Harley Davidson Head Badge Controversy

Discussion in 'Antique Bicycles Pre-1933' started by 47jchiggins, Oct 11, 2017.

  1. #21 Posted Oct 12, 2017

    Riding a '38 Autocycle Deluxe

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    It's a Fake, no other way about it.

    All fonts are diff from real to the repop, I see it clearly. If you have a real one on hand you will notice another difference that images dont show.
    -The weight- real are super light, I'm sure yours is heavy



    I , as much as the next guy am always looking and hoping for a new discovery, in this case it's just not so.

    As an aside...your letter from H-D is Not an authentication of your badge as a real authentic, its your interpretation of the letter.


    Read post by Bike again, exactly spot on.
     
  2. #22 Posted Oct 12, 2017

    I live for the CABE

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    This is exactly what I'm talking about. When I was at the Davenport MC swap, I saw an HD badge that looked like the stamped badge, even had an impression on the reverse. When I picked it up, I immediately noticed the weight and thickness, someone made an absolutely beautiful CASTING of the stamped badge, if only it was a bit lighter and thinner, it could have passed.....that's what I'm talking about. Why make a fake that looks like a fake?

    The badge below is made to look like the STAMPED badge but it is cast, not stamped.......my badge is STAMPED or pressed from a piece of what was once flat stock, not cast......

    IMG_5980.JPG

    IMG_5981.JPG
     
    #22 47jchiggins, Oct 12, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2017
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  3. #23 Posted Oct 12, 2017

    Riding a '38 Autocycle Deluxe

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    Please call,
     
  4. #24 Posted Oct 12, 2017

    Riding a '38 Autocycle Deluxe

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    Here's one that's a little bit different.
    It's the bottle cap fastened type. image.jpeg
     
  5. #25 Posted Oct 12, 2017

    Riding a '38 Autocycle Deluxe

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    Both badges look like they were hand made and not by machine. The edges around the lettering are not smooth more like jagged.. that to me indicates copies. The brass badge holes appear to be slightly wider then the other badge next to it. I feel some one was a engraver and made the brass badge (gave it some patina) for a bike that had slightly wider spaced holes.
     
  6. #26 Posted Oct 12, 2017

    Cruisin' on my Bluebird

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    I think the suspect badge is photoetched, run through a vibratory tumbler and run over on the garage floor.. What do these things sell for? I could go into production.
     
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  7. #27 Posted Oct 12, 2017

    I'm the Wiz, and nobody beats me!

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    Oh, I see it now... the "a" of Harley Davidson should be flatter on top and not more curved.
     
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  8. #28 Posted Oct 12, 2017

    Riding a '38 Autocycle Deluxe

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    Making an exact replica of anything is difficult. 99% of repop parts have glaring differences from the originals. It does seem like if you were going to go through the effort of making reproduction parts you might as well get it right but without the same tooling it can be almost impossible.
     
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  9. #29 Posted Oct 12, 2017

    Moderator Staff Member

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    Someone please correct me if I’m wrong, but this badge is photoengraved/etched.
     
  10. #30 Posted Oct 12, 2017

    Wore out three sets of tires already!

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    Yes, the Pontiac badge is acid etched.
    At some point after its removal it was run over in the driveway


    47jchiggins,
    your badge was acid etched
    then hammered repeatedly to make the scuff marks or nicks
    and then varnished or baked with grease on
    the edges of the letters and outlines (or cliffs) are not worn or burnished at all
    which they would be if the badge were old enough to have all those bang marks
    The Milwaukee font should have little tiny serifs or spurs
    Like Copperplate Gothic created around 1901
    Look closely at the bottom of the A
    Copperplate Gothic.jpg
     
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  11. #31 Posted Oct 12, 2017

    I live for the CABE

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    IMG_4654.JPG

    IMG_5985.JPG

    IMG_7002.JPG

    IMG_7003.JPG
     
    #31 47jchiggins, Oct 12, 2017
    Last edited: Oct 12, 2017
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  12. #32 Posted Oct 12, 2017

    Cruisin' on my Bluebird

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    You mean not all San Serif fonts are exactly the same? ;) The width of the letters in the repro badge are wider than the Original as well. It's subtle to most, but it's screaming at me in the side by side comparison.
     
  13. #33 Posted Oct 12, 2017

    I'm the Wiz, and nobody beats me!

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    easy way to tell if a Harley badge is real or not....
    Just submit a thread showing the badge and say "look what I just picked up".
    If your mail box gets filled, it is real. if no mail, well......
     
  14. #34 Posted Oct 13, 2017

    Riding a '38 Autocycle Deluxe

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    OK (while we are looking for the truth) here is a little story:
    A guy had an early NOS b6 may have been Goodrich (At Doc Gibsons show in Costa mesa- long time ago) it had drop center wheels- the bike was nos- he could not sell it till he put nos s-2s on it.

    So lets say that it is REAL- that is good for your own satisfaction but there would be doubt about it in many minds-you would probably have to put the earlier badge on it to realize maximum value (if that is your goal.)
    2cents OPINION as always.
    PS ditto on the post that it looks like it was aged on purpose.
     
  15. #35 Posted Oct 13, 2017

    Riding a '38 Autocycle Deluxe

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    NO-real- BUT IT DOES NOT HAVE ANY OF THE DEEP SAME SHAPED DINGS PRACTICALLY IN A ROW WHICH SEEM TO HAVE BEEN MADE BY A POINTED TOOL
    shoot sorry for the caps
     
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  16. #36 Posted Oct 13, 2017

    Finally riding a big boys bike

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    Also look at the spacing of the "of" on the brass badge. Looks like this: OG :"U.S.ofA"
    The brass "repop" "U.S. of A." If that makes any sense.
     
  17. #37 Posted Oct 13, 2017

    I'm the Wiz, and nobody beats me!

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  18. #38 Posted Oct 13, 2017

    I live for the CABE

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    Helvetica and Arial seem to be in the same font family. They are what you look for when you want a clean looking sans serif logo or letter font. A more exotic version that is thicker is Zurich, which is available with many word processing suites and easy to add to for font cache.
     
  19. #39 Posted Oct 14, 2017

    I live for the CABE

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    All Designs, Typography and Orthography of early art, logos, badges and decals was hand lettered (no computers, Letraset, or digital typesets). Often artwork was drawn over-sized on illiustration board, then given to an engraver, who would transfer the design to scale with a pantograph tool, then with the skills of a jeweler cut the intricate design in an "investment casting" or lost-wax casting. It was then turn over to a metal worker or foundry for mass production - a steel die of the design was made pressing it while red hot it into a cavity for embossing.

    Screen Shot 2017-10-14 at 11.06.19 PM.png Screen Shot 2017-10-14 at 11.06.49 PM.png Screen Shot 2017-10-14 at 11.11.52 PM.png Screen Shot 2017-10-14 at 11.12.01 PM.png

    Screen Shot 2017-10-14 at 11.09.36 PM.png

    Screen Shot 2017-10-14 at 11.11.37 PM.png
     
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  20. #40 Posted Oct 15, 2017 at 5:29 AM

    Riding a '37 Dayton Super Streamline

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    Welcome back Carlton! You back for good or just a stop over? V/r Shawn
     
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