Verification of model year change

[PAValentine]

Another thing that i find interesting about the date stamping and the production date confusion....
From what I have read about Colt Firearms productions, is that when Colt productions ran a batch of parts/frames that carried a serial number. The stamped parts were all tossed into a bin, and when a builder needed a frame, he went to the bin and grabbed one, and took it to the workbench. Nothing has ever been said that those frames were arranged in a SN order. So likely when he grabbed a SN frame, it was the easiest one to pick up. By this reasoning, a frame in the bottom of the bin could lay there for quite some time before it was ever built into a gun. This is supposed to be why Colt firearms are extremely difficult to find with consecutive SN's! They weren't built in SN order.
Could this sort of process also apply to a lot of other SN marked products? Schwinn parts perhaps?
Guess it would depend on when the SN was actually stamped. Was it stamped when the part bearing it was produced, or after the frame was fully assembled? Either way, like Colt, not too likely things were produced in an actual SN order??? Built for convenience probably, and not for historical significance????

 

[Rusty Klunker]

Another thing that i find interesting about the date stamping and the production date confusion....
From what I have read about Colt Firearms productions, is that when Colt productions ran a batch of parts/frames that carried a serial number. The stamped parts were all tossed into a bin, and when a builder needed a frame, he went to the bin and grabbed one, and took it to the workbench. Nothing has ever been said that those frames were arranged in a SN order. So likely when he grabbed a SN frame, it was the easiest one to pick up. By this reasoning, a frame in the bottom of the bin could lay there for quite some time before it was ever built into a gun. This is supposed to be why Colt firearms are extremely difficult to find with consecutive SN's! They weren't built in SN order.
Could this sort of process also apply to a lot of other SN marked products? Schwinn parts perhaps?
Guess it would depend on when the SN was actually stamped. Was it stamped when the part bearing it was produced, or after the frame was fully assembled? Either way, like Colt, not too likely things were produced in an actual SN order??? Built for convenience probably, and not for historical significance????

Thats possible but we do have some documents stating when the part was stamped.
The parts were stamped ahead of the frame being welded but I can't tell you how well oiled the machine was. Did it build them in order, .. I have no idea.

 

[Schwinn Sales West]

Okay valid, yet we have Americans, Corvettes, Heavy Duti's and Typhoons with a serial number from one year but marketed as the following year.

And I think we all know there was discrepancies in the SN's back then. Batches of numbers left out or out of place.

And heres one for you. The LA KSHD, with the holidays when do you think that hit the showroom floor Jan, Feb, Mar or April of 66?

Keep in mind that the bike in question might not have been directly ordered and shipped to any Schwinn Dealer. If it was a Jobber/Sales Company warehouse bike, it could have sat in their warehouse inventory for six months BEFORE it was purchased by a dealer and shipped to the Schwinn Dealer. Who knows when it might have first showed up in a Dealers Floor?

In those days, it took two to three weeks for the rail car to move bicycle freight from Chicago to Arizona. We complained to Schwinn that the Bill was due before we might receive the shipment unless it was an extended dating order. The date the serial number was stamped, the date the frame was built, when the bike was assembled, the delay in shipping time, if the bike went into the Dealer's or Jobber's inventory all make it impossible to know "when the bike was first displayed on the dealer's floor".

I agree with Shawn, maybe we are over thinking this whole thing?

John

 

[AS-1]

Did it build them in order, .. I have no idea.

And neither does anybody else. And that is why I refer to arguments about serial numbers as a waste of time and "blatant speculation."

 

[AS-1]

In those days, it took two to three weeks for the rail car to move bicycle freight from Chicago to Arizona. We complained to Schwinn that the Bill was due before we might receive the shipment unless it was an extended dating order. The date the serial number was stamped, the date the frame was built, when the bike was assembled, the delay in shipping time, if the bike went into the Dealer's or Jobber's inventory all make it impossible to know "when the bike was first displayed on the dealer's floor".

I agree with Shawn, maybe we are over thinking this whole thing?

There it is Boys and Girls, The Gospel According to John. Wouldn't it be nice if all the arguing about serial numbers just went away?

 

[Schwinn Sales West]

Thats possible but we do have some documents stating when the part was stamped.
The parts were stamped ahead of the frame being welded but I can't tell you how well oiled the machine was. Did it build them in order, .. I have no idea.

The stamped serial number on production built bikes had almost no meaning to Schwinn, excluding Paramount frames (all custom built) numbers which were tracked. They did not track normal production frames. Only the date of manufacture four digit number which was stamped on the name plate and also on a small square sticker located on the seat mast was important for product recall purposes if needed. The serial number was used for warranty frame replacement just to keep track of one frame from another.

John

 

[coasterbrakejunkie1969]

The LA KSHD, with the holidays when do you think that hit the showroom floor Jan, Feb, Mar or April of 66

I'm not sure about any others but my LA KSHD was stamped, built and sold on October 31 1964 hahahaha. At least that's the story I'm sticking with.

 

[Rusty Klunker]

I agree with things John, but sales are sales and marketing is marketing.
Some people aren't so frugal and happy with with a leftover bike. I'm sure little Tommy didn't go around bragging "look at my leftover bike". And I'm sure little Tommy's dad was say "I just bought my son the latest and greatest bike".

They might have been good ol boys or playboys (hey its good to be the king!). But some body in the corporation had a clue of the date stamped to day assembled to shipped and received. And probably knew what year to market it as..

Well, I'm gonna go ride a bike while I have a nice day.

 

[Rusty Klunker]

I'm not sure about any others but my LA KSHD was stamped, built and sold on October 31 1964 hahahaha. At least that's the story I'm sticking with.

So it was sold 13 months before it was stamped?? I like it.

 

[Schwinn Sales West]

I agree with things John, but sales are sales and marketing is marketing.
Some people aren't so frugal and happy with with a leftover bike. I'm sure little Tommy didn't go around bragging "look at my leftover bike". And I'm sure little Tommy's dad was say "I just bought my son the latest and greatest bike".

They might have been good ol boys or playboys (hey its good to be the king!). But some body in the corporation had a clue of the date stamped to day assembled to shipped and received. And probably knew what year to market it as..

Well, I'm gonna go ride a bike while I have a nice day.

Manufacturing accountants refer to what you are talking about as W.I.P. It's Work IN PROGRESS. It's the cost of the parts inventory, and the lead time the parts needed to be ordered, or built, in order to keep a large assembly factory running at a smooth speed. You can bet that one of the "bean counters" knew the exact number of lefthand fork ends were in that barrel. He just could not care less about what serial number was stamped on them.

You cannot build several thousand bicycles "every work day" in one factory without a lot of planning. Remember, this was before we had special apps and laptop computers. The engineers used slide rules, not a CNC program. Planning was with a paper and pencil.

The Schwinn factory was very organized. It just became a bigger job of forecasting the parts needs as the lead time became longer as more bicycle parts companies closed down in the United States and bicycle parts had to be sourced from Europe and Asia.

John