may not have been correct. I've seen the green "shield" style shown on as early as a '48 (based on the owners dating), but it would seem that some headbadge use may have been concurrent for the same year (?). I'm surprised that they were still using bolt-on stays in the '50s. I've assumed the paint to be a respray, but was done well excepting some of the masking. I guess I need to find some period decals to finish it off since I'm not changing the paint. Also, looking for a Dynohub front for my lighting gear.

Sadly @Oilit , my friends plan for collating Herc' serial numbers is a project that may take decades!
And @HPL, bolt on seat stays were not uncommon at the time, my '54 Raleigh has them.

 

[dnc1]

This is another friends 1934 Sports model, currently fitted with a 'Williams' crank and 'Elan' chain ring set up.....

 

[Oilit]

This is another friends 1934 Sports model, currently fitted with a 'Williams' crank and 'Elan' chain ring set up.....

View attachment 1085800

View attachment 1085801

From what I can see, the lugs aren't the usual Hercules type. Was this originally a Kestrel?